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Indian economic growth is good for Pakistan

If the west stop handing india everyt hing in a silver platter, India would still be in a deep hole.

Let me give some examples.

what is the difference between India and Pakistani talents when it come to setting up call centers, Why India is preferred over Pakistan, only one can guess, and it looks fishy.

The Mini car a true copy of German smart car was so much talked about in western media where as Pakistan had developed a car few years prior to Indian car and the name was Revo (revolution)never got such attention. Why?


Photos: Pakistan's first locally designed car Revo picture and comments.

Computer industry in Pakistan is much better and more vibrant in Pakistan than India but somehow India is given more access than Pakistan.

Pakistan has been fighting for the world since Russians walked in Afghanistan, but world denies it and do not want to see the truth, it is very bad when your neighbor joins the array of harming Pakistan by trying to stop developments. and use false propaganda and surveys by those who are known adversaries of Pakistan and talk about its breakup and neighbor who bring in the adversary who is killing Muslims by scores.

Nevertheless we believe in truth decency and honesty, these traits shall win.

It is law of Nature and of Universe.


well this is unfair. dont diminish india's acheivemnts by saying everything was given on a platter to india.

these western countries did not even notice india untill it had already made a lot of progress. yes now i may agree they notice and give due respect to india but not untill we proved ourselves.

we gatecrashed into thier party and were not invited.

further pakistan does not lack in talent or resources in any way. Actually in the initial years after independence pakistan was growing faster than india. bur somehow in between it lost track and got involved in other affairs. and india found its track

having said that pakistan can grow rapidly provided it takes the right steps wich i am sure it must be taking
 
The law of business is that efficiency, foresight, scale, organization, enterprise, understanding of the market and timing plus a bit of luck - these traits win most of the time.

Agree with most of your post, except that you left out the single most important factor in business success: connections.

The fact is that business deals are made on the golf course, not in the boardroom.

Let's not kid ourselves. Every successful businessman claims that he made it on merit, but luck and connections have far more impact than they are given credit. And what is true of individuals is also true of countries. India benefitted extensively in the beginning from its stable government and large expat base in the West. All the infrastructure and business support capabilities you mentioned developed much later, after India had been doing basic call center and grunt programming for several years.
 
Agree with most of your post, except that you left out the single most important factor in business success: connections.

The fact is that business deals are made on the golf course, not in the boardroom.

Let's not kid ourselves. Every successful businessman claims that he made it on merit, but luck and connections have far more impact than they are given credit.



IMO, too much importance is given to the connections angle. And it is not really understood.

Yes many business deals are made on a golf course, and happen because of connections. Connections are very important.

The fact is - and I have seen this personally - you can make use of all the connections you have but they don't get you anywhere unless you can show that you can deliver.

And, another thing: there is nothing wrong with connections. As an Indian my culture taught me to despise connections, the people who got things done 'by the back door'.

Well, a business school education and work experience in the west taught me different. You must aggressively make use of connections to better yourselves; it is not only encouraged, it is expected.

However, connections are made on the basis of a track record; on mutual business capabilities. Not just bhai bhai attitudes.

It lies in the assumption that you are competent. If you're not, your connections will not matter a damn.

And what is true of individuals is also true of countries. India benefitted extensively in the beginning from its stable government and large expat base in the West. All the infrastructure and business support capabilities you mentioned developed much later, after India had been doing basic call center and grunt programming for several years.

Your stable government and the expat base argument are absolutely right. But to identify them as the only reason is to court failure if you're trying to replicate that success. IMO, the critical reasons for business success are the ones I identified in my earlier post, so I wont go there.

I am not sure what you meant by your infrastructure argument, but here goes a response anyway.

The fact that India had been doing basic call center and grunt work in IT for years actually supports another facet of my argument - business evolution. Obviously a business evolves in stages. The infrastructure and capabilities develop as the business develops. It makes no business sense to have capabilities that exceed your actual output.

So, going back to an earlier example, it makes no sense to produce a mini car if the market is not ready to accept it, if you don't have volumes and if you don't have an after sales service infrastructure (repair shops, spare parts etc) to support it.
 
I disagree ASQ.India did work hard to get all that foreign business.The reason for Indian Economic Success is
1) Good Economic Policies
2)Stable Government
3) Iron First rule over pretty much whole country.
Indians have worked hard and its time for Pakistanis to work hard for themselves and their country instead of saying yanks gave India the money and not Pakistan just because Pakistan is a Muslim nation.If we offer good competition we'll too snatch foreign investment.
 
Which actually leads to a fascinating discussion - what are the conditions for Pakistan to develop into a flourishing economy? - but I am not sure if this is the thread to debate that in any detail.
 
Credit where it's due, gentlemen. India was bankrupt two decades ago, and look where they have come. They would become an economic superpower in another decade or two & we would be still crying over spilled milk.

Indians are successful because they worked hard for it. While we were busy blowing each other apart, they were building educational institutions that are respected the world over. Poor thing is that no leader in Pakistan ever thinks of doing that, Islamic education alone will not bring prosperity & business, modern education will.

People here talking about how the west conspired against us & nonsense, as long as you continue to believe that, our politicos will never be under pressure to deliver. They will never have to build colleges & universities, research centres & training institutes, because you all will readily believe that we are in deep **** not because of the drastic short comings of our education system & oppurtunities but because of the Christian-Jew-Hindu conspiracies. And we would be back to where we are.
 
Its easy to bl;ame every body else for Pakistans Failures.

The fact is simple since independence in 1947 Pakistan has been struggling for a true sense of direction.

Its wants to make it own trade mark in THE WORLD but has got drawn into a bitter rivalry with its giant neighbour.

All its resoucres efforts for over 60s HAVE BEEN WASTED in this bitter rivalry.

In stead of becoming a strong vibrant mordern islamic nation which could lead the rest of the islamic world it has become a nation torn between internal politics military rulers and religous factions.
 
Pakistani economic growth is good for Pakistan -- Why does the Pakistani economy under perform? Because it continues to be a economy largely under governement control and infuleneced by monopolies.
 
On a side note, having lived in the West for several years, there is not a shadow of a doubt in my mind that there is a concerted effort against Muslims and, especially Pakistan, because we are a nuclear power. It's not a question of being paranoid. It's about keeping your eyes open and navigating around known obstacles instead of banging your head against a wall.
http://www.defence.pk/forums/general-images-multimedia/33387-medias-war-upon-islam.html
http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakistans-war/31811-western-media-s-war-pakistan.html

However, getting back on topic, this does not excuse our sorry performance in development because most of our problems are of our own making and, in addition to the domestic market of 170 million consumers, there is a huge export market to be tapped outside the Zionist-dominated world: Middle East, Asia, Africa and South America.

I just coined an acronym to convey the thought.
What any country needs to grow economically is good TIMES (Talent, Infrastructure, Money, Entrepreneurship and Stability).

India has good TIMES. The question for Pakistan is, what part of it is the government's job, and which parts can be provided by individual citizens?
 
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As far as claiming India for having served in served in the silver platter. I belong to IT industry. There are majors like Wipro which have separate companies like Wipro Infotech which work for middle east generating a huge revenue. Companies like Infosys also have huge investments in middle east. So Indians cannot be said to have an advantage because westerners are favoring them.

Personally I have worked for Turkish project and with Turkish agents in Europe. So the statement of bias can be rejected very easily.

As far as the industry are concerned Indians have the best process and the buisness models avaiable in the market. No company is going to give nor they think that China is threat so outsource to India. Its simple profit loss and quality dynamics..

In the field of industry there is no Pakistani Industry which can compete with Indian companies ranging in multiple fields. So Pakistan needs to develop infrastructure first... then only it would be able to sustain the market. And the first step would be to stop playing the victim card. STOP GIVING EXCUSES

As far as just the cheap labor is concerned the first microprocessor was created by an Indian. Hotmail was designed by an Indian. There are projects which were complex. My friends would understand how complex is the project when the degree of complexity of an algorithm crosses 3

The main reason for the boom is the proper education. Total no of engineering colleges in India is 1346 which gives roughly 5 lakh engg graduates every year.Pakistan needs to work on education for the same part

Anyways I find hard to compete with Indian IT for Pakistan as of now. Anyways Indian IT industry rocks.
 
As far as claiming India for having served in served in the silver platter. I belong to IT industry. There are majors like Wipro which have separate companies like Wipro Infotech which work for middle east generating a huge revenue. Companies like Infosys also have huge investments in middle east. So Indians cannot be said to have an advantage because westerners are favoring them.

Indian IT exports started from US outsourcing and were limited to cheap, low level, grunt programming for several years. Full ISO certification and BPO support came much later.

Personally I have worked for Turkish project and with Turkish agents in Europe. So the statement of bias can be rejected very easily.

http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-affairs/33581-fifty-years-turkey-still-pines-become-european.html

As far as the industry are concerned Indians have the best process and the buisness models avaiable in the market. No company is going to give nor they think that China is threat so outsource to India. Its simple profit loss and quality dynamics.

In the field of industry there is no Pakistani Industry which can compete with Indian companies ranging in multiple fields. So Pakistan needs to develop infrastructure first... then only it would be able to sustain the market. And the first step would be to stop playing the victim card. STOP GIVING EXCUSES

We are trying to have a productive conversation here, so please spare us the trolling and chest thumping.

As far as just the cheap labor is concerned the first microprocessor was created by an Indian. Hotmail was designed by an Indian. There are projects which were complex.

In November, 1971, a company called Intel publicly introduced the world's first single chip microprocessor, the Intel 4004 (U.S. Patent #3,821,715), invented by Intel engineers Federico Faggin, Ted Hoff, and Stan Mazor.

Hotmail was founded by Jack Smith and Sabeer Bhatia (Indian) in Silicon Valley, not India.
 
On a side note, having lived in the West for several years, there is not a shadow of a doubt in my mind that there is a concerted effort against Muslims and, especially Pakistan, because we are a nuclear power. It's not a question of being paranoid. It's about keeping your eyes open and navigating around known obstacles instead of banging your head against a wall.
http://www.defence.pk/forums/general-images-multimedia/33387-medias-war-upon-islam.html
http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakistans-war/31811-western-media-s-war-pakistan.html

However, getting back on topic, this does not excuse our sorry performance in development because most of our problems are of our own making and, in addition to the domestic market of 170 million consumers, there is a huge export market to be tapped outside the Zionist-dominated world: Middle East, Asia, Africa and South America.

I just coined an acronym to convey the thought.
What any country needs to grow economically is good TIMES (Talent, Infrastructure, Money, Entrepreneurship and Stability).

India has good TIMES. The question for Pakistan is, what part of it is the government's job, and which parts can be provided by individual citizens?

I like it, nice new acronym. I will use it from now on: TIMES :smitten:
 
Indian IT exports started from US outsourcing and were limited to cheap, low level, grunt programming for several years. Full ISO certification and BPO support came much later.



http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-affairs/33581-fifty-years-turkey-still-pines-become-european.html



We are trying to have a productive conversation here, so please spare us the trolling and chest thumping.



In November, 1971, a company called Intel publicly introduced the world's first single chip microprocessor, the Intel 4004 (U.S. Patent #3,821,715), invented by Intel engineers Federico Faggin, Ted Hoff, and Stan Mazor.

Hotmail was founded by Jack Smith and Sabeer Bhatia (Indian) in Silicon Valley, not India.

Ha ha, we have a pro here Deleopereo! :) (and me too).....
 

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