India's Engineering Marvels #2 - A Himalayan Megastructure

[Levina]

arre bhaiya, himalyan mountains are new fold humid and wet mountains in a high volcanic and earthquake prone contour. It is never advised to build an arch dam there at those heights.

You have to shift the villages and towns, to make valley as reservoir.

Google it, past 5 years an arch - embankment dam is being built in Srinagar but because the mountain is wet and brittle phyllite, they are not able to complete even 20%.

Only gravity dams are safe but still, deforestation is required which leads to 2013 type flash floods in Hills.

You might have done your project there, but i have lived in hills for 12 years.

You're being very dilettante.
Do you know of Luiemei dam,Italy???
It was one of the highest arch dams in the world for few years and was built in a seismic zone aka earthquake prone area.
Heard of Shapai dam, China???
Shapai Roller Compacted Concrete (RCC) Arch Dam is the highest RCC arch dam of the 20th century in the world with a maximum height of 132 m, and it is a concrete arch dam near the epicentre of Wenchuan earthquake on May 12th, 2008.Shapai arch dam exhibited high seismic resistance and overload capacity in the Wenchuan earthquake event.
Arch dams are one of the most common types of major dams.
These masonry or concrete dams are ideal for narrow and/or rocky locations because their curved shape easily holds back water via gravity without the need for a lot of construction material.

 

[Screambowl]

You're being very dilettante.
Do you know of Luiemei dam,Italy???
It was one of the highest arch dams in the world for few years and was built in a seismic zone aka earthquake prone area.
Heard of Shapai dam, China???
Shapai Roller Compacted Concrete (RCC) Arch Dam is the highest RCC arch dam of the 20th century in the world with a maximum height of 132 m, and it is a concrete arch dam near the epicentre of Wenchuan earthquake on May 12th, 2008.Shapai arch dam exhibited high seismic resistance and overload capacity in the Wenchuan earthquake event.
Arch dams are one of the most common types of major dams.
These masonry or concrete dams are ideal for narrow and/or rocky locations because their curved shape easily holds back water via gravity without the need for a lot of construction material.

Schapai is not in central Himalaya. And if they are doing a blunder, why should we follow them? The terrain there is different from what we have on our side. We have good civilization living there, we have bird century, we have beautiful landscape. you want to destroy that?

Whole Tehri city was evacuated and shifted to a new Tehri, why? Just to make valley as reservoir. No sorry, we do not want that.

 

[Levina]

Schapai is not in central Himalaya. And if they are doing a blunder, why should we follow them?

You didnt read it right.
I had said ....
"It is a concrete arch dam near the epicentre of Wenchuan earthquake on May 12th, 2008.Shapai arch dam exhibited high seismic resistance and overload capacity in the Wenchuan earthquake event."

The terrain there is different from what we have on our side. We have good civilization living there, we have bird century, we have beautiful landscape. you want to destroy that?
Whole Tehri city was evacuated and shifted to a new Tehri, why? Just to make valley as reservoir. No sorry, we do not want that.

Every dam comes with this disadvantage whether embankment dam ,buttress or the arch dam.
Its a necessary evil to shift ppl from the reservoir area.

 

[Screambowl]

You didnt read it right.
I had said ....
"It is a concrete arch dam near the epicentre of Wenchuan earthquake on May 12th, 2008.Shapai arch dam exhibited high seismic resistance and overload capacity in the Wenchuan earthquake event."




Every dam comes with this disadvantage whether embankment dam ,buttress or the arch dam.
Its a necessary evil to shift ppl from the reservoir area.

And read what I have written. The HImalyan mountains are humid mountains you cut tree make embankments they will lose their soil due to abundance of water inside mountains. This will cause flashfloods. Will you send superman to stop flashfloods?

Tell those who are making unauthorized colonies in plains to leave their city for legal purposes and to keep city un-conjusted then I will see how many will agree. People in Tehri have already suffered by leaving their 1000 years old city. Can you even imagine? Necessary evil my foot.

People steal electricity, there is mismanagement in grid system, 800kV powerlines are delayed, the 2 phase transformers are outdated for step up and step down voltage creating core loses, first manage that. which will add do 1 GW of power.

Promoting such kind of videos, is propaganda because may be some one does not want that India has good flora and fauna, tourist places, beautiful hills etc.

 

[axisofevil]

Schapai is not in central Himalaya. And if they are doing a blunder, why should we follow them? The terrain there is different from what we have on our side. We have good civilization living there, we have bird century, we have beautiful landscape. you want to destroy that?

Whole Tehri city was evacuated and shifted to a new Tehri, why? Just to make valley as reservoir. No sorry, we do not want that.

Plz our Indian govt has shown that they follow and unfollow as they wish. There is no logic to it.

 

[Levina]

And read what I have written. The HImalyan mountains are humid mountains you cut tree make embankments they will lose their soil due to abundance of water inside mountains. This will cause flashfloods. Will you send superman to stop flashfloods?

Tell those who are making unauthorized colonies in plains to leave their city for legal purposes and to keep city un-conjusted then I will see how many will agree. People in Tehri have already suffered by leaving their 1000 years old city. Can you even imagine? Necessary evil my foot.

People steal electricity, there is mismanagement in grid system, 800kV powerlines are delayed, the 2 phase transformers are outdated for step up and step down voltage creating core loses, first manage that. which will add do 1 GW of power.

Promoting such kind of videos, is propaganda because may be some one does not want that India has good flora and fauna, tourist places, beautiful hills etc.

So I guess you mean no dams ...isnt it??? .
I already know the ills of making one.
But then that was not our discussion.Our discussion was about arch dams.

 

[Screambowl]

So I guess you mean no dams ...isnt it??? .
I already know the ills of making one.
But then that was not our discussion.Our discussion was about arch dams.

if you want to make dams, make small scale gravity dams on tributaries. Arch dam needs big area. And doing that in a fragile mountains is hitting your feet on an axe. If Tehri fails to stop flash flood in Bhagirathi, it will be catastrophe.

Small scale gravity dams on hills are economical and possess less danger to economy and life.That's why in Bhutan, their government did not allow any arch dam to be built.

Plz our Indian govt has shown that they follow and unfollow as they wish. There is no logic to it.

That is a bad-luck for this nation.

 

[Levina]

if you want to make dams, make small scale gravity dams on tributaries. Arch dam needs big area. And doing that in a fragile mountains is hitting your feet on an axe. If Tehri fails to stop flash flood in Bhagirathi, it will be catastrophe.

Small scale gravity dams on hills are economical and possess less danger to economy and life.That's why in Bhutan, their government did not allow any arch dam to be built.
.

But then you do know
1) small dams reduce the power generation many folds.
2) the area ultimately needed for reservoirs would be same.
3)remember the smaller dams are less earthquake resistant.

 

[Reviewer21]

True this seems very promising.
But there's one more part which i didn't post from the original article and it is that a huge chunk of thorium have been siphonned off by corrupt from these deposits . Read the end of the original article :wall:

There isn't going to be a one-stop fix to all of India's energy demands what is needed and, what is being pursued, is a multifaceted approach with HEP, solar, Wind, Nuclear, Coal, Thorium etc all being linked to a national grid to meet this demand. This is the most logical approach one can take for a number of reasons- cost, safety, redundancy etc


As for Thorium, I don't know enough about it to really tell if this hype is justified but it seems to very promising and could be a nice little ace in India's pocket over the coming decades....

 

[Armstrong]

But then you do know
1) small dams reduce the power generation many folds.
2) the area ultimately needed for reservoirs would be same.
3)remember the smaller dams are less earthquake resistant.

Aieevaiiinn....you're just writing these big words so that you may come across as being a smart & knowledgeable person warnaaa aaap kooo ABC nahin pataaa Dams kiiii !

Waisee jokes aside a question, if you will : I've always wondered if in-land reservoirs can be built which store rain-water or can be used for flood control but because they aren't built on Rivers but a few kms near Rivers, they don't necessarily become something that affect the flow of water throughout the year !

What I'm trying to get at is that here in Pakistan we've got an Upper-Lower Riparian tussle that finds a mention every now & then whenever Dams are talked about (hence why we haven't made that many Dams despite planning for quite a few of them & for quite some time) so would it be possible to have say a reservoir, with brick-lined walls so that water doesn't seep, which is perhaps 1-2 km in radius & serves as a collection point for rain-water in Monsoon or other sporadic Rainy Seasons & can also be linked to the river in such a way that it serves as flood control in times of severe flooding ? In addition some of that water collected in those reservoirs are pumped back into the ground to replenish the water table (keeping in mind the salinity etc. of course) whereas some of it is stored either in specially constructed large concrete tanks near each one of these reservoirs whilst the remaining water stays in the reservoir ?

And to have multiple such reservoirs across the rivers !

Kuch ho saktaa haiii or is this too much of my imagination having gone wild ?

 

[Screambowl]

But then you do know
1) small dams reduce the power generation many folds.
2) the area ultimately needed for reservoirs would be same.
3)remember the smaller dams are less earthquake resistant.

no it is not that. in Hills when you build gravity dams, the floor of a tributary in a particular segment is gauged, they make water inlets. you open the gauge the water will flow through pipes into the turbine. It is a great design. And can generate upto 500-600 MW. We call it run of the river dams.

Edit to it, this also has disadvantage
1) stream loses its water when turbines run
2) Aquatic life is effected
3) Perfect slope is needed where it can be installed.

 

[Screambowl]

Aieevaiiinn....you're just writing these big words so that you may come across as being a smart & knowledgeable person warnaaa aaap kooo ABC nahin pataaa Dams kiiii !

Waisee jokes aside a question, if you will : I've always wondered if in-land reservoirs can be built which store rain-water or can be used for flood control but because they aren't built on Rivers but a few kms near Rivers, they don't necessarily become something that affect the flow of water throughout the year !

What I'm trying to get at is that here in Pakistan we've got an Upper-Lower Riparian tussle that finds a mention every now & then whenever Dams are talked about (hence why we haven't made that many Dams despite planning for quite a few of them & for quite some time) so would it be possible to have say a reservoir, with brick-lined walls so that water doesn't seep, which is perhaps 1-2 km in radius & serves as a collection point for rain-water in Monsoon or other sporadic Rainy Seasons & can also be linked to the river in such a way that it serves as flood control in times of severe flooding ? In addition some of that water collected in those reservoirs are pumped back into the ground to replenish the water table (keeping in mind the salinity etc. of course) whereas some of it is stored either in specially constructed large concrete tanks near each one of these reservoirs whilst the remaining water stays in the reservoir ?

And to have multiple such reservoirs across the rivers !

Kuch ho saktaa haiii or is this too much of my imagination having gone wild ?

This is a very old technique. They persisted in every village and district till 1950's and even if you go to some rural areas you will find them near streams. It is very much feasible, they can be built in earth embankment - gravity style.

 

[axisofevil]

if you want to make dams, make small scale gravity dams on tributaries. Arch dam needs big area. And doing that in a fragile mountains is hitting your feet on an axe. If Tehri fails to stop flash flood in Bhagirathi, it will be catastrophe.

Small scale gravity dams on hills are economical and possess less danger to economy and life.That's why in Bhutan, their government did not allow any arch dam to be built.


That is a bad-luck for this nation.

Screambowl....thanks. At least you are quite honest from what I have seen on numerous threads.....I may seem rude or obnoxious.....but I am just fed up with the Indian gov't. Hoepfully, as social media and tech progress....ppl will finally grasp the truth and reality of what is really going on...

 

[Levina]

Kuch ho saktaa haiii or is this too much of my imagination having gone wild ?

Dont worry..bahut kuch ho sakta hai.

Waisee jokes aside a question, if you will : I've always wondered if in-land reservoirs can be built which store rain-water or can be used for flood control but because they aren't built on Rivers but a few kms near Rivers, they don't necessarily become something that affect the flow of water throughout the year !

What I'm trying to get at is that here in Pakistan we've got an Upper-Lower Riparian tussle that finds a mention every now & then whenever Dams are talked about (hence why we haven't made that many Dams despite planning for quite a few of them & for quite some time) so would it be possible to have say a reservoir, with brick-lined walls so that water doesn't seep, which is perhaps 1-2 km in radius & serves as a collection point for rain-water in Monsoon or other sporadic Rainy Seasons & can also be linked to the river in such a way that it serves as flood control in times of severe flooding ? In addition some of that water collected in those reservoirs are pumped back into the ground to replenish the water table (keeping in mind the salinity etc. of course) whereas some of it is stored either in specially constructed large concrete tanks near each one of these reservoirs whilst the remaining water stays in the reservoir ?

And to have multiple such reservoirs across the rivers !

From what I glean rain water can be stored in rainwater holding tanks for specific releasing subsequently. A stormwater /rainwater retention tanks are a good idea.And these dont have to be massive structures....just simple tanks...water catchment areas are enough.But then your government needs to take initiative on this.From what I know theres already a Pilot Rainwater Harvesting Project going on in Pakistan under UN.
In India 18 of the country’s 28 states it is mandatory to include collection systems in new buildings. Cities such as Mumbai and Bangalore are using the small scale technology to endure water shortages
See what a small village community has done in Chungugo, Chile. They have harnessed Fog to convert useable water on self-help bases.Impressive isnt it??
Your Indus water hasnt been desalinated for long now and hence the flood issues due to erosion.Do you know KSA has come up with solar powered desalination plants,these are energy efficient ones.Improving agricultural practices ie using less water thirsty crops.
Where there's a will there's a way!!!

Aieevaiiinn....you're just writing these big words so that you may come across as being a smart & knowledgeable person warnaaa aaap kooo ABC nahin pataaa Dams kiiii !

Bas ek dams pe project kiya tha

no it is not that. in Hills when you build gravity dams, the floor of a tributary in a particular segment is gauged, they make water inlets. you open the gauge the water will flow through pipes into the turbine. It is a great design. And can generate upto 500-600 MW. We call it run of the river dams.

Edit to it, this also has disadvantage
1) stream loses its water when turbines run
2) Aquatic life is effected
3) Perfect slope is needed where it can be installed.

so be it.
I still support arch dams.

 

[Screambowl]

so be it.
I still support arch dams.

archs dams work well in Plain and plateaus where you need force in water. Himalayan rivers are already in run with high velocity, arch dams are risky. Agey jo Ram chahey.