Islamabad delays $24 bln deal with France: Retaliates for JF-17 parts hold

[ramu]

This deal is not gonna help Pakistan in its energy problem, as the deal is about LPG. The deal was with a French company, which will get the gas from Qatar.

The ironic part is that a Pakistani company in joint venture with another foreign company had out the lowest bid, which was not even looked at or entertained. It was around 1B US$ less compared to the French company's bid.

Any reason why the Pakistani company was not awarded the contract ?
P.S: Bids are not always awarded to the lowest bidder. Just because they are the lowest is not an automatic qualification. Projects are awarded on factors such as track record, delivery schedules and company capabilities. Not that the Pakistani company does not have them but which is this company that lost out ?

 

[SekrutYakhni]

When you are called Faouji (Army) foundation who else is suited to get kick backs ?

I think - Corporation should not allow Arm ppl to run for lucrative contracts it creates conflict of interest

It simple .. you are in army protect nation you retire stay home spend time with kids

I don't see what has the Fouju (Army) foundation has to do with civilian power contract

The issue is not that Army should run the company or anything else. (in this case)
The problem is about the lowest bidder!

 

[TaimiKhan]

Any reason why the Pakistani company was not awarded the contract ?
P.S: Bids are not always awarded to the lowest bidder. Just because they are the lowest is not an automatic qualification. Projects are awarded on factors such as track record, delivery schedules and company capabilities. Not that the Pakistani company does not have them but which is this company that lost out ?

As per ex-finance minister, he came to know about the lowest bid price after the company officials called him and asked why their bid was not even considered and to their shock the ex-finance minister said he has no idea if your bid even was there. The ex-finance minister was himself surprised that how come this happened and the Ministry of Petroleum by that time had already given the contract to the French company, so this clearly shows some foul play, as the Pakistani company's bid was not even put into the bidding process.

The Petroleum minister is a close aide of Mr. Zardari & Zardari has close grip on some of the attractive ministries as he has appointed his loyals, so it is very evident, there was foul play and deliberately lowest bid was not put in the process so that the French get it.

 

[Super Falcon]

Tit for Tat good slap to frenchs from pakistan first time pakistan played its foerign politics cards welll ausum work now pakistan should never buy subs from french they are not reliable

 

[SEAL]

Good decision. I think Indians on this forum are suffering more they never thought even in their dreams that France wants to invest huge amount of money in Pakistan.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

The issue is not that Army should run the company or anything else. (in this case)
The problem is about the lowest bidder!

But I have experience with bidding and not always the lowest bid is the best bid ....

The person for example has to analyse the workmanship the quality of work performed and guarentees to the investment , insurance policy in acase something breaks down will they come and fix it etc ...

French bid looks ok , how much was the Fouji (Army) bid , and not sure why they are bidding they should be working on borders not building gas mines ..frankly

But I think Cheif Justice is investigating the issue and its correct to analyse such issues just like French "departments" investigate french deals

Its like if you have a super expensive house , and you want to paint it

On one side you have
a) Marvelous Italian Painter he bids 939$
b) Student workong on summer job he bids 50$ bucks

But obviously you don't want paint dripping on floors or pant spots all over the walls where painting is un even etc ....


The real issue to investigate is

WERE THERE CURRUPTION of 1 Billion dollar in deal ? Or not

 

[SekrutYakhni]

But I have experience with bidding and not always the lowest bid is the best bid ....

The person for example has to analyse the workmanship the quality of work performed and guarentees to the investment , insurance policy in acase something breaks down will they come and fix it etc ...

French bid looks ok , how much was the Fouji (Army) bid , and not sure why they are bidding they should be working on borders not building gas mines ..frankly

But I think Cheif Justice is investigating the issue and its correct to analyse such issues just like French "departments" investigate french deals

Its like if you have a super expensive house , and you want to paint it

On one side you have
a) Marvelous Italian Painter he bids 939$
b) Student workong on summer job he bids 50$ bucks

But obviously you don't want paint dripping on floors or pant spots all over the walls where painting is un even etc ....


The real issue to investigate is

WERE THERE CURRUPTION of 1 Billion dollar in deal ? Or not

My father also sometimes bid for different contracts.
Trust me
Kick backs work!
^^ You cannot do anything without it. From police station to president, the system is corrupt.

The person for example has to analyse the workmanship the quality of work performed and guarentees to the investment , insurance policy in acase something breaks down will they come and fix it etc ...

This will get clear in few weeks!

WERE THERE CURRUPTION of 1 Billion dollar in deal ? Or not
$1 billion is the difference between two bids (I think) not the amount of corruption. Corruption (IMO) would be far less than that..

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

MAN 1 BILLION DOLLAR IS A BIG NUMBER !!!

1,000,000,000 dollar

Enough zeros , if we give 1 Million dollar to each Pakistans all Pakistan will be million ares ...


Who is STEALING OUR money ..???? JUSTICE HAS TO BE SERVED

Come to think of it why don't we give away 1 Million dollar to each pakistan ,and let them invest it back and move our economy ? with Buiness and other ideas .. hmm I am actually wondering .. about that ...

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

When you are called Faouji (Army) foundation who else is suited to get kick backs ?

I think - Corporation should not allow Arm ppl to run for lucrative contracts it creates conflict of interest

It simple .. you are in army protect nation you retire stay home spend time with kids

I don't see what has the Fouju (Army) foundation has to do with civilian power contract

The FF pays a huge amount in taxes every year, and the profits are used to provide benefits to retired army officials and their children. Higher education scholarships, funding for pursuing degrees abroad etc is partly where the money goes. The ratio of serving Army officials in the organization, to retired and civilian employees, is pretty low. I'll have to dig up Brian Cloughley's book to provide the exact numbers.

 

[SekrutYakhni]

The main reason of corruption in lower class or middle class is because of the wages. If we increase the wage than corruption will decrease.

The corruption on higher level is to live a lavish life
^^ This should not be tolerated at all.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

The main reason of corruption in lower class or middle class is because of the wages. If we increase the wage than corruption will decrease.

The corruption on higher level is to live a lavish life
^^ This should not be tolerated at all.

I don't such a power project should cost 24 billion dollar
May be 5 billlion to 10 billion I mean after all all the raw material is made in Pakistan what are they planning to do build a plant with gold plated soft french metal?

I think Police/Army should have standardized pay on western standards.

And No one should be allowed to hold civilian companies which take part in bidding that is just plain , against interest

And if the fouji foundation will build the plant with Local Companies 'Ahlan washalan'

But if they idea is Fouju foundation will just get the deal so they can then allocate a forigne company by subcontracting while taking a 2-3 billion dollar cut that is just plain ...choori

I am not informed on this perhaps other more informed ppl can share idea on fouji foundation I am not familiar who they are??

Ideal case for Pakisan is

a) Pakistani company wins
b) 80% of project is done by Pakistani Companies
c) 20% of project is allocatd to Chinese Consultants

We save 15 billion dollars and put it in Bank!!!

Invest 3 billion from that into solar pannel projects convert 100% of street lights into solar enabled lights

 

[Dazzler]

This development will ring alarms in France. I suspect a retaliation soon from French. Its too big a chunk to be denied even though in the longer run.

 

[niaz]

There is more to it than meets the eye. I am convinced that motive is political.

Fact: Pakistan is energy short and needs LNG (liquefied natural gas) for power production as well as for burning. For the record, if a pipeline cannot be built; liquefied natural gas is the best way of importing natural gas. LNG is mostly methane; one cubic foot of natural gas would generate 600 cubic feet of piped gas. Problem is that one needs to build a very large re-gasification plant to handle LNG. However miles and miles of cold storage would a bye product of this plant.

Fact: Qatar has the largest gas deposits in world (about 600 trillion cubic feet or about 20 times more than what Pakistan has) and a major exporter of LNG.

Here is the crunch. A country to country FOB deal would involve very little kick backs and commissions. Thus benefiting no one but the country. Any delivered deal with a third party would therefore be preferred by all those in power.

It is extremely difficult to compare an FOB deal ( from Qatar) to a delivered deal because this involves transportation and who can predict transportation costs in special LNG carries over next 20 years with certainty? Additionally, does Pakistan have the resources to set up an LNG receiving facility; purchase a couple of 50,000 SDWT LNG carriers required for import directly from Qatar?

Point I am trying to make is that IMO Suo Motto notice by Supreme Court and the cries by the media could have a political motive to stop Zardari from getting richer. Believe me, no matter whichever company wins the deal, some people will make lot of money.

IMO Supreme Court these days is highly biased and openly pro Nawaz Sharif. Remember the famous Pakistan Steel mill case where anti Musharraf media and a very biased CJ cancelled a done deal. If any one cares to examine, GOP has already suffered huge losses in the three years since the deal was cancelled and it looks more than likely that steel mill will eventually be closed and scrapped. Thus Pakistan has been deprived of at least $400-million in foreign exchange. Motive was the same, if we can’t make money, we won’t let any one else either; country be damned.

I am personally not aware of the actual facts and figures but know that this action by a pro PML Supreme Court would delay the project by at least a couple years. How can one be certain that the next deal will be any better for Pakistan? Who cares that Pakistan is suffereing from severe energy shortage and loss in the industrial productivity due to delay may far exceed any possible savings in the new deal.

To illustrate how people in power can reject one bid but accept another at much higher price is:

During the time when NS was PM and Shahbaz Sharif was Punjab Chief Minister, a tender for the supply of Granite and Marble for the under construction Lahore Airport was issued.

To favor a PML lackey, delivery time was deliberately kept very short. Parties that physically owned the mines bid at much lower number. Their bid was rejected because delivery time was longer than specified. Instead a much higher bid was accepted where it was said that delivery dates will be met, even though physically impossible.

Subsequently, the party who got the award went back to the party with granite quarry and bought the material at the price the particular party had quoted in the tender.

The delay in delivery was ignored during the performance of the contract. Thus it is very difficulty for an outsider such as media or the Court to decide whether due diligence was carried out or not.

By the way, $24-billions appear a lot but actually it is only $1.2-billions per year. Our current fuel import bill is already $10-billion per year. Also take it from me that Vitol are no angels.

 

[araz]

Niaz Saheb
If iremember correctly you have been employed in the oil industry. Is this true? You may very well be right as all the deals in Pakistan are made on the basis of commission and someone always ends up making money. The steel mills problem is more or less the same as POF wah, in that there are too many people employed to run the industry. Political and other considerations do not allow us to make the right decisions and curtail staffing to the minimum required. As to the CJ. where as nothing is beyond belief in Pakistan, I gather from a senior retired Judge and supreme court lawyer that the current CJ is honestfinancially.That might still mean that he may have a chip against the PPP, but it would seem that this is not the case.
Araz

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

1 Billion dollar worth of kick backs is a bit too much

Considering we could get French Avionics , with that now of course if we get the Avionics for Thunder as kickbacks

Great award the deal to France