@Galactic Penguin SST
Which solid fuel test and development "city" like Shahroud does North Korea have?
North Korea is liquid orientated and unfortunately you Chinese wont help them on solids.
If they have now a solid fuel PK-4 ICBM, then the most likely helper is Iran.
Irans solid fuel tech. is ahead of North Koreas, with all respect for their Juche ideology.
Its possible that NK's R&D program is just not visible or very small and there is no contribution from Iran.
Until the 2000's Iran was learning and importing from NK, sure, but that was liquid tech.
Iran has mastered most advanced liquid R-27 technology, NK aborted R-27 based tech. likely not only due to its lower range but also the high tech. requirements.
Is it only me or it seems that some here really act as if they were on the wikipedia pages:
1. Delete all sources that substantiates the contributor's edit. Use the lack of credibility of the source as an excuse.
2. Delete everything else the contributor has posted under the pretence of missing sources, as it is compromising the official wikipedia's line.
3. Then ban the contributor that protest, under some fallacious fabricated double standards reason.
4. Use armies of professional trolls to disinform at will by the old playbook according to the official propaganda's line as nobody even remembers of the truth previously exposed by the banned contributor.
Dude,
all your questions have been answered last years in this same thread.
Not allowed to repost the deleted content, I will only state that in aerospace, North Korea is in no way backward, at the exception of only one field: the manned space program.
Indeed, this is really more about prestige, with less military applications, and by far the most costly.
Therefore, Iran will probably do most of the development by its own, and only transfert the finished hardware to North Korea for the final testing phase: the manned capsule E1, the Iranian version of the Sokol spacesuit, the space food.
• It is obvious that North Korea has dedicated military-industrial complex to develop solid propellant technologies: the entire greater region around Hamhung, from start to finish. It includes the static horizontal and vertical pop-up test stands, and extends to 55 km northeastward to the Sinpo region were submarine-launched ballistic missile (SLBM) are tested.
• Unlike Iran, the North Korean horizontal static test stand does not give a clue to the foreign satellites, with no traces left on the ground by the plume. Indeed, Iran's Shahroud is build on desertic soil, thus compromising its secrecy, while Hamhung's plume goes over a river!
• The grain's quality has been improved steadily over the years and is far more advanced than in Iran.
• The North Korean casings are made of composite aramid fiber for all Pukguksong series engines ranging from 1.1 meters diameter to 2 meters diameter, while Iran is mostly using alloy steel such as the 1.25 meter diameter Sejil, with only the exception of the relatively small 0.9 meter diameter Salman motor, and only as second stage of the Qased rocket.
• For the moment, the only solid propellant motors technology that Iran has demonstrated before North Korea is TVC, but only for the relatively small 0.9 meter diameter Salman-1 used as second stage of the Qased SLV.
• North Korea has casting pit for solid motors of 4 meters diameters:
North Korean casting pit
Satellite imagery of the 'Place of the ascension of Martyrs’ (35.624581°N 50.872523°E) at the Shahid Modarres Garrison shows that before the 12 November 2011 explosion, the site was housing a rail-movable hangar, cranes and large cylindrical objects.
The epicenter of the 2011 explosion might be a large casting pit with a moveable superstructure.
The measured diameter of the casting pit is about 5 meters, and can be used to cast rocket motors of diameters up to 3.5 meters for the Qaem SLV.
https://archive.ph/qjrPO/68eb99eb7d15ec1a7c9196409df5c15b6bc47848.jpg ; https://archive.ph/qjrPO/fa1c57a917f9e3624ef9e835877dd9e932bbd35b/scr.png ; http://web.archive.org/web/20191121173100/https://i.imgur.com/NQBBJzK.jpg
▲ 1. Large casting pit of of about 5 meters diameters at the Shahid Modarres Garrison.
The same large casting pit with a moveable superstructure has been built thereafter at the Imam Sadegh Satellite Launch Center.
The measured diameter of the casting pit of about 5 meters, and is used to cast the 3.5 meter diameter Qaem SLV first stage.
https://archive.ph/WDXbj/76b0357beb1aca1f87880474e88627e404eddb76.jpg ; https://archive.ph/WDXbj/eb2f179c64ca0bf87362bc5aeada69e0d0535a7e/scr.png ; http://web.archive.org/web/20191121174913/https://i.imgur.com/0zP7IzP.jpg
▲ 2. Large casting pit of about 5 meters diameters at the Imam Sadegh SLC.
Recent satellite imagery of 5th Febryary 2018 have revealed a similar site in North Korea’s Chemical Materials Institute, a key facility for the production of solid-rocket motors.
July 25, 2018
This imagery shows some unique features that appear to be related to testing or finishing solid motor case production. Among these is a circular foundation in the southern fabrication building that measures (approximately 4 meters-in-diameter, interior dimension) and surrounds an excavation of undetermined depth.
The intended purpose of this excavation is unclear. One suggested purpose would be to fulfill a requirement for pressure testing, degreasing, or coating filament-wound rocket motor casings prior to being filled.[6] Alternately, if this pit is intended for hydro-pressure testing—during which the pressure is slowly increased until the case fails—it would require a dome or heavy lid to keep it sealed during testing.
While recent press reports have focused on the expansion of North Korea’s Chemical Materials Institute (CMI)[1]—a key facility in its…
www.38north.org
https://archive.ph/QbYnk/5db49c16da7f65e769b4dae7c3f9017adb100abe.jpg ; https://archive.ph/QbYnk/ac50a431f2b1b08628d3ebe5542d63ff997b655f/scr.png ; http://web.archive.org/web/20190310...ads/2018/07/Fig2B_CMI-18-0725-AIR-768x576.jpg ; https://www.38north.org/2018/07/cmi072518/
▲ 3. Large casting pit of of about 4 meters diameters at the North Korea’s Chemical Materials Institute (CMI). 39°57'29.08"N 127°33'35.24"E
https://archive.fo/Yn6K0/e303b34c8e3a81e837476467d8930a195b2c6a62.jpg ; http://web.archive.org/web/20190906200458/https://i.imgur.com//J2KKUoW.jpg ; http://www.dprktoday.com/content/photo/2016/20160304-kp-01-7.jpg ; http://www.dprktoday.com/index.php?type=42&no=1964 ; 왕들의 궁전-만경대학생소년궁전을 찾아서 (2) ; 나어린 미술가들의 솜씨 ; 访王的宫殿--万景台学生少年宫(2) ; 儿童美术家的手艺 ; 16-03-09 10:51 ; http://www.xici.net/d228225918.htm
▲ 4. North Korean version of the Iranian "Qaem" SLV. 주체105(2016)년 3월 4일
• The vintage Russian cold war era R-27 technology is not worth being further developed. And totally obsolete compared to the Paektusan series engine, that allows single chamber engine fully gimballed up to possibly ~150 tons of thrust. Here the clarification.
Flight evidence and age seem to indicate that those engines aren’t reliable enough anymore.
Given unreliability, a two engine installation is n^2 more likely to have a flight failure. 70% reliable per engine is 0.7^2 ~= 0.49 probability of flight success. 60%reliable is 0.36 probability of flight success. We don’t know everything about 4D10 Zyb engines failures but by far most of the 4D10 Zyb engines failed. Some very low or on launchers, mostly at altitude. The latter ones grew grid fins arguably for transonic stabilizing margins. But there were failures after that, credibly of engines.
So we have two known (or very high credibility based on evidence) failure modes; engines and aerodynamic. It looks like engine reliability was in 60-70% range. The Hwasong-13 ICBM just stopped being viable with that rate.
And importantly, North Korea almost immediately went to public testing of the Paektusan engine (RD-250 lineage cousin). That’s likely an admission that they knew they needed new motors and demonstration that they could do that and make it work.
They’re remarkably open with sharing for deterrent credibility.
4D10 is a work of art. But perhaps not best starter high performance liquid fuel motor.
RD-250 is a straight forward design compared to the tank integrated, space restricted, closed combustion cycle, counter-cavitation gas to tank re-pressuring, R-27 design.
A high risk tech. path for a first ICBM.
Iran concentrated on it, and finally mastered it, but it took time.
https://twitter.com/GeorgeWHerbert/status/1317944911807672322
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• Recently in end September 2020, the U.S. Treasury has even disclosed that North Koreans were present to
assist during Iranian space launch!
• In the same report, Iran is alleged now to be receiving aid from North Korea for new long range missile!
Clearly North Korea is leading.
While Iran only recently hinted at its first upcoming SLBM test!
https://archive.vn/5kWnl/07bef765ee3ec1ab391d2234e9fa37c67fff3c25.jpg ; https://archive.vn/5kWnl/6e15c6bc4308fede950c150b6653b9e546905248/scr.png ; http://web.archive.org/web/20201018...age/1397/03/23/13970323124050939144161910.jpg
▲ 5. Official poster distributed by Iran's Supreme leader hinting at a first ever SLBM test ! Roughly translated as "They will fire one - and will get 10 times over". 2020.
https://archive.vn/MPZL7/e906170db144c5b5c363be69aef4b6c439863c77.jpg ; https://archive.vn/MPZL7/a9a00f049b6e99b4bcdae09cc3f0eb326fd431f9/scr.png ; https://i.imgur.com/oXw05ph.jpg ; http://web.archive.org/web/20201018202016if_/https://i.imgur.com/oXw05ph.jpg
▲ 6. ▲ Undated image of an Iranian SSBN, with 14 SLBM.
https://twitter.com/nktpnd/status/1317237768213483521