International Movies/photos

[A.Rahman]

F-35

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4712727003603861589&q=us+air+force

Imagine getting your hands on one of these

 

[Muradk]

Imagine getting your hands on one of these

Rehman my friend in the 70s we asked the USAF for A-6s and they refused us and after a couple of years my old course mate
Mr perviz who left PAF early in the 70s and got a job with Lockheed martin in USA he came to Pakistan and asked PAF to ask USA for F-16s , and every body thought the he is crazy. F-16 in the 70s was like the raptor or the JS-35 we used to dream about F-16s and PAF with the help of Mr Perviz took couple of years but finally they gave us the F-16s they were delivered to one of my seniors and a war hero Air Cdre Nozi Haider and Brig Mahmood Durrani .
So you never know what we get in the future, it all depends how desperate US is for our help.

 

[melb4aust]

Chinese air force with Su-27s

[URL="

Hell they're playing F-22 Raptor Lightning III in this clip.

 

[melb4aust]

Rehman my friend in the 70s we asked the USAF for A-6s and they refused us and after a couple of years my old course mate
Mr perviz who left PAF early in the 70s and got a job with Lockheed martin in USA he came to Pakistan and asked PAF to ask USA for F-16s , and every body thought the he is crazy. F-16 in the 70s was like the raptor or the JS-35 we used to dream about F-16s and PAF with the help of Mr Perviz took couple of years but finally they gave us the F-16s they were delivered to one of my seniors and a war hero Air Cdre Nozi Haider and Brig Mahmood Durrani .
So you never know what we get in the future, it all depends how desperate US is for our help.

There is one thing, we do alot of debate about getting this from there and also put a lot of effort to have that, say from other countries. Why dont we consume all that effort to develope some thing ours, why rely on some body else? Every one Just think about it for a min....... We are no different specie on this earth. Obviousley there are going to be some issues we have to go through, but should try our best, China is the biggest example

 

[TexasJohn]

Thunderbirds

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7073108393387680067&q=us+air+force

I was very fortuntate in seeing them live in Ft.Worth, especially when they sneak up behind the audience and scare the p!$$ out of them!

Muradk - one crazy question - I have never seen them in flight suits. How do they handle it with all the Gs they pull? even in the clip they are not wearing any!

 

[Muradk]

I was very fortuntate in seeing them live in Ft.Worth, especially when they sneak up behind the audience and scare the p!$$ out of them!

Muradk - one crazy question - I have never seen them in flight suits. How do they handle it with all the Gs they pull? even in the clip they are not wearing any!

These aerobatics piolts when they join the teams like , Blue angles, Thunder Birds, RED As, they have more than 2 to 3 thousand hours so they have a lot of experience in flying and are used to forces of gravity plus or Minus. "At nine [positive] G's, you can't move a muscle. It pins your hands and arms down, and your head weighs 100-plus pounds.

G-LOC, pronounced 'Gee-Lock', is an abbreviated term meaning G-Induced Loss of Consciousness. Not many simulations have been able to model this phenomenon effectively. Most people refer to it as "blackout," including the simulation companies. Because of the incorrect use of terminology, many believe that when you pull high G's, the only symptom you get is the tunnel vision and eventual blackout / simulated loss of consciousness. There is nothing further from the truth.
What does a pilot have to worry about during a high G maneuver?

First off, there is the amount of concentration involved in preparation of and then the actual "grunting" done while in the maneuver. No game has been able to model this. As you sit in your comfy chair, you have none of these factors to deal with. Already you are at an advantage.
Second, there is shear physical pain involved in pulling high G’s. flight surgeon in the Pakistan AirForce, FLIGHTDOC regularly has to go on flights with pilots to evaluate them and their condition. To me the pain during a high G maneuver is excruciating. Anyone that has ever experienced any type of pain knows that it is extremely difficult to think of anything else while in severe pain. Training can overcome some of this, but nowhere near all of it. Concentration is difficult to maintain while in pain. So again, as you sit in your comfy chair, sipping on a soda, you are at a serious advantage.
I have heard jokes from pilots about the new guys that come out of a training exercise with their necks twisted in pain. They tried to look around in a high G turn. Of course, there are ways to help overcome some of this, but the effort and gyrations you must go through makes it a difficult task. I also need to point out that there is a distinct difference between grey / blackout and G-LOC. The first time in F-86 I experienced a 5+ G pull out during the war I was lucky that day, I greyed felt like I was getting a headache and started to lose field of view (in that order) only a few seconds of pulling out at the bottom of a dive. This isn't G-LOC since I didn't actually go nighty-night but I lost control of the plane and went into a dive which actually helped save my *** that day.
To have a pilot state that they can "pull high G’s as long as they need to" is understating the importance of proper preparation and physical fitness. These comments completely discount and downplay the difficulty that fighter pilots must overcome every day. It just is not as easy as they were making it sound. If this were indeed the case, why would there be a need for G-suits or "speed jeans?" The other question is just exactly how long is "as long as I need to?" In a true life or death situation, the human body is capable of amazing feats, but rarely has anyone in a situation like this ever been hooked up to the proper equipment to get an accurate idea of just what really can be done.
Some may argue that it is a well-known fact that the Blue Angels do not wear G-suits. A short analysis will show that the Blue Angels pull sustained G’s in a controlled, gradual onset (gradual may be quick, or slow, but a build up, as opposed to a sudden jerk to 9 G's) environment. They also do not make many high G maneuvers without periods of rest. Ever wonder what Angels 5 and 6 are doing while 1, 2, 3, and 4 are showing off? Or vice versa? The shows are designed to allow the pilots to perform high G maneuvers without risk to the pilots or audience. Do not take this as an insult to the Blue Angels or their abilities. On the contrary, I regard them as some of the finest pilots in the world, even more so for their understanding and recognition of their own physical limitations. Their reasons for not wearing G-suits are based on precision control, not on physical reasons. They brace their arms on their legs to help maintain precise movements of the stick. The pumping up and down of the G-suit would cause their arm to move which in turn would cause movement in the stick. The Thunderbirds, on the other hand, do not have to worry about this since their sticks are on the side (F/A-18 vs. F-16).

Next, folks will quote the myth that the Russians do not wear G suits either. These guys are also known to drink hydraulic fluid when they are out of vodka. Does that mean it is right? But seriously, Russians DO have G-suits. Pretty darn good ones, too. While it is my understanding these are optional at the pilot’s discretion, most do wear them.

The G-LOC fatigue factor is such an important and integral part of combat flying that development of the Combined Advanced Technology Enhanced Design G-Ensemble (COMBAT EDGE) is in progress. While a normal G-suit provides passive protection to about 5.5+ G’s, anything beyond that requires active participation from the pilot. Even up to 5.5+ G's, pilots are using their "grunting," CTFB ("crap the football"), or L1/M1 (anti-G straining) maneuver. The COMBAT EDGE will enhance the pilot’s ability to tolerate sustained G's as well as assist in proper breathing rhythms for maximum tolerance.

There is also the "HOOK" maneuver that the Navy is researching. The word "HOOK" is used as a mnemonic aid to help the trainee accomplish the anti-G strain properly. Vocalizing "HOOK" causes voluntarily closing of the glottis (the vocal apparatus of the larynx, consisting of the true vocal cords and the opening between them), which is an important part of effective anti-G straining. U.S. Navy experience shows that this method is more effective than the "grunt" and L-1/M-1 techniques used before. If fighter pilots could already "pull high G’s as long as they need to," none of these improvements or this research would be necessary.
But on the serious side, pulling 9 G’s in a simulator with no need to control an aircraft or deal with combat issues is entirely different than pulling 9 G’s while trying to maintain control of an aircraft.
In addition, most modern centrifuge seating is adjustable. It has been proven in a centrifuge that an 80 degree recline can allow sustained G tolerance of up to 15 G’s. It would be a bit difficult to actually see out of an aircraft at this angle. The F-16's 30 degree recline or SU-25M's 35 degree recline is about as far as is practical at this point. These angles allow an increase in G tolerance of about 1 additional G.
I have never lost a dogfight to human or AI due to blackout limitations, but from my own mistakes. The fatigue factor comes in the more high G maneuvers you make in a row, the sooner G-LOC will set in. If you take a rest between maneuvers, body recovers its self .

Some of the stuff was taken from an article by General Chuck Horner.I would recommend every one who is into aviation go and get the book
EVERY ONE A TIGER that tells you what a fighter pilot is and it will also tell you where Pakistan Air force stands in world ranking.

effects of Gs

plus you can see that the ediot is chewing a gum that could kill him in a black out if it gets stuck in his throat.

 

[Officer of Engineers]

General,

Does that mean you're combat ineffective just after one fight? How fast is the turnaround?

 

[tahirkhely]

[COLOR=#0000]Brother tahirkhely,[/COLOR]

we all know of the crimes being commited by Isreal on palastinian civilians, but here were were discussing about military might, tahir face it; why do you think that arab lost the war in six days? all of them vs one small nation?

We have to first help ourself then rely on Allah, Allah helps who help themselves.

Even when mecans invaded media to kill muslims, sahabi (companions of prophet) formed an army and resisted, then only Allah helped them.

Also brother you do know its a big sin calling another muslims brother "non-muslim".



who are we to judge? Only Allah knows whats in the heart.

Very pious man you are. i have said sorry to the gentleman.

 

[tahirkhely]

Some of the stuff was taken from an article by General Chuck Horner.I would recommend every one who is into aviation go and get the book
EVERY ONE A TIGER that tells you what a fighter pilot is and it will also tell you where Pakistan Air force stands in world ranking.

Where does PAF stand in the world?

 

[tahirkhely]

General Murad, hope you will Ignore him.

Neo was going to ban him for life, but I stopped him in time

Our "little" friend still has lot to learn.

Your little friend has lot to learn from my big friends :flag: :army:

 

[tahirkhely]

brother please feel free to PM me about any problem you have here.

Salam.

Wsalam.
there is no prejudice in this post of mine. You are a moderator and your spelling mistakes :read: .

 

[Neo]

Fighters in action.

[URL="

 

[Muradk]

General,

Does that mean you're combat ineffective just after one fight? How fast is the turnaround?

:smile: No my friend this is not how it works , when you are engaged in a dog fight it is only for 2 or 3 min that is it. In that you or the enemy are pulling up-to 9 Gs and that does deplete your energy but you recover in 30 to 40 sec when you straighten the plane once the blood runs once from head to toe you feel normal and you are ready to get back in action , human body is amazing it calculates its self that this body goes into stress every day and it adjusts its self. And yes when you land you are very tired, Again you get used to it that is why these aerobatics teams keep rotating there pilots.

 

[melb4aust]

effects of Gs

[URL="

plus you can see that the ediot is chewing a gum that could kill him in a black out if it gets stuck in his throat.

I've never thought, that its that difficult to cope G forces after looking at this video. On the other hand the pilot was quite use to it, so thats why he was mentally aware of the situation, both in and out of the aircraft.

 

[Muradk]

I've never thought, that its that difficult to cope G forces after looking at this video. On the other hand the pilot was quite use to it, so thats why he was mentally aware of the situation, both in and out of the aircraft.

Yes you are very right. check your Pm in a min