ISI - a big failure?

[Zabaniyah]

Information provided by the ISI are generally dependable.

Ultimate success depends on how one uses that information as per intention.

 

[Safriz]

Comrade last hope,

ISI is the most taked about agy in the world for sometime now and many have tried to dismantle it---. If it was an ordinary agy---who would have bothered to spend anytime at all discussing the issues.

All agy's have issues one time or another---and so does isi.

If you compare CIA,RAW budget with ISI budget...
And look at the fact that ISI has been locking horns with both the above agencies for years now...
You will praise ISI for doing so much with such little money and little resources.

 

[Safriz]

Information provided by the ISI are generally dependable.

Ultimate success depends on how one uses that information as per intention.

The information they pick up after taking great risks,making efforts and using what ever little resources they have,get ''lost in translation''.

I said this many times....PAF Kamra attack was picked up by ISI 4-6 months before the attacks and info was Passed on to civilian law enforcement agencied ..

What happened next....we all know that.

 

[Last Hope]

Comrade last hope,

ISI is the most taked about agy in the world for sometime now and many have tried to dismantle it---. If it was an ordinary agy---who would have bothered to spend anytime at all discussing the issues.

All agy's have issues one time or another---and so does isi.

This is exactly what my friend, whose brother is serving in ISI with 'Red Tapes', says every time talks about ISI comes up and someone tries to bash it.

 

[Bratva]

Hello, there is something called FACTS. Please check them before posting. It has increased and kept increasing almost every year after 2001 when we became American Allies (and ISI caught MANY "Militants" and handed them over to USA)

And maybe people are also forgetting, GHQ attacks, Naval HQ in Karachi etc etc..

Oh and what about the Agencies personal who kidnap people for extortion? The latest was a lawyer from Pindi whose cell was traced back to ISI Safe house! lols.. ISI later said when confronted, oh, he is a terrorist!!

Care to share the news link?

The information they pick up after taking great risks,making efforts and using what ever little resources they have,get ''lost in translation''.

I said this many times....PAF Kamra attack was picked up by ISI 4-6 months before the attacks and info was Passed on to civilian law enforcement agencied ..

What happened next....we all know that.

two weeks before Kamra attack to be precise, Rehman Malik specifically warned an impending attack on kamra.

Now what ISI can do if relevant authorities "satt pi kar so rahy ho"

 

[Safriz]

Care to share the news link?



two weeks before Kamra attack to be precise, Rehman Malik specifically warned an impending attack on kamra.

Now what ISI can do if relevant authorities "satt pi kar so rahy ho"

No.
4-6 months.
The news appeared in express tribune 4 months before attack...you can check yourself.
And my friends living there noticed hightened security 6 months prior with all non essential personnel barred from entering Kamra gates...

 

[Jango]

No.
4-6 months.
The news appeared in express tribune 4 months before attack...you can check yourself.
And my friends living there noticed hightened security 6 months prior with all non essential personnel barred from entering Kamra gates...

Check the dates:

Threat alerts:

The actual attack was on Aug 16 or 15???

These threats mentioned Lahore base as the target, and not Kamra. But threat alerts like these are also sent to AHQ and then further distributed to other bases for precautionary measures.

The letter also got the date spot on.

 

[Safriz]

The terrorists were hiding among afghan refugee campa which are very close to Kamra airbase.
From there they were observing the airbase.
The base commander was a goof ball.
He didnt change shift change patterns of guards.. It was too predictable.
And there was no element of surprise...

The terrorists knew everything prior to attack.

Check the dates:

Threat alerts:

The actual attack was on Aug 16 or 15???

These threats mentioned Lahore base as the target, and not Kamra. But threat alerts like these are also sent to AHQ and then further distributed to other bases for precautionary measures.

The letter also got the date spot on.

Like i said...check express tribune.
Report posted there mentioned Kamra base.

Btw..i never came across this letter,and if true it shows a very common pattern normally used by drugs and arms dealers.
They would deliberately create a fake threat away from their real target,and subliminally infotm authorities,making them think they picked up intel when its a deception.

 

[Jango]

The terrorists were hiding among afghan refugee campa which are very close to Kamra airbase.
From there they were observing the airbase.
The base commander was a goof ball.
He didnt change shift change patterns of guards.. It was too predictable.
And there was no element of surprise...

A very surprising thing you say there, but since this isn't a thread for it, I'll keep quiet.

Btw..i never came across this letter,and if true it shows a very common pattern normally used by drugs and arms dealers.
They would deliberately create a fake threat away from their real target,and subliminally infotm authorities,making them think they picked up intel when its a deception.

Actually there was another letter of around 7-8th Aug I think, which mentioned three bases, CHaklala, Kamra and Lahore as potential targets. So your theory about his being a fake does not hold valid here.

A very recent example is of the Chaklala attack just a couple of months ago. When the airport was all cordoned off and closed for civilian traffic. That was a very good example of intel coordination and timely implementation of that intel, coupled with some luck.

 

[Panther 57]

ISI is among one of the top ranked agencies in the world. All influential agents have tried their level best to disban ISI or get it under civilian control, so that it could be manipulated. This itself is sufficient evidence to prove its competence. Allow them to work freely and see the results.
Bash them with false missing person is demoralising the institution.

 

[Slav Defence]

ISI is among one of the top ranked agencies in the world. All influential agents have tried their level best to disban ISI or get it under civilian control, so that it could be manipulated. This itself is sufficient evidence to prove its competence. Allow them to work freely and see the results.
Bash them with false missing person is demoralising the institution.

You are reminding me of last words of Mr.MUsharraf,his last words before resigning from presidency,I remember how he was crying on his subject's foolishness saying that ISI and Pakistan army are our backbone.
As usually, two types of opinions are here as well:
-Those who believe that ISI is performing with excellence, with limited provided budget and time.
-The second one which is speaking against of it-
what my personal opinion is that ISI is working with excellence in given limited resources,we need to support our agencies who are working 24/7 for our defense and security in limited amount of time and budget,we need to support our security and intelligence agencies at such tough time as strong nations get success only when their civil and security sectors works with complete co-operations and co-ordination.
Such accusations that ISI didn't send warning on time are false accusation,the Kamra base incident reminds me of the KPK authorties response who also made same accusation in D.I Khan jail break case when they were interrogated of lapses.
Where as far as missing person cases are concerned,then I suggest that proper investigations must be carried out,but with co-ordinatination and peace,we must prevent ourselves to put blame games on our agencies in order to prevent foreign media to create hype of any sort,it is better to settle issues quietly.

 

[MastanKhan]

ISI is among one of the top ranked agencies in the world. All influential agents have tried their level best to disban ISI or get it under civilian control, so that it could be manipulated. This itself is sufficient evidence to prove its competence. Allow them to work freely and see the results.
Bash them with false missing person is demoralising the institution.

Hi,

They need to man up to it---the missing person issue just like the agency here in the u s---. In the u s---the agy does not have to proe anything to the judge----they just have to make this statement that according to them---this person of interest is a threat with these ties and we are going to hold them---indefinitely.

Pakistani judges need to be straightened up---they need to tow the line of the 'state' when it comes to terrorist issues.

 

[TheGujju]

I would in fact argue that ISI is the worst intelligence agency in the world. We now have a unique situation not seen in human history. A country's own intelligence agency responsible for the loss of 5% GDP growth rate year on year and general ruination of its reputation on the world stage. Why? ISI directly or indirectly nurtured jihadis and mullahs that are now turning Pakistan into a theocratic hell hole. The country is regressing while everyone else around it are progressing.

Bat-shit crazy Islamists that it thought it could use as "strategic assets" have turned against their masters. A HUGE self goal by Pakistan and ISI. Good going. Imagine how much Pakistan can grow without these "frothing at the mouth" mullahs.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

I would in fact argue that ISI is the worst intelligence agency in the world. We now have a unique situation not seen in human history. A country's own intelligence agency responsible for the loss of 5% GDP growth rate and general ruination of its reputation on the world stage. Why? ISI directly or indirectly nurtured jihadis and mullahs that are now turning Pakistan into a theocratic hell hole. The country is regressing while everyone else around it are progressing.

Batshit crazy Islamists that it thought it could use as "strategic assets" have turned against their masters. A HUGE self goal by Pakistan and ISI. Good going.

ISI had long since been independent of Pakistan. (Almost)Nobody in Pakistan can decide it's actions anyway. Judging ISI with objectives of the State of Pakistan is incorrect.

 

[dray]

ISI had long since been independent of Pakistan. (Almost)Nobody in Pakistan can decide it's actions anyway. Judging ISI with objectives of the State of Pakistan is incorrect.

In fact in Pakistan the equation is just the opposite of what is considered as 'normal', here ISI and the military has a country, not otherwise.