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Indian Navy outgunned 1 to 4 as China steps up presence in Indian Ocean

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http://www.hindustantimes.com/india...ndian-ocean/story-MIbR4PoOSThQmtIuzRJiVN.html

Indian Navy outgunned 1 to 4 as China steps up presence in Indian Ocean
US Office of Naval Intelligence, Indian Navy

China’s widening naval capabilities compared to India can be seen in the context of the PLA-N’s growing presence in the Indian Ocean region.

“Chinese activity in the Indian Ocean has touched a new high in recent months,” according to an Indian Navy official, The Hindustan Times reported on July 5, 2017.

The Indian Navy has sighted over a dozen PLA-N warships, submarines and intelligence-gathering vessels in the Indian Ocean in the last few months.

These sightings come as the Indian and Chinese troops are locked in a three-week long standoff at the India-China-Bhutan tri-junction near Sikkim, leading to increasingly belligerent rhetoric between New Delhi and Beijing.

Comparing inventories

The PLA-N has 26 destroyers, more than twice as many as India (11). Destroyers are both the PLA-N and IN’s frontline warships that possess powerful radars, can travel long distances and are capable of fulfilling land attack, missile defence, and surface and anti-submarine warfare. This makes them very powerful tools for power projection.

China recently launched its indigenously developed 12,000-tonne Type 55 destroyer, which “is considerably larger and more powerful than India’s latest … destroyers which have still not been commissioned”, according to NDTV Defence Editor Vishnu Som.

China’s Type-55 will eventually have around 120 missiles of various types. India’s most powerful destroyer, the yet-to-be commissioned Project 15-B “Visakhapatnam” class destroyers, will have 50 missiles.

The PLA-N has 52 frigates, nearly four times as many as India (14). Frigates are not as heavily armed as destroyers but can fulfil similar roles and can operate in open oceans.

India has 25 corvettes and missile boats, around one-fourth as many as China (106). Corvettes and missile boats are lightly armed as compared to frigates and provide coastal protection.

India’s aircraft carrier advantage no more?

So far, both India and China each have one aircraft carrier. The carrier is a sign of its growing military prowess.

In April 2017, China launched a new aircraft carrier, its second after the Liaoning, but the first to be indigenously manufactured. The Chinese aircraft carrier is scheduled to be operational by 2020.

The development comes as India’s own homemade aircraft carrier, INS Vikrant, faces several delays. The Vikrant has been in development since 2009 but is unlikely to be completed before 2023, The Hindu reported on July 28, 2016.

For decades, India has enjoyed a naval advantage over China by possessing at least one aircraft carrier in its inventory while the PLAN had none.

China now possesses the Liaoning, a Soviet-era warship it purchased from Ukraine and commissioned in 2012 following refit. After four years of testing, the Liaoning conducted its first ever live-fire drills on December 16, 2016. It also conducted similar drills in the disputed South China Sea on January 3, 2017, a sign of its increasingly aggressive posture.

The Liaoning was getting ready to expand its operations to other regions, including the Indian Ocean, a Chinese naval expert told the Chinese government-owned newspaper Global Times in December 2016.

“Ultimately, Beijing will likely build at least a half-dozen carriers to meet its requirements,” wrote defence expert Dave Majumdar in the National Interest, an international affairs publication, on February 22, 2017.

The Indian Navy has finalised the specifications for the construction of INS Vishal, an indigenous successor to INS Vikrant. The Vishal will be nuclear-powered, weigh 65,000-tonne and carry more aircraft than Vikrant and Vikramaditya. India is collaborating with the US to fit it with advanced “electro-magnetic aircraft launch system” (EMALS) for the aircraft.

Maritime doctrine

Indian Navy’s force structure is aimed at providing it with the capability to project power in ‘blue waters’ as envisioned in the Navy’s revised 2015 maritime doctrine.

“In theory, a blue-water Navy is a maritime force capable of operating in the deep waters of the open oceans,” noted Abhijit Singh, a Senior Fellow and Head, Maritime Policy Initiative at Observer Research Foundation, in The Diplomat, a current-affairs magazine.

The navy’s doctrine defines India’s areas of maritime interest as the wider Indian Ocean, which includes the Arabian Sea, Bay of Bengal, Andaman Sea, South-West Indian Ocean, Persian Gulf, Gulf of Oman, Gulf of Aden, Red Sea and chokepoints such as the Strait of Hormuz.

The PLA-N’s growing area of operations in this region places it in direct competition to India’s defined interests. However, it’s important to note that the PLA-N and its current force structure is aimed at securing the South China Sea and East China Sea, which it claims as its territories and is embattled in a bitter dispute with neighbouring countries as well as the US.

(Sethi is a Mumbai-based freelance writer and defence analyst.)
 
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PLAN wil be barely able to deploy a couple of destroyers and submarines in IOR.
Their submarines are of such poor quality they can't move without support ships.
PLAN has laughably bad power projection capability.
 
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China has large number of outdated diesel subs, a few noisy nuclear subs, and a training-aircraft carrier, numbers lie.

We won't allow the road there.
Ok, if we are going to go this route, how many of your Destroyers are actually made in the last decade and possesses capabilities matching that of the latest China, or for that matter yourself fields? It's 3, you know how many of these vessels China has? 6 052C, 5 052D, with another 4 in sea trial. I'm sure you can do the math.

As for subs, it is true, China doesn't have that many new subs, but in terms of AIP equipped subs, China is infinitely stronger, literally, as India currently fields 0 such subs.

This is a defense forum, if you can't be knowledgeable about such matters, I'm sure Reddit has openings.

As to the rest, just wow. The ignore list grows ever longer. We don't have to agree, but if you can't bring facts to the table, you bring nothing and there's really nothing more to be said.
 
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Ok, if we are going to go this route, how many of your Destroyers are actually made in the last decade and possesses capabilities matching that of the latest China, or for that matter yourself fields? It's 3, you know how many of these vessels China has? 6 052C, 5 052D, with another 4 in sea trial. I'm sure you can do the math.

As for subs, it is true, China doesn't have that many new subs, but in terms of AIP equipped subs, China is infinitely stronger, literally, as India currently fields 0 such subs.

This is a defense forum, if you can't be knowledgeable about such matters, I'm sure Reddit has openings.

AIP is not comparable as it lacks speed. Submarines operate in the principle of shoot and scoot. and with modern Hull mounted sonars once the sub fires it is dead meat. The top speed attained with AIP is 4 knots to 5 knots. That is not enough for the subamarine to escape. That is why Diesel electrics are now mostly used for sea denial instead of offensive warfare.
 
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AIP is not comparable as it lacks speed. Submarines operate in the principle of shoot and scoot. and with modern Hull mounted sonars once the sub fires it is dead meat. The top speed attained with AIP is 4 knots to 5 knots. That is not enough for the subamarine to escape. That is why Diesel electrics are now mostly used for sea denial instead of offensive warfare.
You should tell the Japanese and for that matter, your own DRDO, because they are developing this capability and adding it to all future submarines, assuming it is finished in time, which I suspect it probably will or at least close.

Also not sure if you know what AIP is based on the last sentence...
 
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Ok, if we are going to go this route, how many of your Destroyers are actually made in the last decade and possesses capabilities matching that of the latest China, or for that matter yourself fields? It's 3, you know how many of these vessels China has? 6 052C, 5 052D, with another 4 in sea trial. I'm sure you can do the math.

As for subs, it is true, China doesn't have that many new subs, but in terms of AIP equipped subs, China is infinitely stronger, literally, as India currently fields 0 such subs.

This is a defense forum, if you can't be knowledgeable about such matters, I'm sure Reddit has openings.

As to the rest, just wow. The ignore list grows ever longer. We don't have to agree, but if you can't bring facts to the table, you bring nothing and there's really nothing more to be said.

First bring all your assets to IOR (those that are capable of coming this far of course) leaving behind all your other engagements in sea, then we will test if they can survive our barrage of Brahmos and torpedoes.

But we won't allow the road construction by China in Bhutanese territory....That's a given..:)
 
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Its not about owing a race car but, can you drive it and is the race car is of very good quality.
 
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First bring all your assets to IOR (those that are capable of coming this far of course) leaving behind all your other engagements in sea, then we will test if they can survive our barrage of Brahmos and torpedoes.

But we won't allow the road construction by China in Bhutanese territory....That's a given..:)
You realize sail boats have gone around the world right...All Chinese and Indian ships can operate far from its own ocean. How effective they are is another matter.

Also a barrage of Brahmos, ok now I remember why you were on the ignore list to begin with. Lets never do this again.
 
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Out gunned in terms of boat, bullets or missiles, nothing matters road won't be allowed.
 
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You realize sail boats have gone around the world right...All Chinese and Indian ships can operate far from its own ocean. How effective they are is another matter.

Also a barrage of Brahmos, ok now I remember why you were on the ignore list to begin with. Lets never do this again.

Ships can, but all subs cannot. And yes, a barrage of Brahmos. And no road by China in disputed territory. Don't forget to write to admin that you are seeing posts of people in your ignore list, that's a technical error.
 
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....and we were still able to stop the construction of the road by PLA ? That's amazing.

And we could locate their stealth warship, spy ship and submarines as well!!!!!!!!!!!

Well chinese naval presence in Indian ocean is no threat to India. Let the children play in Indian ocean before they go back because of Inability to operate far away from theeir sea shore for a long time.
 
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