Indian Double Standards on Terrorism

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I am starting this thread to illustrate Indian double standards on terrorism, glorifying Indian support for violent rebels that committed tens of thousands of atrocities in East Pakistan, while condemning the insurgency in disputed Jammu & Kashmir.

To start off, I'll use this post by an Indian calling for condemnation of Kashmir based insurgent groups and referring to them as 'terrorists':

I hope you carry out the same excercise for Kashmir based terrorist organizations and their cheer leaders in this forum.

Any person or group using violence against a state and its citizens should be treated as terrorist.

I hope you use this criteria.

I hope Indians will also condemn the terrorist acts (atrocities against tens of thousands of civilians in EP) by rebels in East Pakistan and Indian State support for such terrorism to show that they are indeed applying a balanced approach to events.

There have been instances today in which Indian members used reasoning identical to their excuses for supporting terrorism in East Pakistan, to support recent terrorists attacks by the BLA in Baluchistan - the massacres of school teachers, college lecturers and principals. These are acts that the BLA has itself proudly claimed, and has vowed to continue. The BLA has also in essence vowed to commit genocide in Baluchistan, by eliminating all non-Baluch ethnicities in the province, especially Punjabis.

This kind of double game and 'good terrorist vs bad terrorist' distinction by the Indians, in both Baluchistan and East Pakistan, needs to stop.

Can BLA be termed as freedom fighters?

YouTube - Marri: Balochistan Independence -4/4

No they cannot because they have themselves taken responsibility for killing civilians - school teachers, principals, non-Baluch ethnicity laborers and residents etc.

They have also openly called for the killing of non-Baluch residents (civilians and non-civilians). I fail to see how any group that so openly calls for the murder of innocents, and acts in that manner, in pursuit of a political objective can be considered anything but a 'terrorist' group.

 

[MilesTogo]

No they cannot because they have themselves taken responsibility for killing civilians - school teachers, principals, non-Baluch ethnicity laborers and residents etc.

They have also openly called for the killing of non-Baluch residents (civilians and non-civilians). I fail to see how any group that so openly calls for the murder of innocents, and acts in that manner, in pursuit of a political objective can be considered anything but a 'terrorist' group.

Can the same logic be applied to Kashmiri groups in case of Mumbai attacks and other terror attacks in India?

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

No they cannot because they have themselves taken responsibility for killing civilians - school teachers, principals, non-Baluch ethnicity laborers and residents etc.

They have also openly called for the killing of non-Baluch residents (civilians and non-civilians). I fail to see how any group that so openly calls for the murder of innocents, and acts in that manner, in pursuit of a political objective can be considered anything but a 'terrorist' group.

In fact, were the BLA allowed to carry out its stated goals, it would be tantamount to a genocide of non-Baluch in the province.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Can the same logic be applied to Kashmiri groups in case of Mumbai attacks and other terror attacks in India?

Terrorist attacks, yes, - attacks on security forces, no.

And, whether true or not, the LeT, JuD and other insurgent groups have stated that they were not responsible for the Mumbai attacks or other terrorist attacks in India. That is a rather different position from that of the TTP/AQ/BLA, who proudly claim responsibility for terror attacks, and call for more of the same.

 

[MilesTogo]

Terrorist attacks, yes, - attacks on security forces, no.

And, whether true or not, the LeT, JuD and other insurgent groups have stated that they were not responsible for the Mumbai attacks or other terrorist attacks in India. That is a rather different position from that of the TTP/AQ/BLA, who proudly claim responsibility for terror attacks, and call for more of the same.

So, if BLA targets Pakistani army - then would you recognize it as freedom struggle.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

.
4. Now it is upto the mod team to walk the talk and either give proof that they were pro freedom insurgents or it should not call them that applying the same logic that I am supposed to follow..

If they are insurgents, then it is pretty obvious they are not fighting the IA because they are pro-India, and if they are not pro-India, then they are fighting the IA to end 'occupation' and therefore for 'freedom'.

btw will we apply the same logic when PA kills so called TTP terrorists in NWFP and the news is reported in this forum? Or is that exempt?

You are correct, they may not be TTP militants, but Uzbeks, Chechens, Lashkar-e-Jhangvi, Al Qaeda etc. But all those groups are terrorists given their open claims of responsibility for attacking civilians, in many cases videos as well. So calling them terrorists or militants would be accurate, since no one aside from these groups is fighting the PA in that region.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

So, if BLA targets Pakistani army - then would you recognize it as freedom struggle.

Too late for that now, since they have in the past few weeks (and before that) openly claimed responsibility for attacking and killing school teachers, principals, laborers, civil servants etc.

They have also openly called for killing/eliminating non-Baluch (especially Punjabi) residents of Balochistan, indicating they wish to perpetrate a genocide.

Once upon a time they might have been 'freedom fighters'.

 

[afriend]

Well.. these freedom strugglers had a history of killing civilians who had refused to shelter them. And also they have unique distinction of killing pandits and throwing them out of kashmir. I do not think this comes under the purview of freedom strugglers.

And AM what evidence do you have to assume these where pro freedom strugglers or militants who come under the above category. I believe its a matter of convinient assumption.

Fundemental disagreement of the categorisation of these militants are always there, and hence the change in title dont make much difference as long as these terrorists are given their well deserved appoinment to hell.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I think, such demarcation of good violance and bad violance is not good as a policy for any country.

Yet I have not seen you condemn Indira Gandhi and India for supporting violent rebels/terrorists in East Pakistan.

Once Indians themselves stop being hypocritical about 'good terrorists and bad terrorists' they might get more support for their position.

You had been bitten once in the western front, and you never know when it will turn around in the eastern front. So clear and uniform policy should be there for all forms of violence else there would always be a trust deficit when it comes to pakistan.

The eastern front has been clamped down on for over a decade now. That is why the violent insurgency in J&K and cross-LoC infiltration remain at historically low levels.

 

[afriend]

Yet I have not seen you condemn Indira Gandhi and India for supporting violent rebels/terrorists in East Pakistan.

Once Indians themselves stop being hypocritical about 'good terrorists and bad terrorists' they might get more support for their position.

The eastern front has been clamped down on for over a decade now. That is why the violent insurgency in J&K and cross-LoC infiltration remain at historically low levels.

I do not understand how can you call it hypocracy,

Indira gandhi clamped down the same people who had guns and terrorised entire punjab and who had killed many innocent civilans and punjab was turning into a lawless state where too you had tried to interfere. And india directly interfered in bangladesh with its army, its support and arms training for mukti bani started only months before the actual assault by the indian army when there where already atrocities going on. And its a one strong blow india made against lawless agents. India did nurture them to grow into a monster. We never continued our support to any organisation who have turned into a lawless entity like taliban in afghanistan.

So you viewing your policy and our policy through the same lens is not right is wot i believe.

 

[KS]

Yet I have not seen you condemn Indira Gandhi and India for supporting violent rebels/terrorists in East Pakistan.

Y should w condemn Indira in the first place..She intervened only because the weak Indian economy at the time could not afford the millions of bengalis who were pouring in as refugees.Does the same thing happen in Kashmir.??
The only refugees i see are the 4 million Kashmiri hindu Pandits.
What have u got for them..?

@Agno:
U said that the BLA can be called terrorists becausr they kill civilians...
From their point and my point they r just killing the Punjabi occupiers who have come to strip their lands of their resources..

nad also can i provide proof of terrorists killing innocent Kasmiris..? will u accept them..?

 

[bandmaster]

Yet I have not seen you condemn Indira Gandhi and India for supporting violent rebels/terrorists in East Pakistan.

Once Indians themselves stop being hypocritical about 'good terrorists and bad terrorists' they might get more support for their position.

I would have condemned Indira Gandhi for not intervening in Bangladesh much earlier, which could have saved countless Bangladeshi lives, but I am told that it was IA's decision.

 

[Skeptic]

Well not only evidence but there are millions of eye witnesses (Kashmiri Pandits) sitting in Jammu camps. But do you considering deaths of innocent civilians as a act of terrorism even if they are non-muslims.

This is an absurd argument that Kashmiri terrorists are freedom fighters as they are not killing civilians. The demography of the entir valley has been permanently altered because of their acts.

In case you do not accept infidels as innocent civilians - there is the case of father of our civil services topper. He has been killed by the same breed of "Freedom Fighters" and his family is saying on live media without being prompted.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I would have condemned Indira Gandhi for not intervening in Bangladesh much earlier, which could have saved countless Bangladeshi lives, but I am told that it was IA's decision.

Ahh, see - another Indian making a distinction between 'good terrorists and bad terrorists', and supporting the GoI decision to be a terrorist sponsoring State.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I do not understand how can you call it hypocracy,

Indira gandhi clamped down the same people who had guns and terrorised entire punjab and who had killed many innocent civilans and punjab was turning into a lawless state where too you had tried to interfere. And india directly interfered in bangladesh with its army, its support and arms training for mukti bani started only months before the actual assault by the indian army when there where already atrocities going on. And its a one strong blow india made against lawless agents. India did nurture them to grow into a monster. We never continued our support to any organisation who have turned into a lawless entity like taliban in afghanistan.

So you viewing your policy and our policy through the same lens is not right is wot i believe.

Y should w condemn Indira in the first place..She intervened only because the weak Indian economy at the time could not afford the millions of bengalis who were pouring in as refugees.Does the same thing happen in Kashmir.??
The only refugees i see are the 4 million Kashmiri hindu Pandits.
What have u got for them..?

Indian support for the East Pakistani terrorists/rebels, both before and after Op. Searchlight, and the fallacy of the argument of 'millions of refugees' has been discussed elsewhere, so I won't take this thread in that direction, but even accepting your arguments, the fact is that they amount to mere excuses, such as those by Pakistanis, that the IA is responsible for the torture, rape and massacres of tens of thousands of Kashmiris - atrocities confirmed by Amnesty International and HRW. Pakistanis would argue that the unjust occupation and subjugation of millions of Kashmiris by India deserves support, and the struggle of Kashmiris is similar to the struggle by Indians and the Americans from British rule.

So at the end of the day, you can dig up whatever excuses you want, but the fact is that India supported rebels (that committed atrocities against civilians) and undermined the rule of a sovereign nation - that is support for terrorism, as was India's support for the LTTE. But while many Indians have accepted that their nation was wrong in supporting the LTTE, they continue to make the 'good terrorist vs bad terrorist' distinction in East Pakistan vs Kashmir - this is completely hypocritical and should change if Indians are really sincere about 'peace' and 'dialog not insurgency in Kashmir'.

@Agno:
U said that the BLA can be called terrorists becausr they kill civilians...
From their point and my point they r just killing the Punjabi occupiers who have come to strip their lands of their resources..

A civilian non-Baluch who teaches in a school or college, educating Baluch youth (amongst others) to have a better future is not a 'usurper' or 'occupier'. A non-Baluch who is a laborer doing really nasty work in poor conditions in a mine is not a 'usurper' or 'occupier'. Baluchistan is part of Pakistan, and when the rulers of the Princely States, and people of other territories comprising the modern province of Baluchistan, and people of all other provinces, chose to join Pakistan they accepted that there would be free movement of all Pakistanis across Pakistan. That is why Karachi is such an ethnically diverse city.

nad also can i provide proof of terrorists killing innocent Kasmiris..? will u accept them..?

Sure, as there is evidence from AI, HRW and others about atrocities committed by the IA, but the leadership of most Kashmir groups, and the IA, has condemned such incidents and does not advocate it as SOP, do they?