Is Pakistan facing bankruptcy?

[DarkStar]

I see everybody is harping about FDI... What has FDI actually contributed towards Pakistan's economy over lets say the last decade? Absolutely nothing.

Most of the investment has been in teh Telecomsm, Real Estate sector and consumer finance.

I agree, we have healthy competition in the mobile phone market, but all that is happening there is profits are going out, there is no real value added to the economy. A handful of jobs are created, but nothing more than that. It is not the sort of labour intensive industry that Pakistan needs investment in.

As for the investment in Real Estate, it has pushed prices up, making sure that there are some winners who sold their land and property at the right time, but for the vast majority of the country's non property owning workers, buying a house or appartment in a town or city is now beyond them.

consumer finance? it has given a superficial aura of prosperity.

Yes, lahore is chock a block with new fancy cars, almost every car being new, or a couple of years old. But this consumer finance is not going to help the real economy. If this money was used to finance big industrial projects, or labour intensive factories which create jobs, then it would have been a good thing.

People are encouraged to spend more than what they earn, by doling out credit cards with astronomical interest rates. The cases of suicide from people who have not kept up their payments are recorded almost daily in local newspapers.

There is a campaign to change Pakistan from a savers nation into a spending nation...Only, that we should spend the cash that we dont have, so that we are indebted for the forseeable future. Guess where all the profit from this financing will go?

The kind of FDI that comes to India and China, is just not coming to Pakistan. We need industries which will add value to the economy, in terms of technology and innovation, bringing much needed blue collar jobs.

Who the hell needs makro and other supermarkets opening in Pakistan? All that mega super markets will do is take away business from pakistan's millions of traders, shops, supermarkets, stalls, wholesalers, suppliers, etc. Pakistan is also a nation of small shopkeepers and traders.

These big makro/wal mart type of warehouse shopping complexes will eventually squeeze the life out of the local traders, effecting millions upon millions of people who depend on trade for their livelihood. It has happened in Europe and the USA, where small traders and to some extent medium sized companies have almost virtually gone bust. The only hope to survive is if you have carved out a niche for youserlf.

What takes this to a new level of preposterousness is that most of these foreign firms raise a significant chunk of their cash from Pakistani banks. If these banks are so willing to splash their cash, how about investing in some local businesses to improve our own industries?

The fact of the matter is, the investment coming in is designed to take the cream off the top of the milk, so to speak.

We should only allow FDI that is industry specific and adresses a need or shorftall in a particular sector.

Otherwise we should politely decline.
Thanks, but no thanks.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Why is it that when any pakistani hears talk about "investors" turning up their noses they have heart attacks? Why should a third world economy be so anxious as to become an INVESTMENT of foreigners? What is wrong with INVESTING IN YOURSELF and standing on your own two feet and exporting and producing equal or more to what you import and consume? Why are INVESTORS with their own CAPITAL so essential to the equations.

Why do you think investors invest in a foreign country to begin with? They do it for PROFIT mostly which means if someone invests $1 billion they expect to MILK $5 billion in the next decade or two and TAKE IT ALL OUT OF PAKISTAN. Now if this "investment" was made by native pakistanis, or the pakistani govt, or even joint ventures and there were laws againt capital flight then money would not run off like this.

None of these investors who are running off intended to invest in pakistan for the benefit of the pakistani people, they did it to make money and then pull their loot OUT of the pakistan economy. The govt should encourage indigenous domestic investment which is guaranteed to STAY in pakistan through thick and thin.

By investors I mean both domestic and foreign - if you go by this governments statements, they were stating in March that over 3 billion dollars in export proceeds were not being repatriated by exporters due to the declining rupee.

That bu itself is a large chunk of our foreign exchange reserves, now imagine if that trend continued.

 

[opinion786]

well no im not a die hard fan of these courses but i had always been critical of FDIs.

As according to my little brain i think the foreign investers sometime add to your finencial crisis by withdrawing their money just like the recent crisis when foreign investerd withdraw their money from Karachi Stock Exchange.

And we always think that party will never last forever which is a great bluff. iguess.

No Jana,

FDI are not just cash sitting idle waiting to be withdrawn. Cash that has been invested or project started cannot be withdrawn easily. When a foreign investor comes to your country...first he transfers an amount to your country... then construction or business moves forward. The amount that is left in Banks can be withdrawn.

Money in Banks or money traded in Shares on Stocks, are easily transfered back. That's why they are hit worse. But, KSE has minimum foreign investment. That's why when in January the world stocks were hit .... kSE was effected only 2%.

Above all, instead of looking down upon foreign investment which brings with it Capital, Management techniques, Technology, Latest gadgets, implementation plans, Safety & Quality standards, etc ....

We should seek to condemn corrupt & immoral political leaders - who effect not only the FDI but the whole economy!

Kind Regards!

 

[opinion786]

=darkStar;204496]I see everybody is harping about FDI... What has FDI actually contributed towards Pakistan's economy over lets say the last decade? Absolutely nothing.

Actually, its not the cash of FDI that contributes. FDI in the last eight years have been around $18 billion. But our economy grew by above $100 billion. Its only when that cash is invested and projects roll on, and they start giving returns that actually helps the economy.

Most of the investment has been in teh Telecomsm, Real Estate sector and consumer finance.

In 2006-07, the FDI in Telecom, Real estate and Financial Business has been around 50%.

The other 50% has been in Oil & Gas, Textiles, Trade, Construction, Power, Chemical, Transport, Communication, Others, etc.

A handful of jobs are created, but nothing more than that. It is not the sort of labour intensive industry that Pakistan needs investment in.

If your country grows Cocoa ... that's where your investment will come in. If your country is suitable for Ship-breaking.... that's where your investment will come in. If your country is meant for farming & milk producing ... that's where your investment comes in. If the country is meant for Tourism .... that's where FDI comes in.

The thing is we can't be an agriculture country and demand industrialization. Let them happen step by step. We were going in the right direction.

As for the investment in Real Estate, it has pushed prices up, making sure that there are some winners who sold their land and property at the right time, but for the vast majority of the country's non property owning workers, buying a house or appartment in a town or city is now beyond them.

Property prices have gone up in whole of Middle East. The basic rule is, if you attract foreign investment and foreigners... the real estate prices & hotelism go up.

In DHA, the prices have gone up the most.... why?

Emaar is building its ambitious project of Crescent Bay. Its home to Creek Marina. KPT Port tower will be built there.

If this money was used to finance big industrial projects, or labour intensive factories which create jobs, then it would have been a good thing.

In 2006-07, The Infrastructure Industries Index, which measures the performance of Seven industries, i.e. Electricity generation, Natural gas, Crude oil, Petroleum products, Basic metal, Cement and coal, has recorded a 26.2 percent growth in Industrial sector of Pakistan.

In 2005, The rate of growth in Pakistan Large Scale Manufacturing (LSM) was at a 30-year high. Construction activity was at a 17-year high.

The IT industry, which was virtually non-existent seven years ago, has grown to be worth $2 billion of which $1 billion is export related. It rregistered a 50% growth. 55 foreign IT companies have already entered the market. Now the sector employed 90,000 professionals.

The total contribution of Auto industry to GDP is 2.8%. Auto sector presently, contributes 16% to the manufacturing sector. AUTO EXHIBITION,|||||::.. A U T O E X P O . C O M . P K ..::||||| Auto & Auto Parts Pakistan 2008 Exhibition, Pakistan #1 Auto Parts Exhibitions, World #1 Auto exhibitions, Auto & Auto Parts Exhibition, Auto & Auto Parts Exhibitions, A Leading & Bigg

Economy rolls to 7% ONLY when BIG industrial projects take a roll. Otherwise, we'd be like the west GDP averaging 2-3%.

The kind of FDI that comes to India and China, is just not coming to Pakistan. We need industries which will add value to the economy, in terms of technology and innovation, bringing much needed blue collar jobs.

No Bro, that's not the case. I'll paste some foreign investment projects later (if needed - though I have pasted them earlier in some other post).

But our economy started revival on all fronts and gave positive results:

1 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued MARBLE PRODUCTION sector at Rs.211,851 million in 2005 thus registering over 99% growth since 2000.

2 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued Large-scale Manufacturing at Rs.981,518 million in 2005 thus registering over 138% growth since 2000 while Small-scale manufacturing was valued at Rs.356,835 million in 2005 thus registering over 80% growth since 2000.

3 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued CONSTRUCTION sector at Rs.178,819 million in 2005 thus registering over 88% growth since 2000.

4 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued TELECOM & Communication sector at Rs.982,353 million in 2005 thus registering over 91% growth since 2000.

5 - Federal Bureau of Statistics valued FINANCE & INSURANCE sector at Rs.311,741 million in 2005 thus registering over 166% growth since 2000.

6 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued Public administration & defense sector at Rs.389,545 million in 2005 thus registering over 65% growth since 2000.

7 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued WHOLE SALE and RETAIL sector at Rs.1,358,309 million in 2005 thus registering over 96% growth since 2000.

8 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued FISHERY sector at Rs.18,290 million in 2005 thus registering over 10% growth since 2000.

Thus bro, the thing is that we need HONEST & DELIVERING LEADERS who are SINCERE and have the ambitions to progress our economy and country! Foreign Investment is not bad. Its the leaders who MISUSE this FDI that are bad and should be condemned.

Its an era of foreign investment, otherwise there was no need to make EU or international consortiums.

Regards! Pakistan First!

 

[DarkStar]

Thanks for trying to bury me under a mountain of statistics, half of which have nothing to do with the point I was making.

Actually, its not the cash of FDI that contributes. FDI in the last eight years have been around $18 billion. But our economy grew by above $100 billion. Its only when that cash is invested and projects roll on, and they start giving returns that actually helps the economy.

My point exactly, the FDI has been minimal compared to our growth. Plz kindly deduct the capital outflows as well as repatriation of profits. This figure of 18 billion will probably go down further.

In 2006-07, the FDI in Telecom, Real estate and Financial Business has been around 50%.

The other 50% has been in Oil & Gas, Textiles, Trade, Construction, Power, Chemical, Transport, Communication, Others, etc.

I would like some figures for this claim. Telecom and Financial services have consistetly been the most active FDI for the past 4 years at least.

in 2007-2008 the financial business sector got around 1.6 billion dollars in Fdi, while the telecom sector was a bit more at 1.62 billion, compared to almost 2 billion in the previous year. that is around 3.2 billion dollars of FDI, from a total of around 5 billion dollars total FDI. now you do the maths.

There are no official figures for FDI in real estate, so that is not even included in the analasys.

Briefly, the sectors you mentioned contributed this much fdi in 2007-2008,


Oil and GAs exploration 634 million.

trade $175.5 million

construction 88.5 million

textiles $30.1 million

transport $73 million

chemicals $78 million

power 61.5 million

FDI inflow into financial sector rises by 72.8pc

Now how can you compare these meagre FDI's to the FDI sectors that I mentioned. It must be noted, that all sectors which can have potential for betterment of pakistani industry and jobs, received meagre FDI.

The thing is we can't be an agriculture country and demand industrialization. Let them happen step by step. We were going in the right direction.

Why the hell not?

What an obviously false statement. China is an agricultural country, India is, France, Italy and the USA are. They are doing pretty well industrialisation wise. It is ludicrous to suggest, we should not encourage FDI in industrialisation, factories, job creating industries.

Property prices have gone up in whole of Middle East. The basic rule is, if you attract foreign investment and foreigners... the real estate prices & hotelism go up..

One of the main reasons for the property price boom, which happened in most places, was the ucnertainty after 9-11, as people sought to invest in more solid and traditional investments like land and gold. Also money coming from Pakistani expats after 9 11 boosted this industry.

In 2006-07, The Infrastructure Industries Index, which measures the performance of Seven industries, i.e. Electricity generation, Natural gas, Crude oil, Petroleum products, Basic metal, Cement and coal, has recorded a 26.2 percent growth in Industrial sector of Pakistan.

In 2005, The rate of growth in Pakistan Large Scale Manufacturing (LSM) was at a 30-year high. Construction activity was at a 17-year high.

The IT industry, which was virtually non-existent seven years ago, has grown to be worth $2 billion of which $1 billion is export related. It rregistered a 50% growth. 55 foreign IT companies have already entered the market. Now the sector employed 90,000 professionals.

The total contribution of Auto industry to GDP is 2.8%. Auto sector presently, contributes 16% to the manufacturing sector. AUTO EXHIBITION,|||||::.. A U T O E X P O . C O M . P K ..::||||| Auto & Auto Parts Pakistan 2008 Exhibition, Pakistan #1 Auto Parts Exhibitions, World #1 Auto exhibitions, Auto & Auto Parts Exhibition, Auto & Auto Parts Exhibitions, A Leading & Bigg

Economy rolls to 7% ONLY when BIG industrial projects take a roll. Otherwise, we'd be like the west GDP averaging 2-3%.



No Bro, that's not the case. I'll paste some foreign investment projects later (if needed - though I have pasted them earlier in some other post).

But our economy started revival on all fronts and gave positive results:

1 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued MARBLE PRODUCTION sector at Rs.211,851 million in 2005 thus registering over 99% growth since 2000.

2 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued Large-scale Manufacturing at Rs.981,518 million in 2005 thus registering over 138% growth since 2000 while Small-scale manufacturing was valued at Rs.356,835 million in 2005 thus registering over 80% growth since 2000.

3 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued CONSTRUCTION sector at Rs.178,819 million in 2005 thus registering over 88% growth since 2000.

4 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued TELECOM & Communication sector at Rs.982,353 million in 2005 thus registering over 91% growth since 2000.

5 - Federal Bureau of Statistics valued FINANCE & INSURANCE sector at Rs.311,741 million in 2005 thus registering over 166% growth since 2000.

6 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued Public administration & defense sector at Rs.389,545 million in 2005 thus registering over 65% growth since 2000.

7 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued WHOLE SALE and RETAIL sector at Rs.1,358,309 million in 2005 thus registering over 96% growth since 2000.

8 - The Federal Bureau of Statistics valued FISHERY sector at Rs.18,290 million in 2005 thus registering over 10% growth since 2000.

Thus bro, the thing is that we need HONEST & DELIVERING LEADERS who are SINCERE and have the ambitions to progress our economy and country! Foreign Investment is not bad. Its the leaders who MISUSE this FDI that are bad and should be condemned.

Its an era of foreign investment, otherwise there was no need to make EU or international consortiums.

All the above statistics have nothing to do with FDI, but are about Pakistan's growth in these sectors.

My question would be, if you take away inflationary changes during the past 8 years, and account for the devaluation of the rupee against major world currencies, how much of this growth is real?

I'll let u ponder on that one.

Kindly, don't post such long statistic at this time of night. figures dhoond dhoond kar mujhe paseenay aa gaye hain...

 

[opinion786]

=darkStar;204540]Thanks for trying to bury me under a mountain of statistics, half of which have nothing to do with the point I was making.

Maybe I did not understand your point. But, I was just trying to make you see is that FDI or foreign investment is not bad.

My point exactly, the FDI has been minimal compared to our growth. Plz kindly deduct the capital outflows as well as repatriation of profits. This figure of 18 billion will probably go down further.

Repatriation of 'profits' is not foreign investment going back. Its RESULT of foreign investment INVESTED and PRODUCING results. On which they also give corporate tax. Pakistan has also earned revenue from their taxes.

Briefly, the sectors you mentioned contributed this much fdi in 2007-2008,

Oil and GAs exploration 634 million.
trade $175.5 million
construction 88.5 million
textiles $30.1 million
transport $73 million
chemicals $78 million
power 61.5 million

Correct! I didn't quote 2007-08, as it consists of some 2 months of caretaker government and 6 months of PPP govt.

This has risen to become 64% of total FDI. Which has increased primarily under this government, and not Shaukat Aziz.

Now how can you compare these meagre FDI's to the FDI sectors that I mentioned. It must be noted, that all sectors which can have potential for betterment of pakistani industry and jobs, received meagre FDI.

Financial sector has revolusionized the Banking sector in Pakistan introducing ATM's and internet banking etc.

Real estate attracted construction activities.

IT & Telecom helped us to raise our IT business worth to $2 billion.

So, all these sectors have helped PAkistan in one way or other. We can't dismiss these sectors as useless.

What an obviously false statement. China is an agricultural country, India is, France, Italy and the USA are. They are doing pretty well industrialisation wise. It is ludicrous to suggest, we should not encourage FDI in industrialisation, factories, job creating industries.

They WERE agriculture countries, especially China. Exclude India (its still agriculture and trying to attract FDI).

China's GDP by sector:

Agriculture (11.7%)
Industry (48.9%)
Services (39.3%)

France GDP by sector:

Agriculture (2.7%),
Industry (24.4%),
Srvices (72.9%)

Italy GDP by sector:

Agriculture (1.9%),
Industry (28.9%),
Services (69.2%)

One of the main reasons for the property price boom, which happened in most places, was the ucnertainty after 9-11, as people sought to invest in more solid and traditional investments like land and gold. Also money coming from Pakistani expats after 9 11 boosted this industry.

Yes, true. But it also rises when foreign investment comes. That's why the land of cities boom and not necessarily villages.

All the above statistics have nothing to do with FDI, but are about Pakistan's growth in these sectors.

Yes, I wrote to you that, that I can provide you FDI later if you wish for them. That I gave you examples of growth in sectors. I have them... I'll post them if you need .... too lengthy.

My question would be, if you take away inflationary changes during the past 8 years, and account for the devaluation of the rupee against major world currencies, how much of this growth is real? I'll let u ponder on that one.

This is why its called REAL GDP and not nominal GDP.

Kindly, don't post such long statistic at this time of night. figures dhoond dhoond kar mujhe paseenay aa gaye hain...

Aray yaar, mujhe sey maang liye hotey. I didn't paste them on purpose as people would have objected that the last 9 months were not of Shaukat Aziz.

Regards!

 

[DarkStar]

My basic point is that FDI is not the holy grail that we are seeking. It is not the magic wand to solve our problems...

If we concentrate on those areas of our economy which have scope for growth, and uplifting of the masses, the FDI will follow automatically...Capital is ever ready to land in a place for a quick buck.

India concetrated a lot on the IT sector, and they are far ahead of us. But this has had virtually no impact on the "real" economy, based in towns and villages, it has only benefited a handful. The shining india backlash exemplifies that.

Let's not repeat the mistakes of our Indian friends.

Look at how modern economies are propping up their manufacturing base, and lets follow that line.

As for Real and Nominal GDP comment, lol. I guess they didn't teach me that at LSE, did they?

 

[Neo]

Pakistan to send delegation to US​

Islamabad, Oct 8: Pakistan will send a delegation to the US next week as it seeks 10 billion dollars in emergency assistance to avoid defaulting on its debt, Bloomberg TV said.

The government is also expected to meet with the 'Friends of Pakistan' group in the United Arab Emirates soon, the channel quoted a finance ministry official as saying.

The group, which met in New York on September 26, includes the US, UK, China, Saudi Arabia and the UAE.

''About 8 billion dollars to 10 billion dollars over 18 months is all we need to get out of this based on our own momentum,'' said a senior Pakistani banker Syed Ali Raza.

''Our biggest problem is [foreign] reserves and confidence in the currency.'' Pakistan ended its three-year, 1.5 billion dollars loan programme with the International Monetary Fund in December 2004.

However, Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani has not said whether it will seek IMF assistance.

''Without external assistance, Pakistan doesn’t have the resources to meet its obligations,'' said Farid Khan, director of equities at Credit Suisse Pakistan in Karachi.

''Pakistan should seek IMF’s assistance now instead of waiting for the eleventh hour. It’s an extraordinary crunch and the outlook is very grim,'' said Zainab Jabbar, group strategist at Karachi-based IGI Financial Services Ltd.

''There are very serious chances of defaulting.''

 

[opinion786]

I agree that we shouldn't seek FDI and that it automatically follows.

My point all along that we should protect our Reserves. That's what I was insisting on. I thought you were saying that FDI is not worth our economy, and hence i was explaining to you that foreign investment is not bad. Its the capability of the leaders to utilise those investment.

When Musharraf took over, the FDI in 2000-01 were only $322 million. But, he corrected the macro-economic indicators and the FDI followed in automatically and increased year-on-year.

I'm sure they teach you real & nominal GDP at LSE. Regards!

 

[DarkStar]

Do what our very own shortcut Aziz did, and buy foreign exchange from the local open market...It will defnitely put pressure on the rupee and might increase inflation, but it is better to do that than to beg for more assistance...When we can stand on our own two feet, our currency should recover too.

Cut spending to bring the budget defecit down. It's time the govt tightened its belt, and stopped spending on all non essential programmes and dpeartments, maybe even looking at changing the local govt system and get as many people off salaries as possible.

This four tier governance system, of MNA, MPAs, Nazims and Councillors, is a waste of resources. Balance the books, so that we don't have to resort to begging...

p.s. Pakistan should stop hoarding the dollar, and invest in a basket of foreign currencies, which includes the euro, yen, etc. Thats the best way of hedging against a shifting dollar, and may have saved pakistan a fair sum if they had implemented this a couple of years ago.

 

[opinion786]

Don't call him shortcut Aziz! I come here just to defend Musharraf and Shortcut

Kick out the MPA's but not the Nazim!

 

[DarkStar]

I didn't say it in a bad way...It's just that they created a way for him to become PM short cut main...its quite a compliment, actually.

 

[jeypore]

The reason Pakistan is in this crises is because of defense spending, especially heavy spending in the nuclear sector of the defense. If i am not mistake, pakistan total defense spending was 40-45% in terms of gov't spending, not GDP. Pakistan also felt that they had to meet India's overall defense spending to meet its needs. I am trying to find a Documentary that I saw regarding this information, when i find it i will post the link.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

The reason Pakistan is in this crises is because of defense spending, especially heavy spending in the nuclear sector of the defense. If i am not mistake, pakistan total defense spending was 40-45% in terms of gov't spending, not GDP. Pakistan also felt that they had to meet India's overall defense spending to meet its needs. I am trying to find a Documentary that I saw regarding this information, when i find it i will post the link.

You know, to ignore the extremely comprehensive arguments that have been made so far, many to precisely counter points similar to yours, and to merely reiterate the same flawed analysis without any attempt to offer a rebuttal to the arguments that have been raised against this canard of 'too much defense spending', is really disrespectful to the other posters.

On the issue of what percentage of the Total budget the defense budget works out to be, her are some figures:

- The 2007/08 budget totals 1,874 billion rupees ($30.9 billion), up 42.5 percent from 1,315 billion rupees last year.

- Defence spending has been increased to 275 billion rupees, up 9 percent from last year's revised target of 252.63 billion.

Pakistan's 2007/08 budget measures, forecasts

That works out to be about 14.67 percent of the total budget - nowhere close to 40-45 percent.

I realize that some Indians are over the moon with the perception that India is responsible for Pakistan's economic mess by virtue of drawing it into an expensive arms race, or that the "Evil Army", that has long been India's nemesis and a foil against its designs on Pakistan, is responsible, but the facts and figures just do not support that view.

You give yourself far too much credit - unless India really does have a hand in the instability and terrorism in Pakistan.

 

[asaad-ul-islam]

there's no question of whether growth was "real" or not due to foreign investment. developing nations, especially Pakistan, need foreign investment to stimulate growth in the economy. How exactly does that happen? Foreign investment brings in foreign exchange, investor confidence in itself, technology, education and vocational training, job opportunities, and possibly exports due to cheap labour.

I see people trying to make the same point advocated by politicians when they were eager to get into power. "Musharraf did nothing for our exports, he turned Pakistan into a consumer-based economy" or "Musharraf imported more than we exported". I strongly suggest people pay a visit to our history books. Corporate Pakistan was totally wiped out when Zulfiqar Bhutto nationalized everything. Privatization efforts made by all govt.'s can be taken as proof of Pakistan still trying to recover from that era.

How would Musharraf or Shaukat Aziz be able to increase exports when there is no "local" industry to begin with? in case some of you haven't noticed, the only companies in Pakistan are either state-owned nationalized, military-owned, or foreign. Don't talk about the thousands of small businesses run by your average locals on your street corner, they don't produce or manufacture anything, actually they increase our imports. none of these people even bother to go further than that level.

Can you tell me, how will we be able to export more or produce and manufacture anything locally? Where will we get the industry to do it? The only option for us is the same route taken by Shaukat Aziz, draw in foreign investment and promote entrepreneurism. Musharraf's govt. has made great strides in the level of education in Pakistan, while at the same time, promoting entrepreneurism at the university level by adopting an extremely efficient strategy, technology incubation centers, or TIC. technology incubation centers have been at the forefront, driving some of China's economic growth.

Most of our exports are textiles and apparel. You'd be lucky to find a soccer ball made in Pakistan in your average sports equipment shop. We've had a recent increase in exports of construction material like cement due to our trade relations with the middle east, that too can give credit to Musharraf. Perhaps the only interesting category of exports we have had is in the IT sector. Pakistan is going (or was going) through its own IT boom. our software exports were expected to reach $11 billion by 2011.

You can thank foreign investments for that as well. Investment in the telecom sector also stimulated software exports, service is also important in the IT sector. Thanks to the increase in software, our military planners have thousands of software specialists designing advanced and complex "upper-end" software for their needs. Our C4i, CFD, and simulation programs have benefited immensely from the IT boom.

Now a fellow member here cracked a good joke, "how would we get transfer of technology on cell phones". He's right, it is a joke. we can't just expect comapanies to transfer technology to us without strings attached. again the best thing to do, is to promote foreign investment. All you can do is hope that these companies bring in production factories. Only after these companies bring in local production, you will see an increase in capable manpower, advanced technology, and better education made available at the university level. This is what happened in China, we were hoping it would happen with us. Once the manpower and education is available at the university level, we can finally start looking at R&D and perhaps entrepreneurship by our own.