Is it too difficult?

[M. Sarmad]

Would that statement apply only to India or other countries in the region, and beyond, as well?

This thread/discussion is about India and Indian held Kashmir, not about other countries in the region or beyond

 

[VCheng]

This thread/discussion is about India and Indian held Kashmir, not about other countries in the region or beyond

I thought so. So does that statement apply equally to India's rival in the Kashmir issue as well, or not?

 

[scorpionx]

There are few things to consider,
1) literacy or being graduate is not being equal to being educated, for e.g. Alqaeda head zawahiri was a surgeon.

2) There was no army before 1987, they were sent there bcos of the things that took place. Thats a good 40 years after 1947. (If you are going to talk about elections they dint like, they could have approached supreme court.)

3) Yes, police (or security ppl) are tough ppl to deal with. Tell me in which state police station would you like to step in and have a coffee with ? Common sense dictates to avoid police at all cost unless you are being hounded by some thing bigger than them. Police kill or harrass ppl all the time whether in TN or haryana they are no different, police in kashmir are no different either.

4) Radicalization is a problem whether you like it or not. Lets be frank, we should treat every one in the same manner, fair & square with no bias. If a right wing hindu group harasses a minority group they need to be dealt with severely, the same applies to the kashmir as well. So why should we placate the mob who committed genocide on kashmiri pandits?

I would totally agree with view the current govt boastfulness and vulgar display of power is appalling. They are simply breaching the invisible red lines of using normal military actions for their own selfish political purpose.

If kashmir isnt a tyranny of the majority over the minority , what else is it?

5) Last but not least , you dint specify which segment of population is crying hoarse. A particular segment within 15k square kms (out of 100k) which plays the victim card after throwing out pandits is holding the entire state to ransom. So what makes you think they should deserve special attention? Do you think there are no other pressing matters for govt to work on. These are just the regular attention seekers who shamefully utilize innocents to implement their devious schemes.


I would say army needs to do its job minus the current govts third rate jingoism. Irrespective of what the issue is , no well meaning society will accept gun toting terrorists roaming freely and threatening the law & order apparatus.

1. I agree. Al Zawahiri was a doctor, Rafi was a PhD in sociology and Faesal was an IAS. Are we suggesting radicalization in Kashmir has reached to the point that existed in the society Al Zawahiri once lived? Most vulnerable to radicalization, the rural youths of Kashmir are joining militancy by peer group network. A serving IPS of Kashmir himself has debunked this popular myth of 'large scale underground' radicalization of Kashmiri freedom movement.

2. Kashmiris, historically had long been resenting about political autonomy; From the days of Sheikh Abdullah. Ground situation of Kashmir, as we mostly tend to stereotype it with other Indian states is completely different for many reasons which I am sure do not need elaboration to an well informed member like you. Had New Delhi been more pragmatic in assessing the public sentiment, I think military invention would not have been required at all. This is just my observation. More informed members may or may not agree with me on this.

3. This is really unfortunate. Police in my area is corrupt, fat bellied, arrogant, abusive too. But my area does not have a violent historical background. Its people did not face insurgency for thirty long years, neither there is close psychological and ideological proximity to a neighboring country. So, some sort of policy pragmatism, top to bottom level sensitivity were needed which we failed to do.

4. About the exodus of Kashmiri Hindus, Muslims of the valley maintain that the reason behind threatening and killing of Kashmiri pandits was totally political. The so called 'mass genocide' also does not corroborate with the data available on casualties that occurred in that year. You can give Anuradha Bhasin's report a read. Instead of entirely being black and white extremes, I would rather prefer to stay balanced on this.

5. If there is unrest, let solved it by means that would show us in a more diligent light, not make us look responsible for killing innocents. It is giving Pakistan a psychological edge, deny it or not. Using pellet guns or firing above the knee is not helping. Of course the government has much pressing matter to do; controlling it's forces in a situation like this is one of those urgent matters too.

 

[Pakistani E]

I don't think either country can now militarily takeover the lands occupied by the other. This issue needs to be sorted out, it's a flashpoint that has caused immense damage to the lives of Kashmiris and violence in the whole of South Asia.

I also don't think that both nations trust each other enough to ever allow a plebiscite. Perhaps the solution is to partition the state of Jammu and Kashmir. With maybe the Vale of Kashmir going entirely to Pakistan, and the rest permanently to India?

I know this may seem bias in favour of Pakistan over India, as India would be losing land and Pakistan gaining some. But, think of it this way, Pakistan in return will renounce all rights to the other parts of state. There is also a sizeable number of Muslim majority districts in Jammu that would go to India. I don't want to act like Radcliffe again, drawing arbitrary lines on the map. But, I don't believe there is any other sensible solution to this issue. There are no significant numbers of Hindus/Sikhs/Buddhists in Pakistani parts of historical Kashmir that would even consider the notion of joining with India. India still keeps the majority of what it has, and gains in return a permanent solution and peace with Pakistan and in their areas. Not sure how this would go down in India, however.

I know there are many holes in this view, but I don't see another solution. The current status quo may benefit India in the short term, but in the longterm, it will only continue to cause violence and mistrust between Pakistan and India. If only we had sensible statesmen in our countries who genuinely thought about resolving issues, instead of thumping their chests with jingoistic rhetoric to win elections.

P.S. This is just an attempt to provide a solution. Not necessarily the only solution.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Hello, friends. It’s been long I have been away from this forum. Since then a lot has been happened in our national and international politics. Unfortunately Kashmir remains on the broil, painfully more than before. The purpose of this thread is to find out a solution of the never ending crisis of Kashmiri militancy which for the last two three years seem to have exploded with a new vigour. No matter how long we, Indians continue to evade this question, this so called once Heaven on Earth remains as a crown of thorns on our head. Although some hawks and ultranationalists attribute this rising unrest to growing Islamic fundamentalism in the valley, time has come for a serious self-introspection and acting upon it.

Why I decided to talk about this is few hours back I watched an Interview with the fathers of two militants, Burhan Wani and Saddam Padder. With absolute calmness and serenity, what the two old men revealed was in fact chilling. When asked about the difference between militancy of the 90’s and militancy of 2016, Mujaffar Wani replied,”Log encounter ki jagah se door bhagte the (in the 90’s), aaj Encounter ki jagah ki tarah bhagte hain”. According to him people no longer are scared by the police. The fear of death from their heart is completely gone. I will come to these two men again later.

As I have already said, hawks will quickly cry growing radicalism for the upsurge in militancy. But for a moment they need to ponder on the fact why increasing numbers of highly educated youths are joining militancy. Is not this enough to ring the bell that something is really going wrong?

“By blocking all peaceful means of expressing dissent, what remains is self-defence against the armed forces…the way forward is change in the status quo, where power won’t be exercised for the sake of power”

The above was posted on his FB post on 18th April’2018 by Mohammad Rafi Bhat, just month before his death. If some of you are still wondering who he was and why does his fb post matter, Rafi was Assistant Professor of Sociology in the University of Kashmir. All his students describe him as a caring, mild gentleman, intellectual with high scholarship. He always encouraged his students to read and write about Kashmir which according to him was the greatest form of protest. Then why did he decide to pick up guns. The reason lies in his fb post. All peaceful means of protest was lost. The continued killing both of militants by encounter and as well as civilians deeply disturbed him. How Kashmiris are taking the burn of thirty years of militancy, curfews, police picketing, random searches in their houses, how deep these has gone into their psyche: why are we not bringing these questions in national debates in this largest democracy is beyond my comprehension.

As per father of Wani and Padder, excess measures by security forces have reached its peaks and it is not long before even old men start taking up arms against Indian forces. Arrogant, humiliating behaviour which may not raise much hue and cry in rest of India, perhaps is a self shooting idea in Kashmir: our policy makers need to understand this very quickly before it gets out of hand. Faizan, a sixteen year old boy was shot in head, chest, and renal spleen in Pulwama. His doctor father asks a quite simple question: If Indians really think Kashmiris as their own then when they are protesting why police are not shooting according to rules and firing below the knee? In this same video, Faizan’s uncle Muhammad Shareef Poswal also speaks about his nephew. More than what he speaks it was astonishing to see the ambience he kept around him; enlarged pictures of his deceased nephew, both in living and dead. Is it too difficult for us to guess what kind of consequences we are generating by such reckless killings of teenagers?

Before it is too late, let us wake ourselves up. Let us not serve the psychological advantage in a platter to Pakistan it was badly looking for after 26/11. Let us accept that our political stand on Kashmir has been very firm but the way we intend to do it is far from being correct and effective. We cannot afford to act as Israel do with Palestine. Is it too difficult for security forces not to force a local youth to bring cigarettes for them? Is it too difficult for security forces to behave with a smile? Can’t we get rid of this Pellet gun nonsense and think about something else which could be more effective and less harmful? Permanent solution of Kashmir may be distance away, but we, Indians can do these at free of cost. Otherwise what is the use of just having a land when its people are alien to us and we are alien to them?

Please share your views: where exactly we are going wrong and what could be the measures to bring back life into the lives of Kashmiris.

@Joe Shearer @Nilgiri @nair @WAJsal @waz @hellfire Cant remember ur new user ID..

I just recently became a senior member so now I can post here

The issue of Kashmir is indeed complex but there's always a solution to a problem if all involved parties are willing. However the reason why Kashmir has gone unsolved all these years boils down to ego/lack of trust. Ego meaning that neither country wants to look weak by giving up its claim and possibly territory to its "enemy". This especially applies in case of India, which has the edge in conventional terms and therefore outright unwilling to solve this issue. In the event that there is an attempt at a solution it goes nowhere bcuz of a lack of trust. There's also the lack of trust towards Kashmiris by India/Indians. The grievances of the Kashmiris against the security forces are ignored. The many injustices that have occurred often go unpunished and hardly any action is taken against the ppl(from the security forces) involved. The unrest that exists is chalked up to Pakistan's meddling.

If we think about it monetarily...both India and Pakistan have spent billions of dollars for decades due to this Kashmir issue. The territory/resources/manpower that they would gain by having Kashmir doesn't add up to what they've already spent. For India it also creates the strategic danger of two fronts and for Pakistan the danger is having to compete with a bigger enemy. Now the stakes are even higher bcuz both are nuclear powers.

If it was up to me...I would say conduct a plebiscite under UN. Both countries withdraw, UN peacekeepers come in(all comprising of soldier from non Indian/Pakistani militaries) to keep any 1947 type of slaughter from happening. Then a plebiscite be conducted in each region Jammu/Ladakh/Indian Kashmir/Azad Kashmir/Gilgit Baltistan/etc. After the results are declared by the UN...still under their control ppl be allowed to move within a certain time. For example if a Hindu fears for his life in a Muslim majority area that voted to go to Pak...then he may freely/safely move to Ladakh(which will most likely vote for India) for example. If a Muslim fears for his life he may also freely/safely move to Kashmir(this includes the valley and Azad Kashmir, which will most likely go to Pak). Then accordingly each part be handed over to the respective country. I think Jammu and Ladakh will choose India while the rest of the region will side with Pak...which is fine as long as the Kashmiri ppl are happy and can finally live in peace. It will also be good for the region...one less flashpoint...more chance for peace.

...though it seems far fetched and a fantasy at this point.

 

[VCheng]

If it was up to me...I would say conduct a plebiscite under UN. Both countries withdraw, UN peacekeepers come in(all comprising of soldier from non Indian/Pakistani militaries) to keep any 1947 type of slaughter from happening. Then a plebiscite be conducted in each region Jammu/Ladakh/Kashmir/Azad Kashmir/Gilgit Baltistan/etc. After the results are declared by the UN...still under their control ppl be allowed to move within a certain time.

Great plan, but UN involvement is possible only if both countries agree as stipulated by the Simla Agreement.

...though it seems far fetched and a fantasy at this point.

The stalemate is therefore likely to continue.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Great plan, but UN involvement is possible only if both countries agree as stipulated by the Simla Agreement.



The stalemate is therefore likely to continue.

Right and UN involvement seems to be the only way forward as neither country would willingly withdraw to let the other in nor would they accept the results of a plebiscite as fair if the other country was in charge of it. I mentioned this lack of trust in my post...hence why my theoretical solution takes into account this lack of trust.

 

[VCheng]

Right and UN involvement seems to be the only way forward as neither country would willingly withdraw to let the other in nor would they accept the results of a plebiscite as fair if the other country was in charge of it. I mentioned this lack of trust in my post...hence why my theoretical solution takes into account this lack of trust.

The most likely outcome, realistically speaking, would be to convert the LoC into a recognized international border between the two countries.

 

[jetray]

Thanks for the response, I do agree with some of the points but as a whole it is still a very hard choice for forces on the ground. In fact forces have repeatedly pointed out this every time by saying they cannot solve political issues and it is up to the govt to handle.

1. I agree. Al Zawahiri was a doctor, Rafi was a PhD in sociology and Faesal was an IAS. Are we suggesting radicalization in Kashmir has reached to the point that existed in the society Al Zawahiri once lived? Most vulnerable to radicalization, the rural youths of Kashmir are joining militancy by peer group network. A serving IPS of Kashmir himself has debunked this popular myth of 'large scale underground' radicalization of Kashmiri freedom movement.

Look finally at the end of the day you become what you want to be and if an opportunity presents you jump to it. Geelani was a MLA before , when opportunity presented he jumped at it and now he wants to become Jinnah of kashmir.
Did any one in westernized society of Iran or afghanistan in 1960 think where they are now?
Some ppl have character and some dont, thats the difference.

2. Kashmiris, historically had long been resenting about political autonomy; From the days of Sheikh Abdullah. Ground situation of Kashmir, as we mostly tend to stereotype it with other Indian states is completely different for many reasons which I am sure do not need elaboration to an well informed member like you. Had New Delhi been more pragmatic in assessing the public sentiment, I think military invention would not have been required at all. This is just my observation. More informed members may or may not agree with me on this.

Well other than the way kashmir acceded to India I dont think they are any thing special. Central govt has always had the lackadaisical approach, dint they imposed hindi on southern states which led to a huge uproar & agitations? Most of the regional parties do not see eye to eye with the central govt on many issues that is normal. Its only some segment in kashmir who think they are special and want to be treated as such. Every idiot out there knows that plebiscite cannot held unless the UN conditions are satisfied but still PDP or NC keep harping about it, why?

3. This is really unfortunate. Police in my area is corrupt, fat bellied, arrogant, abusive too. But my area does not have a violent historical background. Its people did not face insurgency for thirty long years, neither there is close psychological and ideological proximity to a neighboring country. So, some sort of policy pragmatism, top to bottom level sensitivity were needed which we failed to do.

yes you are right, police is a legacy of british rule and they are designed to be imposing on ppl thats a fact. Now if you have a backing of external power you can simply run riot without thinking about its repercussions, that is what exactly geelani & co is doing. Theoretically it might look great on paper practically it wont work on the ground. There are too many useful idiots for hire if not one they can get another.

4. About the exodus of Kashmiri Hindus, Muslims of the valley maintain that the reason behind threatening and killing of Kashmiri pandits was totally political. The so called 'mass genocide' also does not corroborate with the data available on casualties that occurred in that year. You can give Anuradha Bhasin's report a read. Instead of entirely being black and white extremes, I would rather prefer to stay balanced on this.

Sorry , I would disagree with it. There are empirical evidence available to prove other wise. Asking for Nizam-e-mustafa is communal not political.

It might have been true initially but there was not enuf support for it in initial stage. Political movement died with maqbool bhat. Maqbool bhat was hanged in 1984 and until 1987 there was political disenchantment. Post maqbool bhat it was afghan success that rallied the movement. Only way they could get more ppl to join is by playing the religious card. There are several documented killings of minority community and mosques used as rallying point to issue threats. Every now then you will see a hurriyat lackey giving lip sympathy to kashmiriyat thats where it ends.

Even though we cannot tar evey one as a jihadi nut case but the movement as a whole is communal right now. JKLF is dead , what we have now is a communal movement.

5. If there is unrest, let solved it by means that would show us in a more diligent light, not make us look responsible for killing innocents. It is giving Pakistan a psychological edge, deny it or not. Using pellet guns or firing above the knee is not helping. Of course the government has much pressing matter to do; controlling it's forces in a situation like this is one of those urgent matters too.

Yes and No.
We should certainly look at more good ways to isolate the trouble making elements and punish them instead of acting on gullible innocents being used as cannon fodder by the trouble makers.
It is certainly a thing to do no doubt about it, it is not just a question of projecting a good image but also ensures innocent ppl dont become victims in the political chess game. But current govt has preferred a hammer & tong.

If you look at the overall picture ,
1) As long as current govt is in power what ever it does will always be seen in communal light, there is no escape from that as such there will always be enuf idiots who can be hired to create trouble by raking in communal angle.
2) World no longer cares about the religious based separatists movements and in fact they shun it post 9/11. As such other than Pakistan crying hoarse we should not be worried about it.
There will be unfortunate collateral damage and pakistan is bound to take advantage of it.

 

[Cookie Monster]

The most likely outcome, realistically speaking, would be to convert the LoC into a recognized international border between the two countries.

I think for now all outcomes are unlikely including the one u suggested. Like I said before...India has the advantage conventionally and therefore India considers that its chances fair well with taking all of Kashmir.

Secondly no Indian politician would give up the claim to Pak's side of Kashmir bcuz it would be a political suicide for them. The whole narrative has been built on Pakistan bashing especially under current BJP leadership painting a "strong man modi" picture and showing Congress as "weak". As far as politicians in the subcontinent go...no one will be willing to end their political careers to do what's right.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Welcome back my dear friend.
In terms of confidence building measures a reduction in force numbers will be a start and less intrusive search operations. I like the idea of a more friendly face i.e. helping local Kashmiris and so on and of course getting rid of harsh counter measures during demos e.g. the pellet guns.

I'll be honest there really can only be one solution i.e. finish off the business of partition or hold a free vote, yes that also includes my ancestral land of AJK.
Partition would be all of Kashmir going to Pakistan, but would Ladakh and Jammu accept this, not at all.
A free vote should be held with a simple join Pakistan or join India, as neither will accept independence of Kashmir, and a landlocked state with ethnic strife will simply divide again. The vote would see AJK, The Northern Areas and the Valley would want to go with Pakistan, but again you will have the issue of Jammu and Ladakh, who would want to remain with India, so in theory it could be split along these lines.
But then you can just keep things as they are and both countries accept the LOC as the IB and shake hands, but then Kashmir I feel is lost forever now with generation after generation against India now, and Pakistanis still see Kashmir as their land and its people as part of them. Indians on the whole feel the same and believe Kashmir has ancient ties to the Hindu faith and too much time, blood etc has been spent to give it up to Pakistan.

In simple terms a solution is far, far away.

I came back to this thread after some time away, getting involved with some complete nonsense elsewhere. In this post, I'd like to address certain very specific observations made by @waz: please be sure that the intention is to correct facts or to comment on them, not to enter into battle.

1. A reduction in force numbers on the Indian side is unlikely given both the constant and unremitting pressure by the Pakistan military, and given the need to deal with demonstrations of disaffection with the least violence that is possible, without it if at all possible. Regarding the pressure, it is not just the regular military pressure, but the additional pressure of knowing that the Pakistani penchant for organising and deploying 'irregular' forces, and for describing them as 'non-state actors' started in Kashmir, in 1947.
2. It may surprise some to know that pellet guns, thought to be non-lethal, were introduced to de-escalate the level of violence; other lesser crowd management measures like water cannons were too unwieldy to penetrate all possible areas of demonstrative dissent. They have turned out to be a nightmare.
3. Any resistance to the possibility of a permanent resolution should be hunted down, in real life as well as in social life; it is criminal to continue to allow Indian citizens to go through this. The options are the only realistic ones.
4. The post by @waz raised important points, and these need to be addressed; the first and foremost being to remind ourselves about the totally synthetic nature of the princely state. It was put together, in the first place, piece by baffling jigsaw puzzle piece, by the Dogras; there was nothing intrinscally integral about the state. It was a piece of property, owned by the Jammu Dogras; getting sentimental about it is strange to see. It is easy to disassemble and to quit 2
5. The foundation for the Indian commitment to continued administration of Kashmir is anything but a blind, unwilling and ultimately cynical retention of the Vale for the sake of a pig-headed obstinacy creating a problem where there is none. This is the Pakistani impression, without a doubt; it is disheartening to see that it is believed with such little questioning. It is also what a section of the Indian, the fringe elements in full-retard mode, believes. A third element that shares this belief is a segment of the government servants responsible directly or indirectly for the administration of Kashmir, located either at Delhi or in Srinagar. This shared belief, shared between the explicit enemy of the Indian state and the implicit enemy, is totally wrong.
6. Kashmir is important to the Indian state for precisely the reason that it is important to the Pakistani state: as a living demonstration of the philosophy or the justification for each state to have come into being. Without labouring the point about the Pakistani point of view, already admirably summarised by @waz , it might be mentioned about the Indian point of view that India sought freedom to build a state based on equality, specifically rejecting any design of the state that would favour a section of the population, any section as higher than any other. For that reason alone, the ability to prove that a largely Muslim section could remain part of the Union becomes critical; there are other parts where there is a large segment of Muslims, Oudh, for instance, or the city of Bombay/ Mumbai, for another, Hyderabad, Bhopal, W. Bengal, and so on; Kashmir, however, is a whole state, and its disposition will serve as dog-whistles to other parts of the population.
7. Add to this India's predisposition to constitutionalism and her strenuous attempts to build a culture based on the rule of law, her tendency to see and to project the entire question in terms of a natural and simply resolved study of the application of law, and the opposite predisposition to classify Pakistan's attempts as typical of that nation's constant attempts to attain desired objectives without any legal foundation has led to a great deal of mutual irritation. Even while considering this very issue, the manner in which Pakistan sought to annex the state is seen to demonstrate precisely the difference between the two states and their world-view.

Please note that this above is an attempt to clarify certain points in the post by @waz.

 

[VCheng]

I think for now all outcomes are unlikely including the one u suggested. Like I said before...India has the advantage conventionally and therefore India considers that its chances fair well with taking all of Kashmir.

Secondly no Indian politician would give up the claim to Pak's side of Kashmir bcuz it would be a political suicide for them. The whole narrative has been built on Pakistan bashing especially under current BJP leadership painting a "strong man modi" picture and showing Congress as "weak". As far as politicians in the subcontinent go...no one will be willing to end their political careers to do what's right.

For now, the stalemate will continue, until the inevitable conversion of the LoC into a recognized international border can be brought about at some point in the future can be brought about, barring a catastrophic collapse on either side, or both.

 

[scorpionx]

Thanks for the response, I do agree with some of the points but as a whole it is still a very hard choice for forces on the ground. In fact forces have repeatedly pointed out this every time by saying they cannot solve political issues and it is up to the govt to handle.


Look finally at the end of the day you become what you want to be and if an opportunity presents you jump to it. Geelani was a MLA before , when opportunity presented he jumped at it and now he wants to become Jinnah of kashmir.
Did any one in westernized society of Iran or afghanistan in 1960 think where they are now?
Some ppl have character and some dont, thats the difference.


Well other than the way kashmir acceded to India I dont think they are any thing special. Central govt has always had the lackadaisical approach, dint they imposed hindi on southern states which led to a huge uproar & agitations? Most of the regional parties do not see eye to eye with the central govt on many issues that is normal. Its only some segment in kashmir who think they are special and want to be treated as such. Every idiot out there knows that plebiscite cannot held unless the UN conditions are satisfied but still PDP or NC keep harping about it, why?


yes you are right, police is a legacy of british rule and they are designed to be imposing on ppl thats a fact. Now if you have a backing of external power you can simply run riot without thinking about its repercussions, that is what exactly geelani & co is doing. Theoretically it might look great on paper practically it wont work on the ground. There are too many useful idiots for hire if not one they can get another.


Sorry , I would disagree with it. There are empirical evidence available to prove other wise. Asking for Nizam-e-mustafa is communal not political.

It might have been true initially but there was not enuf support for it in initial stage. Political movement died with maqbool bhat. Maqbool bhat was hanged in 1984 and until 1987 there was political disenchantment. Post maqbool bhat it was afghan success that rallied the movement. Only way they could get more ppl to join is by playing the religious card. There are several documented killings of minority community and mosques used as rallying point to issue threats. Every now then you will see a hurriyat lackey giving lip sympathy to kashmiriyat thats where it ends.

Even though we cannot tar evey one as a jihadi nut case but the movement as a whole is communal right now. JKLF is dead , what we have now is a communal movement.


Yes and No.
We should certainly look at more good ways to isolate the trouble making elements and punish them instead of acting on gullible innocents being used as cannon fodder by the trouble makers.
It is certainly a thing to do no doubt about it, it is not just a question of projecting a good image but also ensures innocent ppl dont become victims in the political chess game. But current govt has preferred a hammer & tong.

If you look at the overall picture ,
1) As long as current govt is in power what ever it does will always be seen in communal light, there is no escape from that as such there will always be enuf idiots who can be hired to create trouble by raking in communal angle.
2) World no longer cares about the religious based separatists movements and in fact they shun it post 9/11. As such other than Pakistan crying hoarse we should not be worried about it.
There will be unfortunate collateral damage and pakistan is bound to take advantage of it.

The discussion enters into broader spectrum. Will respond as soon as I get time.

 

[Hamza913]

LOC will become IB make no mistakes

I doubt it will ever be officially recognised as such by both parties (for the foreseeable future).

If you want a solution to a problem, you need to recognize it as it is.

If you try and shift the focus towards Islam as a whole, you will never achieve peace and will probably just make things worse for yourself.

3. Problem lies on the other side of LOC ,are we going to ignore where they get their training ? Who funds them ? Who provides weapons ?

You've tried to tackle the problem of Pakistan/Pakistanis ensuring the insurgency remains active, and you've failed. You cannot stop us.

Stop returning bodies to the families ,bury them in undisclosed locations.

Such a move will only further the cause of the insurgents.

Focus on Pakistan ,expose their state sponsor of terrorism and build support against it and create economic pressure.

You've tried and failed.