Is Vietnam a good role model for Japan in dealing with China?

[Not So Good]

Is that what they teach you in Hindu brainwashing school?

India will be superpower by 2012 - Kalam the clown

Its all about perception

 

[frequency]

Arrest and then detain them. We should jail illegal Chinese interlopers. For far too long has the JCG been to gracious enough to deport them immediately afterwards. Next time, we should just jail them.



As much as I despise illegal Chinese interlopers coming into our islands without the proper documentation , I think that executing them is way too malicious. I prefer incarceration and then eventual deportation to their nation of origin.

There should be a good reason to wipe them off the map. Hopefully, my meteorite landed in their nation like the one in my avatar.

 

[Aepsilons]

There should be a good reason to wipe them off the map. Hopefully, my meteorite landed in their nation like the one in my avatar.

That's just too harsh, we have to learn to differentiate political differences from people to people. I'm not anti-China, actually on the contrary I an a fond admirer of Chinese people, Chinese culture, history etc. I am a Sinophile.

Be that as it may, I am quite against some policies of the CPC and the political games that they play regarding Japan.

Do I think there can be further rapprochement? Yes, I do. Do I believe there are significant hurdles ? Yes, of course.

Hopefully, my meteorite landed in their nation like the one in my avatar.

My friend , you're beginning to sound like a Palpatine...

 

[seven7seven]

Time is on China's side. Just keep salami slicing and slowly take bits of territory over time. The key is to never do anything big at any one time to justify USA intervening. Japan, Vietnam and Philippines can't do anything on their own, and the USA won't get involved unless pushed to the limit by China, by doing something major and drastic. China is patient and will get everything it wants in due time.

 

[Beidou2020]

Uncle Sam did a better job than China. Viets sent your daddy home in less than a month. You shouldn't attack Viet near then end of Vietnam war. You should do it during the war, you would have higher chance of winning.

"All the destruction was suffered by Vietnamese civilians and Vietnamese infrastructure."
That is why they call it a "war", noob. Where do you get your education? you need to go back to the school.

Agent Orange? US is helping Viet to do the clean up. But the Viets that were affected by Agent Orange are getting immune to it. Their body slowly adapt to AO and living healthy like tigers. You don't want to mess with those people. They will rip your head off.

The key word is 'Vietnamese' in Vietnamese civilians and Vietnamese infrastructure
I guess when all those schools have been bombed, its impossible to find a school in Vietnam.

What are the effects of AO? Hallucinations?
What kind of meds do you take?

 

[VALKRYIE]

"They", you mean we.

China bombed the snot out of Vietnam and left in 1979. Like the US did to Iraq. All the destruction was suffered by Vietnamese civilians and Vietnamese infrastructure.

Btw, how's that agent orange situation in Vietnam now? Still a big problem?

From A History of the Modern Chinese Army by Xiaobing Li (U. Press of Kentucky, 2007), pp. 255-256, 258-259 (footnote references omitted):

Some Chinese soldiers called it a “painful, little war.” Vietnamese troops avoided battle and instead harassed PLA forces. Some Chinese officers described it as a “ghost war,” since the enemy troops were almost invisible, or a “shadow war,” since it seemed they were fighting against their own shadows. The Vietnamese troops employed the same tactics, made the same moves, and used the same weapons as the Chinese. They knew exactly what the Chinese were trying to do. They exploited almost every problem and weakness the Chinese had. The Chinese troops had to fight their own problems first before they could fight the Vietnamese. Deng’s border war taught the PLA a hard lesson….

Many of the PLA’s commanding officers were shocked by the poor discipline, low morale, combat ineffectiveness, and high casualties in the 1979 Sino-Vietnamese War. During the nineteen days of the first two phases, the PLA suffered 26,000 casualties, about 1,350 per day. Gerald Segal points out that in Vietnam, “in contrast to Korea, Chinese troops performed poorly. In Korea, they adequately defended North Korea, but in 1979 they failed to punish Vietnam. China’s Cambodian allies were relegated to a sideshow along the Thai frontier, and China was unable to help them break out.”

During the war, 37,300 Vietnamese troops were killed, and 2,300 were captured. The Soviet Union surprised the Vietnamese by refusing to get involved in the conflict. On February 18, Moscow had denounced China’s aggression and promised that the Soviet Union would keep its commitments according to the Soviet-Vietnam cooperation and friendship treaty. Then, however, the Soviet Union did not make any major moves. Russian military intelligence did increase its reconnaissance planes and ships in the South China Sea and along the Vietnamese coast after China’s invasion. On February 24, two Russian transport planes landed at Hanoi and unloaded some military equipment. Most countries maintained a neutral position during the Sino-Vietnamese War.

The brief war was a grievous misfortune for both China and Vietnam, not only because it resulted in material and human losses for both nations but also because it brought years of earlier cooperation to a dispiriting conclusion. The war showed that American belief in the domino theory was misplaced, since two Communist countries, one of which had just attained national liberation, were now in conflict with each other. Each valued its own national interests much more than the common Communist ideology. On February 27, 1979, Deng told American journalists in Beijing that “Vietnam claims itself as the third military superpower in the world. We are eliminating this myth. That’s all we want, no other purpose. We don’t want their territory. We make them to understand that they can’t do whatever they want to all the times.”

Hanoi believed, however, that the Vietnamese army had taught the Chinese army a lesson. One [People’s Army of Vietnam] general said that China lost militarily and beat a hasty retreat: “After we defeated them we gave them the red carpet to leave Vietnam.” As Henry J. Kenny points out, “Most Western writers agree that Vietnam had indeed outperformed the PLA on the battlefield, but say that with the seizure of Lang Son, the PLA was poised to move into the militarily more hospitable terrain of the Red River Delta, and thence to Hanoi.” Kenny, however, points out that Lang Son is less than twelve miles from the Chinese border but is twice that distance from the delta. Moreover, at least five PAVN divisions remained poised for a counterattack in the delta, and thirty thousand additional PAVN troops from Cambodia, along with several regiments from Laos, were moving to their support. Thus the PLA would have taken huge losses in any southward move toward Hanoi.


Beaten up by militia of women and children.

 

[Beidou2020]

From A History of the Modern Chinese Army by Xiaobing Li (U. Press of Kentucky, 2007), pp. 255-256, 258-259 (footnote references omitted):

Some Chinese soldiers called it a “painful, little war.” Vietnamese troops avoided battle and instead harassed PLA forces. Some Chinese officers described it as a “ghost war,” since the enemy troops were almost invisible, or a “shadow war,” since it seemed they were fighting against their own shadows. The Vietnamese troops employed the same tactics, made the same moves, and used the same weapons as the Chinese. They knew exactly what the Chinese were trying to do. They exploited almost every problem and weakness the Chinese had. The Chinese troops had to fight their own problems first before they could fight the Vietnamese. Deng’s border war taught the PLA a hard lesson….

Many of the PLA’s commanding officers were shocked by the poor discipline, low morale, combat ineffectiveness, and high casualties in the 1979 Sino-Vietnamese War. During the nineteen days of the first two phases, the PLA suffered 26,000 casualties, about 1,350 per day. Gerald Segal points out that in Vietnam, “in contrast to Korea, Chinese troops performed poorly. In Korea, they adequately defended North Korea, but in 1979 they failed to punish Vietnam. China’s Cambodian allies were relegated to a sideshow along the Thai frontier, and China was unable to help them break out.”

During the war, 37,300 Vietnamese troops were killed, and 2,300 were captured. The Soviet Union surprised the Vietnamese by refusing to get involved in the conflict. On February 18, Moscow had denounced China’s aggression and promised that the Soviet Union would keep its commitments according to the Soviet-Vietnam cooperation and friendship treaty. Then, however, the Soviet Union did not make any major moves. Russian military intelligence did increase its reconnaissance planes and ships in the South China Sea and along the Vietnamese coast after China’s invasion. On February 24, two Russian transport planes landed at Hanoi and unloaded some military equipment. Most countries maintained a neutral position during the Sino-Vietnamese War.

The brief war was a grievous misfortune for both China and Vietnam, not only because it resulted in material and human losses for both nations but also because it brought years of earlier cooperation to a dispiriting conclusion. The war showed that American belief in the domino theory was misplaced, since two Communist countries, one of which had just attained national liberation, were now in conflict with each other. Each valued its own national interests much more than the common Communist ideology. On February 27, 1979, Deng told American journalists in Beijing that “Vietnam claims itself as the third military superpower in the world. We are eliminating this myth. That’s all we want, no other purpose. We don’t want their territory. We make them to understand that they can’t do whatever they want to all the times.”

Hanoi believed, however, that the Vietnamese army had taught the Chinese army a lesson. One [People’s Army of Vietnam] general said that China lost militarily and beat a hasty retreat: “After we defeated them we gave them the red carpet to leave Vietnam.” As Henry J. Kenny points out, “Most Western writers agree that Vietnam had indeed outperformed the PLA on the battlefield, but say that with the seizure of Lang Son, the PLA was poised to move into the militarily more hospitable terrain of the Red River Delta, and thence to Hanoi.” Kenny, however, points out that Lang Son is less than twelve miles from the Chinese border but is twice that distance from the delta. Moreover, at least five PAVN divisions remained poised for a counterattack in the delta, and thirty thousand additional PAVN troops from Cambodia, along with several regiments from Laos, were moving to their support. Thus the PLA would have taken huge losses in any southward move toward Hanoi.

China bombed the snot out of Vietnam and left. All the civilian deaths were inflicted on Vietnamese people and all the infrastructure destruction was on Vietnamese soil

US bombed the snot of out of Vietnam and left. All the civilian deaths were inflicted on Vietnamese people and all the infrastructure destruction was on Vietnamese soil

Guess who lost the most?

Btw, still enjoying that Agent Orange mate?

 

[xesy]

China bombed the snot out of Vietnam and left. All the civilian deaths were inflicted on Vietnamese people and all the infrastructure destruction was on Vietnamese soil

US bombed the snot of out of Vietnam and left. All the civilian deaths were inflicted on Vietnamese people and all the infrastructure destruction was on Vietnamese soil

Guess who lost the most?

Btw, still enjoying that Agent Orange mate?

US had their puppet to convince the world. China stabbed VN in the back when we were busy dealing with Khmer Rogue. And when we finally turned our head around China turned tail between legs and ran, screaming victories over VNese civilians. Good job, Chinese "soldiers"! At least the US fought on the battlefield and lost on the negotiation table, China didn't even dare to take chance with our veterans.

 

[Rechoice]

Without Chinese and Soviet help, every Viet born would be disfigured.

without Soviets, our Nguyen Dynasty is existed and ruled in Vietnam until now.

 

[Beidou2020]

US had their puppet to convince the world. China stabbed VN in the back when we were busy dealing with Khmer Rogue. And when we finally turned our head around China turned tail between legs and ran, screaming victories over VNese civilians. Good job, Chinese "soldiers"! At least the US fought on the battlefield and lost on the negotiation table, China didn't even dare to take chance with our veterans.

You mean killing millions of Viets and annihilating Vietnamese infrastructure is a loss for the US?

You mean like Afghanistan 'won' against Soviet Union right?

without Soviets, our Nguyen Dynasty is existed and ruled in Vietnam until now.

I really don't care about Viet 'dynasties'. All I care is that China is strong and growing stronger.

 

[xesy]

You mean killing millions of Viets and annihilating Vietnamese infrastructure is a loss for the US?

You mean like Afghanistan 'won' against Soviet Union right?

Did the Soviet lose against Germany? Did China lose against Japan? Both countries suffered great loss in WW2, and both were the victor. Victory is not measured by casuality, stop being childish. Do you know that VNese army changed their tatics from killing to wounding US soldiers to put more pressure on US anti-war movement back at America?

 

[Beidou2020]

Did the Soviet lose against Germany? Did China lose against Japan? Both countries suffered great loss in WW2, and both were the victor. Victory is not measured by casuality, stop being childish. Do you know that VNese army changed their tatics from killing to wounding US soldiers to put more pressure on US anti-war movement back at America?

Do you realise the Vietnam war was fought between Soviet and Chinese forces vs the US forces?
The war just happened to take place in the country of Vietnam.
Vietnamese contribution to the war is almost zero.

 

[xesy]

Do you realise the Vietnam war was fought between Soviet and Chinese forces vs the US forces?
The war just happened to take place in the country of Vietnam.
Vietnamese contribution to the war is almost zero.

Vietnamese blood is not water. We bleed for our independence. We bleed for Cambodians. Hundreds of thousands VNese still suffer the scar of war till this days. And you dared to call their suffering nothing? You are not qualified as a human being.

 

[Rechoice]

Do you realise the Vietnam war was fought between Soviet and Chinese forces vs the US forces?
The war just happened to take place in the country of Vietnam.
Vietnamese contribution to the war is almost zero.

Civil war in China is battle field of Soviet Russian and Uncle Sam, Chinese CPC and KMT is black soldiers in fightings.

 

[Beidou2020]

Civil war in China is battle field of Soviet Russian and Uncle Sam, Chinese CPC and KMT is black soldiers in fightings.

Nope. Chinese civil war was exactly that....cilvil war on who will rule China. Two Chinese forces fighting each other.

Vietnam war was fought between Soviet and Chinese soldiers and US soldiers. There was zero contribution from Vietnamese people.