Iraq to buy 12 JF-17 Thunder jets from Pakistan

[Windjammer]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1442810120954650630

 

[iLION12345_1]

A usually reputable Iraqi source has also said this deal is happening, Hopefully we get official confirmation Soon.

 

[Keysersoze]

So wait,was the Argentina deal fake news or not? What's going on?

Apparently the Argentines are looking at the JF17. But they might be looking at other options as well (5 Apparently) and the request for money was just that A request.

"In a statement, Argentinian MoD said: “The Ministry of Defense informs that, by means of a Public Credit Operations Authorization note, it has requested the inclusion for the 2022 Budget of the authorisation to manage credit for up to $664m for the acquisition of multipurpose fighter aircraft, for the surveillance and control of the air space.

“Likewise, this ministry clarifies that it has not been issued regarding the purchase of supersonic aircraft of any origin and is in the technical-economic and financial evaluation stage of five alternatives.”


The JF-17 Thunder is a single-engine, lightweight, multipurpose combat aircraft that was developed jointly by Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation (CAC) of China and Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) of Pakistan.

The newest variant JF-17 Block-III features an electronically scanned radar and many advanced electronics.

According to sources, South Korean FA-50 aircraft, Swedish firm Saab’s Gripen multirole fighter jet and more are the other potential options"

 

[Crimson Blue]

So wait,was the Argentina deal fake news or not? What's going on?

Argentina denies it has purchased JF-17 from Pakistan

 

[Foinikas]

Apparently the Argentines are looking at the JF17. But they might be looking at other options as well (5 Apparently) and the request for money was just that A request.

"In a statement, Argentinian MoD said: “The Ministry of Defense informs that, by means of a Public Credit Operations Authorization note, it has requested the inclusion for the 2022 Budget of the authorisation to manage credit for up to $664m for the acquisition of multipurpose fighter aircraft, for the surveillance and control of the air space.

“Likewise, this ministry clarifies that it has not been issued regarding the purchase of supersonic aircraft of any origin and is in the technical-economic and financial evaluation stage of five alternatives.”


The JF-17 Thunder is a single-engine, lightweight, multipurpose combat aircraft that was developed jointly by Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation (CAC) of China and Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) of Pakistan.

The newest variant JF-17 Block-III features an electronically scanned radar and many advanced electronics.

According to sources, South Korean FA-50 aircraft, Swedish firm Saab’s Gripen multirole fighter jet and more are the other potential options"

I can imagine Argentina buying the Gripen. But they could buy 12 JF-17s too!

 

[Ali_Baba]

I can imagine Argentina buying the Gripen. But they could buy 12 JF-17s too!

The UK manufactures parts for the Gripen - so there is a UK veto there. Same with the Korean ( political veto, not industrial unless they want UK eject seats and Meteors AAMs ). Argentinas only options are F16s(cause the USA dont give a crap), Russian and Chinese.

If Argentina has taken a look at Zuhai 2021 they should be see which country (Russia, China) has industry momentum. You are looking to buy a product with a shelf life of 30-40 years from start to finish..

The Mig-35 is an old design that is a dead end as far as mid-life upgrades go and addition of new weapons etc.

China is the only game in town for Argentina.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Not my most immediate concern , I rather see Pakistan Airforce Arm up first with another
150 JF17 Block 3

 

[khanasifm]

Apparently the Argentines are looking at the JF17. But they might be looking at other options as well (5 Apparently) and the request for money was just that A request.

"In a statement, Argentinian MoD said: “The Ministry of Defense informs that, by means of a Public Credit Operations Authorization note, it has requested the inclusion for the 2022 Budget of the authorisation to manage credit for up to $664m for the acquisition of multipurpose fighter aircraft, for the surveillance and control of the air space.

“Likewise, this ministry clarifies that it has not been issued regarding the purchase of supersonic aircraft of any origin and is in the technical-economic and financial evaluation stage of five alternatives.”


The JF-17 Thunder is a single-engine, lightweight, multipurpose combat aircraft that was developed jointly by Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation (CAC) of China and Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) of Pakistan.

The newest variant JF-17 Block-III features an electronically scanned radar and many advanced electronics.

According to sources, South Korean FA-50 aircraft, Swedish firm Saab’s Gripen multirole fighter jet and more are the other potential options"

Doubt that 12 jas-39 or f-50 would cost 664 mil and f-50 already issued with British components which is also case for grippen where bae is partner anyway Argentinas, Chinese and pak can work it out it’s no one business except the buyer ans seller

 

[Keysersoze]

I can imagine Argentina buying the Gripen. But they could buy 12 JF-17s too!

The Gripen option was already "Shot down" so to speak back in 2015. The FA50 likewise in 2019. I am guessing the F16 and a Russian option are the others on the table. The Russian option will be too expensive (With probably higher maintenance costs) This is why I believe the F16 will be the likely winner. But if there are complications with the US then the JF17 will likely be the next option. But my money is on the US trying to keep Chinese influence to a minimum in South America with F16s. They have already sold blk 52s to Chile so it would not create any military imbalances in the region.

 

[Keysersoze]

Doubt that 12 jas-39 or f-50 would cost 664 mil and f-50 already issued with British components which is also case for grippen where bae is partner anyway Argentinas, Chinese and pak can work it out it’s no one business except the buyer ans seller

The Gripen and FA50 have already been "Shot down" so to speak but you have forgotten about the USA and the Russians. The Americans will not let Argentina slide into the Chinese camp without at least trying to do something. The Argentine airforce has always prefer Western equipment (Or compatible) hence their trying to get the Gripen and FA50. The Russians ask too much and their aircraft are all twin engine which equate to higher maintenance costs.

 

[araz]

The Gripen and FA50 have already been "Shot down" so to speak but you have forgotten about the USA and the Russians. The Americans will not let Argentina slide into the Chinese camp without at least trying to do something. The Argentine airforce has always prefer Western equipment (Or compatible) hence their trying to get the Gripen and FA50. The Russians ask too much and their aircraft are all twin engine which equate to higher maintenance costs.

Cost might be an issue. They certainly wont get Bl 52 with weaponry for 600 odd million dollars. PAF with established infrastructure was getting 8 bl.52s for 800 odd million dollars. Establishment of infrastructure for the Argentinians will be more expensive. However refurbished Bl.52s may be a possibility but infrastructure will still have to be set up which might hike up the cost.
A

 

[Beast]

The Gripen and FA50 have already been "Shot down" so to speak but you have forgotten about the USA and the Russians. The Americans will not let Argentina slide into the Chinese camp without at least trying to do something. The Argentine airforce has always prefer Western equipment (Or compatible) hence their trying to get the Gripen and FA50. The Russians ask too much and their aircraft are all twin engine which equate to higher maintenance costs.

There is nothing US can do to stop Argentina from embracing China.

Argentina vs UK, which US prefer as strategic partner? US sells weapon to Argentina will be a betrayal to UK and weaken UK stand in continue as the AUKUS. Even really US sells weapon to Argentina ,will Argentina even willing to buy given US most likely will side with UK by jamming the weapon sold to them or given out source code or delay logistic in case of an Argentina vs UK conflict.

If I am Argentina, it will be no brainer to take Chinese weapon as it can ensure continue support in case of embargo from UK. There is no point taking a sophisticated weapon which they cant use on UK. It is as good as throwing away the money.

Argentina denies it has purchased JF-17 from Pakistan

Of cos Argentina never purchase JF-17 from Pakistan. They directly deal with China. This kind of statement is to avoid backlash for Pakistan with regards to concern by UK.

 

[Keysersoze]

Cost might be an issue. They certainly wont get Bl 52 with weaponry for 600 odd million dollars. PAF with established infrastructure was getting 8 bl.52s for 800 odd million dollars. Establishment of infrastructure for the Argentinians will be more expensive. However refurbished Bl.52s may be a possibility but infrastructure will still have to be set up which might hike up the cost.
A

The F16 has been offered before and only rejected because of the airframe life. The cost might be lower if they give the F16s as EDA and only charge for the upgrades. It cost Pakistan 1.3 Billion for 60 upgrade kits ,so roughly 260 million for 12 airframes. The rest could easily go to UP/STAR upgrades/ muntions and Airfield upgrades.

It depends How badly the US wants to keep Argentina out of the Chinese camp. The Argentine forces were always strongly anti communist and have always used Western based equipment.

 

[Keysersoze]

There is nothing US can do to stop Argentina from embracing China.

Argentina vs UK, which US prefer as strategic partner? US sells weapon to Argentina will be a betrayal to UK and weaken UK stand in continue as the AUKUS. Even really US sells weapon to Argentina ,will Argentina even willing to buy given US most likely will side with UK by jamming the weapon sold to them or given out source code or delay logistic in case of an Argentina vs UK conflict.

If I am Argentina, it will be no brainer to take Chinese weapon as it can ensure continue support in case of embargo from UK. There is no point taking a sophisticated weapon which they cant use on UK. It is as good as throwing away the money.

Of cos Argentina never purchase JF-17 from Pakistan. They directly deal with China. This kind of statement is to avoid backlash for Pakistan with regards to concern by UK.

You need to read more about Argentine history and their dislike of Communists. The US will do what they need to to keep their interests safe. The AUKUS pact shows that. The risk to the Falklands from 12 aircraft is very low and the Argentine armed forces are a complete mess. The UK (is Part of AUKUS BTW) will balance the risk of letting the Argentines have a few planes and letting China in the door. 12 F16's will not make that much of difference and won't break UK-US relations.

Also people need to stop with the Myopic "Falklands" view of this purchase. The Argentine navy has only 15 out 42 ships functional and rarely puts to sea. They wouldn't even have a proper landing ship available to land troops. The army is also falling apart. Add this to the state of the airforce and Argentina won't be a threat to anyone for decades.

 

[Windjammer]

ENGLISHDEFENCE
JF-17 Thunder: Iraq would be the next customer of the Sino/Pakistani fighter


PorGASTÓN DUBOIS
-
27/09/2021


As per information reported, Pakistan would have already obtained a new export order for the JF-17 Thunder, this time from Iraq, which intends to purchase a dozen fighters in its advanced Block III version.

According to the Pakistani media The Nation, high-level military sources have reported the information that several rounds of negotiations took place between Pakistan and Iraq this year, and that these concluded with the recent visit of the Iraqi defense delegation, headed by the Deputy Commander of the Iraqi Air Force, Major General (Pilot) Muhammad Majeed Mahmood and other officials.




Insiders claim that the defense agreement was approved by the Iraqi and Pakistani governments and a formal agreement is expected to be signed in Islamabad next month. The Iraqi government has approved an outlay of $664 million for the purchase of 12 JF-17 Thunder Block III fighter jets from Pakistan.

Iraqi Defense Minister Lt. Gen. Juma Inad Saadoun earlier visited Pakistan in May, when he held meetings with Pakistani leaders and officials and discussed Iraq’s interest in purchasing the JF-17 Thunder fighter jets.


Pakistan previously hosted a major defense exhibition in Baghdad in April 2021, where the JF-17 Thunder featured prominently and attracted a lot of attention. A month earlier, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Committee, General Nadeem Raza also visited Iraq and met with local senior defense officials and discussed defense cooperation between the two countries.

JF-17 Block III prototype

Currently the JF-17 Thunder Block III is in production at the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) for the Pakistani Air Force, and it is expected that, after the signing of the contract, the production of the Iraqi aircraft will commence. Argentina is also expected to make a decision on its next supersonic fighter. Following the mention of this specific model in the fiscal year 2022 budget proposal (later rectified) presented to the Argentine congress, hopes are high that the Thunder will also wear the Argentine Air Force (FAA) badge in the future.