Indian veteran: Calling ‘71 Indo-Pak war is not fully correct

[Centaur]

Infact MuktiBahini was not even trained by Army but BSF and were trained in Guerrilla warfare not war exercises with co ordination of Navy and air force ,who wrested controls of ports by Pakistan and stop aerial supply, these Bangabandhu type nationalist who call us "Mitrosena " like you had any Sena at that time.

Thanks man. You have pointed out a very good thing that I should have pointed out before .
Yes so with such guerrilla training muktis even
No match for training from army that our sadharon ansar force get from army!
But Bangladeshi commoners don't accept that .
Even they have no idea that in a war you need air support because a fight can't be fought only with
Infantry!
And muktis doesn't have any air power !!
When Bangladeshi emotional kids will understand that muktis will not survive 1 minute against air attack with their three not three c.rap !!

And also a war can't be won with such soldiers or Sena of spirit like pen fighters, voice fighters,Melody fighters( singers who claimed to be the entertainers of mukti ),
And also bamboo force who used bamboo stick to beat rajakars and pakistan army ..... Countless so called soldier group in Bangladeshi mythology ,but in real war they will not survive a single night .

 

[Mage]

Just trying to explain my feelings and feelings of most of bangladeshis in my time.

How do you know the feelings of most Bangladeshis?

And I am also a Pakistani

That's a confession. Thanks for clearing the confusions. Now can you change your flags? Then your post won't look so out of place..

Every Muslim from indian subcontinent is Pakistani who believe in a separate Homeland for Muslims .

I doubt. Since there are probably more Muslims in India then Pakistan or Bangladesh. At the end of the day, most Muslims remained where they were. They didn't move. A good portion did. But most didn't.

And 1971 was wasn't against West pakistan, but it was against Lahore resolution, it was against Sher e Bangla , it was against Hussein Shahid sohrawardi (founder of awami league who even couldn't speak well in Bengali ), and indeed the 1971 India Pakistan war is against sheikh mujib and benglais too propogate by India. But that's the forgotten part at that moment.

The war was for Bangladesh. The Bangladesh which exists today.

How many jamaat leaders you have met personally? How do you know that if they are good or bad peoples?

It's up to the court to judge.

Jamaat leaders , shibir ( student branch of jamaat) members are the most polite people, most obidient to elders , most respectful to ladies yet jamat is bad and war criminal?

Shibir are peaceful? They are known for their notorious activities. Mostly cutting veins of their opponents.

It was for propaganda. The propaganda to show islam as slender ,infamous , to potray muslims as hypocrites , as Islamic unity can be deadly to them.

Where is Islamic unity to begin with? What has it done in modern times?

you even refuse Muslim torture by bjp government, what else I can expect from You ?

I don't care what BJP govt do in India. However I am not aware of any govt involvement in any such incidents. And I have actually met Indian Muslims who support BJP.

you are atheist and friendly to India

I might be an atheist but not friendly to India. I try to be neutral but you find it friendly with your biased glass.

Why bengal was divided ? Because in joint Bengal Muslims were 60% and vinayak savarkar invented hindutva and mother India concept in order to be part of India.

I wish Bengal were not divided. However it is what it is. However, if ever in 100,500 or even in thousands of years, West Bengal decides to separate from India, then we must seize the opportunity and unite.

Where were the crocodile tears of so called Bengalis that time ? That time hindutva was their main reason .
What about the war crimes of direct action day ( do you know what is the day?) when's hindu thugs start killing innocent Muslims on the street of Kolkata?

Have I ever supported these?

Why dont you level them as war criminals ? They were killing your Bengalis.
But do you even recognize the martyrs ? They are terrorist right because they are Muslim?

I don't think I ever commented on this issue. This subforum is about Bangladesh thus this topic is not brought up here usually. It usually goes among Pakistan and India.

But you know the noakhali riot correct? And you recognize the victims as martyrs because victims of Kolkata riots are Muslims so terrorist by default, and victims of noakhali riots are martyr as they are hindus ?

I actually have read about direct action day and it's consequences. However this is the first time I hear about oakhali riot. I will look it up.

The real problem is you peoples start crying on Bengali B.S nationism when Muslims speak for their religion. Muslims want religious freedom.

They have this in Bangladesh. Every religion has the religious freedom in Bangladesh. However that does not mean that any religion can dictate our policy makings.

(And as a result jamatis are bad , war criminals, rapist ,killers , horned demons ,Pakistan army also portrait as demons and hanadar/raider .
No one want to understand that in Pakistan ,Pakistani army isn't raider but the real raider is indian army ,as they are the army from another country. But you guys have Bengali propaganda that time )

Man...you should perhaps change your country. Your views are completely against this country you claim to live in. However since Bangladesh is a nice and tolerant country you can live in peace. However to find mental peace perhaps moving elsewhere would be the solution.

Finally in short, Pakistan is not a piece of land that you guys misunderstood and dislike. Pakistan is an identity, pakistan is a recognization of a separate Muslim Homeland , a recognization that sub Continent Muslims have the right to live as seperate nation , and this part you won't understand.

I have never felt any connection to Pakistan. I don't think many Bangladeshi have. And after the partition most Muslims kept living where they used to live. Otherwise India today wouldn't have 200million Muslims. Pakistan is what it is. History cannot be changed. However it has nothing to do with Bangladesh of today.

Pakistan zindabad , Lahore resolution zindabad, birth right and living right of indian subcontinent Muslims as seperate nation zindabad.

@Mage

Joy Bangla. May Bangladesh find peace and prosperity.

 

[Centaur]

How do you know the feelings of most Bangladeshis?

Slightly from my own experience ,and mostly from cricket.
When Bangladesh wasn't a good cricket team , Bangladeshis were great cricket fan too.
There were compition.
Even peoples were ready to say cow and goat during 1999 world cup final in order to celebrate Pakistani victory . But Pakistan lost to australia.

And I have started watching cricket since 1992 . Bangladesh was not a good cricket team .almost everyone supported Pakistan , the victory of Pakistan was celebrated.
News papers tried to show rivelry between India and pakistan but few Bengali supported India in cricket in reality .
Everywhere was pakistani flags, stadium and even houses . In the cheek and head of peoples .
It's the only example I can provide now as I am not here to write a history book here .

Shibir are peaceful? They are known for their notorious activities. Mostly cutting veins of their opponents.

Yes ,you learn it from leftist newspapers ,and bangladehsi media always under control of them.
But did you see any of them cutting vein?
I saw awami and BNP thugs are hitting each other in my college when I was a student . I always found that the so called vein cutters shibir are good people .

So vein cutting theory I also knew from news papers ,never saw any one .

connection to Pakistan

The problem is your brain is limited to a country that is called Pakistan , and I line of thinking is different and that is about a concept ,so if I write here thousand times you will ignore .

Otherwise India today wouldn't have 200million Muslims.

If Muslims are living there with minimal honor , then it's because they have a concept that was established in 1940 .

Joy Bangla. May Bangladesh find peace and prosperity.

Indeed I agree . I was talking about the same .
As if there was no Pakistan concept in 1940 and no country formed in 1947 , you would be cleaning indian dish if you are Muslim , and as atheist/agnostic/secular, you still would be a subservient to indian Hindus, no joy Bangla or bangladesh would exist .
Learn from the tragedy of semi hindu semi Muslim national Bengal poet kazi nazrul Islam.
Finally he died in a Muslim country and not in his loving mother named India (Bharat mata).
He was much more secular and humanist than you .
Remember Bangladesh is a Muslim majority country in indian subcontinent and this entity of Bangladesh proudly proclaiming that Pakistan is eternal , as paksitan is the concept , a movement that was for separate Muslim country /countries in indian sub Continent .
So if you say joy Bangla and may Bangladesh proper ,remember that no sovereign Bangladesh would exist without Lahore resolution.

That's a confession. Thanks for clearing the confusions. Now can you change your flags? Then your post won't look so out of place

When I joined here ,in the first post I made it clear that I am an east Pakistani ,living under the name of bangladesh, and I prefer the name separated /indipendant east Pakistan over Bangladesh.
(Today even I didn't proclam this . In this post I said I am a Pakistani in the sense of a citizen of an indipendant Muslim country.
(But my point if view much more strick about East pakistan.)

Yet I am ready to change my one flag to sitara and hilal , if you can give me the garanty that moderators will not ban me as they must know I am using a basic Bangladeshi ip provided by a mobile operator .
Because if east Pakistan seperate with a referendum them the name and flag would be different .however still we can spread Islamic lifestyle under the name and flag , seculars can't even prevent it .


P.s : However, when I use ' You' I use it as plural and I use it to indicate a group named athesit/humanist/secular/ who are mostly Hindutva under the umbrella
. I understood that though you are atheist ,yet you are a good peacefully boy, and don't believe such absurd propaganda like, 3 million , don't show disgrace to Muslims ! So I have no problem with you or peoples like you!
And also flag mean little to me. Last part of my message is. Counter to your suggestion
. Thank you .

@Mage

 

[Mage]

Slightly from my own experience ,and mostly from cricket.

Not much credibility.

And I have started watching cricket since 1992 . Bangladesh was not a good cricket team .almost everyone supported Pakistan , the victory of Pakistan was celebrated.
News papers tried to show rivelry between India and pakistan but few Bengali supported India in cricket in reality .
Everywhere was pakistani flags, stadium and even houses . In the cheek and head of peoples .
It's the only example I can provide now as I am not here to write a history book here .

lol...even I support Pakistan in a cricket match between India and Pakistan. Does that mean anything?

Bangladesh is terrible in football yet many support Argentina. So they must feel some connection towards them? Right? Don't involve politics with sports.

Everywhere was pakistani flags, stadium and even houses . In the cheek and head of peoples .

In Bangladesh? When? Where?

But did you see any of them cutting vein?
I saw awami and BNP thugs are hitting each other in my college when I was a student . I always found that the so called vein cutters shibir are good people .

So vein cutting theory I also knew from news papers ,never saw any one .

Well, when my elder brother was in Uni, he saw shibir guys and other student politics from very close angle. Back in 2006 shibir were very powerful. My brother(who never had any affiliation to any party) was forced to hide their weapons(Boti,chapati and even guns) below his bed in University hall room. Every party has violent student activists. But shibir surpasses all of them in violence. My brother has seen shibir guys stabbing opposition students in his own eyes. Although by 2011 shibir were almost cleansed from University campus. They are now forced to keep a low profile. Many shibir guys are talented. But calling them in general peaceful compared to other student organization is far from truth.

The problem is your brain is limited to a country that is called Pakistan , and I line of thinking is different and that is about a concept ,so if I write here thousand times you will ignore .

What is Pakistan? A country or an ideology ?

If Muslims are living there with minimal honor , then it's because they have a concept that was established in 1940 .

I don't know. Indeed there are violence against Muslims in India. In every society there are nutjobs who commit crime against other communities. But on a whole saying that they are living in minimal honor is a bit stretched. India has had Muslim presidents, Muslims are more successful in film industries. India has Muslim billionaires. And how many Indian Muslims you have interacted with on personal level? I interacted with a few. And they it didn't seem like they feel too discontented about India. I had in depth discussion with two. And it didn't seem that they feel connected with Pakistan. One of them was from Patna, Bihar and he seemed to support BJP. And that person was a devout Muslim too.

As if there was no Pakistan concept in 1940 and no country formed , you would be cleaning indian dish if you are Muslim , and as athest you still would be a subservient to indian Hindus, no joy Bangla or bangladesh would exist .

Of course, I am glad BD is not a part of India. But I am also as much glad that it is not part of Pakistan either.

So if you say joy Bangla and may Bangladesh proper ,remember that no sovereign Bangladesh would exist without Lahore resolution.
@Mage

Actually Bangladesh is a reflection of 1940's Lahore resolution. Under which there is supposed to be two Muslim countries in both side of India. It being part of Pakistan in 1947 was something I don't feel too happy about. And what happened from 1947-71 definitely showed that Bangladeshis(The people of East Pakistan back then) needed their very own country. Which is what we have now. So, all is well. Although the process was very bloody, I am still delighted about the end result and the consequences which has made me a proud Bangladeshi.

So yeah, Shere-e-Bangla is still revered in Bangladesh. Suhrawardi is a revered figure in Bangladesh. Sadly they did not live long enough to see an independent Bangladesh. But Maulana Bahsani was there to see independent Bangladesh. He also a devout Muslim supported the liberation war.

All of them are very prominent figure of our history along with our Father of the nation.

 

[Centaur]

What is Pakistan? A country or an ideology

Ideology, at least my version of pakistan is ideology.
And I will not push . Not from cricket support.
It was a visible part only .

In Bangladesh? When? Where?

Am I supposed to show you the live video from ages ago ?
Your profile shows that you are 21 old and I am talking about that time when you were an infant

And do not compare Brazil Argentina with pakistan cricket .they simply supported Pakistan because Pakistan is Muslim nation .
And now peoples in Bangladesh still supporting Argentina and Brazil, no one is asking not to raise flag of those countries.
Now chetona thugs are in power and peoples can't raise Pakistani flag .
So the thugs proving many things not only me.
And don't retreat from Politics as without politics life isn't complete .and not all version of politics are like dirty politics of bangladesh.

But let's not push as there is no parmanent solution .Thank you.
@Mage

 

[Mage]

Am I supposed to show you the live video from ages ago ?
Your profile shows that you are 21 old and I am talking about that time when you were an infant

So, I guess this feelings fade away with time? I have seen cricket world cups of 2003, 2007 and 2011. And haven't witnessed Pakistani flags in Bangladesh. And no it wasn't always Hasina in power. Back in 2003 it was BNP with Jamaat in power. In 2007 it was neither BNP nor Awami league.

 

[Centaur]

Actually Bangladesh is a reflection of 1940's Lahore resolution

Dear sir, my signature is showing the same thing isn't it?

All I just want to say all freedom war dramas never existed, and it was india Pakistan war. And I have little difference with you and bluesky in this case .
Lahore resolution was to create multiple Muslim nation or multiple Pakistan . As sohrawardi proposed United Bengal including greater Assam. And in United Bengal and assam muslims would be 60% so hindutva propaganda raised.

When hindutva propaganda divide Bengal and assam then this part had no other option but to join with Western part !
However still we can be separated by referendum if India wouldn't propogate a war .
This is the only thing I am trying you make you understand!

 

[Mage]

However still we can be separated by referendum if India wouldn't propogate a war .

India did not conduct operation searchlight.

This is becoming a habit of people.In this subcontinent everyone blames other to hide their own failures.

 

[Centaur]

India did not conduct operation searchlight.

This is becoming a habit of people.In this subcontinent everyone blames other to hide their own failures.

India pakistan proxy war started long before this operation
It's becoming habbit of some peoples to rely on one-sided opinion and even aren't ready to research on another source!
Well leave it.

 

[Mage]

India pakistan proxu war started long before this operation

How?

It's becoming habbit of some peoples to rely on one-sided opinion and even aren't ready to research on another source!

I am not stating an opinion. Operation searchlight was conducted in 25th March mid night. Declaration of Independence happened in 26th March.

Although East Pakistan had more people, only 30% money was spent on developing it. It is a fact. And it is not just discrimination. It is a heinous crime.

 

[Centaur]

Declaration of Independence happened in 26th March.

Who declared indipendance?

 

[Mage]

Who declared indipendance?

A Major of then Pakistan Army..
You can't score a point beating around the bush.

 

[Centaur]

Although East Pakistan had more people, only 30% money was spent on developing it. It is a fact. And it is not just discrimination. It is a heinous crime.

You can read this article
http://songlapblog.com/4913

 

[Doctor Strange]

Exactly . If Pakistan would not break that time , all mukti thugs would be skinned alive by patriot East Pakistani Bengali and bihari . @ziaulislam

Jacksparrow can I request you to hold your horses so that atheists/leftists with Hindutva agendas dont get more opportunities to prolong infighting between Bangladeshis from such remarks. All the things are not for general consumers. Let people have more time to grow their senses. No one would skin alive Jiaur Rahman, Osmani and other stronger Bengali Muslim personalities, you are spewing bogus now. But its true Chetona badis have hijacked BD's Muslim identity and attributed BD's liberation war as anti Muslim agenda.

Every Muslim from indian subcontinent is Pakistani who believe in a separate Homeland for Muslims .

No, the Indian congress successfully could divide the vote between Muslims of Indian subcontinent. Otherwise chunk of Assam and West Bengal would be in BD now. Jamaat e Islami, Congress Muslim leadership and some core Muslim parties were in support of unity with India. They were not in favor of secular/progressive Muslim leadership like Jinnah.That is why Muslims are large number in India.

Shibir are peaceful? They are known for their notorious activities. Mostly cutting veins of their opponents.

So much religion is bad for health but they are at least honest unlike chapti, chandabaz, rapists, drug addict thug wings of AL. Now that is honest observation.

 

[Centaur]

A Major of then Pakistan Army..

Since when majors are given this authority?
You also can't score a point beating around the bush.

No one would skin alive Jiaur Rahman, Osmani and other stronger
Bengali Muslim personalities, you are spewing bogus now.

I was not talking about them .
I was talking about those separatist who were always responsible for chaos,

Jacksparrow can I request you to hold your horses so that atheists/leftists with Hindutva agendas dont get more opportunities to prolong infighting between Bangladeshis from such remarks.

You have a point , I am also becoming tired of this endless argument and endless pushing .they are making me repeat same things again and again .
Like I put and end with mage yet he is pushing , and I am just replying.
And this part you quoted was a reaction to another one.