India's Track 3: Afghan-Iran rail link

[Abu Zolfiqar]

it's bizarre how the indians accuse us of being paranoid about their actions in the country when their media itself is the one which either feeds on (or likely creates its own) hysteria

Afghanistan already has alternate means to sea water, Pakistani route simply provides the cheapest and shortest route to parts of the country; the remainder of Afghanistan (especially the western parts) bring in goods via road and via Iran and this has been going on for years and years. It's not as if this is a new thing



i do have a feeling though that the U.S. civil nuclear deal will be contingent on hindustany willingness not to engage with business in Iran; surely the indians are not as dumb as we think they are --they likely know this already. And as someone earlier pointed out, it's something the indian govt. will have to be prepared to confront. It's no secret that the U.S. --which is pushing for strategic partnership with india -will woo and sway and arm-twist the indians not to engage with them. But let's see.

 

[Desert Fox]

This must be the record of BS. Indian Muslims are much better in our country thank you. At least they don't have to watch their backs for a bombing or a suicide attack. Anyways, if Iran thinks Pakistan is a better bet go right ahead, you would get your stern answer in 10-20 years. In my opinion, Pakistan can never have a similar diplomatic clout as India.

Muslims in india are lacking in many fields despite being the second largest religious group in india after hindus (170 million+ Muslims):

Literacy rate by religious communities

"The rate of literacy of the population computed for 2001 Census after
excluding the population less than 7 years of age is found to be 64.8 per cent for the
whole country, male literacy percentage being 75.3 per cent while the percentage for
female being 53.7 per cent. Except Muslims and other religions, all the rest of the
major religions have literacy rates higher than the national average. Jains have the
highest total literacy rate of 94.1 per cent followed by Christians with 80.3 per cent.
Buddhists with 72.7 per cent occupy the third position. The lowest total literacy rate
of 47 per cent is found among other religions."
http://censusindia.gov.in/Ad_Campaign/drop_in_articles/04-Distribution_by_Religion.pdf

Work Participation Rate by Religion

"Work participation rate,
i.e., the percentage of workers
to total population for the
country is 39.1 per cent in 2001
Census. Religious groups which
have work participation rate
above the national average in
descending order are Other
religions (48.4 per cent),
Buddhists (40.6 per cent),
Hindus (40.4 per cent) and
Christians (39.7 per cent).
Muslims have the lowest
participation rate of 31.3 per
cent followed by Jains with 32.9 per cent and Sikhs with 37.7 per cent."
Male work participation rate for the country in 2001 is 51.7 per cent. Male
work participation rate for Hindus, Jains and other religions are above the nationallevel. The highest was among Jains with 55.2 per cent which is followed by Sikhs
(53.3 per cent) and Hindus (52.4 per cent). Muslims, Christians and Buddhists are
the other major religious communities which have rates below the national level. The
work participation rate for Muslims which is 47.5 per cent is the lowest. The second
lowest of 49.2 per cent is found among Buddhists."
http://censusindia.gov.in/Ad_Campaign/drop_in_articles/04-Distribution_by_Religion.pdf

 

[justanobserver]

...

....

Wow Jains, Sikhs Christians and Parsis have a much higher literacy rate than Hindus, discrimination !

India clears oil debt to Iran through Russia

Why should we go for the interests of a country that can have no sustainable ties with Iran due to the US pressure?

This makes it insanely difficult for ANY country to trade with Iran if trade is lopsided (like in India's case). South Korea and China can trade in their own currencies, but would Iran accept Indian Rupee when balance of trade is hugely in Iran's favour ?

 

[Arian]

This makes it insanely difficult for ANY country to trade with Iran if trade is lopsided (like in India's case). South Korea and China can trade in their own currencies, but would Iran accept Indian Rupee when balance of trade is hugely in Iran's favour ?

I'm not quite understanding your point about using the Rupee as the currency for trading between us. The problem is that some Indian banks, or in fact most of them, have stopped trading with Iranian banks. There is almost zero banking system between us and that's not because of the currency, that's because India is willing to implement US engineered sanctions in its full sense. Now does it change anything if Iran and India agree to switch to Rupee for trade? I don't know, but I doubt.

 

[Nothing]

Muslims in india are lacking in many fields despite being the second largest religious group in india after hindus (170 million+ Muslims):

Literacy rate by religious communities

"The rate of literacy of the population computed for 2001 Census after
excluding the population less than 7 years of age is found to be 64.8 per cent for the
whole country, male literacy percentage being 75.3 per cent while the percentage for
female being 53.7 per cent. Except Muslims and other religions, all the rest of the
major religions have literacy rates higher than the national average. Jains have the
highest total literacy rate of 94.1 per cent followed by Christians with 80.3 per cent.
Buddhists with 72.7 per cent occupy the third position. The lowest total literacy rate
of 47 per cent is found among other religions."
http://censusindia.gov.in/Ad_Campaign/drop_in_articles/04-Distribution_by_Religion.pdf

Work Participation Rate by Religion

"Work participation rate,
i.e., the percentage of workers
to total population for the
country is 39.1 per cent in 2001
Census. Religious groups which
have work participation rate
above the national average in
descending order are Other
religions (48.4 per cent),
Buddhists (40.6 per cent),
Hindus (40.4 per cent) and
Christians (39.7 per cent).
Muslims have the lowest
participation rate of 31.3 per
cent followed by Jains with 32.9 per cent and Sikhs with 37.7 per cent."
Male work participation rate for the country in 2001 is 51.7 per cent. Male
work participation rate for Hindus, Jains and other religions are above the nationallevel. The highest was among Jains with 55.2 per cent which is followed by Sikhs
(53.3 per cent) and Hindus (52.4 per cent). Muslims, Christians and Buddhists are
the other major religious communities which have rates below the national level. The
work participation rate for Muslims which is 47.5 per cent is the lowest. The second
lowest of 49.2 per cent is found among Buddhists."
http://censusindia.gov.in/Ad_Campaign/drop_in_articles/04-Distribution_by_Religion.pdf

See below figures ... based on sachar report

And Muslims have bigger family size than other majority .. which makes them more vulnerable .. per head less resources...

Jain community is economically one of the strongest and population wise one of the smallest and they tends to do more for community by building college and low price housing for other community members to promote better welfare in community .. they are one of the most peaceful also ..

 

[justanobserver]

I'm not quite understanding your point about using the Rupee as the currency for trading between us. The problem is that some Indian banks, or in fact most of them, have stopped trading with Iranian banks. There is almost zero banking system between us and that's not because of the currency, that's because India is willing to implement US engineered sanctions in its full sense. Now does it change anything if Iran and India agree to switch to Rupee for trade? I don't know, but I doubt.

I don't know much about economics, but afaik trading requires a kind of "clearing house". India previously used the Asian Clearing Union, but trading in in $ or Euro had to be stopped due to sanctions .

Trading in other currencies fixes this issue eg: China trades with Yuan. It's not possible to trade in Rupee because India doesn't export much to Iran

RBI claims ACU ban will ease oil imports

And Muslims have bigger family size than other majority .. which makes them more vulnerable .. per head less resources...
..

"muslims" are not monolithic

In India socioeconomic condition is


Parsis>Jains>Sikhs=Upper Caste Hindus=Bohra Muslims>Shias>Christians>Sunnis>Lower Caste Hindus

 

[Desert Fox]

Wow Jains, Sikhs Christians and Parsis have a much higher literacy rate than Hindus, discrimination !

You completely missed the point of my argument. Jains, Sikhs, and Christians combined only make up 3.7% of india's population therefore despite their few numbers they have a higher literacy rate, but my argument was specifically targeting the fact that Muslims make up 13.4% of india's population yet their literacy rate is lower than that of Jains, Christians, Sikhs, and even hindus.

http://censusindia.gov.in/Ad_Campaign/drop_in_articles/04-Distribution_by_Religion.pdf

 

[justanobserver]

You completely missed the point of my argument. Jains, Sikhs, and Christians combined only make up 3.7% of india's population therefore despite their few numbers they have a higher literacy rate, but my argument was specifically targeting the fact that Muslims make up 13.4% of india's population yet their literacy rate is lower than that of Jains, Christians, Sikhs, and even hindus.

Buddhists are also a very small minority, but their literacy rates are very low

Refer to this quote

"muslims" are not monolithic

In India socioeconomic condition is


Parsis>Jains>Sikhs=Upper Caste Hindus=Bohra Muslims>Shias>Christians>Sunnis>Lower Caste Hindus

 

[Desert Fox]

See below figures ... based on sachar report
http://realitycheck.files.wordpress.com/2006/12/sach2.JPG

And Muslims have bigger family size than other majority .. which makes them more vulnerable .. per head less resources...

But then the same should also apply to hindus as well since their are more than 800 million hindus in india making up more than 80% of the indian population, but yet hindus have a much higher literacy rate and work participation rate than the Muslims.

 

[raje]

The only weak link is here is Iran. If they keep on locking horns with US and Israel, there is a high chance that this project will not materialize.

we should stand by iran and see that it comes clean on nukes in all other cases we should be with iran as brothers ,but i understand even if we want to we cant at the movement because of china pak nexus ,bad shape of our forces , we desperatly need U.S support or "peace say till 2020" our old frnd russia cant help us now and our younger brother afganistan needs us (it's a great game after all)

 

[Desert Fox]

we should stand by iran and see that it comes clean on nukes in all other cases we should be with iran as brothers ,

But then why vote against it in IAEA?

but i understand even if we want to we cant at the movement because of china pak nexus

Why always put the blame on China and Pakistan? Did we command you to vote against Iran?

(it's a great game after all)

So you admit that your only in Afghanistan to play games with the lives of Afghans.

 

[justanobserver]

Voting against Iran was unfortunate, but we needed US support on NSG exemption . India's energy security is paramount

 

[Nothing]

But then the same should also apply to hindus as well since their are more than 800 million hindus in india making up more than 80% of the indian population, but yet hindus have a much higher literacy rate and work participation rate than the Muslims.

Its about family... size if 40 hindus are divided in 12 family .. family size will be less than 3.5 head per family.. but is 10 musilms are divided in 2 families size will be 5 head per family .. At least in Mumbai I know many Muslim family where they have 3-4 kids and only father earning .. and for Other religions (including Hindus) they will have max 2 kids .. and mostly both father and mother are earning .. not talking about people of age 40+ but they are below 40 .. mostly this is scenario..
My fathers friend (A nice Muslim man) have good business here in Mumbai but he has 10 kinds back in UP out 10 only 3-4 got proper school education rest were in madressa ...
Muslim community lacks in girl education .. which other community realize lately .. and % of crime in muslim youth because of their restiveness to include in mainstream society (these % is very lower .. in single figure but compare to other community very large).. more or less Muslims are very near to those politicians who wants them to remain uneducated like Mulaym singh and Lalu ... At least in Mumbai if Muslim is staying in good suburb.. he will be educated and very progressive but opposite case with Muslim majority lower income area.. same pattern you can see in UK and USA .. with Muslim youth ..

This is something Muslim needs to work .. with positive government support and support from majority

 

[Nothing]

But then why vote against it in IAEA?



Why always put the blame on China and Pakistan? Did we command you to vote against Iran?



So you admit that your only in Afghanistan to play games with the lives of Afghans.

Our vote against Iran was sad thing .. but I am sure our government had explained their situation to Iran ...
and vote against them or in favor of them would be just and formalities interns of numbers.. Iran was isolated that time..

That was chance for India to get NSG's approval (prime factor to secure our energy needs) .. I bet if Pakistan were in same situation for energy they had been sided with USA that time ..

You sided with USA before many times.. for your own benefits ..

 

[raje]

This can be a strategic plan but I prefer that Iran grows its ties with Pakistan more than India. India will at the end treat Iran in the way that the USA wants her to do. I see no independent foreign policy in India's stance toward Iran so I believe there's no reason that we want to help India in defeating its rival in Afghanistan through us if they are of no use to us due the US pressure on them.

iran need to be with india, it can be netural when comes to support india agianst pakistan but it need to be with india ,understand india was the most vocal country agianst US but today we need time pak and china has penerated us till some extent we were cAREless when it came to our military equipements but the tiger has wokeup, but it will take time for us to be strong and more than pakistan ,india can help iran even today,think!!!