Indonesia Defence Forum

[NEKONEKO]

I think it's possible to be like an ally without the need to enter an alliance when facing common enemy. I mean in the past US and Soviet (with love and hate relationship) fight against Nazi Germany, the US even offer ships to the Soviet to invade Japan, didn't UK purposely leaking infos to the soviet to help them fight against Germany. It will be different for us and US.

Intinya cuman melawan musuh bersama untuk posisi hubungan dengan AS ya tinggal bagaimana menjelaskannya ke publik.

View attachment 655326

F35 please.

 

[JCMan]

To be fair, we're pretty much already well within the US sphere, just not publicly. Anybody that genuinely thinks we're not is in denial at this point.

What do they think the HUGE new annex over at the US embassy is for? Processing visas?

As a hub for intelligence gathering in the region since the Jakarta embassy had sufficient space for that purpose?

I highly doubt the notion that your trying to spin about how the size of a country's embassy represent how tight the diplomatic relations of that country is with the host nation, were you really trying to imply that?

I would advice you not to continue insinuating things that are clearly unsubstantiated and without factual details to back up those statements as to not insult the intelligence of other readers. Cheers!

 

[Raduga]

France give Us $30b
48 rafale
Scorpene
Gowind (im prefer mistrale class)
SAM
US of A ??
Maybe we can ask US permission for Scalp
Since Scalp use some US material part, or maybe tomahawk.. we need cruise missile range about 500km till 750km..
F15ex or F16v,F18Suphorn??
Much more tech acces for ifx/lfx

gowind and mistral are different thing , and going to gowind wont give us any advantage to that sigma or even the Iver huitfeldt , choose either belharra or FREMM-ER (FREMM with Seafire 500 instead of Herakles)

 

[Chestnut]

Dude whats up with you and your US thingy really? I can understand your fascination about US, but I think we get your point already. US relation with us is always going to be up and down. Sure US has special place in our diplomatic relation, simply because they are Superpower. Is that mean we have to "bow down" and publicly stated that we need US then go with full fledged alliance? Come onnn...

I'm not. Really just go to Monas and look for yourself. It's not hard to put 2 and 2 together.

Our founding father put "bebas aktif" in our constitution for a reason. They know superpower Nations will try their best to influence Indonesia to their full alliance side thus locking our political/economic move, With this "bebas aktif" we can reject any full military aliance with respect to them as well. And this also giving us more rooms to pasang dua kaki thus benefit our nation more. If we all going to do it under the table for our own interest and lean more to one side so be it, Im sure any sane and educated person in Indonesia who have political knowledge wont mind.

In a perfect world sure, but we both know that no law in this country is absolute. The law changes to suit the individual, not the other way around.

and here we go again

The Air Force (and largely the majority of our air assets) is geared towards American made planes my guy; logistically, operationally, and in some cases culturally. Hence why I am always going to pick an American made plane when given choice because like it or not, they are always going to be the ones that would give us more bang for the buck.

The Navy is geared towards European made ships, hence why I never suggest buying Burkes, OHPs, or any sort of American ship since it would take the Navy some time to get used to the change (and in some cases, likely never would *ahem* Flanker *ahem*)

That's not even fanboying, that's just being realistic.

As a hub for intelligence gathering in the region since the Jakarta embassy had sufficient space for that purpose?

I highly doubt the notion that your trying to spin about how the size of a country's embassy represent how tight the diplomatic relations of that country is with the host nation, were you really trying to imply that?

I would advice you not to continue insinuating things that are clearly unsubstantiated and without factual details to back up those statements as to not insult the intelligence of other readers. Cheers!

Lmao and here we go again...

Honestly, believe in whatever you want my guy, this obsession towards me is pretty cringe but I appreciate the love.

Also.

I highly doubt the notion that your trying to spin about how the size of a country's embassy represent how tight the diplomatic relations of that country is with the host nation, were you really trying to imply that?

>tfw you don't have an argument so you basically start putting words in your opponent's mouth so you make an argument for that one instead.

Lmao.

 

[Cromwell]

Damn, i don't like that video on our KKP personels boarding what seems alike Vietnamese fishing vessel illegally poaching on our waters, idk whether these people are state sponsored but there seems to be lack of effort from their authority preventing their fishermen stealing from us. I'm telling you these people no more better than China, both are potential threat to our interests

 

[JCMan]

I'm not. Really just go to Monas and look for yourself. It's not hard to put 2 and 2 together.



In a perfect world sure, but we both know that no law in this country is absolute. The law changes to suit the individual, not the other way around.



The Air Force (and largely the majority of our air assets) is geared towards American made planes my guy; logistically, operationally, and in some cases culturally. Hence why I am always going to pick an American made plane when given choice because like it or not, they are always going to be the ones that would give us more bang for the buck.

The Navy is geared towards European made ships, hence why I never suggest buying Burkes, OHPs, or any sort of American ship since it would take the Navy some time to get used to the change (and in some cases, likely never would *ahem* Flanker *ahem*)

That's not even fanboying, that's just being realistic.


Lmao and here we go again...

Honestly, believe in whatever you want my guy, this obsession towards me is pretty cringe but I appreciate the love.

Also.



>tfw you don't have an argument so you basically start putting words in your opponent's mouth so you make an argument for that one instead.

Lmao.

I'm not. Really just go to Monas and look for yourself. It's not hard to put 2 and 2 together.



In a perfect world sure, but we both know that no law in this country is absolute. The law changes to suit the individual, not the other way around.



The Air Force (and largely the majority of our air assets) is geared towards American made planes my guy; logistically, operationally, and in some cases culturally. Hence why I am always going to pick an American made plane when given choice because like it or not, they are always going to be the ones that would give us more bang for the buck.

The Navy is geared towards European made ships, hence why I never suggest buying Burkes, OHPs, or any sort of American ship since it would take the Navy some time to get used to the change (and in some cases, likely never would *ahem* Flanker *ahem*)

That's not even fanboying, that's just being realistic.


Lmao and here we go again...

Honestly, believe in whatever you want my guy, this obsession towards me is pretty cringe but I appreciate the love.

Also.



>tfw you don't have an argument so you basically start putting words in your opponent's mouth so you make an argument for that one instead.

Lmao.

What words did I put in your mouth? Did you not said it yourself that there's a correlation between the huge new Annex in the US embassy with us moving closer into US sphere of influence? Not your words, huh?

Yeah, I'm obsessed with debunking unsubstantiated bullshits.

 

[Kansel]

Yeah, same as you guys I'm hoping MoD will procure F35 too. But in terms of supporting infrastructure like network infrastructure? Knowing F35 is an flying computer and seeing our network infrastructure i think it's not a right time to procure F35, there's much more beside than that. We're had no experience to tend Stealth fighter in terms of its coating. We're also had no great experience on BVR warfare.

 

[Chestnut]

What words did I put in your mouth? Did you not said it yourself that there's a correlation between the huge new Annex in the US embassy with us moving closer into US sphere of influence? Not your words, huh?

Yeah, I'm obsessed with debunking unsubstantiated bullshits.

No, since all I said was what do you think the new annex is for? Not once did I say "hurr durr bigger embassy = close relations!!", you said that.

You're grasping at straws my guy.

BTW, you just proved that I'm right by speculating what the annex was likely for.

So in your own words, you're saying that Indonesian government is letting the American government erect a massive nerve center for regional intelligence gathering, all done explicitly within our borders; the capital even, and yet we are somehow NOT well within the US sphere of influence?

 

[Nike]

Damn, i don't like that video on our KKP personels boarding what seems alike Vietnamese fishing vessel illegally poaching on our waters, idk whether these people are state sponsored but there seems to be lack of effort from their authority preventing their fishermen stealing from us. I'm telling you these people no more better than China, both are potential threat to our interests

there is little Commies and Big Commies

Both are nuisance and need to be spanked properly

 

[JCMan]

Yeah, same as you guys I'm hoping MoD will procure F35 too. But in terms of supporting infrastructure like network infrastructure? Knowing F35 is an flying computer and seeing our network infrastructure i think it's not a right time to procure F35, there's much more beside than that. We're had no experience to tend Stealth fighter in terms of its coating. We're also had no great experience on BVR warfare.

https://www.beritasatu.com/nasional/528665-batan-kembangkan-cat-khusus-anti-deteksi-radar

 

[Fl0gger]

fyi every fish poacher on our water is state sponsored viet is just as bad as china then thai's incase of illegal fishing malay's is come last right now belive it or not.

oh iya TNI AU secara culture saat ini terutama saat orde baru memang dekat dgn US tapi secara history tidak AU besar saat era pak soekarno ah jd ingat dl ada seorang "teman" yg berjuang mati matian menawarkan pswt delta dr eropa dgn paket komplit wes sak network e sampai join prod di DI pun mau sayang ga berhasil padahal udh pake segala cara kasihan skr dengar bisikan entah benar atau tidak pindah ke produk barat lain nya yg lebih super power pake cara yang sama bahkan lebih ekstrem ya maklum supe powe tapi ttp ajah dpt proyek receh itu juga karena kasihan sih di AU masih blm deal di AD dpt lah dikit di AL dia nyerah karena dia tau AL lebih padat karya dan east centris dr matra lain nya lol well good luck old friend dimana pun km berada skr di cari di kaskus udh ga posting lg kayanya .....

 

[Raduga]

https://www.beritasatu.com/nasional/528665-batan-kembangkan-cat-khusus-anti-deteksi-radar

developing a stealth coating is one thing ,turning it into aerospace grades is other problem, we don't have a climatic test facility to make sure that coating is applicable to aerospace structure, you can get normal aerospaces grade paint easily but not in the case of paint with radar absorbent properties.

even an experienced country like US still experiencing their high tech coating getting crumbled and scraped off from their plane.

 

[Gen3115]

Yeah, same as you guys I'm hoping MoD will procure F35 too. But in terms of supporting infrastructure like network infrastructure? Knowing F35 is an flying computer and seeing our network infrastructure i think it's not a right time to procure F35, there's much more beside than that. We're had no experience to tend Stealth fighter in terms of its coating. We're also had no great experience on BVR warfare.

F-35 is inevitable, but I'm hoping we acquire them at the right time, now is not the right time. Like I said before, it's not a good idea to do that big of a leap, we have to at least operate a 4.5-gen fighter first. All the F-35 operators are doing the same thing, they either joined the JSF program and had time to contribute in development and setup their infrastructure or they have already operated the latest F-16's and F/A-18's. F-16V is a preliminary step to operating true 5th gens like the F-35.

 

[Nike]

prefer doing it step by step, Indonesian Air Forces even doesn't have integrated network system yet (still in build), doesn't have adequate number of workhorse fighter to cover more than 7 million square kilometer of our Air space area, doesn't have adequate number of supporting units like tanker aircraft, doesn't have adequate number of SAR combat helicopter and utility helicopter to support ground units, doesn't have overlapping radar coverage for our Air Defense Radar system. And many thing we are lacking like AWACS/AEW, intelligent surveillance gathering and so on.

I am still in believe fourth generation fighter (high end type like Rafale, Typhoon, F-15 E, F-18 E/F and F16 V) still became the backbone of any air force until 2040 or 2050 as even USA still ordering them in large number and projected to be used until half of century. Prefer to build the airforce in number based on such mature platform first then when all of the facility, tools, human resources, industrial capability to support the already we had and everything else is ready we can move to create elite units in which operating high end fifth Gen platform.

 

[Gen3115]

https://www.beritasatu.com/nasional/528665-batan-kembangkan-cat-khusus-anti-deteksi-radar

I wouldn't really be as confident about this if I were you, stealth coating isn't easy