Is Chinese WZ-10 Attack Helicopter, Good for PAF?

[Jigs]

TAI/AgustaWestland T-129 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

check this

it is just a upgraded varient of agusta westland

This has already been discussed it is confirmed and turkey can export the T-129 variant on its own to any country besides Italy and the UK. We have rights to this variant just like the Italians have the right to the base platform A-129. This was what the contract was signed for. Agusta Westland btw is the company name. A-129 is their attack helicopter. We upgraded the avionics,engines and integrated our own weapons systems creating the T-129 variant that we have full export rights too.


So if pakistan says we want to buy some T-129s then it will be turkey exporting this specific variant. If they want A-129s then they will be talking to Italy about it.

 

[cabatli_53]

This has already been discussed it is confirmed and turkey can export the T-129 variant on its own to any country besides Italy and the UK. We have rights to this variant just like the Italians have the right to the base platform A-129. This was what the contract was signed for. Agusta Westland btw is the company name. A-129 is their attack helicopter. We upgraded the avionics,engines and integrated our own weapons systems creating the T-129 variant that we have full export rights too.


So if pakistan says we want to buy some T-129s then it will be turkey exporting this specific variant. If they want A-129s then they will be talking to Italy about it.

We have discussed all those things thousands of times with safe international sources including Agusta's webpage informations about T-129 Atak and This Indian is coming with a Wiki source and want us to prove adverse.

Again, Check this and previous pages and sources instead of talking nonsense...

http://www.defence.pk/forums/land-f...k-helicopter-being-eveluated-pakistan-18.html

 

[Parashuram1]

^ Z 10 is almost been abandoned so i think T-129 ATAK would be my choice..

But the T-129 is a specially configured version for the Turkish military by Augusta Westland. TAI is assembled it but I doubt that AW would let Turkey re-sell something like that and gain 100% from it.

Pakistan IMO has three options:

1) A-129 directly from AW
2) AH-64 directly from Boeing
3) AH-2 Rooivalk AH-2 from Denel
4) Eurocopter Tiger
5) Russian Mi-28 or Ka-50

I believe that unless and until the Chinese are satisfied, you will have to rely on other tried and tested gunships. Since most of you Pakistani members are apprehensive about American products, you could consider Denel's AH-2 or Tiger.

 

[alibaz]

I think T-129 should be the best option for PA cause am not sure US will be willing to sell us Apaches or sell without strings or will not be embargoed. I think we should go for T-129 and may be some Z-10 after they get mature in 5 years time

 

[Jigs]

But the T-129 is a specially configured version for the Turkish military by Augusta Westland. TAI is assembled it but I doubt that AW would let Turkey re-sell something like that and gain 100% from it.

Pakistan IMO has three options:

1) A-129 directly from AW
2) AH-64 directly from Boeing
3) AH-2 Rooivalk AH-2 from Denel
4) Eurocopter Tiger
5) Russian Mi-28 or Ka-50

I believe that unless and until the Chinese are satisfied, you will have to rely on other tried and tested gunships. Since most of you Pakistani members are apprehensive about American products, you could consider Denel's AH-2 or Tiger.

Under the agreement Turkey will be selling the T-129 variant. Pakistan has also talked to turkey and shown interest in the attack helicopter. The T-129 is also configured by TAI not Agusta. The avionics and weapons are turkish made while the engines (CTS800-4N) are under license builds at TEI and upgrade to the A-129 engines.

 

[cabatli_53]

But the T-129 is a specially configured version for the Turkish military by Augusta Westland. TAI is assembled it but I doubt that AW would let Turkey re-sell something like that and gain 100% from it.

Pakistan IMO has three options:

1) A-129 directly from AW
2) AH-64 directly from Boeing
3) AH-2 Rooivalk AH-2 from Denel
4) Eurocopter Tiger
5) Russian Mi-28 or Ka-50

I believe that unless and until the Chinese are satisfied, you will have to rely on other tried and tested gunships. Since most of you Pakistani members are apprehensive about American products, you could consider Denel's AH-2 or Tiger.

Some members, Especially Indians have to practise reading the official and international text posted about subjects instead of talking nonsense without having any single idea What they are talking about. After We have told tens of page about a subject with many sources, I expected The people who read those pages, should understand what We have discussed but Already Some members are telling that AW do not give permission Turkey to sell T-129... bla bla bla..

Interesting !!!

If you have eyes, I expect You will see what I will post now...

Pakistani defence minister has visited SSM as an invetee of TAI to talk about T-129 Atak helicopter likely export and cooperations...

Again, Check those pages !!!
http://www.defence.pk/forums/land-f...k-helicopter-being-eveluated-pakistan-18.html

 

[Nishan_101]

I will always say that 80-100 Z-10 will be best for PA with the TOT/Licence Production agreement been done with PAC to produce it in Paksitan. And as we are able to develop H-2 & H-4 IR-Homing Stand-off weapons and also we have develop Falco(with its complete sensor suite) then it will be best to develop our own IR-Homing Guided Rockets and Anti-Tank/Anti Armour Missiles for our Attack Choppers that we are procuring, and also to produce Man portable Anti-Tank/Anti Armour Missiles(like Javelin/Tow) that will reduced the future cost of buying weapons and open our export market. And we could also develop ASRAAM.

 

[blufmaster]

I agree with trying to purchase as many Apache Longbow as we can.

It was great of Geroge Bush to designate Pakistan as a Major non-NATO ally (MNNA). We are open to acquire vastly more weapons & military hardware than not being one.

ARE YOU GUYS KIDDING...........Y AMERICA IS GOING TO SELL APACHE TO PAKISTAN.THEY ARE NOT MAD YET.ITS ENOUGH THEY ARE GIVING COBRA`S
SEEMS LIKE ENDLESS LINE OF APACHE LONGBOW

 

[Mani2020]

ARE YOU GUYS KIDDING...........Y AMERICA IS GOING TO SELL APACHE TO PAKISTAN.THEY ARE NOT MAD YET.ITS ENOUGH THEY ARE GIVING COBRA`S
SEEMS LIKE ENDLESS LINE OF APACHE LONGBOW

And are you kidding me? what was the need for digging a ~5 months old thread?

 

[Major Shaitan Singh]

Ka-50 Hokum Specifications
Primary Function: Anti-armor helicopter

Contractor: Kamov

Crew: One (Two in Ka-52)

Unit Cost: N/A

Powerplant
Two Klimov TV3-117VK turboshaft rated at 2,226 shp (1660kW) each

Dimensions
Fuselage Length: 44 ft, 3.5 in (13.5 m) -- excluding gun and probe
Rotor Diameter: 45 ft, 6.9 in (14.5 m)
Height: 17 ft, 8.6 in (5.4 m)

Weights
Empty: 7,692 kg
Maximum Takeoff: 16,534 lb (7,500 kg)

Performance
Speed: 188kt (350km/h / 217 mph)
Ceiling: 13,125 ft (4000m)
Combat Radius: 135nm (250km / 155 mi)

Armament
One 2A42 30-mm cannon; up to 16 AT-9 Vikhr anti-armor missiles; AS-12 'Kegler' guided missiles; 80 S-8 80mm rockets;AAM and ARMs



Mi-28 Havoc Specifications
Primary Function: Attack helicopter

Contractor: Mil

Crew: Two - pilot (rear) and a navigator/weapons operator (front)

Unit Cost: N/A

Powerplant
Two 2070shp (1545kW) Klimov TV3-117VM turboshafts driving a five blade main rotor and four blade tail rotor

Dimensions
Fuselage Length: 55 ft, 9 in (17.01 m)
Rotor Diameter: 56 ft, 5 in (17.2 m)
Height: 12 ft, 7 in (3.82 m)

Weights
Empty: 17,845lb (8095kg) -- equipped
Maximum Takeoff: 25,705lb (11,660kg)

Performance
Speed: 162kt (300km/h / 184.8 mph)
Ceiling: 19,020ft
Range: 595nm (1100km) -- (w/ reserves)

Armament
One 30 mm NPPU-28 cannon
SA-16 Gimlet AAMs
AT-6 Spiral AT missiles
130 mm or 80 mm rockets



The Mi-28N and Kamov Ka-50 are competing to fulfil the Russian Army Aviation requirement for a night-capable anti-tank helicopter, a replacement to the Mi-24 created 25 years ago. The Mi-28N is based on the Mi-28A, a daylight helicopter first flown in December 1982. In comparison with the AH-64D Longbow Apache, the 10,5-ton Mi-28N is some 2.5 tons heavier, partly due to its more powerful cannon. In general the two helicopters have similar flight performance. Two Klimov TV-3-117 engines of 2,200 hp each allow the Russian aircraft to show a maximum level speed of 300 km/h and maximum climb at sea-level of 13.6 meters per second.


Ka-50 and Mi-28 can work together because they don't do the same job. Ka-50 can take the armor out and Mi-28 can take on anybody else. In some places though Ka-50 and Mi-28 can't work together because Mi-28 can go on far missions while Ka-50 just stays close to the base for protection.

But if Russia does have to pick from the two, it would be the Mi-28 because it has close to what Ka-50 has plus more other combat material. Russia though doesn't have to pick from the two because they have different missions.

Also a good comparesent(spelling) to the Mi-28 is an Apache AH-64. Apache AH-64 is the main Mi-28 opponent. But the Mi-28 outperformce the Apache in many ways. First of all Mi-28 has better weapons and therefore it is better armed.

 

[Tajdar adil]

We need all of them AH 64. ZS 10. Tai 129. Euro Tiger..
Because India have more 484 combat choppers so we need all of this as soon as possible..

 

[fatman17]

We need all of them AH 64. ZS 10. Tai 129. Euro Tiger..
Because India have more 484 combat choppers so we need all of this as soon as possible..

good one!!! even US does not have that many combat choppers - BTW do u know what 'combat helo' stands for?

 

[fatman17]

^guys pls note pakistan evaluates all kinds of weapons systems / platforms. it dosnt mean it is going to purchase them. we are developing a very meaningful defence collanoration with Turkey and the T-129 could be a 'long-term' development for pakistan