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@Chestnut i heard, the T&C for us to acquire advanced eagle is to cancel current contract for SU-35, is it true? The issues are rising again eventually

Better u214, but their milgem also good. The pakistani one is likley more armed than turks' milgem and Altay? NO just BIG NO
(Have problem witth engine and their BMC company, still they not produce it- sorry turk arkadas)

Btw anyone know AH tweets about choice beacuse we didint have money between u209 (many said kasel kw) vs KFX?

(Since some peoples tell me about him more, i think what he said maybe based)


What if the public is kind like kaum bravo travo travo hidup tni?

Searching battle proven label? Killing 3 pantsir in syria and some apc

Killing 1 pantsir and make advance in al watiyah

The army in 2003 already use vest and the marine in this pic using belgian made fnc. The army vest is great blend with camo. Not like now black vest over camo...

Tim jatanras polis (tingkat polres lah) also have good armament like imported ar15 (sig sauer, colt, hk etc)
Eh brimob punya tavor :partay:
Milgem included as kornas contender if im not wrong.
 
Meanwhile KFX has always been billed as a medium to long term project, whose goals are not simply to buy additional airframes but mostly to gain the know how of fighter design and manufacturing process (and having some input in the design).. Which is basically a long term investment for our aerospace industry and skill... so no contest in that regards really...

That's why I'm rather confused on why some people seems to think that this is a "either KFX or Vipers/Su35/Rafale/etc" situation instead of a "Vipers/Su35/Rafale/etc and KFX" situation... It's not like KFX and the other fighters are mutually exclusive, where we can only have one and not the other...

This time I actually agree with you, people need to differentiate between the short-term fighter acquisitions, the potential crash program acquisitions and the long term development like the KFX. However, you will find it surprising that there are people on here and other forums who'd be willing to sacrifice the other more urgent acquisitions like F-16V for the sake of more long-term and riskier programs like the KFX. I agree that we should continue KFX but we cannot risk sacrificing the more urgent short term acquisitions especially when our Air Force requires more air power generation and the only platform that can add capability but also cost-effective in adding airpower generation for the AU is the F-16V for now.

The gripe I have with the KFX is simply on our involvement and our agreement with the South Koreans, other than our lack of political will and commitment that resulted in us not paying for the program for 2 years. There is also doubts coming from our side whether we are getting what we invested 20% in the program for, like mentioned here before there were doubts about our manufacturing and IP rights relating to the KFX. So yes you can say that the purpose of KFX to gain know how of fighter design and manufacturing as well as our own input for KFX (more range, probe and drogue refueling instead of boom, our own datalink (was told by an SK journalist that we were going to put our own datalink on IFX, which I doubt)), but the problem now is whether we're actually getting what we're worth for 20% and some say thats one of the reasons we haven't been paying and why there was talks about renegotiating our investment to only 15% is because there was doubts whether we're going to get we paid 20% in the program for. Again I'm not against KFX, I actually support it, but its a bad idea to sacrifice urgent needs for combat effectiveness and air power generation for a riskier more long term program, not too mention when KFX flies in the 2030's, most of the other countries are probably going to go 5th gen, I don't really want the TNI-AU to fall behind simply because we prioritized pseudo-pride and prestige over actual airpower generation and overall capability.
 
@Chestnut i heard, the T&C for us to acquire advanced eagle is to cancel current contract for SU-35, is it true?

I can believe it.

Here is a more in depth take about the Euro Triangles.

A survey of AirPower developments to inform the TNI AU’s proposed aquistion of a new fighter type

1. In theory, Australia, Singapore and Indonesia need to work together it to stand a chance against the new hegemonic power that has appeared in the post COVID-19 world. But given current Indonesian attitude to regional cooperation, I am not sure if this cooperation can ever occur.

2. Let me survey some AirPower developments in Australia and Singapore to inform this TNI AU discussion on a proposed new platform acquisition — the Eurofighter Typhoon (and my preference is to see Tranche 4 capabilities installed).
(i) The RAAF with its E-7A as battle manager, MC-55As and Growlers has formidable capabilities to dominate the electromagnetic spectrum. They are also well advanced in their fleet renewal plan with the F-35A to hit IOC in Dec 2020.
(ii) By 2026, Singapore will make a start on operating 4 F-35Bs (with an option for 8 more). The RSAF as plans to slowly phase out, what I speculate to be between 24 to 36 of our F-16s by the late 2030s (to be replaced by F-35Bs, many of which will be based in the US). News appeared yesterday that Singapore’s 12 F-16s at Luke Airbase will be moving to another location.
(iii) By late 2030s, Singapore’s F-35Bs will operate forward in hostile airspace using its VLO characteristics to survive, while passing detailed targeting information back to the G550 AEW who as a battlespace manager will cue the fleet of 40 F-15SGs to fire their air-to-air and air-to-surface missiles at maximum range. This approach maximises the qualities of the different aircraft involved.


3. By the way, I have always been a fan of the Eurofighter Typhoon — really hope to see it at regional airshows in TNI AU colours.

4. TOT matters and will affect the sustainment of the selected platform. I would strongly prefer the Eurofighter Typhoon over any F-16V purchase. My preference is informed by the following facts:
(i) Singapore’s F-16s will eventually be retired in favour of 24 to 36 F-35Bs in the late 2030s. I see the RSAF’s F-16 fleet, first acquired in Feb 1988, as no longer regionally competitive in 2049.
(ii) Starting in 2026, Singapore’s 12 F-16s will operate along side its first four lot 15 (Block 4) F-35Bs, in a US base location to be selected. Singapore has an option for 8 more F-35Bs, which will be exercised if testing and/or technical discussions are satisfactory to DSTA as acquisition program manager. But the F-35Bs’ data links still need work to talk to our G550AEWs and money is going to be spent. But these nagging issues can’t be simply resolved in 1 to 2 years. This is why the defence minister talks about the need to do testing on the F-35Bs and these distributed lethality issues can easily take until 2028 to 2030 to resolve at an initial level with different IOC and FOC gates. With distributed lethality FOC taking place in the late 2030s, at the earliest, I suspect (and really to early to predict in 2020).

(iii) The UK’s Eurofighter Typhoons will continue to operate alongside their F-35Bs as part of their AirPower fleet renewal plans well into the 2040s.
(iv) Eurofighter Typhoons in production for Kuwait and Qatar are considered the most advanced. They will be equipped with the AESA Captor-E radar, produced by the Euroradar consortium, that is being tested in Germany aboard the Instrumented Production Aircraft (IPA)-8 and also tested aboard IPA-5 from Warton. Another sensor that will be tested in Warton in support of this purchase is the Lockheed Martin Sniper targeting pod. Deliveries of the 28 Kuwait aircraft start in 4Q 2020, while the 24 Qatar jets will be delivered from 2022.
(v) The first Qatari students have started their training in the UK, with 65 students taking English language training at the RAF Cosford base in 2019. The first of these students will eventually join the RAF and Qatar Amiri Air Force Typhoon Joint Squadron.
(vi) If the TNI AU is really interested in this platform, Indonesia’s ministry of defence will need to place an order (with contracts signed) by 2022 to take first deliver of new aircraft by 2028 — as there is a production queue (behind Kuwait and Qatar orders).
(vii) The TNI AU is not on the way to being a regionally competitive air force until it has AWACS and tankers in service. Until then, Indonesia will need support from all its allies and partners that the country can summon, to be competitive against the PLA(N).

5. Plus it would be good for TNI AU, RAAF and RSAF to operate the same tanker. So that if any of our airbases are bombed or if the aircraft suffers battle damage, we can divert the A330MRTTs to each other’s bases — esp RAAF Butterworth and TNI AU’s Natuna Besar which have limited air defence coverage with SAMs.



I agree with his take. Like or not in order to survive a hypothetical 'hot' war with 'you know who', we would need to work together closely with the Australian and Singaporean Air Forces; Least until external American help arrives. I think it's great if we procure the MRTT, Wedgetail, Poseidon, F-16V, and the F-35 since you would at least have a common pool of mechanics and facilities in the region that knows how to maintain and support them.

Having the Euro Triangle would at least satisfy a lot of parties in the country without deviating too far from what is compatible with our current inventory.

All in all a good plan today instead of a perfect plan 10 years from now.
 
Last edited:
I can believe it.

Here is a more in depth take about the Euro Triangles.

A survey of AirPower developments to inform the TNI AU’s proposed aquistion of a new fighter type

1. In theory, Australia, Singapore and Indonesia need to work together it to stand a chance against the new hegemonic power that has appeared in the post COVID-19 world. But given current Indonesian attitude to regional cooperation, I am not sure if this cooperation can ever occur.

2. Let me survey some AirPower developments in Australia and Singapore to inform this TNI AU discussion on a proposed new platform acquisition — the Eurofighter Typhoon (and my preference is to see Tranche 4 capabilities installed).
(i) The RAAF with its E-7A as battle manager, MC-55As and Growlers has formidable capabilities to dominate the electromagnetic spectrum. They are also well advanced in their fleet renewal plan with the F-35A to hit IOC in Dec 2020.
(ii) By 2026, Singapore will make a start on operating 4 F-35Bs (with an option for 8 more). The RSAF as plans to slowly phase out, what I speculate to be between 24 to 36 of our F-16s by the late 2030s (to be replaced by F-35Bs, many of which will be based in the US). News appeared yesterday that Singapore’s 12 F-16s at Luke Airbase will be moving to another location.
(iii) By late 2030s, Singapore’s F-35Bs will operate forward in hostile airspace using its VLO characteristics to survive, while passing detailed targeting information back to the G550 AEW who as a battlespace manager will cue the fleet of 40 F-15SGs to fire their air-to-air and air-to-surface missiles at maximum range. This approach maximises the qualities of the different aircraft involved.


3. By the way, I have always been a fan of the Eurofighter Typhoon — really hope to see it at regional airshows in TNI AU colours.

4. TOT matters and will affect the sustainment of the selected platform. I would strongly prefer the Eurofighter Typhoon over any F-16V purchase. My preference is informed by the following facts:
(i) Singapore’s F-16s will eventually be retired in favour of 24 to 36 F-35Bs in the late 2030s. I see the RSAF’s F-16 fleet, first acquired in Feb 1988, as no longer regionally competitive in 2049.
(ii) Starting in 2026, Singapore’s 12 F-16s will operate along side its first four lot 15 (Block 4) F-35Bs, in a US base location to be selected. Singapore has an option for 8 more F-35Bs, which will be exercised if testing and/or technical discussions are satisfactory to DSTA as acquisition program manager. But the F-35Bs’ data links still need work to talk to our G550AEWs and money is going to be spent. But these nagging issues can’t be simply resolved in 1 to 2 years. This is why the defence minister talks about the need to do testing on the F-35Bs and these distributed lethality issues can easily take until 2028 to 2030 to resolve at an initial level with different IOC and FOC gates. With distributed lethality FOC taking place in the late 2030s, at the earliest, I suspect (and really to early to predict in 2020).

(iii) The UK’s Eurofighter Typhoons will continue to operate alongside their F-35Bs as part of their AirPower fleet renewal plans well into the 2040s.
(iv) Eurofighter Typhoons in production for Kuwait and Qatar are considered the most advanced. They will be equipped with the AESA Captor-E radar, produced by the Euroradar consortium, that is being tested in Germany aboard the Instrumented Production Aircraft (IPA)-8 and also tested aboard IPA-5 from Warton. Another sensor that will be tested in Warton in support of this purchase is the Lockheed Martin Sniper targeting pod. Deliveries of the 28 Kuwait aircraft start in 4Q 2020, while the 24 Qatar jets will be delivered from 2022.
(v) The first Qatari students have started their training in the UK, with 65 students taking English language training at the RAF Cosford base in 2019. The first of these students will eventually join the RAF and Qatar Amiri Air Force Typhoon Joint Squadron.
(vi) If the TNI AU is really interested in this platform, Indonesia’s ministry of defence will need to place an order (with contracts signed) by 2022 to take first deliver of new aircraft by 2028 — as there is a production queue (behind Kuwait and Qatar orders).
(vii) The TNI AU is not on the way to being a regionally competitive air force until it has AWACS and tankers in service. Until then, Indonesia will need support from all its allies and partners that the country can summon, to be competitive against the PLA(N).

5. Plus it would be good for TNI AU, RAAF and RSAF to operate the same tanker. So that if any of our airbases are bombed or if the aircraft suffers battle damage, we can divert the A330MRTTs to each other’s bases — esp RAAF Butterworth and TNI AU’s Natuna Besar which have limited air defence coverage with SAMs.



I agree with his take. Like or not in order to survive a hypothetical 'hot' war with 'you know who', we would need to work together closely with the Australian and Singaporean Air Forces; Least until external American help arrives. I think it's great if we procure the MRTT, Wedgetail, Poseidon, F-16V, and the F-35 since you would at least have a common pool of mechanics and facilities in the region that knows how to maintain and support them.

Having the Euro Triangle would at least satisfy a lot of parties in the country without deviating too far from what is compatible with our current inventory.

All in all a good plan today instead of a perfect plan 10 years from now.

Man, you copy paste OPSSG comment on Defense Talk without mentioning him
 
Diajak Kerja Sama Bareng Pindad buat Bikin Maung, Ini Kata Toyota
Jumat, 24 Juli 2020 | 14:15 WIB

Komentar

Lihat Foto
KOMPAS.COM/KRISTIANTO PURNOMO
Prototipe kendaraan taktis (rantis) Maung 4x4 produksi PT Pindad di Bandung, Jawa Barat, Rabu (22/7/2020). Kendaraan ini digunakan beberapa waktu lalu oleh Menteri Pertahanan, Prabowo Subianto dan rencananya akan diproduksi secara massal.

Penulis: Stanly Ravel
|
Editor: Azwar Ferdian


JAKARTA, KOMPAS.com - PT Pindad (Persero) mengklaim tengah menjejaki upaya kerja sama dengan Toyota Indonesia terkait pengadaan mesin untuk produk kendaraan taktis (rantis) ringan terbarunya, Maung.

Hal ini disampaikan oleh Direktur Utama PT Pindad (Persero) Abraham Mose yang menjelaskan bila pihaknya sudah melakukan diskusi dengan pihak Auto2000 terkait upaya menjalin kerja sama tersebut.

"Soal dengan Toyota bagaimana, kami ini sekarang sedang bikin kerja sama berupa long term agreement dengan mereka (Toyota). Kemarin kami sudah bicara dengan Auto2000 ya, namun paling tidak itu harus naik ke atasnya lagi, ke Astra-nya. Jadi kita lihat dulu seperti apa," ucap Abraham kepada Kompas.com, Kamis (23/7/2020).

Baca juga: Pindad Kirim Sinyal Kerja Sama dengan Toyota untuk Maung

Ketika mengkonfirmasikan hal ini, Direktur Pemasaran PT Toyota Astra Motor (TAM) Anton Jimmi Suwandy mengakui adanya permintaan dari perusahaan Badan Usaha Milik Negara (BUMN) tersebut untuk menjalin kolaborasi.



Lihat Foto
Donny Apriliananda/Kompas.com
Toyota Hilux diajak berenang di kubangan.



Namun demikian memang belum ada keputusan apapun karena Toyota pun masih melakukan study lebih lanjut terkiat bentuk kerja sama yang dimaksud.

"Iya, ada permintaan untuk study dari Pindad. Sekarang ini sedang kami bicarakan dengan pihak prinsipal kami lebih dulu," ujar Anton kepada Kompas.com, Jumat (24/7/2020).

Baca juga: Pindad Mulai Produksi Rantis Maung

Seperti diketahui, rantis Maung yang akan menjadi kendaraan tempur ringan dibangung dengan mengandalkan dapur pacu milik Toyota Hilux, yakni turbodiesel berkubikasi 2.494 cc lengkap dengan sistem pengerak empat roda dan transmisi enam percepatan manual.



Lihat Foto
KOMPAS.COM/KRISTIANTO PURNOMO
Prototipe kendaraan taktis (rantis) Maung 4x4 produksi PT Pindad di Bandung, Jawa Barat, Rabu (22/7/2020). Kendaraan ini digunakan beberapa waktu lalu oleh Menteri Pertahanan, Prabowo Subianto dan rencananya akan diproduksi secara massal.



Mesin dengan kode 2GD-FTV tersebut diklaim mampu menghasilkan tenaga sebesar 149 tk dengan torsi badak, yakni 400 Nm. Spesifikasi dari mesin tersebut pun sampai saat ini dianggap cocok untuk diaplikasi Maung yang telah diuji ketangguhannya.

https://amp.kompas.com/otomotif/rea...reng-pindad-buat-bikin-maung-ini-kata-toyota-
 
@Chestnut i heard, the T&C for us to acquire advanced eagle is to cancel current contract for SU-35, is it true? The issues are rising again eventually
Jadi pembicaraan ke arah eagle memang ada ya?
Do our MoD or Air force enthusiastic or at least interested to pursue this possibilities?
 
Willing to bet that there's actually a restarted bidding process behind-closed-doors now that the Su-35 is pretty much dead in the water.
 
Jadi pembicaraan ke arah eagle memang ada ya?
Do our MoD or Air force enthusiastic or at least interested to pursue this possibilities?

I know theres probably some people in the Air Force who's more than happy to have Eagles.
 
Vlog of Brimob commander when inspect his troops in Poso remote jungle

 
Edp8U_qU8AAgqiW.jpeg
Edp8YRWUcAAVeA9.jpeg
Edp8Tn1UEAAdrGU.jpeg
Edp8a4nUwAAK0bl.jpeg

AP rounds it seemed
 
Going back into the the EF after consulting people who are more informed about them, personally I wouldn't mind the AF buying Euro Triangles. Rather I strongly advise that they buy new air frames instead of procuring the problematic Austrian Tranche 1's. For the most part it is too expensive for what they are and at that point you should just buy new air frames.

Going into detail:

> Having Euro Triangles would at least appease the "diversification" crowd without having to delve into the weapons integration issues that you have with the Rafale. The Euro Triangle can carry AMRAAMs and Sidewinders, JDAM integration as well as JSM is being done currently. They can also carry the Sniper ATP as well so we can rely on one type of targeting pod. This would at least allow the Air Force to procure common missiles for their fleet instead of a hodge podge inventory of different missiles from different countries.

> Since it is an EADS/Airbus product you likely have good kickbacks going to PTDI, cheaper too if you bulk buy with the MRTT (let's face it, the issues with the KC-46 won't be solved anytime soon).

> Since the budget would be coming from the F-5 replacement budget instead of the Hawk replacement budget, the Air Force can still procure the F-16V's for airpower generation duties. Arguably you would likely have to retire the Flankers early to free up more funds for the Typhoons to reach IOC/FOC, which at this point is probably a welcome relief for the hangar queens.

> IF we stay in the KFX program, they would likely take over the Typhoon interception mission at some point, with (what I assume is going to happen) the F-35 taking over the F-16's patrol/strike mission; Or the other way around.


I still prefer an F-15 or a SHornet but realistically it's a better compromise than the Rafale


Well, had Erdogan stopped with his 'Ottoman Empire 2.0: Electric Boogaloo' wet dream, it would have likely been a European or South Korean engine.

when do we exactly will retire hawk series? while the drama for tiger not yet find firm ground. and why F-15 or SHornet? i have read your discussion in previous pages, yes this is are more less same engine as f-16 but this is bigger than that, nowadays all F-15 operator are using this craft not just as air superiority craft but also as a bomb truck, do we even have capabilities and other supporting sista and ammo to put F-15 at it's full potential? and if yes, what's the future plan?
 
when do we exactly will retire hawk series? while the drama for tiger not yet find firm ground. and why F-15 or SHornet? i have read your discussion in previous pages, yes this is are more less same engine as f-16 but this is bigger than that, nowadays all F-15 operator are using this craft not just as air superiority craft but also as a bomb truck, do we even have capabilities and other supporting sista and ammo to put F-15 at it's full potential? and if yes, what's the future plan?

We had targeting pod, we got JDAMS KITS and trying to reverse engineering them, we got plethora of any kind of dumb bombs from mk82,84 and so on, we got laser designator for ground units, our ground radar system and other units being networked into link 16 standard, we starting to stockpilling AMRAAM and we bought many Sidewinder ex German stock to refurbish them.
 
We had targeting pod, we got JDAMS KITS and trying to reverse engineering them, we got plethora of any kind of dumb bombs from mk82,84 and so on, we got laser designator for ground units, our ground radar system and other units being networked into link 16 standard, we starting to stockpilling AMRAAM and we bought many Sidewinder ex German stock to refurbish them.
What model, P or L?
Refurbished to newer model?
 

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