Iqbal on Punjabi Muslims

[xairhossi]

(Zarb-e-Kaleem-063) Punjabi Musalman

Punjabi Musalman
Punjabi Muslim

Mazhab Mein Bohat Taza Pasand Iss Ki Tabiyat
Kar Le Kahin Manzil To Guzerta Hai Bohat Jald

A newborn faith invokes his taste,
Adopts with zeal but leaves with haste.

Tehqeeq Ki Bazi Ho To Shirkat Nahin Karta
Ho Khail Mureedi Ka To Harta Hai Bohat Jald

In search for truth he takes no part,
As disciple stakes both head and heart.

Taveel Ka Phanda Koi Sayyad Laga De
Ye Shakh-e-Nasheman Se Uterta Hai Bohat Jald

If comments’ snare some hunter set,
From nest on bough would drop in net.

is it me or does this sound a little racist?

 

[Pakistani E]

A newborn faith invokes his taste,
Adopts with zeal but leaves with haste.

Is he describing himself there? Sorry all the respect to one side. But he also adopted a faith that he quickly left after a few years. We who are Kashmiris and know the history remember. No disrespect to the founding father. But this poem is probably when he was confused.

 

[My-Analogous]

Is he describing himself there? Sorry all the respect to one side. But he also adopted a faith that he quickly left after a few years. We who are Kashmiris and know the history remember. No disrespect to the founding father. But this poem is probably when he was confused.

If you are referring Qadyani faith then he never join them and yes he support him earlier and finally he knows where to stand

Iqbal’s opposition was against Qadiani doctrines.

Despite such intense opposition, when Iqbal’s attention was drawn to his speech in 1910 (in which he had described the Ahmadiyya Jama'at as a “true model of Islamic life”), the answer he gave is worth pondering over. He replied:

• 
  “I regret that I do not have that speech, neither the original English version nor its Urdu translation which was done by Maulana Zafar Ali Khan. As far as I remember I made that speech in 1911 or earlier, and I have no hesitation in admitting that a quarter of a century ago I expected good results to flow from this movement.… However, the true spirit of a religious movement is not revealed in a day, but takes years to be manifested properly. The mutual controversies between the two parties within the movement show that even those people who had personal connections with the founder did not know the direction the movement would take in the future. Personally, I became disillusioned with this movement when a new prophethood was claimed, a prophethood superior even to the prophethood of the Founder of Islam, and all Muslims were declared as kafir. Later my disillusionment developed to the stage of open opposition.”
  (Harf-i Iqbal, pp. 122 – 123.)
  Read below link for more information
  
  http://www.muslim.org/iqbal/ch6.htm

Please back to the topic now

(Zarb-e-Kaleem-063) Punjabi Musalman

Punjabi Musalman
Punjabi Muslim

Mazhab Mein Bohat Taza Pasand Iss Ki Tabiyat
Kar Le Kahin Manzil To Guzerta Hai Bohat Jald

A newborn faith invokes his taste,
Adopts with zeal but leaves with haste.

Tehqeeq Ki Bazi Ho To Shirkat Nahin Karta
Ho Khail Mureedi Ka To Harta Hai Bohat Jald

In search for truth he takes no part,
As disciple stakes both head and heart.

Taveel Ka Phanda Koi Sayyad Laga De
Ye Shakh-e-Nasheman Se Uterta Hai Bohat Jald

If comments’ snare some hunter set,
From nest on bough would drop in net.

is it me or does this sound a little racist?

Tariq Fateh is best example for this. But we can't judge the whole community by few culprits.

 

[xairhossi]

Tariq Fateh is best example for this. But we can't judge the whole community by few culprits.

What do you mean? How is Tarek Fatah relevant here?

 

[My-Analogous]

What do you mean? How is Tarek Fatah relevant here?

But again we have not to blame whole community and plus i don't consider him a Muslim

 

[xairhossi]

But again we have not to blame whole community and plus i don't consider him a Muslim

Tarek Fatah is not a Punjabi, he himself mentioned in a tweet that his ancestors came from Rajasthan in the 19th century to Punjab supposedly and converted to Islam. Moreover, his father was born in Bombay and moved to Karachi in 1947, his story seems too fishy. He only claims to be Punjabi so that his Punjabi-bashing and hatred for them is seen as justified.

https://twitter.com/x/status/735849650159157248

 

[Pakistani E]

If you are referring Qadyani faith then he never join them and yes he support him earlier and finally he knows where to stand

Iqbal’s opposition was against Qadiani doctrines.

Despite such intense opposition, when Iqbal’s attention was drawn to his speech in 1910 (in which he had described the Ahmadiyya Jama'at as a “true model of Islamic life”), the answer he gave is worth pondering over. He replied:

• 
  “I regret that I do not have that speech, neither the original English version nor its Urdu translation which was done by Maulana Zafar Ali Khan. As far as I remember I made that speech in 1911 or earlier, and I have no hesitation in admitting that a quarter of a century ago I expected good results to flow from this movement.… However, the true spirit of a religious movement is not revealed in a day, but takes years to be manifested properly. The mutual controversies between the two parties within the movement show that even those people who had personal connections with the founder did not know the direction the movement would take in the future. Personally, I became disillusioned with this movement when a new prophethood was claimed, a prophethood superior even to the prophethood of the Founder of Islam, and all Muslims were declared as kafir. Later my disillusionment developed to the stage of open opposition.”
  (Harf-i Iqbal, pp. 122 – 123.)
  Read below link for more information
  
  http://www.muslim.org/iqbal/ch6.htm

Please back to the topic now



Tariq Fateh is best example for this. But we can't judge the whole community by few culprits.

Did I ask for the reason? I know when he joined, why he left and when. Most of his family are still Ahmadi. We know his history.

I am replying to his criticism of Punjabi Musalman in that couplet, while he himself was first inspired by European Philosophers and secularism, then Indian nationalism, Sufism and then Ahmadiyya Jama'at and then finally to Sunnism. He kept changing himself, but he uses that as a criticism for others.

I am asking why he criticized others for what he did himself, while this life is a test and a journey it is natural for a man to look at different avenues and paths to choose. I still respect him as one of our founding fathers, and that respect is not diminished in any way.

 

[My-Analogous]

Tarek Fatah is not a Punjabi, he himself mentioned in a tweet that his ancestors came from Rajasthan in the 19th century to Punjab supposedly and converted to Islam. Moreover, his father was born in Bombay and moved to Karachi in 1947, his story seems too fishy. He only claims to be Punjabi so that his Punjabi-bashing and hatred for them is seen as justified.

https://twitter.com/x/status/735849650159157248

And where Singh are from? Please listen his full video

Did I ask for the reason? I know when he joined, why he left and when. Most of his family are still Ahmadi. We know his history.

I am replying to his criticism of Punjabi Musalman in that couplet, while he himself was first inspired by European Philosophers and secularism, then Indian nationalism, Sufism and then Ahmadiyya Jama'at and then finally to Sunnism. He kept changing himself, but he uses that as a criticism for others.

I am asking why he criticized others for what he did himself, while this life is a test and a journey it is natural for a man to look at different avenues and paths to choose. I still respect him as one of our founding fathers, and that respect is not diminished in any way.

You are putting tea and coffee on same cup. Philosophy is different ground and religion is different ground. Religion is a complete system but Philosophy is not and it is based on certain ideas about something

 

[Pakistani E]

And where Singh are from? Please listen his full video



You are putting tea and coffee on same cup. Philosophy is different ground and religion is different ground. Religion is a complete system but Philosophy is not and it is based on certain ideas about something

I mentioned religious aspects as well.

 

[My-Analogous]

I mentioned religious aspects as well.

and i reply accordingly and only two system you mentioned Ahmedi and sunni. Rest all are not systems

 

[xairhossi]

And where Singh are from? Please listen his full video

What do you mean 'where Singh are from'? It is a surname used all over India. He clearly mentions his family migrating from Rajasthan to Punjab and converting in the 19th century, his father was from Bombay and moved to Karachi in 1947 where he was born and brought up. His story doesn't even add up. I mean, it's pretty obvious. He bashes Punjabis since he is angry at the army for locking him up. He only says one or two phrases in Punjabi, and speaks in a very 'Mohajir' accent (of Karachi).

 

[Finer]

Apparently you haven't read his poetry about certain race or figure that will promote terrorism to defy Islam being biggest enemy of Islam will betray Pakistan to no end. I am not gonna mention the race just to avoid being accused of propagating racial profiling.

Iqbal emphasized greatly on this topic which i understood through the translation thanks to the translator. In original language, that is very hard to understand. Urdu is not my strong suit.

 

[xairhossi]

Apparently you haven't read his poetry about certain race or figure that will promote terrorism to defy Islam being biggest enemy of Islam will betray Pakistan to no end. I am not gonna mention the race just to avoid being accused of propagating racial profiling.

Tell me, I'm curious.

 

[Kabira]

Tarek Fatah is not a Punjabi, he himself mentioned in a tweet that his ancestors came from Rajasthan in the 19th century to Punjab supposedly and converted to Islam. Moreover, his father was born in Bombay and moved to Karachi in 1947, his story seems too fishy. He only claims to be Punjabi so that his Punjabi-bashing and hatred for them is seen as justified.

https://twitter.com/x/status/735849650159157248

He doesn't know punjabi which is enough proof. This rajasthan angle is new one. I remember reading his tweet about parents migrating from Mumbai. He just pretend to be one and then go on to bash punjabis. But his family history and the fact that he can't speak punjabi doesn't add up.

Is he describing himself there? Sorry all the respect to one side. But he also adopted a faith that he quickly left after a few years. We who are Kashmiris and know the history remember. No disrespect to the founding father. But this poem is probably when he was confused.

I don't think it means what you are implying. Pretty sure translation is wrong for some reason.

 

[xairhossi]

He doesn't know punjabi which is enough proof. This rajasthan angle is new one. I remember reading his tweet about parents migrating from Mumbai. He just pretend to be one and then go on to bash punjabis. But his family history and the fact that he can't speak punjabi doesn't add up.

His stories just don't add up. His family migrated from Rajasthan to Gujrat, Punjab in the mid-1800s (probably British times), converted to Islam but somehow his father ended up in Bombay and migrated to Karachi in 1947 where he was born and brought up? And look at his accent from the video posted above, he literally says 'abey bhaiyya' every other minute.