Iran signs MOU with China to cooperate in Chinese construction of two nuclear reactors at Chabahar

[mohsen]

Supreme leader tells you to STFU!

My leader isn't Obama!

 

[Madali]

The million dollar question: where were the delvapasan in 1995?

Most of my current fav guys were much younger in 1995. During 1995, it was the reign of Akbar Shah. Back then, the Doctor was merely a governor in Ardabil, aged 39. Remember, when the Doctor came into power, his cabinet was young (which is what pissed of the elites). Jalili would have been only 30 back in 1995. ُSome of the team back then, such as Mehdi Mohammadi would have been a teenager in 95. The Deputy in the Negotiation Team is now Araghchi, back then it was Ali Bagheri. Listen to Bagheri's response in the Parjam Committee Review, he speaks in a very reasonable and honest manner. He is now aged 48, meaning in 95 he would have been 29.

Of course, many of the delvapasan are useless, and it's hard to know if a member's statements are from the heart or its just a political statement to get media attention. I mean, look at the King of Double Talk, Ali Larijani. Can anyone actually know his political ideology? Most of the Left & Right in Iran's political environment mean absolutely nothing. It was such a laugh during the Mahmood-jan's second election, suddenly all the elites became reformists, from Larijani to Rafsanjani to Karoubi, the whole elite who were in charge of government for all its years, suddenly acted like Ahmadenijad was the System and they were the Outsiders fighting for Reform. Load of crap.

I've lost my point. I don't know what I wanted to say.

--

Listen to Salehi's response to this student,
http://iusnews.ir/fa/news-details/1...نشجویان-شریف-در-حاشیه-یک-مراسم-دانشجویی-+صوت/

It gets on my nerves.

 

[IR1907]

My leader isn't Obama!

Ayatollah Khamenei tells you to STFU and let the negotiators do their job.

 

[mohsen]

Ayatollah Khamenei tells you to STFU and let the negotiators do their job.

He let the negotiators do their job but didn't tell the critics to be silent.
Did Mr obama tell you that?!

 

[Daneshmand]

about AP.
Daneshmand! AP was accepted by the board of governors of IAEA in 1997, and if I have made any mistake, that's not mentioning the start of discussions in 1993, the AP was formerly called 93+2 Protocol.
مذاکرات هسته‌اي و پروتکل الحاقي

Yes it was accepted by "BOARD of GOVERNORS" in 1997. It had no bearing on Iran. Basically when board of governors accepts such a framework then it puts it up for membership and if countries start to sign up to it and ratify it, then it becomes an international treaty. If only three countries sign it and only one ratifies it, even if Board of Governors keep screaming, it will never become an international treaty.

Iran signed up to AP during Khatami negotiation with EU3 states in December 2003 but has not yet ratified it. Long time after Iran had signed and RATIFIED the indefinite version of NPT in 1995. Please do not mix these two issues up. These are separate issues and Iran's ratification of indefinite version of NPT whose age and expiry date is now tied with the age of solar system, caused much damage to Iran providing the international basis and the ultimate excuse to sanction Iran.

AP by comparison is just a bad joke. NPT is a blanket treaty. It is the same for every third work nuclear country, and is used by first world countries to blackmail the third world nations. AP is negotiated case by case between the member state and the IAEA since it is not a treaty per say but an inspection agreement between IAEA and the member state. Some states give full access to IAEA inspectors and spies. Some other countries negotiate a wait time for IAEA to warm where and when it wants to have inspections. Other countries bind IAEA inspectors to certain restrictions eg. being accompanied by security services of the nation in question and they be "blind folded" etc. As I said even nuclear armed India which has been one of the most vocal critical opponents of NPT has signed up to AP.

AP is not that big of an issue since its terms can be carefully negotiated and you can withdraw from it much more easier. NPT slaved to the age of solar system is on the other hand quite another monster.

So my question stands: Was there any delvapas whether inside or outside the country who stood up and questioned Iran's intention to ratify the 1995 NPT? To my knowledge no body, not among the Islamic conservatives, not among the Shahollahis not among liberals and not among Iranian-Americans, absolutely none, opposed it. I guess there was no noone in that.

 

[Daneshmand]

Most of my current fav guys were much younger in 1995. During 1995, it was the reign of Akbar Shah. Back then, the Doctor was merely a governor in Ardabil, aged 39. Remember, when the Doctor came into power, his cabinet was young (which is what pissed of the elites). Jalili would have been only 30 back in 1995. ُSome of the team back then, such as Mehdi Mohammadi would have been a teenager in 95. The Deputy in the Negotiation Team is now Araghchi, back then it was Ali Bagheri. Listen to Bagheri's response in the Parjam Committee Review, he speaks in a very reasonable and honest manner. He is now aged 48, meaning in 95 he would have been 29.

Of course, many of the delvapasan are useless, and it's hard to know if a member's statements are from the heart or its just a political statement to get media attention. I mean, look at the King of Double Talk, Ali Larijani. Can anyone actually know his political ideology? Most of the Left & Right in Iran's political environment mean absolutely nothing. It was such a laugh during the Mahmood-jan's second election, suddenly all the elites became reformists, from Larijani to Rafsanjani to Karoubi, the whole elite who were in charge of government for all its years, suddenly acted like Ahmadenijad was the System and they were the Outsiders fighting for Reform. Load of crap.

I've lost my point. I don't know what I wanted to say.

--

Listen to Salehi's response to this student,
http://iusnews.ir/fa/news-details/182427/اظهارات-قابل-تامل-صالحی-با-یکی-از-دانشجویان-شریف-در-حاشیه-یک-مراسم-دانشجویی- صوت/

It gets on my nerves.

That is true. But you are thinking about personalities. My contention here is about an ideology. The ideology of delvapasan. The most important thing here is to keep focus on developing Iran into an economic power house with a diversified economy not an oil based one which can be sanctioned. Delvapasan are not helping in that regard. The JCPOA has been signed and until the other side does not mess it up, Iran must use this agreement to get as much mileage out of it. Iran should use JCPOA as a pressure point to exert pressure on the other side not ourselves as delvapasan are doing. One way would be to use the lever JCPOA has provided Iran to push for ToT's.

 

[mohsen]

Yes it was accepted by "BOARD of GOVERNORS" in 1997. It had no bearing on Iran. Basically when board of governors accepts such a framework then it puts it up for membership and if countries start to sign up to it and ratify it, then it becomes an international treaty. If only three countries sign it and only one ratifies it, even if Board of Governors keep screaming, it will never become an international treaty.

Iran signed up to AP during Khatami negotiation with EU3 states in December 2003 but has not yet ratified it. Long time after Iran had signed and RATIFIED the indefinite version of NPT in 1995. Please do not mix these two issues up. These are separate issues and Iran's ratification of indefinite version of NPT whose age and expiry date is now tied with the age of solar system, caused much damage to Iran providing the international basis and the ultimate excuse to sanction Iran.

AP by comparison is just a bad joke. NPT is a blanket treaty. It is the same for every third work nuclear country, and is used by first world countries to blackmail the third world nations. AP is negotiated case by case between the member state and the IAEA since it is not a treaty per say but an inspection agreement between IAEA and the member state. Some states give full access to IAEA inspectors and spies. Some other countries negotiate a wait time for IAEA to warm where and when it wants to have inspections. Other countries bind IAEA inspectors to certain restrictions eg. being accompanied by security services of the nation in question and they be "blind folded" etc. As I said even nuclear armed India which has been one of the most vocal critical opponents of NPT has signed up to AP.

AP is not that big of an issue since its terms can be carefully negotiated and you can withdraw from it much more easier. NPT slaved to the age of solar system is on the other hand quite another monster.

So my question stands: Was there any delvapas whether inside or outside the country who stood up and questioned Iran's intention to ratify the 1995 NPT? To my knowledge no body, not among the Islamic conservatives, not among the Shahollahis not among liberals and not among Iranian-Americans, absolutely none, opposed it. I guess there was no noone in that.

NPT is harmless, unless we plan to build a bomb, there is no problem to accept that. Is it that much difficult to understand?
But Additional protocol is a security hazard, only fools may think giving access to military sites is not a big deal!
specially when we know the version of AP which Iran has accepted is the most limiting and severe one.
مونیز: ایران باید پروتکل الحاقی را تا ابد اجرا کند/ هیچ کشوری تا این حد در برنامه هسته‌ای محدود نشده است

 

[Azizam]

so whatever Chinese build, we wont be allowed to reverse engineer, another secret side deal of the JCPOA.

Do you think China is a charity shop?

 

[Daneshmand]

NPT is harmless, unless we plan to build a bomb, there is no problem to accept that. Is it that much difficult to understand?
But Additional protocol is a security hazard, only fools may think giving access to military sites is not a big deal!
specially when we know the version of AP which Iran has accepted is the most limiting and severe one.
مونیز: ایران باید پروتکل الحاقی را تا ابد اجرا کند/ هیچ کشوری تا این حد در برنامه هسته‌ای محدود نشده است

According to who, it is "harmless"? According to you? A delvapas? You are sounding bizarre now.

Baba boro hamon delvapasito bokon. NPT was the BASIS and the FOUNDATION of sanctions on Iran. If Iran was not a member of NPT, there would be no basis in international law to sanction Iran. Iran had to sign AP because NPT requires inspections. If Iran was not a member of NPT, there was no need to sign AP. JCPOA was signed on the basis that Iran is a member in NPT. If Iran was not in NPT, there would be no JCPOA.

Boro hamon delvapasito bokon, azizam. Mesleh yeh tooty dari chizai ro keh shinidi tekrar mikoni. Sometimes use your brain. In kambod khod etemadi az koja miad? Keh ma bayad hatman dar 1995 NPT emza mikardim? Really?

AP is not a security hazard. NPT is on the other hand, a huge security hazard. Only fools think by signing NPT in 1995 slaved to the age of solar system, they can buy security for the nation. AP has been signed even by India, a non-signatory to NPT and a nuclear armed state with many more military bases than Iran.

Unfortunately you did not have the courage and bravery to come out and say that those people who signed the indefinite version of NPT in 1995 were also traitors and the delvapasan were not protesting then because they had got their free booze and their share of the booties under Rafsanjani. The mere fact that you try to cover up the 1995 treason and only go after the LITTLE and TINY issues of AP or JCPOA, without looking at the motherload of NPT, shows how honest you are in your criticism of JCPOA.

 

[IR1907]

According to who, it is "harmless"? According to you? A delvapas? You are sounding bizarre now.

Baba boro hamon delvapasito bokon. NPT was the BASIS and the FOUNDATION of sanctions on Iran. If Iran was not a member of NPT, there would be no basis in international law to sanction Iran. Iran had to sign AP because NPT requires inspections. If Iran was not a member of NPT, there was no need to sign AP. JCPOA was signed on the basis that Iran is a member in NPT. If Iran was not in NPT, there would be no JCPOA.

Boro hamon delvapasito bokon, azizam. Mesleh yeh tooty dari chizai ro keh shinidi tekrar mikoni. Sometimes use your brain. In kambod khod etemadi az koja miad? Keh ma bayad hatman dar 1995 NPT emza mikardim? Really?

AP is not a security hazard. NPT is on the other hand, a huge security hazard. Only fools think by signing NPT in 1995 slaved to the age of solar system, they can buy security for the nation. AP has been signed even by India, a non-signatory to NPT and a nuclear armed state with many more military bases than Iran.

Unfortunately you did not have the courage and bravery to come out and say that those people who signed the indefinite version of NPT in 1995 were also traitors and the delvapasan were not protesting then because they had got their free booze and their share of the booties under Rafsanjani. The mere fact that you try to cover up the 1995 treason and only go after the LITTLE and TINY issues of AP or JCPOA, without looking at the motherload of NPT, shows how honest you are in your criticism of JCPOA.

Thanks for your post man. Very well said and i can not imagine the ''delvapasan'' being sincere in their intentions.

 

[mohsen]

Do you think China is a charity shop?

China itself is the biggest copier.

According to who, it is "harmless"? According to you? A delvapas? You are sounding bizarre now.

Baba boro hamon delvapasito bokon. NPT was the BASIS and the FOUNDATION of sanctions on Iran. If Iran was not a member of NPT, there would be no basis in international law to sanction Iran. Iran had to sign AP because NPT requires inspections. If Iran was not a member of NPT, there was no need to sign AP. JCPOA was signed on the basis that Iran is a member in NPT. If Iran was not in NPT, there would be no JCPOA.

Boro hamon delvapasito bokon, azizam. Mesleh yeh tooty dari chizai ro keh shinidi tekrar mikoni. Sometimes use your brain. In kambod khod etemadi az koja miad? Keh ma bayad hatman dar 1995 NPT emza mikardim? Really?

AP is not a security hazard. NPT is on the other hand, a huge security hazard. Only fools think by signing NPT in 1995 slaved to the age of solar system, they can buy security for the nation. AP has been signed even by India, a non-signatory to NPT and a nuclear armed state with many more military bases than Iran.

Unfortunately you did not have the courage and bravery to come out and say that those people who signed the indefinite version of NPT in 1995 were also traitors and the delvapasan were not protesting then because they had got their free booze and their share of the booties under Rafsanjani. The mere fact that you try to cover up the 1995 treason and only go after the LITTLE and TINY issues of AP or JCPOA, without looking at the motherload of NPT, shows how honest you are in your criticism of JCPOA.

as it seems, for you limited observations in nuclear facilities is a security hazard, but inspecting military sites is no big deal. well this is some kind of mentality which I have no answer for.


so in your naive thoughts the same Americans who didn't let Iran to have even two centrifuges, the same America wouldn't sanction us if we wouldn't even allow these limited observations!.
the NPT gives us the right to have the uranium enrichment yet Americans don't even recognize that right, yet you wanted to quit the NPT and bring us peace! and avoid the sanctions!
India was after the bomb, so obviously they couldn't sign the NPT.
the AP isn't a pre-written text, it's different for every country, Now to prove your baseless comment show us the text which they have signed, show us where they allowed to inspect their military sites.
also you expect the Americans to treat us their number one enemy in the world, the same way they treated the India?
you have really childish thoughts!

 

[Daneshmand]

China itself is the biggest copier.


as it seems, for you limited observations in nuclear facilities is a security hazard, but inspecting military sites is no big deal. well this is some kind of mentality which I have no answer for.


so in your naive thoughts the same Americans who didn't let Iran to have even two centrifuges, the same America wouldn't sanction us if we wouldn't even allow these limited observations!.
the NPT gives us the right to have the uranium enrichment yet Americans don't even recognize that right, yet you wanted to quit the NPT and bring us peace! and avoid the sanctions!
India was after the bomb, so obviously they couldn't sign the NPT.
the AP isn't a pre-written text, it's different for every country, Now to prove your baseless comment show us the text which they have signed, show us where they allowed to inspect their military sites.
also you expect the Americans to treat us their number one enemy in the world, the same way they treated the India?
you have really childish thoughts!

First of all its your knowledge that is so limited which does not allow you to even think properly. AP is not a security hazard, if it was, today SL would not have signed on it. Are you claiming that you know more than SL? Now you are being funny.

If Iran was not a member of NPT, there is nothing in international law which obliges Iran to have ANY kind of inspections. None what so ever. We are being inspected because of NPT not because of AP. The AP is only there to augment inspections for NPT. The fact that you have issue with AP but not with NPT, shows that you are hypocritical on the issue.

NPT does not give you any right. Who are they to give rights to Iran? Are Americans or the United Nations your god and idol who are giving you rights under NPT? Hilarious. Iran by signing NPT actually limited its own rights.

NPT brought all the sanctions, pressures and JCPOA on Iran. If Iran was not part of NPT, the life would have been easier for Iranians.

ALL the AP agreements between ALL the nations and the IAEA are confidential. Whether India or Japan or Iran. Your ignorance on the matter is really hilarious.

India was in Soviet camp and not a "friend" of US till 1990's. As I said, you are too ignorant and are now clutching at straws.

You have exposed yourself. You did not know that it was the delvapasan who were at the time close to Rafsanjani who signed and ratified the indefinite version of NPT. And now these delvapasan are worried about a limited time JCPOA and implementation of AP without actually ratifying it. This hypocrisy has really started to stink.

So that is from my side. You did not answer my question and instead started clutching at straws. The question was, where were these delvapasan when Iran in 1995 signed and ratified the indefinite version of NPT slaved to the age of solar system?

 

[mohsen]

First of all its your knowledge that is so limited which does not allow you to even think properly. AP is not a security hazard, if it was, today SL would not have signed on it. Are you claiming that you know more than SL? Now you are being funny.

If Iran was not a member of NPT, there is nothing in international law which obliges Iran to have ANY kind of inspections. None what so ever. We are being inspected because of NPT not because of AP. The AP is only there to augment inspections for NPT. The fact that you have issue with AP but not with NPT, shows that you are hypocritical on the issue.

NPT does not give you any right. Who are they to give rights to Iran? Are Americans or the United Nations your god and idol who are giving you rights under NPT? Hilarious. Iran by signing NPT actually limited its own rights.

NPT brought all the sanctions, pressures and JCPOA on Iran. If Iran was not part of NPT, the life would have been easier for Iranians.

ALL the AP agreements between ALL the nations and the IAEA are confidential. Whether India or Japan or Iran. Your ignorance on the matter is really hilarious.

India was in Soviet camp and not a "friend" of US till 1990's. As I said, you are too ignorant and are now clutching at straws.

You have exposed yourself. You did not know that it was the delvapasan who were at the time close to Rafsanjani who signed and ratified the indefinite version of NPT. And now these delvapasan are worried about a limited time JCPOA and implementation of AP without actually ratifying it. This hypocrisy has really started to stink.

So that is from my side. You did not answer my question and instead started clutching at straws. The question was, where were these delvapasan when Iran in 1995 signed and ratified the indefinite version of NPT slaved to the age of solar system?

this is the brief of your whole comments:
if we wouldn't sign the NPT, U.S wouldn't sanction us.

good luck with your mentality, people will judge who is funny here.

 

[Daneshmand]

this is the brief of your whole comments:
if we wouldn't sign the NPT, U.S wouldn't sanction us.

good luck with your mentality, people will judge who is funny here.

Obviously it is you who is funny. You do not know even the contemporary history of Iran, let alone anything else. All you can do is making strawmans and attack them.

Iran was under sanctions by United States since 1979. But these were unilateral sanctions. The sanctions that made the lives of Iranians hell were the ones which were instituted by the authority of UNSC which made it possible to make international international sanctions against Iran. And these UNSC sanctions were all per the international law according to NPT.

No NPT, no international sanctions. Simple as that.

And you still can not grasp this simple fact. Now you can go and do your delvapasi, while the delvapasan were silently complicit in signing indefinite version of NPT which made AP and JCPOA inevitable.

By the way, SL gave go ahead for implementation of JCPOA and AP. So what is your problem, now?

 

[mohsen]

Obviously it is you who is funny. You do not know even the contemporary history of Iran, let alone anything else. All you can do is making strawmans and attack them.

Iran was under sanctions by United States since 1979. But these were unilateral sanctions. The sanctions that made the lives of Iranians hell were the ones which were instituted by the authority of UNSC which made it possible to make international international sanctions against Iran. And these UNSC sanctions were all per the international law according to NPT.

No NPT, no international sanctions. Simple as that.

And you still can not grasp this simple fact. Now you can go and do your delvapasi, while the delvapasan were silently complicit in signing indefinite version of NPT which made AP and JCPOA inevitable.

By the way, SL gave go ahead for implementation of JCPOA and AP. So what is your problem, now?

It wasn't the NPT law which sanctioned us, it was Iranophobia.
Iran was sanctioned based on some false accusations of PMD and Iranophobia, UNSC asked Iran to give more access to IAEA, beyond the NPT, sanctioned us for not doing what we haven't signed.
now the funny thing here is your claim that if we wouldn't allow any access (be not signing the NPT) then UNSC would leave us alone! end of Iranophobia!
good luck buddy.