India's Cold Start Is Too Hot

[Skull and Bones]

India can't afford a long time war. About 90% of it's oil supply is heavily depend on export from Arab gulf countries any cold start invasion at Pakistan bring the angry of fire of the Muslim world to India. I bet they are not stupid enough to neglect that.

Has there been any intervention from this so called 'Muslim world' during the past four wars?

Maybe didn't noticed their change of policy towards Pakistan by them in the recent times.

 

[oct605032048]

Has there been any intervention from this so called 'Muslim world' during the past four wars?

Maybe didn't noticed their change of policy towards Pakistan by them in the recent times.

That was because India didn't learned to utilize oil to fully speed up your military machine by then. Of course you are free to test your theory~

 

[Skull and Bones]

That was because India didn't learned to utilize oil to fully speed up your military machine by then. Of course you are free to test your theory~

The fact is, the world has moved on a lot since the 80-90s, and some people still believe that their brothers will come for their rescue is case of any hostility, and unfortunately their brothers never showed up.

A bit off-topic, but this will show their change of policy towards Pakistan.

UAE staples visas for Pak Kashmiris - Hindustan Times

 

[oct605032048]

They don't really need to sending troops to the front line. Simply oil embargo would be enough to suffocate Indian economy while harvest the ultra-profits from higher oil prices.

 

[Jango]

There shall be no war of attrition. The aims and objectives of IA in case of a future conflict (which is difficult to imagine in the prevailing scenario) will be to hold ground in sizeable chunks to force a resolution of the conflict at a political level and NOT for dissection/fragmentation of Pakistani state. Mobilisation has been a problem which has largely been negated with forward staging on weapons and stores as also improvement in rail-road communication links.

With the change in stress from conventional forces to specialised forces, IA is increasing its Special Forces and Airborne component. While 1,2,3,4,5,6,9,10,21 PARA (SF) 7,8,25(PARA) units are already in place, 11 and 12 PARA SF are being raised to further augment their numbers along with further enhancement of ancillary Airborne Uniits. There is further augmentation in pipeline, to ultimately raise and field 02 divisions worth of airborne troops with the necessary support and infrastructure.

On ground, the firepower is being augmented in terms of artillery support with another Artillery Division in process of being raised (42nd) and another in pipeline. The upgradation of M-46 130 mm by Soltam is roughly complete to 155 mm config. The aim is to have a greater number of SP and SP(APU) types to facilitate both armoured and mechanised as also SF ops.

Number of mechanized units is also going up slowly with more units getting mechanized to BMP-II configuration as of now.

The stress is on high tempo synergistic ops as envisioned by the Cold Start Doctrine. The existence of this doctrine is real and any denial by Indian COAS should be seen in backdrop of US pressure on GoI to keep the situation 'stable' and not to antagonise GoP and PA for their own interests.

As there is a convergence in US's and our interests at this point, GoI and IA are only too happy to accomodate them.



Impossible? I am sure your PA think tanks dont think so. As for conventional balance of forces, its askew. That is why you have had to go on to a first use policy, because whether you accept it or not, your defences will not be able to hold against a sustained high intensity offensive.

Your only alternative to relieve any pressure in plains will be to take the offensive in J&K. Be our guests.

the whole point of a cold start is to avoid a sustained effort against us because by that time the ruskies and yanks will come in and make peace.a quick operation which is limited in a way and does not tag along for weeks along with surprise is the basic idea of a cold start, not sustained effort after surprise.,for a sustained effort you need more troops hence letting the other know of the build up.

 

[Masterchief]

They don't really need to sending troops to the front line. Simply oil embargo would be enough to suffocate Indian economy while harvest the ultra-profits from higher oil prices.

india has more friends in arab world than pakistan,the only nation which would help pak would be china, of course china would have to weigh its options because if it gets directly involved USA and NATO would also join the party.

 

[johnny boy]

They don't really need to sending troops to the front line. Simply oil embargo would be enough to suffocate Indian economy while harvest the ultra-profits from higher oil prices.

u have forgotten there is something called natural gas which we can import from russia..u have forgotten there is something called shale gas which we have more than 2100 trillion cubic feet...yes u saw the damn figure right 2100 trillion cubic feet.. if u have trouble reading english that is!!!!!!!!!

二一〇〇〇〇〇〇〇〇〇〇〇〇〇〇立方英尺 translation in chinese if need be......dont think that india needs oil for survival mate////we can squeeze ur oil supply which comes from saudi and thanks to shia sunni conflict we will always have omeone to take gas from iran also..

 

[kingdurgaking]

There shall be no war of attrition. The aims and objectives of IA in case of a future conflict (which is difficult to imagine in the prevailing scenario) will be to hold ground in sizeable chunks to force a resolution of the conflict at a political level and NOT for dissection/fragmentation of Pakistani state. Mobilisation has been a problem which has largely been negated with forward staging on weapons and stores as also improvement in rail-road communication links.

With the change in stress from conventional forces to specialised forces, IA is increasing its Special Forces and Airborne component. While 1,2,3,4,5,6,9,10,21 PARA (SF) 7,8,25(PARA) units are already in place, 11 and 12 PARA SF are being raised to further augment their numbers along with further enhancement of ancillary Airborne Uniits. There is further augmentation in pipeline, to ultimately raise and field 02 divisions worth of airborne troops with the necessary support and infrastructure.

On ground, the firepower is being augmented in terms of artillery support with another Artillery Division in process of being raised (42nd) and another in pipeline. The upgradation of M-46 130 mm by Soltam is roughly complete to 155 mm config. The aim is to have a greater number of SP and SP(APU) types to facilitate both armoured and mechanised as also SF ops.

Number of mechanized units is also going up slowly with more units getting mechanized to BMP-II configuration as of now.

The stress is on high tempo synergistic ops as envisioned by the Cold Start Doctrine. The existence of this doctrine is real and any denial by Indian COAS should be seen in backdrop of US pressure on GoI to keep the situation 'stable' and not to antagonise GoP and PA for their own interests.

As there is a convergence in US's and our interests at this point, GoI and IA are only too happy to accomodate them.



Impossible? I am sure your PA think tanks dont think so. As for conventional balance of forces, its askew. That is why you have had to go on to a first use policy, because whether you accept it or not, your defences will not be able to hold against a sustained high intensity offensive.

Your only alternative to relieve any pressure in plains will be to take the offensive in J&K. Be our guests.

Hoping you are making some.. and being from IA i hope you are not leaking some sensitive data but only those in public domains

 

[Hellfire]

India can't afford a long time war. About 90% of it's oil supply is heavily depend on export from Arab gulf countries any cold start invasion at Pakistan bring the angry of fire of the Muslim world to India. I bet they are not stupid enough to neglect that.

You hopefully do understand that India has oilfields too ? .... and that 90% dependency is for civil use and NOT defence use. And further I hope you understand 'strategic reserves' and 'war stocks'

War stocks for 8 weeks is enough?

 

[Hellfire]

That was because India didn't learned to utilize oil to fully speed up your military machine by then. Of course you are free to test your theory~

Oh my god. Thanks a lot for telling us we need oil to drive engines for our vehicles for our faster mobilisations!!!!!!!!!!!! We are truly enlightened that now we know it. Too bad you let the secret out!!!! We were using compressed air so far!!! Thanx a tonne for your insights

 

[Hellfire]

the whole point of a cold start is to avoid a sustained effort against

I said sustained high intensity ..... not sustained operations. There is a difference. Please do understand the difference and appreciate what is being said.

because by that time the ruskies and yanks will come in and make peace.a quick operation which is limited in a way and does not tag along for weeks along with surprise is the basic idea of a cold start, not sustained effort after surprise.,for a sustained effort you need more troops hence letting the other know of the build up.

Diplomatically no intervention possible for the first 2-3 days minimum. So the window is 48-72 hrs, which, if I may draw your attention, is the time frame determined for this policy to attain its objectives in.

 

[Hellfire]

Hoping you are making some.. and being from IA i hope you are not leaking some sensitive data but only those in public domains

the numbers are accurate .... and the info is open sourced. no operational info in it




(C) The Indian military has embarked on an ambitious modernization program starting with revising its Army doctrine, procuring cutting-edge equipment and technology to enhance its capabilities, and conducting joint and combined exercises with an expanding number of partners. The Army also considered changing its counterinsurgency methods, converting more battalions to Special Forces units, and increasing use of precision munitions and information warfare. An ambitious schedule of US-India joint military exercises, including the largest such event to date off the Indian coast in October, enhanced US-India mil-mil ties and paved the way for better relations in other areas. These efforts laid the groundwork for unprecedented cooperation between the US and India in tsunami relief. A US decision to move ahead with an F-16 sale to Pakistan, and the subsequent political fallout, however, would endanger US hopes for a breakthrough arms sale to India in the near future.


http://www.thehindu.com/news/the-india-cables/the-cables/article1576947.ece

http://www.asianage.com/india/army-shopping-spree-special-forces-weapons-649

http://www.dailypioneer.com/336003/Can-India-carry-out-US-like-operation.html

although the author has given original number of units wrong

 

[IND151]

I think you are right about 1965. It was a pathetic display from both sides.

1971 was more professionally done by India. The Sunday Times of London compared it to the Blitzkrieg of WW-2.

One would hope the militaries would be much better now.

this was because despite Indira Gandhi was eager to start liberation of Bangladesh SAM manekshaw was firm to start war only when winter shows up. manekshaw also used psychological warfare. Indian aircrafts dropped millions of pamphlets on Dhaka warning PA soldiers in Dhaka of consequences if they dont surrender. this crushed morale of PA.

 

[asad71]

1. Looking from outside it appears, whereas Pakistan has been pre-occupied with countering Cold Start I &II, she has ignored India's national doctrine. Cold Starts are purely mily doctrine and mostly land warfare centric. And Pakistan has been working out her possible response to which India now claims to be working on a counter response.

2. But what is India's National Doctrine? This Doctrine has existed for centuries and have rarely been understood by Muslims. Al Beruni had compiled a series of books and treatise on India and the Hindus to assist his monarch Sultan Mahmud Ghazni. Babar himself had read and written about the people that he conquered. But these were exceptions. Not much is understood by Muslim adversaries about the history, characteristics, mindset, aspirations and the dreams of the Hindu.

3. In a concise form, The National Doctrine of India is The Asthasastra compiled centuries ago by Chanokkya / Katulya. Sun Tzu to Mao Tse Tung via Machiavelli - all teachings for the Hindu is enumerated here. While preoccupied with Cold Starts, Pakistan has been subjected to onslaughts internally and also in Afghanistan just as Chanokkya had taught. FYI, this book is taught to all Indian higher mily officers and bureaucrats.

 

[praveen]

1. Looking from outside it appears, whereas Pakistan has been pre-occupied with countering Cold Start I &II, she has ignored India's national doctrine. Cold Starts are purely mily doctrine and mostly land warfare centric. And Pakistan has been working out her possible response to which India now claims to be working on a counter response.

2. But what is India's National Doctrine? This Doctrine has existed for centuries and have rarely been understood by Muslims. Al Beruni had compiled a series of books and treatise on India and the Hindus to assist his monarch Sultan Mahmud Ghazni. Babar himself had read and written about the people that he conquered. But these were exceptions. Not much is understood by Muslim adversaries about the history, characteristics, mindset, aspirations and the dreams of the Hindu.

3. In a concise form, The National Doctrine of India is The Asthasastra compiled centuries ago by Chanokkya / Katulya. Sun Tzu to Mao Tse Tung via Machiavelli - all teachings for the Hindu is enumerated here. While preoccupied with Cold Starts, Pakistan has been subjected to onslaughts internally and also in Afghanistan just as Chanokkya had taught. FYI, this book is taught to all Indian higher mily officers and bureaucrats.

Shitshovelling is exactly what you are doing