Iraq F16 Blk 52's slightly inferior

[Indus Falcon]

Iraq F16 Blk 52's slightly inferior
In terms of its front-line fighters, its chosen F-16IQ Block 52s show a pattern of slight downgrades from the more advanced F-16C/D Block 52 base systems. The official export request’s determined avoidance of sophisticated air to ground weapons like GPS-guided JDAMs, or advanced air-to-air missiles, also seems designed to assuage regional fears. The net effect seems cleverly calibrated to give Iraq an air defense force that can handle aging threats from Syria or Iran relatively well, and perform strike missions within Iraq, without being a serious threat to more advanced air forces in the region. Regional memories among its Arab neighbors, as well as Israeli concerns, make that a smart starting point. Upgrades can always take place later, and the F-16IQs have at least some of the equipment required to handle more advanced weapons
The New Iraqi Air Force: F-16IQ Block 52 Fighters

 

[Falcon29]

Which Arab nation doesn't have an inferior air force in comparison to Israel's?

This article explained it well, although with an exception. Iraq doesn't seek protecting from Syria or Iran, they actively support each other.

 

[That Guy]

Which Arab nation doesn't have an inferior air force in comparison to Israel's?

This article explained it well, although with an exception. Iraq doesn't seek protecting from Syria or Iran, they actively support each other.

I'm going to address the bolded part. Right now, Saudi Arabia has better equipment, and aircrafts than Israel, and in large enough numbers to rival Israel. What KSA lacks is experience which Israel has in strides.

 

[Falcon29]

I'm going to address the bolded part. Right now, Saudi Arabia has better equipment, and aircrafts than Israel, and in large enough numbers to rival Israel. What KSA lacks is experience which Israel has in strides.

And you base that on...?

Israel is allowed much flexibility on their Air Force and they have a developed military industry. Not to mention their relations with the West which allows them to acquire their military needs at times of need or not. So their Air Force is effective since it has an opportunity to be effective. They have assurances for munitions and other technology.

Saudi Arabia doesn't have a developed military industry or experience as you mentioned. Even if they do get good training. What would their Air Force mean if it was put to test? We don't really know. And please don't tell me they don't seek war. I acknowledge that, but what's important is what they can secure in an event of a war. If they can't secure any support in the form of intelligence, resupplied munitions, etc... like Israel does then it doesn't mean much.

For Saudi Arabians here don't get upset at me, I love Saudi Arabia and wish the best for them. I want to see a Saudi Arabia with multiple plans in other words. I don't want something where I don't know what to expect.

 

[That Guy]

And you base that on...?

Israel is allowed much flexibility on their Air Force and they have a developed military industry. Not to mention their relations with the West which allows them to acquire their military needs at times of need or not. So their Air Force is effective since it has an opportunity to be effective. They have assurances for munitions and other technology.

Saudi Arabia doesn't have a developed military industry or experience as you mentioned. Even if they do get good training. What would their Air Force mean if it was put to test? We don't really know. And please don't tell me they don't seek war. I acknowledge that, but what's important is what they can secure in an event of a war. If they can't secure any support in the form of intelligence, resupplied munitions, etc... like Israel does then it doesn't mean much.

For Saudi Arabians here don't get upset at me, I love Saudi Arabia and wish the best for them. I want to see a Saudi Arabia with multiple plans in other words. I don't want something where I don't know what to expect.

I think you're basing your opinion on the past. Today's reality is different, and Saudi Arabia can get tech quite easily from the US, if it pushes for it hard enough. The recent massive upgradation of KSA's F-15 fleet is an example of just how ambitious KSA's military programs are getting, and from what I've heard, they're starting to develop a modern defense industry, which may take a while, but will be worth it.

Having said that, in the event of a war with today's equipment that KSA and Israel have on them, Israel would only win out because of their superior training. Israel's problem is that it can only deploy a limited amount of equipment at a time, which is why it has always relied on quality over quantity, but with KSA's military force on the rise, that qualitative edge may be losing it's sharpness.

 

[Falcon29]

I think you're basing your opinion on the past. Today's reality is different, and Saudi Arabia can get tech quite easily from the US, if it pushes for it hard enough. The recent massive upgradation of KSA's F-15 fleet is an example of just how ambitious KSA's military programs are getting, and from what I've heard, they're starting to develop a modern defense industry, which may take a while, but will be worth it.

Having said that, in the event of a war with today's equipment that KSA and Israel have on them, Israel would only win out because of their superior training. Israel's problem is that it can only deploy a limited amount of equipment at a time, which is why it has always relied on quality over quantity, but with KSA's military force on the rise, that qualitative edge may be losing it's sharpness.

You're misunderstanding me. With Israel, they get a green light, intelligence support, resupply of munitions, funding for missile systems, Western support if it get's out of hand. Not to mention Jewish lobbyists who can have an impact on the policies of other states.

Saudi Arabia can't get that, unless the West wants to pitch them against Iran to keep all of us preoccupied with fighting each other. Anything that damages Israel's interests won't be supported.

 

[That Guy]

You're misunderstanding me. With Israel, they get a green light, intelligence support, resupply of munitions, funding for missile systems, Western support if it get's out of hand. Not to mention Jewish lobbyists who can have an impact on the policies of other states.

Saudi Arabia can't get that, unless the West wants to pitch them against Iran to keep all of us preoccupied with fighting each other. Anything that damages Israel's interests won't be supported.

I don't know about that, you say that as if KSA wouldn't receive any support from foreign nations at all. For one thing, it would give China and Russia a new market for their military equipment, because the US would have abandoned the KSA. No doubt other Muslim nations would also come to aid KSA, Pakistan would be one of them. I don't doubt for a second that Pakistani military commanders would be involved in advising the KSA, or using their own intel networks against Israel.

But, this is all hypothetical.

 

[Indus Falcon]

I don't know about that, you say that as if KSA wouldn't receive any support from foreign nations at all. For one thing, it would give China and Russia a new market for their military equipment, because the US would have abandoned the KSA. No doubt other Muslim nations would also come to aid Israel, Pakistan would be one of them. I don't doubt for a second that Pakistani military commanders would be involved in advising the KSA, or using their own intel networks against Israel.

But, this is all hypothetical.

Say What?

 

[That Guy]

Say What?

oops, I meant KSA, sorry, my mistake.

[Edit]: Fixed, thanks for catching that.

 

[Falcon29]

I don't know about that, you say that as if KSA wouldn't receive any support from foreign nations at all. For one thing, it would give China and Russia a new market for their military equipment, because the US would have abandoned the KSA. No doubt other Muslim nations would also come to aid Israel, Pakistan would be one of them. I don't doubt for a second that Pakistani military commanders would be involved in advising the KSA, or using their own intel networks against Israel.

But, this is all hypothetical.

China and Russia are the only two alternatives. The problem is I don't trust Russia and neither do Arabs. In the past Russia claimed to support Arabs but behind the doors have benefits to Israelis. As for China, neither do I think they would make any effort to support Saudi Arabia. So we have can only rely on Muslim nations. Which all are struggling at this moment with the exception of a few.

So Saudi Arabia could look to Turkey and Pakistan for their military industries to get to work. They'll fund such efforts. That's the only realistic scenario I see but it's not close to what Israel can get.

So the air force is useful only at doing what we're limited to doing by the West.

 

[Kompromat]

Hazzy has a point. PAF after getting a rude shock from the US in 65 war went on and developed a plan to not only seek multiple suppliers, but also to develop capability to build and refurbish aircrafts at home. Starting off with Mushak, F-6 Rebuild factory, Mirage RF, K-8 and JF-17 Thunder.

Then it moved to develop local air launched weapons. Now Pakistan develops air launched stand off weapons, LGBs, Anti Runway bombs, Gravity bombd, Glide bombs and Guided bombs at home. Soon we'll get to build Bunker Busters at home through a TOT agreement with Turkey.

Then PAF sought to venture out into avionics, radar and sensors. PAC builds GrifoS and KLJ-7VI/II radars now as well as working on ground radars. JFT program has been a blessing for our industrial independance in this regard, which greatly improves our ability to conduct war.

KSA needs to build its industrial potential and seek to become independant in munitions and sensors production.

 

[500]

 

[Hyperion]

It's all about balance through MAN<->MACHINE

Iraq may have better men, but slightly outdated machines.
Saudi has tad better machines, but slightly inferior men.

Give Israeli's "no holds barred" machines, and economy that of US, and see what happens.

I'm going to address the bolded part. Right now, Saudi Arabia has better equipment, and aircrafts than Israel, and in large enough numbers to rival Israel. What KSA lacks is experience which Israel has in strides.

 

[rockstarIN]

I'm going to address the bolded part. Right now, Saudi Arabia has better equipment, and aircrafts than Israel, and in large enough numbers to rival Israel. What KSA lacks is experience which Israel has in strides.

I think you are underestimating KSA AF. They too might sweating too much in exercises and practice and my be flying much more hours than IAF.

I give IAF more points on their equipments, well oiled machinery with state of the art stuff. Not to forget their advancement in electronics. They are much ahead in that arena.

 

[Indus Falcon]

It's all about balance through MAN<->MACHINE

Iraq may have better men, but slightly outdated machines.
Saudi has tad better machines, but slightly inferior men.

Give Israeli's "no holds barred" machines, and economy that of US, and see what happens.

What is your hypothesis based on?