What's new

Iranian Vice Prez cancels Pak visit

Negative again, Arabs still support Pakistani stance in all conflicts with India although today they are preoccupied with war rhetoric towards Iran. They are courting India by presenting themselves as somebody India would be willing to do business with in order to remove Indian dependence on Iranian natural resources and isolate Iran. The same is being done in Pakistan by offering Pakistan alternatives to the IP gas pipeline however Pakistan refuses to drop the pipeline.

Not really, all they do is give lip service at that Tea-Biscuit organization known as OIC. Actions speak louder than words and thus far Arabs have stayed neutral in regards to indo-Pak rivalry and the Kashmir dispute. Kashmir issue is very sensitive for india and Arabs won't dare antagonize india at a time they are eager to increase oil exports to the country to gain a monopoly over the Iranians in the indian market, they won't antagonize india for Pakistan, the latter whom they now consider a liability.



Also, strengthening Saudi-india defense relations:


The Hindu : News / National : India, Saudi Arabia to enhance military ties

India-Saudi Arabia to enhance defence cooperation

India, Saudi to ramp up defence cooperation - Times Of India

Antony

Nudged by US, India, S Arabia inch closer on terror, defence ties

Saudi Gazette - New Delhi seeks upgraded strategic ties with Riyadh
 
.
Not really, all they do is give lip service at that Tea-Biscuit organization known as OIC. Actions speak louder than words and thus far Arabs have stayed neutral in regards to indo-Pak rivalry and the Kashmir dispute. Kashmir issue is very sensitive for india and Arabs won't dare antagonize india at a time they are eager to increase oil exports to the country to gain a monopoly over the Iranians in the indian market, they won't antagonize india for Pakistan, the latter whom they now consider a liability.



Also, strengthening Saudi-india defense relations:


The Hindu : News / National : India, Saudi Arabia to enhance military ties

India-Saudi Arabia to enhance defence cooperation

India, Saudi to ramp up defence cooperation - Times Of India

Antony

Nudged by US, India, S Arabia inch closer on terror, defence ties

Saudi Gazette - New Delhi seeks upgraded strategic ties with Riyadh

In every war, the Arabs have sent some help. I will admit that this is the new norm of Saudi-Indian times if/when the Iranian regime is attacked and/or toppled in the near future.

Secondly you just proved my point, it is not about Pakistan but Iran.
 
.
It will anger Arabs because of their hatred for Iranians not their love for Indians. Saudi king visited India in 2006 that was before Zardari and trade deals were signed then, which proves trade was inevitable any further gestures extended today is directly aimed at isolating Iran by shifting India away from Iranian resources.

Yes, their main aim is to isolate Iran but India won't abandon Iran for the sake of Arabs because Arabs never missed a chance to bully India.
 
.
Desert here your analysis incorrect, everything the Arabs (GCC to be exact) have done within the last 1-2 years has been focused on isolating Iran, Pakistan is a mere after thought to them.
Isolating Iran, even if it means strengthening economic as well as military relations with india (Pakistan's enemy), thus at the expense of Pakistan.



As for increasing trade ties with India that was bound to happen and any Pakistanis who think otherwise are delusional every country likes to trade with emerging economies.
Not only trade, but military ties with india have also been stepped up. It's only delusional when people think Arabs still support us against india when in fact they don't. By strengthening the economy of our adversary and cooperating with them in the field of defense is not support Pakistan, its like Pakistan starts cooperating with Iran or israel in the field of defense, these Arabs would start issuing fatwas against Pakistan.

Secondly, according to the OP article, Zardari visited Qatar for a deal involving Pakistan importing fuel through india, now is that in Pakistan's interests? By making Pakistan dependent on fuel supplies through india will hurt us in the long run.

Qatar and UAE are also involved in supporting the unrest in our Balochistan province, what does that say of these Arabs?


Even Surenas thanking your comment should realize how insecure the GCC is when it comes to Iran and see how the politics being played today are directly in opposition to Iran.
I already addressed this part.

As for China yes they want Pakistan to take down the separatists of East Pakistan and Pakistan has, you can look up the number of ETIM leaders killed in the past couple of years by Pakistan.

My point was that it just goes to show that even our closest allies are beginning to accuse of allowing terrorists and separatists to operate from within our territory with free will and thus they have become cautious and wary of us.
 
.
In every war, the Arabs have sent some help.
Leave the past, i'm talking present and future. As i said before, Saudis and Arabs only give lip service at tea-biscuit organization OIC, but even that is no longer the case since the last OIC summit didn't host the IOK (india occupied Kashmir) separatist faction as they did before, so as to not antagonize india.

I will admit that this is the new norm of Saudi-Indian times if/when the Iranian regime is attacked and/or toppled in the near future.
FYI, the Iranian regime won't be toppled any time soon. Its one thing to have economic ties with india, buts its a whole different ball game to form defence/military ties with india, which again proves my point.

Secondly you just proved my point, it is not about Pakistan but Iran.
No i did not, i proved my point, which is GCC isolating Iran at the expense of Pakistan.
 
.
Arabs and the West can be damned.

Pakistan is facing chronic power shortages and we need this pipeline to help aleviate our acute energy shortages.

If the Arabs and the West won't step up to the plate to help with our dilapated energy grid, then we will rely on Iran to help us out.
 
.
Arabs and the West can be damned.

Pakistan is facing chronic power shortages and we need this pipeline to help aleviate our acute energy shortages.

If the Arabs and the West won't step up to the plate to help with our dilapated energy grid, then we will rely on Iran to help us out.

Forget about Arabs and the West when its our own leadership and co who are willing to sell out Pakistan's national interests for their own personal gains thus compromising Pakistan's stance on key issues.
 
.
Ah! The Arabs, the Arabs, those arabs...and Iran & the West. Delightful discussion.

For a bit of perspective. The Arabs are not monolithic, i.e., one solid uniform nation. Pakistan must understand the nuances, divisions, and cleavages in the wider Arab world.

The GCC is one chunk of Arabs of one variety. This chunk is led by House of Saud & 22000+ princelings. Then there is Qatar. A tiniest of nation with 600,000+ and money to burn. It wants to elevate her status from a puny Lilliput to power player of the Arab World. UAE, Oman, Kuwait & Bahrain fall in between these two.

Then there are true Arab giants like Egypt, Iraq, Syria. These nations have molded the Arab identity for better or for worse while the traders and fishermen of Gulf used to bide their time.

Further westwards there is Morocco, Algeria, Tunis, Saharan Republic etc.

Pakistan must deal with each grouping with subtle nuances.

Since Iran is the theme of this thread; If Pakistan feels her future lies with making nice with her western neighbor, then one can look to Iraq, Lebanon, and Egypt as Arabs who would be amenable to warmer ties. You can include Syria, and maybe Yemen to that-if you must.

House of Saud is convinced that Iran must be demolished to secure a safe future for House of Saud. That family is oddly convinced that once Israel (& perhaps USA) "take care" of the Iran problem - the Arab Spring will fizzle and all will be good. They think it is sort of like Gulf War I, when Saddam was defeated and retreated from Kuwait with American war-machine & Saudi dollars.

Historically, House of Saud has had a good opinion of Pakistan and its military might. It deteriorated once you brought upon yourselves the humiliating saga of 1971. Bhutto was able to present Pakistan in favorable light to Saudis but the obsequious Zia UlHaq changed all that. Saudis have had envy & repsect for the professional army in Pakistan but were amused to find that the Leader of such a powerful military was so beholden to them and had absolutely no self-respect or dignity. They have never looked at Pakistan differently eversince- except when you came out of the nuclear closet: that got their attention. But then came Nawaz Sharif and Musharraf and the shady deals these gentlemen made with house of Saud for their own personal interest over and above the national interests. Saudis knew they were back to El-Miskeen territory. A fist full of petro-dollars go a very, very long way in power corridors of Pakistan - present ones excluded/excepted until evidence emerges.

BOTTOMLINE: What is in the interest of Pakistan? If House of Saud makes Pakistan a member of GCC/Or enters into an exclusive free-trade pact which prioritizes trade with Pakistan over India, Bangladesh, Philippines, Ethiopia, Turkey etc then go for it.

If however, Iran offers a safe border, preserves your interests in Afghanistan, Chabahar, Central Asia, trade & maybe some discounted oil & gas, refinery then you should look at that offer seriously. In a war with your best buddy India, Iran can help you much more than Saudis. Maybe you can play a mediatory role Pakistan played when Henry Alfred Kissinger first visited China!?

Be more imaginative and keep diplomatic channels open with ALL players. Do not commit unending fealty to anyone power, be it China Or House of Saud. Watch Erdogan's moves.
 
.
Yes but things are as good as past relations. Even wikileaks report revealed Saudis don't like present Zardari regime and refused aid number of times. If Pakistan go for IP pipeline it will further anger Arabs.

We are not leaving both Iran and Saudi Arabia. Pakistan in fact has good relations with all Islamic countries. If the house of Saud don't like Zardari, who cares, no one including in Pakistan like him! If that has got to do with the sunni and shia, well we have got them in our government.
One is the Prime Minister while the other is the President.
 
.
Just a matter of time , when Israel & its allies will prepare their gears for IRAN , all of u gona see many deligations landing in islamabad from tehran!
Just a matter of time?
 
.
The Indians here should cut the smile now

Case closed !

Iranian vice president puts off visit due to hand injury

ISLAMABAD: A hand injury has forced Iranian Vice President Ali Saeedlou to postpone his visit to Pakistan and instead a team of Iranian experts dealing with $1.5 billion Iran-Pakistan gas pipeline and power import projects will arrive next week to push the projects forward.
“We have been told by the Iranians that the vice president has put off the trip because of a hand injury and may come to Pakistan after recovery,” an official told The Express Tribune.

The governments of Pakistan and Iran were scheduled to sign a $250 million loan agreement for financing the gas pipeline during the visit of Saeedlou from November 5 to 9.
“Now, we expect that initial signing of the loan agreement may take place when an Iranian team arrives next week, possibly on Monday or Tuesday,” the official said.
Tehran has also offered additional credit of $250 million, which will be arranged from its commercial banks, for financing the construction of the pipeline. It will also provide material support for the project.
On its part, the Government of Pakistan will raise funds for the pipeline through Gas Infrastructure Development Cess (GIDC), a kind of tax being charged from domestic gas consumers. The government expects to receive Rs30 billion from the consumers on this account in the current financial year.
During the visit of Iranian team, a proposal that Pakistani and Iranian companies form a joint venture to lay the pipeline will also be discussed. Sources say the cost of the project will come down if local companies participate in construction of the pipeline from the Iranian border.
German-based firm ILF has already completed detailed engineering design of the project and according to the interim feasibility report, the cost of the project will be in the range of $1.2 to $1.5 billion.
Iran has also offered to lay Pakistan’s side of the pipeline following reports about difficulties being faced by Islamabad in raising funds. China and Russia had earlier committed to financing the pipeline if they were awarded the construction contract without bidding, but no progress could be made apparently due to US opposition.
The pipeline, if completed by December 2014, will bring 750 million cubic feet of gas per day to energy-deficient Pakistan. The supply can be enhanced to 1 billion cubic feet per day.
The two countries will also discuss how to clear the outstanding amount for power import from Iran. Additional import of 100 megawatts will also come up for discussion.
Pakistan and Iran have already signed a memorandum of understanding (MoU) for supply of 1,000MW. Under this project, Iran will build a powerhouse in its Zahedan province bordering Pakistan to generate electricity and has also expressed its willingness to provide $800 to $900 million for the project. A 700km transmission line of 500 kilovolts will be laid from the Pak-Iran border to Quetta.
Iran has also expressed interest in setting up a 200MW power plant in Balochistan near the border. In addition to it, Iran is keen on installing smaller plants of 25MW on the ground as well as on barges to help Pakistan overcome the power crisis.

Iranian vice president puts off visit due to hand injury – The Express Tribune
 
.
^^^ They are not going to show their displeasure openly even if they cancelled due to such reason.
I guess some negotiations could not be finalized hence he had to cancel the visit. One has to justify a foreign visit by signing some documents (at least that how our ministers visit foreign countries)
 
.
Just a matter of time , when Israel & its allies will prepare their gears for IRAN , all of u gona see many deligations landing in islamabad from tehran!
Just a matter of time?

May be as india will not be there to act against israel......
 
.
Not only trade, but military ties with india have also been stepped up. It's only delusional when people think Arabs still support us against india when in fact they don't. By strengthening the economy of our adversary and cooperating with them in the field of defense is not support Pakistan, its like Pakistan starts cooperating with Iran or israel in the field of defense, these Arabs would start issuing fatwas against Pakistan.


this is the type of logic that is needed for pakistani's to understand the situation.

the arabs would be loathed to see the IP/IPI pipeline go ahead, where is the good will from their side?

pakistan is basically an incubator for their backwards wahabi'ism, they dont even keep it in their lands, they just export the criminals, zealots and nutters to pakistan/afghanistan - what great friends to have? and what great leaders who allow this?!
 
.
Ah! The Arabs, the Arabs, those arabs...and Iran & the West. Delightful discussion.

For a bit of perspective. The Arabs are not monolithic, i.e., one solid uniform nation. Pakistan must understand the nuances, divisions, and cleavages in the wider Arab world.

The GCC is one chunk of Arabs of one variety. This chunk is led by House of Saud & 22000+ princelings. Then there is Qatar. A tiniest of nation with 600,000+ and money to burn. It wants to elevate her status from a puny Lilliput to power player of the Arab World. UAE, Oman, Kuwait & Bahrain fall in between these two.

Then there are true Arab giants like Egypt, Iraq, Syria. These nations have molded the Arab identity for better or for worse while the traders and fishermen of Gulf used to bide their time.

Further westwards there is Morocco, Algeria, Tunis, Saharan Republic etc.

Pakistan must deal with each grouping with subtle nuances.

Since Iran is the theme of this thread; If Pakistan feels her future lies with making nice with her western neighbor, then one can look to Iraq, Lebanon, and Egypt as Arabs who would be amenable to warmer ties. You can include Syria, and maybe Yemen to that-if you must.

House of Saud is convinced that Iran must be demolished to secure a safe future for House of Saud. That family is oddly convinced that once Israel (& perhaps USA) "take care" of the Iran problem - the Arab Spring will fizzle and all will be good. They think it is sort of like Gulf War I, when Saddam was defeated and retreated from Kuwait with American war-machine & Saudi dollars.

Historically, House of Saud has had a good opinion of Pakistan and its military might. It deteriorated once you brought upon yourselves the humiliating saga of 1971. Bhutto was able to present Pakistan in favorable light to Saudis but the obsequious Zia UlHaq changed all that. Saudis have had envy & repsect for the professional army in Pakistan but were amused to find that the Leader of such a powerful military was so beholden to them and had absolutely no self-respect or dignity. They have never looked at Pakistan differently eversince- except when you came out of the nuclear closet: that got their attention. But then came Nawaz Sharif and Musharraf and the shady deals these gentlemen made with house of Saud for their own personal interest over and above the national interests. Saudis knew they were back to El-Miskeen territory. A fist full of petro-dollars go a very, very long way in power corridors of Pakistan - present ones excluded/excepted until evidence emerges.

BOTTOMLINE: What is in the interest of Pakistan? If House of Saud makes Pakistan a member of GCC/Or enters into an exclusive free-trade pact which prioritizes trade with Pakistan over India, Bangladesh, Philippines, Ethiopia, Turkey etc then go for it.

If however, Iran offers a safe border, preserves your interests in Afghanistan, Chabahar, Central Asia, trade & maybe some discounted oil & gas, refinery then you should look at that offer seriously. In a war with your best buddy India, Iran can help you much more than Saudis. Maybe you can play a mediatory role Pakistan played when Henry Alfred Kissinger first visited China!?

Be more imaginative and keep diplomatic channels open with ALL players. Do not commit unending fealty to anyone power, be it China Or House of Saud. Watch Erdogan's moves.



this is a great post with some genuine wisdom, imo.

however, this would have to be predicated on a modicum of independent policy and decent leadership!!
 
.

Latest posts

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom