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Indonesia had opened the channel with China military since the opening of bilateral relationship, and gain traction especially after the signing of strategic action plan in 2010 (the follow up of comunique in 2005 action plan between Indonesia and China) both had the hand of Susilo Bambang Yudoyono to push forward the cooperation, there is a reason and among other why both countries prefer not to follow up the channel anymore and the previous joint exercise like Sharp Knife excerise along with other military cooperation in which came to abrupt end following the abrupt end of dialogue between two countries high military officer and MoD regarding some matter (i will not disclose this matter right now until further notice). This is something absurd for many in my minister of foreign affairs circle, especially after Joko Widodo himself trying to push the cooperation between Indonesia China at much higher level, this came from the President whose political party circle actually very supportive with cooperation with China in many areas especially military and economy. This pause is actually came during Joko Widodo first terms.

Chinese threat is real, they're being assertive on us. This SCS dispute is real and no matter how some of us being denial; we are part of this and be dragged on this since Nine Dash Line contradicts our EEZ

Based on my observation, only 1 Indonesian in pdf pro China, many are neutral, and some are pro America or anti China.

IMHO, we should remain neutral and cooperate strongly with both China and US.

How is your idea with some who pro US and anti China such as @striver44?
 
INDONESIA’S STAKE IN AUSTRALIA’S NEW STRATEGIC UPDATE
GRETA NABBS-KELLER
JULY 14, 2020
COMMENTARY
Indonesian_Army_infantryman_participating_in_the_GPOI-1024x654.jpg

Editor’s Note: A version of this article was originally published by The Interpreter, which is published by the Lowy Institute, an independent, nonpartisan think tank based in Sydney. War on the Rocks is proud to be publishing select articles from The Interpreter.



One might assume that Australia’s announcement of a significant increase in defense funding and move to a more assertive military posture would be welcomed by Jakarta. After all, as the old proverb goes, “the enemy of my enemy is my friend,” and Indonesia certainly has its own challenges with China, seen starkly in Beijing’s increasing encroachment into Indonesia’s Exclusive Economic Zone.

But in reality, Jakarta’s response to the 2020 Defence Strategic Update and 2020 Force Structure Plan is likely to be more complex and will require deft management by Australian policymakers.

Given that a perceived lack of consultation by Australian governments on policy announcements of vital national concern to Indonesia has been the catalyst for repeated bilateral tensions in the past, one would expect that Canberra’s key defense and foreign policy interlocutors in Jakarta were briefed well ahead of such a significant policy announcement. Assuming there were no surprises in Canberra’s policy announcement, the shift in Australia’s defense policy heralds opportunities for Indonesia.



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The update’s underlying strategic imperatives would be well understood by Indonesia’s strategic policymakers, who appreciate the impact of emerging technologies, and the implications of Beijing’s growing strategic reach into the South China Sea and Indian Ocean. Such factors explain the expanded definition of the “immediate region” in the update to an “area ranging from the north-eastern Indian Ocean, through maritime and mainland South East Asia to Papua New Guinea and the South West Pacific” as Australia’s area of “most direct strategic interest.”

Similarly, the update and the Force Structure Plan’s recognition of “grey zone” tactics, including “coercive paramilitary tactics in the South China Sea,” is a pressure felt more directly by Indonesia than Australia, due to maritime territorial violations by China Coast Guard-led fishing fleets around Indonesia’s Natuna island chain.

The Indonesian defense apparatus would also understand that the three new strategic objectives identified in the update as the basis of defense planning — shape Australia’s strategic environment, deter actions against Australia’s interests, and respond with credible military force — are all partly contingent upon Indonesia’s cooperation.

A high-intensity conflict in the Indo-Pacific is a scenario that the update predicts as “still unlikely” but “now less remote.” But it would not necessarily take a high-intensity conflict to make Indonesia’s cooperation essential in enabling the Australian Defence Force to operate in and maneuver through Indonesian air and maritime space. This is in addition to the critical need to share information and intelligence on evolving threats and warn of the deployment of ADF personnel, weapons, and military hardware.

In this sense, the 2020 Defence Strategic Update and 2020 Force Structure Plan hold promise for the Indonesian Armed Forces in particular, although this would never be expressed publicly. Indonesia’s military, now constrained in its own military modernization program by the economic damage caused by COVID-19, may look with envy at Australia’s investment. Australia’s annual defense funding in the 2020 to 2021 period is AU$42.2 billion ($29.3 billion), according to the update. In contrast, Indonesia’s 2020 defense budget was $9.26 billion, and it was recently cut by $590 million due to the pandemic.

For the Indonesian military, Australia’s Defence Cooperation Program has long been seen as a vital source of skills development and an overseas education opportunity. However, the update’s focus on “strengthened international engagement” will likely see enhanced joint exercises, technology transfer, capacity building, information exchange and intelligence sharing. It is still unclear what the update’s reference to improved wide-area surveillance of Australia’s eastern approaches provided by the Jindalee over-the-horizon radar network might mean for Indonesia’s own maritime domain awareness — an awareness in critical need of improvement in order to deter territorial violations by Chinese and other vessels.

Similarly, the update’s commitment to continue “working alongside” the United States to develop defense cooperation in the region carries opportunities for the Indonesian military and the country’s maritime security agencies. Greater coordination not only between Australia and the United States but also Japan, India, and South Korea will undoubtedly bring benefits in access to military and paramilitary equipment, intelligence sharing, maritime domain awareness, training, and enhanced interoperability. Moreover, an increased Australian and American presence in the region would support the ability of the Indonesian military and coast guard to protect the country’s maritime zone, potentially compensating for Jakarta’s own constrained budgetary environment.

At a more practical level, Canberra and Washington will need to balance Jakarta’s procurement priorities with U.S. political tensions with Moscow. Russia remains a very important defense partner for Indonesia. Jakarta’s planned procurement of 11 more Russian-made Sukhoi Su-35 Flanker E multirole fighters, which would enhance its deterrent capabilities against China, remains hampered by U.S. sanctions on Russian defense exports. Deconflicting U.S. political tensions with Russia and its strategic aims in the Indo-Pacific will require close consultation and necessary policy exemptions.

While the Indonesian military can be seen as a potential beneficiary of Australia’s more assertive defense posture, diplomats in Indonesia’s foreign ministry will likely feel unease about its implications for escalating strategic rivalries and its potential to further bypass ASEAN as the principal arbiter of the regional order. Indonesia views ASEAN centrality as key to moderating tensions not just between major powers, but increasingly between China and ASEAN claimant states themselves over Beijing’s illegitimate maritime claims. However, ASEAN’s ability to mediate regional tensions, traditionally predicated upon Indonesia’s strong leadership within the regional grouping, has been less evident in recent years. ASEAN’s relative ineffectiveness has also been exacerbated by the absence of a coherent strategic policy on China within the Indonesian government itself.

There are also those within Indonesia’s political apparatus who, although they do not welcome China’s intrusion in Natuna waters or its expanding claims to historic maritime rights and entitlements, are uneasy with aspects of Australia’s more assertive defense posture evident in the procurement of long-range missiles, submarines, frigates, smart sea mines and investment in hypersonics, space capabilities and autonomous systems.

The mooted closer coordination with the United States on regional security engagement, meanwhile, risks evoking nationalist sentiment and old resentments about Australia as a U.S. proxy. As jockeying ahead of Indonesia’s 2024 presidential election gathers pace, Australia’s strategic objectives may be either hampered or boosted by politicization of regional security issues. The propensity to conflate Indonesian Chinese with mainland Chinese and the actions of Beijing is highly susceptible to manipulation by political elites, as evidenced by Indonesia’s recent election contests.

As the strategic environment of the Indo-Pacific deteriorates, Australia’s relationship with Indonesia will assume even greater importance. Canberra must be ready to accept, however, that despite growing strategic convergence, its views will not always align with those in Jakarta, and there are relationship risks ahead that require policy consideration now. As a result, new and innovative modalities of cooperation with Indonesia and other regional states will need to be formulated and adequately resourced if Australia is to achieve its new strategic objectives in the Indo-Pacific.



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Greta Nabbs-Keller is a Research Fellow at The University of Queensland’s Centre for Policy Futures and Adjunct Lecturer at the School of Political Science and International Studies (POLSIS-UQ).

Image: U.S. Army (Photo by Jason Shepherd)

https://warontherocks.com/2020/07/i...1fN0zKZblVLYl6OusXedQ6CcjLqm5A8FeE4btBl8gegXo
 
Based on my observation, only 1 Indonesian in pdf pro China, many are neutral, and some are pro America or anti China.

IMHO, we should remain neutral and cooperate strongly with both China and US.

How is your idea with some who pro US and anti China such as @striver44?

Well being an Anti China is also unhealthy. Indonesia is built on the non block principle and we work with just anybody as long as they give benefits to us. Not long ago, we were also anti US and that was even worse than the current anti China trend.
 
Based on my observation, only 1 Indonesian in pdf pro China, many are neutral, and some are pro America or anti China.

IMHO, we should remain neutral and cooperate strongly with both China and US.

How is your idea with some who pro US and anti China such as @striver44?
just act accordingly with current circumstances.
 
The only thing we can get a hold is our fist, without big fist we can't talking about sanity against them. Indonesia economy, industry and population base (especially educated people base) is large enough to support a more bigger and complex military posture, at the level of current South Korea posture actually very possible.

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That's going to be a long investment
 
That's going to be a long investment

Unless those China doing something drastic, like bombing Spratly and put their carrier battle group inside Natuna water territory there will be no crash program like what Soekarno did
 
Based on my observation, only 1 Indonesian in pdf pro China, many are neutral, and some are pro America or anti China.

IMHO, we should remain neutral and cooperate strongly with both China and US.

How is your idea with some who pro US and anti China such as @striver44?
It is in fact undeniable there will be flare up north of us and for whatever that is, Indonesia will get the impact and we must be at the situation of full readiness. Indonesia for its national interests must always stand with winning one and the strongest one which so far is US. Indonesia has an issue with China as a " State " not " Ethnicity " somehow some people here often use " racial card " though it's not the case. Indonesia & China have conflict of interests regarding their claim and our EEZ and Indonesia must side with one favours to our interests

Unless those China doing something drastic, like bombing Spratly and put their carrier battle group inside Natuna water territory there will be no crash program like what Soekarno did
No; they're ambitious but still they have sanity to not overly assert their ambition; maybe to Philippines, Vietnam, and Malaysia but not Indonesia so long we play our geopolitical games correctly and so long US 7th Fleet is still around Pacific, they won't do insane things
 
I stress this as people seems forget who they are and how they're supposed to act accordingly. We Indonesian must not confuse ourself as Pro US; Anti US; Pro China; Anti China; Neutral. None of them are correct, We're all " Pro Indonesia " and being Pro Indonesia is different with being neutral, being Pro Indonesia requires to take any stands necessary including standing with whoever side which serves our national interest best. Being " Pro Indonesia " means all stuffs like Hong Kong issue, Lockheed Martin bans, etc, they don't matter to us and we will never defend anyone's interests since we have nothing there however Natuna is our interest.
We will stand with whoever favours us on defending our waters and the values inside againts anyone try to seize them from Indonesia, to steal from Indonesia, to claim from Indonesia, to confiscate from Indonesia.
Never forget yourself who you are; Pro Indonesia.
 
As long they not offend Indonesia in theyre thread or comment is fine to me. But theyre often offending us.. i have warn by moderator in here for offending them but every time im report them because insult us there is no action from mod.. n when comment in thread to ask about what they say about Indonesia sometime is was erase by unknown..
 
I stress this as people seems forget who they are and how they're supposed to act accordingly. We Indonesian must not confuse ourself as Pro US; Anti US; Pro China; Anti China; Neutral. None of them are correct, We're all " Pro Indonesia " and being Pro Indonesia is different with being neutral, being Pro Indonesia requires to take any stands necessary including standing with whoever side which serves our national interest best. Being " Pro Indonesia " means all stuffs like Hong Kong issue, Lockheed Martin bans, etc, they don't matter to us and we will never defend anyone's interests since we have nothing there however Natuna is our interest.
We will stand with whoever favours us on defending our waters and the values inside againts anyone try to seize them from Indonesia, to steal from Indonesia, to claim from Indonesia, to confiscate from Indonesia.
Never forget yourself who you are; Pro Indonesia.

I am rarely stand and giving opinion about China internal issue (like Xinjiang, democracy in Hongkong) as i had stated from before it was not our concern at all, unless they touched what is Indonesia concern like (covid 19 debacle in which bring death to at least 3000 people here (and hundreds experienced medical worker) and said it has nothing to do with them, their "coincidentally" assertiveness in Natuna water at the same time when we are busy with Covid 19 cases even until today yes till today you get it right ) , and lately they supported some elements in the eastern region, i am prefer not to said anything but all had changed drastically lately and we need to change our opinion about them.
 
As long they not offend Indonesia in theyre thread or comment is fine to me. But theyre often offending us.. i have warn by moderator in here for offending them but every time im report them because insult us there is no action from mod.. n when comment in thread to ask about what they say about Indonesia sometime is was erase by unknown..
This is afterall Pakistani based site and despite their repetitive words on " Islamic brotherhood " their interest with Communist China is way stronger than with Muslim majority Indonesia. We will never have our justice here which is why i care solely in Indonesian thread

I am rarely stand and giving opinion about China internal issue (like Xinjiang, democracy in Hongkong) as i had stated from before it was not our concern at all, unless they touched what is Indonesia concern like (covid 19 debacle in which bring death to at least 3000 people here (and hundreds experienced medical worker) and said it has nothing to do with them, their "coincidentally" assertiveness in Natuna water at the same time when we are busy with Covid 19 cases even until today yes till today you get it right ) , and lately they supported some elements in the eastern region, i am prefer not to said anything but all had changed drastically lately and we need to change our opinion about them.
Our perspective has changed the day they drew that line and tried to enforce them upon us againsts internationally and legally recognised our EEZ. Some people are just forgeting who they are.
 
This is afterall Pakistani based site and despite their repetitive words on " Islamic brotherhood " their interest with Communist China is way stronger than with Muslim majority Indonesia. We will never have our justice here which is why i care solely in Indonesian thread

Quite a hassle though
 
Quite a hassle though
Someone need to speak the truth, these people hipocrisy on so called " Islamic Brotherhood " yet they prioritise Communist China over us should make us think over and over again on our Foreign Policies on who actually genuinely benefits us and stands with us and how us, netizens here act accordingly. I've never seen a single of them to even support and defend us on how we being at conflict in Natuna waters instead they adviced us on keeping friendship with those against us. I say to hell with them
 
Our perspective has changed the day they drew that line and tried to enforce them upon us againsts internationally and legally recognised our EEZ. Some people are just forgeting who they are.


Btw PRC and ROC is almost the same shit with different clothes regarding their claims over Natuna water and nine Dash line (in which the ROC seemed more crazier than their communist counterpart), so the motion of one China policy is still same to me and somewhat better to preserve the current status quo and let USA to re arming but with limited capability of Taiwan to draw the attention of their communist brethen from the South China Sea.

Someone need to speak the truth, these people hipocrisy on so called " Islamic Brotherhood " yet they prioritise Communist China over us should make us think over and over again on our Foreign Policies on who actually genuinely benefits us and stands with us and how us, netizens here act accordingly. I've never seen a single of them to even support and defend us on how we being at conflict in Natuna waters instead they adviced us on keeping friendship with those against us. I say to hell with them

The only way to speak with such government and people is to slapped them with money, a lot of money. They rarely speak ill against the Saudi, because they know Saudi had slapped them with a lot of money.
 

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