Indian Muslims want 'Ground Zero Mosque' relocated

[LaBong]

Danish Cartoons: Reactions in India, Pakistan and Bangladesh by L Venkateshwaran



Would you like a cup of coffee for you and your horse?

Some people burning a flag and some loony offering bounty to get political mileage, how does it contradict what Desiman said? The page was banned in India because GoI knew it would hurt the sentiments of Muslims, Indian muslims didn't have to go on a rampage to prove a point.

 

[Beskar]

Lol, MK! You're reading way too much into little things.

Lets get back to the topic, shall we?

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Maybe the Indian Muslims don't care to be defined by you or anyone else of your ilk. This is easily one of the most confused posts here. You seem to assume that the Indian Muslims should somehow behave in such a manner as to please you & that would prove that they have,as you so eloquently put it, grown a pair ?

The argument isn't that they should 'behave in such a manner as to please supporters of the mosque' but that they should at the least offer sound reasoning and rationale in support of their position. They have offered no such thing - the entire statement smacks of appeasement in the face of prejudice and irrational outrage over a community center.

Why should they fit into your mould? How would that make it any different from what you are accusing them of? Of trying to fit in ? Who are you or anyone else to decide for them? Do the pair that they grow have to resemble yours? Do they need to bend over only for the likes of you? Maybe you should practice what you preach & accept them for what they are. For a person who expects the Americans not to be judgmental, I see that you have no problem in being plenty that yourself !

Again, it is not about 'fitting into our mold instead of their mold' but of rationally justifying their position, rather than canards about 'not offending sentiments'. Prejudice and bigotry is not a sentiment that should be respected.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

In taking this initiative on their own they will earn much goodwill of the entire American nation, will resolve the current tense relationship between Muslim Americans and other Americans, and will build a very durable bridge of understanding between Muslims and others in America.

Do they actually believe this tripe they put out? Will those calling Islam a 'cult of terrorists', shoving signs in the faces of children leaving mosques screaming 'murderers', actually do a 180 and believe the opposite of Muslims and Islam?

Stop deluding yourselves. Just listen to right-wing talk radio and read conservative blogs and writers - read about the number of mosques being opposed across the US - this is Islamophobia run amuck. There is a State legislator in Florida looking for restrictions on Islam itself (a close friend of the Dane Geert Wilders).

These people are not going to change their minds about Islam and Muslims because one mosque is relocated, and in fact they don't intend to stop with the NYC center given their opposition to the other proposed mosques in the US.

 

[gubbi]

They have offered no such thing - the entire statement smacks of appeasement in the face of prejudice and irrational outrage over a community center.

And why should the Americans "appease" a community by treading on egg shells?

Again, it is not about 'fitting into our mold instead of their mold' but of rationally justifying their position, rather than canards about 'not offending sentiments'. Prejudice and bigotry is not a sentiment that should be respected.

Precisely! Except for a few "ultra right wing" zealots, Americans in general dont mind or rather arent bothered about the NY mosque. I have spoken to many fellows here in the "Bible belt" and their attitude is of indifference. However, one learned gentleman (a geezer, Vietnam vet) put it this way - he said he rather not have the mosque built there near Ground Zero not for any other reason but for the reason that Americans are tired having to tread on egg shells or treat everything with kid gloves when it comes to Islam. He asked why? Why are their sentiments so easily offended? Why do they still stick to their bronze-age traditions/customs when they come to US in pursuit of the American dream? Why is American culture so offending to them and yet they want to come to US of A? IMHO, valid questions. Any answers?

If you answer that a few conservative, right wing voices dont speak for Islam, then in the same vein, a few conservative right wingers dont speak for the Americans. Your views of Americans' understanding of the issue in question based on conservative TV/Radio shows is as wrong as it gets. However in their defense, they dont go about killing innocents in the name of US or any other platform they apparently are supporting. While 9/11 had nothing to do with Islam, the perpetrators and their supporters very well claimed that it was a Jihad for Islam! And therein lies the problem.

The Indian community is right in voicing their opinion and a correct one at that. The point that many members are making here implying that Indian Muslims arent Muslim enough to voice opinions regarding Islam are, seriously, perverted!

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

And why should the Americans "appease" a community by treading on egg shells?

Calling for the relocation of a mosque and by implication holding all Muslims and Islam responsible for terrorism and specifically the 9/11 attacks is not 'treading on egg shells', but vicious slander and denigration of an entire community and its faith.

Precisely! Except for a few "ultra right wing" zealots, Americans in general dont mind or rather arent bothered about the NY mosque. I have spoken to many fellows here in the "Bible belt" and their attitude is of indifference. However, one learned gentleman (a geezer, Vietnam vet) put it this way - he said he rather not have the mosque built there near Ground Zero not for any other reason but for the reason that Americans are tired having to tread on egg shells or treat everything with kid gloves when it comes to Islam. He asked why? Why are their sentiments so easily offended? Why do they still stick to their bronze-age traditions/customs when they come to US in pursuit of the American dream? Why is American culture so offending to them and yet they want to come to US of A? IMHO, valid questions. Any answers?

Answers to what? What comparison is being made here? Muslims taking offense at cartoons meant to be derogatory and demeaning towards Islam and Muslims vs a community center that in no way seeks to 'make fun of', denigrate or minimize the attacks of 9/11?

And what 'bronze age traditions and customs' do the majority of Muslim Americans follow? Its all very well to pass uninformed and offensive snide comments (like 'bronze age traditions) that find a willing and equally uninformed audience, but what exactly are the traditions that most American Muslims follow that are so repressive and vulgar?

You are not asking me to respond to honest 'questions', but respond to demagoguery. Try again with more specifics.

If you answer that a few conservative voices dont speak for Islam, then in the same vein, a few conservative right wingers dont speak for the Americans. Your views of Americans' understanding of the issue in question based no conservative TV/Radio shows is as wrong as it gets. However in their defense, they dont go about killing innocents in the name of US or any other platform they apparently are supporting. While 9/11 had nothing to do with Islam, the perpetrators and their supporters very well claimed that it was for Islam! And therein lies the problem.

And I never said that the right-wing in American speaks for 'all Americans', which is why I have very specifically referred to 'right wing nutters' etc. Please stop putting words in peoples mouths (or in our keystrokes in this case). Distorting someone's comments to try and make your point better is intellectual dishonest.

And a community and peoples cannot be responsible for nut cases going around claiming to do evil in the name of the community and faith. Its not like Muslims have super powers to control the minds of these people and make them stop using a distorted interpretation of Islam as justification. We have voiced our opposition to these acts, while the likes of OBL and AQ glorify them and proudly proclaim them, and that should be more than enough to contrast us vs them.

The Indian community is right in voicing their opinion and a correct opinion at that. The point that many members are making here implying that Indian Muslims arent Muslim enough to voice opinions regarding Islam are, seriously, perverted!

I don't know if they are Muslim enough or not, but the IAM Association definitely comes across as 'appeasing prejudice' given the lack of any strong rationale or arguments supporting their position of having the mosque relocated.

 

[gubbi]

Calling for the relocation of a mosque and by implication holding all Muslims and Islam responsible for terrorism and specifically the 9/11 attacks is not 'treading on egg shells', but vicious slander and denigration of an entire community and its faith.

Your extrapolating the issue of relocating the mosque to image of Islam and the community being held responsible for 9/11 is bogus. Americans are much much more intelligent than one gives them credit for. Majority of the Americans do not equate 9/11 to Islam and you of all people should know this better. The whole issue of bulding a Mosque is being blown out of proportion by a few "right wing nutters" like you said and a few conservative Muslims who want a mosque there for reasons best known to them. There is this editorial by an Arab editor, you might get a perspective:
Al-Arabiya Director: The Majority of Muslims Do Not Want or Need a Mosque Near Ground

Answers to what? What comparison is being made here? Muslims taking offense at cartoons meant to be derogatory and demeaning towards Islam and Muslims vs a community center that in no way seeks to 'make fun of', denigrate or minimize the attacks of 9/11?

You have a point.
Enywho, if this is such a non-issue why are people here defending so vehemently the "right" to build a mosque at the very spot citing a test for America's secularism or limits thereof?

And what 'bronze age traditions and customs' do the majority of Muslim Americans follow? Its all very well to pass uninformed and offensive snide comments (like 'bronze age traditions) that find a willing and equally uninformed audience, but what exactly are the traditions that most American Muslims follow that are so repressive and vulgar?
Try again with more specifics.

Try talking to some people here, you will get a real idea about racism and bigotry in the flesh. Once the geezer made sure I wasnt a Muslim, he launched into a tirade against the faith and people bringing in Iraq, Afghanistan, SA etc. I had to interrupt him (politely for business reasons) saying I had business to attend to!
About my comment on the "questions", heres what it is: I feel suffocated/stymied whenever I question any Muslim about his/her faith. Believe me I am an Agnostic, and have been literally dragged away from arguments from priests and the like! I ask questions and somehow I feel suppressed if I try to question Muslims about their faith. I sense uneasiness. I dont get such negative vibes with Christians. Thats why I put in "IMHO" there. I maybe wrong, but I have my doubts.

And I never said that the right-wing in American speaks for 'all Americans', which is why I have very specifically referred to 'right wing nutters' etc. Please stop putting words in peoples mouths (or in our keystrokes in this case). Distorting someone's comments to try and make your point better is intellectual dishonest.

And a community and peoples cannot be responsible for nut cases going around claiming to do evil in the name of the community and faith. Its not like Muslims have super powers to control the minds of these people and make them stop using a distorted interpretation of Islam as justification. We have voiced our opposition to these acts, while the likes of OBL and AQ glorify them and proudly proclaim them, and that should be more than enough to contrast us vs them.

That is exactly what I meant. Reread what I posted.

I don't know if they are Muslim enough or not, but the IAM Association definitely comes across as 'appeasing prejudice' given the lack of any strong rationale or arguments supporting their position of having the mosque relocated.

What it means, eh? Ridiculous, is it not?
Appeasing prejudice? Read the editorial and let me know your comments.

 

[HAIDER]

A debate good and bad aspect of building this mosque.
If build then few hardliner outside the mosque raise the slogan of some kinda Islamic victory, where Islam has nothing to do,if somone built the mosque or not.
But being a muslim, I would avoid to support something which is very sensitive and trivial issue for the nation. Building the mosque near national tragedy spot is not much supportive idea.
We muslim shouldn't make this matter of ego, give a respect to the emotion of people of the land.
Even I would say President Obama and few people have lions heart who approve the project.
I ask sometime to my fellow muslim brother, if 911 happened somewhere in muslim country,do you allow to built a holy place to convict party next to seen of incident ?

 

[LaBong]

The whole issue of bulding a Mosque is being blown out of proportion by a few "right wing nutters" like you said and a few conservative Muslims who want a mosque there for reasons best known to them. There is this editorial by an Arab editor, you might get a perspective:

Exactly! Who are actually to blame linking the prayer hall to WTC? Right wing loonies or Muslims conservatives? Whoever done this, people dont seem to get the fact that by linking the mosque to Ground Zero they are actually doing exactly opposite of what sane people have been saying for last 10 years --- Don't equate Islam and Terrorism!

 

[GentlemanObserver]

Exactly! Who are actually to blame linking the prayer hall to WTC? Right wing loonies or Muslims conservatives? Whoever done this, people dont seem to get the fact that by linking the mosque to Ground Zero they are actually doing exactly opposite of what sane people have been saying for last 10 years --- Don't equate Islam and Terrorism!

If only people like Brad Blakeman and Palin understood this..

 

[linkinpark]

Well Indian Muslims aren't doing much to Islamize America. As a matter of fact, I do not even think any Masjid build or sponsored by Indian origin Muslims. May be they are out numbered. Most Masjid here are build and sponsored by Arabs, Pakistanis and Bangladeshis so I think we will decides weather this Masjid will get build or not. I think we will.

As a matter of fact, prayers are already taking place inside the proposed Masjid.

Why should Indian muslims Islamize America, for that matter any other muslims. It seems your agenda in US is to Islamize it. Indian muslims are there in US for a better future and will work hard towards that goal. They are not there to involve in religious bigotry that some of you show here openly.

Indian muslims have the wherewithal to build mosques for themselves if the need ever arises. So, you can live in your wonderland of non-existent ummah and try to ostracize Indian muslims form it.

 

[Peregrine]

Why should Indian muslims Islamize America, for that matter any other muslims. It seems your agenda in US is to Islamize it. Indian muslims are there in US for a better future and will work hard towards that goal. They are not there to involve in religious bigotry that some of you show here openly.

Indian muslims have the wherewithal to build mosques for themselves if the need ever arises. So, you can live in your wonderland of non-existent ummah and try to ostracize Indian muslims form it.

Then wont it be better, if Indian Muslims will stop imparting real estate recommendations to those who actually own the land?

 

[EjazR]

It is unfortunate how some people jump at a moment to 'bash' Indian muslims.

The statement was given by American muslims of indian origin by just ONE such association.

Fareed Zakaria who is MUCH MUCH MORE influential than any Pakistani, Bangladeshi or probably an Indian even for that matter on prime time TV has this tosay" How many will not praise Fareed Zakaria for his stand. Or will his "Pakistani bashing" will come in the way? Hypocrisy at its best unfortunately

 

[Zeluvaa]

Then wont it be better, if Indian Muslims will stop imparting real estate recommendations to those who actually own the land?

It is the Association members opinions and they just made public these opinions. They are entitled to them and it is their prerogative if they want to express it. Similarly others have opinions which they are voicing and they are free to oppose or approve of the mosque.

Similarly the owners of the land have the right to ignore or consider these opinions and the constitution and law grants them full rights to build the centre. Simple

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

News: Indian Muslims want 'Ground Zero Mosque' relocated: Relo to Delhi via the next "shamjota masjid sai karlo" express.................