Indian Special Forces

[Unknowncommando]

RIP BRAVEHEART

 

[Ragnarok connection]

Did the helmet fail or the gun?

He was shot in the neck.

 

[bloo]

 

[Abingdonboy]

None of the SF forces are using INSAS or desi gear, something must be done to make the SF get rid of their love for phoren maal.

Look around the world- no world class SF unit (Russia, US, UK,France, Italy, Spain, Canada etc etc) is using homemade weaponary.

SF are meant to get the best of the best and that means Israeli or Belgian or German weapons- end of story.

Meanwhile in Kashmir a SF operator of the elite 21 PARA SF lost his life due to this...Indian maal

He wasn't serving in the SF anymore, he had been in 21 Para (SF) but was the CO of 41 RR when he was killed.

Dd a bullet penetrate his helmet?

He was hit in the neck- nothing any BPJ or helmet can do about that.

Every time a soldier is killed in JK we see this knee-jerk "give them proper helmets/BPJs" response but look at the pics- the RR are equipped with very decent BPJs and the Patak is good at its role. There is no such thing as "bullet proof"- only bullet resistent and when engaged at close range by 7.62mm automatic fire (as this unit was) no amount of protective equipment is going to offer you adequte protection. US soldiers are still killed by small arms fire too- one cannot elimnate all risk from combat- this is the nature of combat,

 

[Talwar e Pakistan]

Lets do one thing ...Lets start with you going on the LOC with an INSAS rather than "phoren maal" rather than you talking from your AC room chilling on your couch.

Meanwhile in Kashmir a SF operator of the elite 21 PARA SF lost his life due to this...Indian maal

View attachment 273110 View attachment 273111

You call those special forces?

 

[Abingdonboy]

headshot penetrating the patka...or maybe a neckshot followed by a soldier inserting a screw driver to make it look like a headshot.

He was shot multiple times by full automatic fire in the head anf neck and the wound to the neck is what proved fatal.

So he lost his SF operator tag and badge after voluntarily joining RR according to you?

Of course not- once SF, always SF, but he wasn't serving in a SF unit when he died. He was the CO of 41 RR- not a member of 21 Para (SF). To say, as you did, "a SF operator of the elite 21 PARA SF lost his life " is a bit misleading brother.

 

[Didact]

He was hit in the neck- nothing any BPJ or helmet can do about that.

Every time a soldier is killed in JK we see this knee-jerk "give them proper helmets/BPJs" response but look at the pics- the RR are equipped with very decent BPJs and the Patak is good at its role. There is no such thing as "bullet proof"- only bullet resistent and when engaged at close range by 7.62mm automatic fire (as this unit was) no amount of protective equipment is going to offer you adequte protection. US soldiers are still killed by small arms fire too- one cannot elimnate all risk from combat- this is the nature of combat,

Well, unfortunately in this case, the BPJ does need to be apportioned a significant part of the blame. The standard BPJ of the IA was intended to provide all round protection to the neck against 7.62x39 at 10m. Unfortunately, the design is flawed; the BPJ is a loose fit around the neck, so much so it takes minimum movement for the section protecting the neck to slide down/unravel and expose the neck.

There is also a problem, mostly among the CAPF, of keeping the neck protector lowered to improve comfort. That defeats the very rationale of keeping those protector.

The term 'bullet proof' is fairly accurate for steel/carbide plate based BPJs used by the IA. They are required and designed to conform to protection requirement of safety against 7.62x39 @ 10m from the gun. And being made of metal as against ceramic, these armor plates will hold against multiple hits, it's another issue that the person will almost certainly suffer broken ribs.

I remember one of the accounts of an officer who lunged at a militant during an encounter in the forests of tral, 2009-10(?) and took a long burst of Ak rounds around his chest and stomach region at point-blank range. His armor protected him and he made quick work of the militant, It is another matter that he suffered from broken ribs and internal bleeding. He won a bravery award for his actions during this encounter.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Well, unfortunately in this case, the BPJ does need to be apportioned a significant part of the blame. The standard BPJ of the IA was intended to provide all round protection to the neck against 7.62x39 at 10m. Unfortunately, the design is flawed; the BPJ is a loose fit around the neck, so much so it takes minimum movement for the section protecting the neck to slide down/unravel and expose the neck.

There is also a problem, mostly among the CAPF, of keeping the neck protector lowered to improve comfort. That defeats the very rationale of keeping those protector.

The term 'bullet proof' is fairly accurate for steel/carbide plate based BPJs used by the IA. They are required and designed to conform to protection requirement of safety against 7.62x39 @ 10m from the gun. And being made of metal as against ceramic, these armor plates will hold against multiple hits, it's another issue that the person will almost certainly suffer broken ribs.

I remember one of the accounts of an officer who lunged at a militant during an encounter in the forests of tral, 2009-10(?) and took a long burst of Ak rounds around his chest and stomach region at point-blank range. His armor protected him and he made quick work of the militant, It is another matter that he suffered from broken ribs and internal bleeding. He won a bravery award for his actions during this encounter.

The kind og BPJs the RR are now being issued (and was used by this officer ad his unit) do not have any neck protector:

This is by design, the RR were explicitly looking for a lightweight BPJ as previous generations had been a major pain for soldiers in the COIN enviroment. The RR's expereince meant they favoured mobility over neck protection, these black BPJs are lightweight but offer good protection for the covered areas.

 

[Unknowncommando]

Col Santosh Mahadik (2nd from right) shooting during practice when he was in 21st PARA SF

 

[Unknowncommando]

NSG

 

[mkb95]

nsg

 

[Unknowncommando]

Indian Navy Marcos with manipur police commandos at Manesar Nsg training centre

NSG

 

[Abingdonboy]

@Unknowncommando bro, it is very important to maintain OPSEC. And I would ask you to blur out the faces of the NSG operators present during the Grudaspur Attack. This is a live CounterTerror team who will still be made up of the same guys today, posting the faces of serving NSG operators (from SAG) like that on an open forum is not wise.

 

[Unknowncommando]

NSG AT GRUDASPUR

51 SAG NSG WITH FOREIGN INSTRUCTOR

NSG commandos

 

[mkb95]

nsg has seen most improvement in equipment and protection in recent years.