Indonesia Defence Forum

[san.geuk]

Thats why US made equipments is not much desired within Indonesia armed forces top brass (especially ones who involved in acquisition program), there is much clarity and announcements about the program and going through US congress mean the prices and spec must be open for public. And some spin off the story much to their interest....

European sources (like France, Netherland corporation and so on) is actually much open to this kind of practices not to say Russian

Fucking Chinese asslivker , hope his and his family got covid 19 as karma.

they often says weapon and arms aquisition details were "rahasia negara" to cover their activity,
afaik the "prime minister" support aqusition heavy fregate from danish, realizing heavy cost to aquire from dutch
i never heard about law-justice.co web before, especially writing about arms aqusition programs

 

[Chestnut]

Thats why US made equipments is not much desired within Indonesia armed forces top brass (especially ones who involved in acquisition program), there is much clarity and announcements about the program and going through US congress mean the prices and spec must be open for public. And some spin off the story much to their interest....

European sources (like France, Netherland corporation and so on) is actually much open to this kind of practices not to say Russian

Fucking Chinese asslivker , hope his and his family got covid 19 as karma.

Speaking of the Chinese, we honestly might just solidly end up as an official US ally pretty soon. Check out what the Federal Reserve just offered to Bank Indonesia.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-york-fed-will-provide-60-billion-credit-line

This puts Indonesian USD liquidity at $180 billion. The largest in Asia-Pacific outside of China and Japan. There's really no way we can actually sit on the fence when it comes to the big three at this point(except within the context of local politics of course). You can really just forget the Su-35 at this point. Even Airbus is going to have some solid competition from Boeing and Lockheed Martin when dealing with PTDI, which is a good thing as it would drive down prices.

On a side note, with this announcement anybody that has repeatedly told me that the US is our "MusUh sEtAn!!1!!" and how Russia is "tEMaN kItA lAmA!!1!!" can pound sand. We wouldn't even exist as a country today if it weren't for the US telling the Dutch to withdraw less they want their Marshall Plan aid taken away from them.

 

[san.geuk]

Speaking of the Chinese, we honestly might just solidly end up as an official US ally pretty soon. Check out what the Federal Reserve just offered to Bank Indonesia.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-york-fed-will-provide-60-billion-credit-line

This puts Indonesian USD liquidity at $180 billion. The largest in Asia-Pacific outside of China and Japan. There's really no way we can actually sit on the fence when it comes to the big three at this point(except within the context of local politics of course). You can really just forget the Su-35 at this point. Even Airbus is going to have some solid competition from Boeing and Lockheed Martin when dealing with PTDI, which is a good thing as it would drive down prices.

On a side note, with this announcement anybody that has repeatedly told me that the US is our "MusUh sEtAn!!1!!" and how Russia is "tEMaN kItA lAmA!!1!!" can pound sand. We wouldn't even exist as a country today if it weren't for the US telling the dutch to **** off less they want their Marshall Plan aid taken away from them.

,

yeah too bad the US has notorious reputation in middle east, event today with the rising of coronavirus some people believe the virus is a conspiracy build by the US, the bad is this stupid theory build by those .50 yuan army eaten raw by some kadrun and cebong who think china is good fren who will take over the world from the evil US

 

[Nike]

,

yeah too bad the US has notorious reputation in middle east, event today with the rising of coronavirus some people believe the virus is a conspiracy build by the US, the bad is this stupid theory build by those .50 yuan army eaten raw by some kadrun and cebong who think china is good fren who will take over the world from the evil US

Chinese is commies, and commies doesnt like religion, look at how they demolizing curch and mosque with the same fervour.

US and China, with all the interest in politics and economy stance, i am geared toward US sides. China is our export economy competitor afterall, they both in the past had meddle in our politics, but US support during our Independence war is very great, and they repeat them again during conflict over Papua , China on other hand very supportive of FRETILIN and condemn our invasion and mostly glad to see Timor break from Indonesia as they can put their military base there, and now with conflict over North Natuna it all clear .

 

[Jatosint]

can someone confirmed or give detalis about this ss2 v1 mar(marinir or marinized?) or any of small arms for the Marines? thanks

btw what kinda stuff they questioned or budge they refuse tho?

So Pindad has finally made (or Marines has finally ordered) Marinized SS2? Great

Btw, I always curious about how much better is SS2 compared to SS1? Does anyone have a comprehensive report or TNI official comments comparing both rifles?

 

[Kansel]

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[Fl0gger]

Thats why US made equipments is not much desired within Indonesia armed forces top brass (especially ones who involved in acquisition program), there is much clarity and announcements about the program and going through US congress mean the prices and spec must be open for public. And some spin off the story much to their interest....

European sources (like France, Netherland corporation and so on) is actually much open to this kind of practices not to say Russian

Fucking Chinese asslivker , hope his and his family got covid 19 as karma.

wkwkwk sabar mas asli nya sih sama ajah kok mereka hanya beda metodelogi east langsungan gepuk ngarep kl west aluss...gepuk mburi and they hit it big time even its not relate to alutsista sama " ngamplopi kok semoga pemimpin kita bijksana agar kepentingan bersama sebagai bangsa dan negara preserve kl masalah amplop an mah wes tutup mata wae pokok kepentingan nasional win

 

[Whizzack]

Pretty much, the reason why there's markups is because the majority of that money ends up being used to grease the palms of officers and politicians involved in the deal. This one guy from my sales team was constantly bringing envelopes full of money that he would give to NCO's and officers whenever they start questioning stuff or refuse to budge.

If you want to get rid of it you really have to tear the system down from the ground up.

It's a big sad joke.

Unfortunately this means that your sales team, or perhaps even your company, is part of the problem by continually perpetuating this habit... No different to those corrupt politicians or TNI officials in the receiving end..

Speaking of the Chinese, we honestly might just solidly end up as an official US ally pretty soon. Check out what the Federal Reserve just offered to Bank Indonesia.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-york-fed-will-provide-60-billion-credit-line

This puts Indonesian USD liquidity at $180 billion. The largest in Asia-Pacific outside of China and Japan. There's really no way we can actually sit on the fence when it comes to the big three at this point(except within the context of local politics of course). You can really just forget the Su-35 at this point. Even Airbus is going to have some solid competition from Boeing and Lockheed Martin when dealing with PTDI, which is a good thing as it would drive down prices.

On a side note, with this announcement anybody that has repeatedly told me that the US is our "MusUh sEtAn!!1!!" and how Russia is "tEMaN kItA lAmA!!1!!" can pound sand. We wouldn't even exist as a country today if it weren't for the US telling the Dutch to withdraw less they want their Marshall Plan aid taken away from them.

As much as the above is good news, we also need to remember.. What the US can easily give, the US can easily take away... example in the article below :

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/11/tru...iraq-could-lose-new-york-fed-account-wsj.html

Let's not treat this as some free lunch money...

Chinese is commies, and commies doesnt like religion, look at how they demolizing curch and mosque with the same fervour.

US and China, with all the interest in politics and economy stance, i am geared toward US sides. China is our export economy competitor afterall, they both in the past had meddle in our politics, but US support during our Independence war is very great, and they repeat them again during conflict over Papua , China on other hand very supportive of FRETILIN and condemn our invasion and mostly glad to see Timor break from Indonesia as they can put their military base there, and now with conflict over North Natuna it all clear .

Yes and the US also supported PRRI and Permesta rebellions to the point of actually sending troops and equipment, assisted in the roundup and massacre of PKI members, supported - or even pushed for - our illegal invasion of TL for cold war purposes, and in the end forced us out when the cold war is over + embargo.. Which is the main reason why we have Sukhois today instead of more F-16s and the entrenched mindset of multi-sourcing our alutsista instead of relying 100% to the west.

Every major power will always use lesser powers to secure their own needs and advantages.. No point in worshiping one and demonizing the other... We are the ones that need to see the bigger picture instead of blindly following the narratives of one party.. and act accordingly that best suits our own needs..

 

[Nike]

Unfortunately this means that your sales team, or perhaps even your company, is part of the problem by continually perpetuating this habit... No different to those corrupt politicians or TNI officials in the receiving end..



As much as the above is good news, we also need to remember.. What the US can easily give, the US can easily take away... example in the article below :

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/11/tru...iraq-could-lose-new-york-fed-account-wsj.html

Let's not treat this as some free lunch money...



Yes and the US also supported PRRI and Permesta rebellions to the point of actually sending troops and equipment, assisted in the roundup and massacre of PKI members, supported - or even pushed for - our illegal invasion of TL for cold war purposes, and in the end forced us out when the cold war is over + embargo.. Which is the main reason why we have Sukhois today instead of more F-16s and the entrenched mindset of multi-sourcing our alutsista instead of relying 100% to the west.

Every major power will always use lesser powers to secure their own needs and advantages.. No point in worshiping one and demonizing the other... We are the ones that need to see the bigger picture instead of blindly following the narratives of one party.. and act accordingly that best suits our own needs..

Permesta and CIA cover action stories, much of it become an action they repent on, as thing you should know they giving us much assistance to crush the same rebellion like more spare parts for Mustang, Mitchell bomber, Dakota transport planes and LST to give us an edge when conducting Amphibious assault especially.

Meanwhile when the Chinese, Soviet and Commies doing stages to up arming peasants in Indonesia and agitation for rebellion they are doing that whole heartly and even without remorse. Madiun affairs and later commies related conflict in central java and North Sumatra is real. When we expose them and their evil scenario , they put distance from us, unlike the evil US who instead trying to placate us with more assistance.

Timor Leste case, is even without US blessing Indonesia still will invade them as communist backed Fretilin with support of communist Soviet and China mean communist military base exactly on Indonesia border and thats not dwell right within our military leader sane mind.

According to you how we can gain much power to content Chinese aggresiveness today? When they can easily churn out destroyer and frigates , with what Indonesia can content with them when you are suggesting Indonesia not to lean with any body, not to say militarily Indonesia is nothing and economically is not big enough to content them toe to toe?

 

[NEKONEKO]

mas

Call her mbak

 

[Kansel]

https://majalah.tni.mil.id/id-read.php?d=2019-10-01#p/45

 

[Nike]

Call her mbak

Well thats had been going on lately

 

[Cromwell]

 

[Nike]

View attachment 623451 View attachment 623452 View attachment 623453

For light fighter program we should looking for appropriate design like Textron scorpion or Cezch made light fighter aircraft. Well if want to closing at all our defense industry relationship with South Korean....

 

[Whizzack]

Permesta and CIA cover action stories, much of it become an action they repent on, as thing you should know they giving us much assistance to crush the same rebellion like more spare parts for Mustang, Mitchell bomber, Dakota transport planes and LST to give us an edge when conducting Amphibious assault especially.

Meanwhile when the Chinese, Soviet and Commies doing stages to up arming peasants in Indonesia and agitation for rebellion they are doing that whole heartly and even without remorse. Madiun affairs and later commies related conflict in central java and North Sumatra is real. When we expose them and their evil scenario , they put distance from us, unlike the evil US who instead trying to placate us with more assistance.

Timor Leste case, is even without US blessing Indonesia still will invade them as communist backed Fretilin with support of communist Soviet and China mean communist military base exactly on Indonesia border and thats not dwell right within our military leader sane mind.

According to you how we can gain much power to content Chinese aggresiveness today? When they can easily churn out destroyer and frigates , with what Indonesia can content with them when you are suggesting Indonesia not to lean with any body, not to say militarily Indonesia is nothing and economically is not big enough to content them toe to toe?

Well the capture and public display of Allen Pope did wonders at the time... that and the fact that the TNI of the time is also a somewhat capable and reliable power (at least compared to the rebels or communists)... But still, in the end the US got what it wanted, the removal of Soekarno, the rise of Soeharto and the change of our political orientation after the G30S movement, and as a bonus the destruction of the 3rd largest communist party in the world + destruction of TL as a potential communist base in SEA... and with minimal cost too.. Of course after Suharto is no longer useful he'll have to go too...

PRC aggressiveness in SCS is a matter of concern of course, but so far is mostly a matter of border friction and overlapping fishing claims rather than any full blown invasion threat... We can continue countering it with what we are already currently doing, but perhaps with more haste... Continue the build up of the Natuna base with better equipment and alutsista.. Increase regular patrols in the North Natuna Sea (both by Navy and Coast Guard), increase surveillance of the area through air patrols, drones, and satellites even, increase military trainings in the area (preferably with other ASEAN countries as well from time to time)... increase the number of our fisherman fleet in the area + educate and provide them with comm gear to act as another layer of surveillance... increase the civilian maritime infrastructure in the Natuna islands (Ports, Fish processing, Ship repair, Storage, Fuel depot, Electricity, Telecom, etc)... Increase gas / oil exploration and extraction activities in the area...

Diplomatically PRC is already isolated in the SCS issue (no other country is supporting their claim) so getting any diplomatic support should not be an issue, but we need to work better with other ASEAN members (at least with those having the same issues) so that we can speak in one voice against these PRC incursions... Publicly protest every known incursions so everyone knows that we are keeping a very close look at the area... Oh and of course, keep improving our already good relationship with all the other powers while increasing our own economic and military strength...

Well there are actually many other things we can still do to try to discourage the PRC from getting within our EEZ.. Formally allying with the US might perhaps be one of them, but that doesn't seem to help much in the case of the Phillipines.. and neither is the FPDA much help to the Malaysians in this case too... So unless there are strong indications of PRC going the Imperial Japan way, we should not be too hasty in joining an alliance or such..