Indian Army is mobilizing tanks and troops along the internationl boundary with Pakistan-OSINT

[Signalian]

Pakistanis have been going gaga since the Feb 27th incident. It was not a war, just a confrontation like what happens almost everyday at the border. In a confrontation today you can have an a kill, tomorrow we can have an advantage of destroying a bunker or the kill. You can’t call this a victory. Yes downing the MIG 21 & getting the pilot as POW is a moral victory. But if you look at how you reacted even after capturing our pilot in spite of having an upper hand, will tell who was scared & in panic of fighting & escalating.

Even after his capture the Indian Gov.t had a tough stand threatening & dictating Pak Gov.t & establishment to release him immediately or face consequences & you obliged. Releasing the pilot & so quick showed the fear Pakistan was in & that’s our moral victory. Loss of MIG 21 is not a big deal because it is anyway going to be phased out. We lost a Helicopter due to the confrontation. I can accept that as a loss even though you didn’t shoot it down, it’s due to the confrontation. So that’s an economic loss.

The facts is Abhinandan or our MIG 21 crossing over changed the course & the fate of Pakistan. Whether he got over excited to venture into the enemy territory or it was our communication flaws is another debate. But it happened on that day, so luck was on your side on that day. Had he not crossed the LOC on that day, the outcome & losses for Pakistan would have been far far greater. It was our bad luck.

If we had a confrontation with full fleet with exchange of missiles & dog fights between our jets & if you downed our jets - Yes you can call it a victory partially. A full victory is when the enemy surrenders or when your purpose of war is met.. But here we didn’t send even one squadron across, so it was the error of the pilot, where it’s bound to happen. What would happen to a Pakistani jet if it crossed into LOC when you are waiting with your full force other side. It’s a suicide. It’s just Pakistanis trying to pacify each other claiming this a victory, which they have never tasted ever & never will.

In any confrontation where there is ceasefire & no decisive victory, what you look at is the impact of the confrontation. What’s the outcome.

Has India panicked after the war? No. If we have got scared then we will be defensive in our statements & speeches. Has it happened. Will India fear to invade or attack Pakistan again. Do you think it won’t happen again?

Pakistan started all previous wars. Does Pakistan today have the will & guts to start a war with India. No – So your posture now will always be we don’t want war, we are peace lovers, because your Gov.t & establishment knows they cannot win any war with India anymore.

All the previous wars it was Pakistan who was bullying India & imposing casualties & fear, but now it’s India who will impose the same. Pakistan has no choice but to be defensive, because before you used to bully India, volley threats, promote terror or start a war at will as you had a choice run to the international community for ceasefire when you near defeat. India was scared of western isolation & sanctions along with the Chinese threat before, but now India doesn’t fear the west, international community or Chinese.

The biggest victory for India was Pakistani establishment announcing on media, India crossed the international boundary & went back without any response or confrontation. But after the announcement they had to prove to their people they are not cowards, so they brought a full fleet & dropped a bomb in open field just across the LOC. But to Pakistan’s surprise India responded to their attempt to cross LOC immediately. Abhinandan crossed the LOC with an outdated jet. That was your luck

Now coming to the result of this confrontation for Pakistan

Last time the surgical strikes was in LOC, so you could get away by rejecting we didn’t enter the territory. But this time we crossed international boundary, just to prove a point to see if you can reject it. If you don’t announce it, you are putting yourself to risk for future similar incursions freely by India. You had to no choice but to announce it immediately. So this “Indians are cowards” manjan won’t sell anymore with your public. Victory for India.

Pakistan was scared to escalate to a full fledged war. Victory for India

After this bold move, Pakistan in future will be scared to do any Mumbai kind of cowardly attack. India has no more worry or fear for such attacks. Our radars, coast guards, BSF & intelligence was always in extreme pressure to be vigilant, not to miss out on any ploy plotted from across the border. So now it’s an advantage for India, if Pakistan does any such kind of attack, we have the reason & license to invade & attack Pakistan.

So the Mullah’s like Hafeez Saeed, Mullah Omar, Syed Salahuddin will become irrelevant. They won’t be able to plan or execute any terror attack in future. We have given an extra head ache for your Govt & establishment to monitor your own terrorists they don’t plot any attack on India as we will be waiting for such a mistake to be committed by Pakistan. The fear has reversed now for Pakistani people & establishment. Victory for India.

Pakistan is talking claiming there can be another attack before election. This thread itself for eg; is the result of the fear. We have put you on back foot & continuous vigil & agony. This fear will continue even after election. Victory for India

We are making you spend on troop deployment, arms & equipment draining your reserves, which is what India wants. India can afford escalation not Pakistan. As long as cost of Military expenditure, LOC clashes increase, it will keep eating into your developmental funds, pushing your economy lower & lower. Victory for India

We are pushing you more & more into Chinese dependence, as a full fledged war means elimination of Pakistan. You would need China for counter weapons, intelligence & satellite data, for which they will ask you to give access to your territory & other economic benefits. You will slowly lose all your voice, freedom to take decisions & most importantly the power with China. You won’t be able to enforce your laws & decisions on your own land. There will be a day soon where your Gov.t & Military will take full orders making you a bonded labor & thorough slave of China. Victory for India.

As long as these above atmosphere prevails, there will be no development & businesses taken over by China one by one. Local businesses are further going to perish gravely affecting cost of living, increasing unemployment, trade deficit & debts. This is the perfect ingredient for instability, collapse of government & political turmoil. This will increase your crime rate, political, regional & ethnic clashes eventually leading to economic collapse & breakup of the country.

You can see it in your increase in costs for necessities, Rupee struggling to even hold at one level, forget strengthening. Except for loans you have not got any investments so far. Everything is big talks & claims, nothing in reality. So as debts & deficits start putting pressure, your Rupee is further going to tumble leading to hyperinflation & increase in further cost of basic necessities.

Such threads & discussions will give you short term happiness & verbal victory. Your real victory will only be after you decide to surrender to India & accept all its terms. You will able to grow like BD. If not distance will grow not only with India but with Afghanistan, Iran, Israel & others.

And my common sense says, there won’t be any attack or incursions before election or near future at least for a year or two. But yes our soldiers at the border are starving, scared & cowards, so the LOC will remain hot with sniping, shelling & violations continuously as Indians are scared of dying.

I don't prefer confrontations, but this is the most delusional post i have seen in 2019.

Pakistan has not really been going "Gaga", not the Government or the Military at least. The Government is handling its affairs where as the Military has geared up already for a possible Indian strike or retaliation, probably a sucker punch. Do you know why its just a confrontation and not a war ? Because Pakistan kept it that way responsibly. had Pakistan wanted, it would have been an all out war. The irresponsible behavior of India was an all intent to not just escalate but push Pakistan into a trap of an all out war and then decimate it conventionally since Pakistan is getting stronger with every passing day. If India claims of a kill on Pakistani soldier, Pakistan also retaliates and makes a kill. Its a tit for tat but even after igniting the LOC and killing civilians, India is not succeeding in weakening Pakistan. I can sense the stench of a burn in your words, in your sentences, the way you portrayed your thoughts. Its alright Mate, Pakistan is not Palestine and India is no Israel. You are under no capacity to point out whether there is a victory or not, whether its a moral victory or not. Let me assure you that scared, panicked and frightened nations behave in a very different way than how Pakistan reacted. Its your own blindness that you see a gesture of good will of returning a POW as an act of fright. Maybe that's your take of fear, in Pakistan we call it kindness and act of friendship.


Its ironic that India's tough stand, threatening and dictating Pakistan only bore fruit in securing an immediate release of pilot who Pakistan treated as a guest and respectfully from Day One; not the release of spy Yadav, not the shut down of so called alleged launching pads, not the closure of river and seas shared by both countries etc. So according to you Pakistan became intimidated and then obliged on releasing the pilot. Maybe you should step down from cloud number nine and wake up. The pilot was handed back as Pakistan didn't want to escalate the conflict but end it, however, delusional as Indian war mongering is, a good gesture was taken by India as a slap on the face by Pakistan. Sorry to disappoint you, but yes Pakistan behaved smartly and showed that it has a bigger heart than India could ever have. India wanted war and got a kind gesture in return, the world acknowledged it, i won't bother to copy paste links, do go through neutral media and news channels.

If you visit Pakistan and introduce yourself as an Indian, you will experience it too. Not just a cup of tea and free passage home, but also free stay and free food, not by the Military but a common Pakistani, we as a nation are that hospitable. Why don't you come and find out before you allege us of cowardice.

India lost a helicopter, an economic loss ? Pity, you calculate the lost lives of your soldiers as an economic loss. For me, its a tragic loss of life, getting shot down by your forces is also showing incompetence of the highest level. May i remind you that the words you used for Pakistan wrongly before, like scared, fright etc can be fitted correctly here, Panic is the correct one. Shooting down own plane in Panic, its a loss after all.

As for the Mig-21, I can imagine why its easy for you say its not a big deal. Flying coffins fall everyday in India right ? No big deal, truly ! This one fell inside Pakistan, why bother. Indian Mig-21's are allowed to fall here and there, that's why IAF flies them. A jet in the process of being phased out, armed with best missile and electronics, once touted to be be better than PAF F-16's... is sent to take on adversary aircraft and the loss is accepted as phasing out strategy, truly amazing, anyways moving ahead.

The poor guy Abhinandan had no idea what he was doing or what was going to happen to him on that fateful day, but it did change the course of the situation and made IAF a laughing stock in front of the whole world. It forced Indian Navy into action which was humiliated just like IAF and its sub was sent back scurrying back to India. So its a series of humiliating events, the Indian Army was getting thrashed on LOC all year long, IAF released payload on trees and backed off avoiding actual combat, when the actual combat was enforced on them by PAF, then the IAF pilot got shot down,in panic IA/IAF shot down own helicopter, then the IN sub was detected and told to go back. If indeed there was a military tri-services mocku-mentary to be made, the premise has been written by IA/IAF/IN together.

Are you really trying that hard to define victory again ? if this happened, If that happened. Get real Mate, what has happened as happened. IA/IAF/IN got humiliated and the India Tri Services Command knows it. IAF Pilot error was forced by PAF, but what about the command and control error? Why didn't you IAF send a squadron across? Remember the words you wrote above, fright, panic etc, yes that seems to be the atmosphere in IAF command center.

Its just you coming online to pacify yourself by giving different definitions of victor after every couple of sentences. Good that you acknowledged that crossing LOC is suicide, IAF proved you correct by crossing LOC. PAF showed you otherwise.

Yes there was a confrontation, the outcome was Pakistan losing a few trees where as india losing plane, losing helicopter, losing troops, submarine getting detected. India Government has been violent in statements trying to hide the shame of losses, but its not working out that well. Indian media has been instrumental in igniting own people, but whats the use of that. As for invading Pakistan again, the submarine did show reckless action, poor thing got detected. Now being brave and being reckless/irresponsible are two very different things. IAF recklessly killed a few trees and then stupidly crossed LOC, Pakistan reacted responsibly without initiating war, took down Abhinandan and handed him back. Pakistan might not initiate the war, but it can defend itself. PAF has the guts to cross LOC, and it did.

Im surprised to know that you acknowledge that India has been bullied by Pakistan thoroughly many times in the past. Its amazing to know that such a small country has the capacity to strike fear in the heart of its rival. To think that Pakistan has gone on the defensive means that you have fallen into the trap of delusion. Had Pakistan been on the defensive, Pakistan would never have crossed LOC into Indian air space and flew towards Indian Bde HQ, dropped bombs at a safe location without creating collateral loss and exited safely. Its further delusional on your part to think that Pakistan will approach super powers for a ceasefire, i suggest you wake up and look at the inventories of nuclear weapons of both countries which will make a difference always in a war.

Pakistan made the announcement of an incident of intrusion and bombing because it actually happened this time, unlike last time, where a Bollywood stunt of SF Ops took place in dreams of Indian GHQ and was presented as a reality show infront of the world while no way near to the reality. While Indians succumbs to Indian media's rhetoric, Pakistan doesn't mislead and this a prime example of that. Abhinandan made the mistake of his life by crossing LOC and has now paid the price dearly, bringing shame to IAF and India. If getting hit by enemy earns medals, then IAF certainly outshines all air forces.

Since you mentioned that this time Indians actually crossed the LOC, means you also know that the last venture by IA SF was a lie - glad you agreed. PAF showed that intrusion into LOC will create trouble for IAF, so crossing LOC only brought losses for IAF. If Indian military intents to intrude again, it will meet with the same fate: Losses-Prisoners- Deaths. It now seems that Indian Military is willing to sacrifice its personnel and increase losses to gain absolutely nothing except than inflated ego of politicians. The worth of a soldiers life is so measly in Indian Military that Politicians aim to gain from it, then by all means, keep losing the war of attrition through failure in operational planning.

Pakistan is never scared of a full fledged war; if such was a premise then PAF jets wouldn't have crossed into India and Pakistan would have laid low and ignored or covered the incident, infact never accepted that IAF bombed trees inside Pakistan. See, now this is where your delusional thinking has taken you and proved that you are completely illogical. Pakistan knew that by sending Pakistan was taking a risk of a fledged war but the Bully India needed to be taught that you cannot mess with Pakistan. So PAF jets intruded into Indian air space and the rest is history. India and IAF were shocked to the core, they were not anticipating a strike in broad daylight (check out the confidence and courage of PAF aviators) and make it back safely. India could have started a full fledged war on this premise, but wait, India couldn't, guilty as charged. Shocked to the bone, stunned and speechless, Indian Military just watched as its own aircraft and helicopter were shot down. With a 1.1 million standing army, an Airforce and a Navy bigger than its arch rival, India couldn't do anything but stand and watch in awe and disbelief. Slapped on the face by an Air Force much smaller in strength with light and medium aircrafts, all IAF could do was to show wreckage of a missile while claiming to have downed an F-16, which can never be proved.

This is what India media does to minds of Indian military - The military forgets that it has trained personnel and weapons to fight a war. IAF couldnt win a war in the skies so IAF top brass started a war on media hoping to win it, but failing miserably to prove anything, infact becoming a laughing stock of the world by holding the tail of AMRAAM infront of international audience. Somebody needs to tell them that let the Media fight its own war. Commandeering the cameras is not going to win wars for IAF. The pilots have to actually sit in planes and fly them to win war against PAF. The prowess of PAF forced Indian Military to stand infront of Cameras to fight a war with Pakistan and you are shouting "victory" all over your post, really? Victory by standing infront of the cameras, yeah buddy, sure thats the Bollywood style of victory, always infront of Camera, following a script.

Its a dream of India and enemies of Pakistan that the economy of Pakistan drains and it becomes pennyless. How many years has it been since independence ? 72 ? The Pakistan nation has survived its worst. The past 15 years have been the worst, billions and billions of damage, loans, corruption and what not. But Pakistan is still standing strong and it will keep standing strong. The damages have surely taken place but timely investment through Chinese and other nations has not only come but is also coming, its on the way. There are many countries which are willingly showing interest in CPEC and other avenues of investment into Pakistan are opening up. Chinese have been allocated certain zones and they have been allowed businesses in those zones, similarly KSA has been allocated areas of interest for investment. Its an Indian dream that somehow Chinese come and ruin Pakistan completely, unfortunately, that dream of India will never materialize. Indians have hoped on every step that Pakistan dis-integrates into tiny pieces and collapses. Its not just your desire in 2019, many before you have desired the same for Pakistan, but with every passing day Pakistan stands strong, its military flourishes, its revenue grow, its population increases, its production increases, Pakistan brings more countries closer to it and makes new partnerships and builds new relationships. Russia, Turkey, China are few solid examples. Most importantly, two of these countries are super powers.

Its not just today that LOC is witnessing constant firings and use of ammunition. If firing and expending ammunition was becoming so expensive for Pakistan then why doesn't the firing stop, no one waits for the last bullet. India knows that Pakistan's COD's (Central Ordnance Depots) are scattered all over Pakistan; in major cities, in suburban areas, in military cantonment's, inside bomb proof mountains. If 1000 bullets are expended everyday, the next day 10,000 arrive while POF keeps churning them out. Pakistan has devised sniper tactics and GPS guided mortars for accurate use of ammunition, not just to expend it but also to make kills. causalities are occurring on both sides of LOC, Pakistan has increased intake of officers/soldiers and raised new formations to balance the strategic shift. Pakistan has actually defined the warfare policy on LOC by shifting ts strategy to cover ots weak points impeccably and forced Indian Military to dictate to its terms.

The most beautiful and admirable methodology of Pakistan is that whatever India throws at it, Pakistan adapts and not only survives but also progresses.

Your post will only give you temporary relief, a false sense of victory, fallacious excitement, temporary relief from burns and spurious sense of satisfaction, nothing more. Stay delusional and keep yourself in a happy state of mind by watching Indian media and Bollywood - On Ground Reality is something you cannot face !

 

[IceCold]

Pakistanis have been going gaga since the Feb 27th incident. It was not a war, just a confrontation like what happens almost everyday at the border. In a confrontation today you can have an a kill, tomorrow we can have an advantage of destroying a bunker or the kill. You can’t call this a victory. Yes downing the MIG 21 & getting the pilot as POW is a moral victory. But if you look at how you reacted even after capturing our pilot in spite of having an upper hand, will tell who was scared & in panic of fighting & escalating.

Even after his capture the Indian Gov.t had a tough stand threatening & dictating Pak Gov.t & establishment to release him immediately or face consequences & you obliged. Releasing the pilot & so quick showed the fear Pakistan was in & that’s our moral victory. Loss of MIG 21 is not a big deal because it is anyway going to be phased out. We lost a Helicopter due to the confrontation. I can accept that as a loss even though you didn’t shoot it down, it’s due to the confrontation. So that’s an economic loss.

Your so called tough stance for your own populace and Modi's domestic compulsions. Modi had to show something as elections were near. Fact is Pakistan not only came on top on the military front but also on the diplomatic front, a fact even acknowledged by many saner minds in India that Pakistan has diplomatically outpaced India after many years.

The facts is Abhinandan or our MIG 21 crossing over changed the course & the fate of Pakistan. Whether he got over excited to venture into the enemy territory or it was our communication flaws is another debate. But it happened on that day, so luck was on your side on that day. Had he not crossed the LOC on that day, the outcome & losses for Pakistan would have been far far greater. It was our bad luck.

Again! a misplace conception which is far from reality. For Pakistan it has changed nothing. Whatever the escalation ladder India was going to climb, Pakistan was equally willing to respond. As for luck There is no luck when you are engaging in aerial fights, its skills and tactics where we outsmarted and outgunned you. Admit it.

If we had a confrontation with full fleet with exchange of missiles & dog fights between our jets & if you downed our jets - Yes you can call it a victory partially. A full victory is when the enemy surrenders or when your purpose of war is met.. But here we didn’t send even one squadron across, so it was the error of the pilot, where it’s bound to happen. What would happen to a Pakistani jet if it crossed into LOC when you are waiting with your full force other side. It’s a suicide. It’s just Pakistanis trying to pacify each other claiming this a victory, which they have never tasted ever & never will.

Your fleet was already up from the mighty Sukhois to the Mirages and Migs. That is pretty much everything you got. On the other side the JF-17s, the mirages and F-16s were up, pretty much everything we have got minus the F-7PGs. So yeah it was a victory alright. What would have happened or could have happened does not matter here, what really matters is what happened that day and it was PAF bombing you in broad day light and shooting Indian jets like flies from the sky. Slowly but steadly your attrition are coming to light with so called accidents with staged pieces. And by the way our jets too violate your airspace as well. A simple google search would tell you.

In any confrontation where there is ceasefire & no decisive victory, what you look at is the impact of the confrontation. What’s the outcome.

Has India panicked after the war? No. If we have got scared then we will be defensive in our statements & speeches. Has it happened. Will India fear to invade or attack Pakistan again. Do you think it won’t happen again?

India panicked or not, but Modi certainly did. His statement about having Rafales, results would had been different should tell you a thing or two, but only if you are listening.

Pakistan started all previous wars. Does Pakistan today have the will & guts to start a war with India. No – So your posture now will always be we don’t want war, we are peace lovers, because your Gov.t & establishment knows they cannot win any war with India anymore.

Its debatable who started what? And why would Pakistan want to start a war with India when our agenda is to fix our economy. The calls from wars are always coming from across the border.

All the previous wars it was Pakistan who was bullying India & imposing casualties & fear, but now it’s India who will impose the same. Pakistan has no choice but to be defensive, because before you used to bully India, volley threats, promote terror or start a war at will as you had a choice run to the international community for ceasefire when you near defeat. India was scared of western isolation & sanctions along with the Chinese threat before, but now India doesn’t fear the west, international community or Chinese.

If Pakistan was the one imposing causalities and bullying, than it would had been India losing a part and not Pakistan. The facts prove otherwise who's bullying whom since our inception. India has always been the darling of the west, when you detonated nuclear weapons, the west was simply issuing statements of condemnation and we waited to see the response of the so called west and it was pathetic and when Pakistan responded all hell break lose and we were sanctioned. So please if anyone who has always been vary of the west is Pakistan. We did not even get the F-16s we paid for resulting in PAF staying out even during the peak of Kargil war.

The biggest victory for India was Pakistani establishment announcing on media, India crossed the international boundary & went back without any response or confrontation. But after the announcement they had to prove to their people they are not cowards, so they brought a full fleet & dropped a bomb in open field just across the LOC. But to Pakistan’s surprise India responded to their attempt to cross LOC immediately. Abhinandan crossed the LOC with an outdated jet. That was your luck

If that is victory for you, what can i say but without any response, are you really that blinded by patriotism that you still failed to see what India lost in all of this? First of all India became the laughing stock of the world when it claimed that 300 + people were killed when it had nothing to show for and the satellites and reporters from independent news agencies visited the area busting your lies. Than came the invincibility of your Sukhois, and i remember how Indians use to say good luck fighting MKI and Mirage 2000 and Migs with those JF-17s and handful of F-16s. Guess what we are the ones having the last laugh after your super duper jets were shot down and your PM and Airchief openly admitting the defeat saying if and buts just like you are. There are no if or buts.

Now coming to the result of this confrontation for Pakistan

Last time the surgical strikes was in LOC, so you could get away by rejecting we didn’t enter the territory. But this time we crossed international boundary, just to prove a point to see if you can reject it. If you don’t announce it, you are putting yourself to risk for future similar incursions freely by India. You had to no choice but to announce it immediately. So this “Indians are cowards” manjan won’t sell anymore with your public. Victory for India.

If someone starts jumping up and down like a clown claiming, the onus of proof also lies upon him and when they have nothing to show for it, they become the laughing stock of the world. Pakistan on its part made the reporters, UN watchdogs visit the area and see for themselves about who's lying. Keep repeating a lie will not make it a truth, specially in today's age. You can say we shot down F-16 showing your own Mig engine, that is on you, the world knows otherwise and laughed at your foolish claims that even Indian administration started to back out. Remember the statement "We did not violated Pakistani airspace? by Indian minister" Lol

Pakistan was scared to escalate to a full fledged war. Victory for India

Another self praising assumption or should i say delusion. Had Pakistan been scared, we would never have dropped bombs on your territory. The fact that Pakistan responded means we were not afraid to escalate should India chose. In anyone it was India who backed out after getting a good thrashing. Otherwise we would had seen that missile strike of yours that India was planning and only backed out after getting a reality check from your friends that Pakistan will again respond and with twice the force.

After this bold move, Pakistan in future will be scared to do any Mumbai kind of cowardly attack. India has no more worry or fear for such attacks. Our radars, coast guards, BSF & intelligence was always in extreme pressure to be vigilant, not to miss out on any ploy plotted from across the border. So now it’s an advantage for India, if Pakistan does any such kind of attack, we have the reason & license to invade & attack Pakistan.

This was said even after the first surgical strike, we have teach Pakistan a lesson. Than why blamed Pakistan for another attack? So either you were lying then about teaching Pakistan a lesson because Pakistan as per India was behind another attack which was the biggest in India's history killing 40 or you are lying now accusing Pakistan of Pulwama because Pakistan would not have dared to attack after the first surgical strike. Take your pick. In either case you are the liar.

So the Mullah’s like Hafeez Saeed, Mullah Omar, Syed Salahuddin will become irrelevant. They won’t be able to plan or execute any terror attack in future. We have given an extra head ache for your Govt & establishment to monitor your own terrorists they don’t plot any attack on India as we will be waiting for such a mistake to be committed by Pakistan. The fear has reversed now for Pakistani people & establishment. Victory for India.

Mullah Omar is long dead. You cant even differentiate between people you want to accuse, shows how much desperation you lot are in.

Pakistan is talking claiming there can be another attack before election. This thread itself for eg; is the result of the fear. We have put you on back foot & continuous vigil & agony. This fear will continue even after election. Victory for India

We know that the whole election campaign in India is run on who barks more against Pakistan, no need to show any work done or improvements or the lack of toilets. So yeah the chances of attack are there and Pakistan has again outplayed India on this, by conveying this to the entire world that India is bringing the whole region to brink of war for petty election gains.

We are making you spend on troop deployment, arms & equipment draining your reserves, which is what India wants. India can afford escalation not Pakistan. As long as cost of Military expenditure, LOC clashes increase, it will keep eating into your developmental funds, pushing your economy lower & lower. Victory for India

Here comes the spending part. All this time i was hearing about how our meager 7 billion dollars of reserves will be drained blah blah blah. Guess what they are rising. So while Indians live in la la land, a google search would had given you the correct picture before repeating this nonsense.

We are pushing you more & more into Chinese dependence, as a full fledged war means elimination of Pakistan. You would need China for counter weapons, intelligence & satellite data, for which they will ask you to give access to your territory & other economic benefits. You will slowly lose all your voice, freedom to take decisions & most importantly the power with China. You won’t be able to enforce your laws & decisions on your own land. There will be a day soon where your Gov.t & Military will take full orders making you a bonded labor & thorough slave of China. Victory for India.

Is that the reason we had Malaysian Premier visiting Pakistan as guest of honor on 23rd march, or Saudi Arabia becoming part of CPEC. Lol so much for us becoming Chinese colony.

As long as these above atmosphere prevails, there will be no development & businesses taken over by China one by one. Local businesses are further going to perish gravely affecting cost of living, increasing unemployment, trade deficit & debts. This is the perfect ingredient for instability, collapse of government & political turmoil. This will increase your crime rate, political, regional & ethnic clashes eventually leading to economic collapse & breakup of the country.

Something every Indian ejaculates too. Break up of Pakistan. Reality check Pakistan is becoming far more peaceful and as a result tourism, sports returning to Pakistan.

You can see it in your increase in costs for necessities, Rupee struggling to even hold at one level, forget strengthening. Except for loans you have not got any investments so far. Everything is big talks & claims, nothing in reality. So as debts & deficits start putting pressure, your Rupee is further going to tumble leading to hyperinflation & increase in further cost of basic necessities.

Instead of circling around like a headless chicken, remain focused on the core of your argument. Rupee had to be declined and that was happening way before Pulwama or Indian drama. The rate had to be adjusted to make our exports cheaper. Guess what today the trade deficit has been reduced by 5%.

Such threads & discussions will give you short term happiness & verbal victory. Your real victory will only be after you decide to surrender to India & accept all its terms. You will able to grow like BD. If not distance will grow not only with India but with Afghanistan, Iran, Israel & others.

Ever thought about your own post and what was it all about? Self praise and delusions. The fact that you mentioned Afghanistan in your post suggests how ill informed you are about the world. As for surrendering to India, a huge middle finger is waiting for you.

And my common sense says, there won’t be any attack or incursions before election or near future at least for a year or two. But yes our soldiers at the border are starving, scared & cowards, so the LOC will remain hot with sniping, shelling & violations continuously as Indians are scared of dying.

There was no common sense in your whole post, filled with empty rhetoric and pity delusions.

 

[Aasimkhan]

Ok and why Allah will only be with you and not with 300 million Indian Muslims, even if forget that there are other 1000s of Gods in India to support, Hindus, Jains, Buddhists, Sikhs and 100s of other religions.

Being born on certain piece of land or being born in certain family doesnt bring you any closer to divine. Its your deeds that makes difference.

Good to have FAITH in HIM, and HE doenst let anyone down, its your deeds that let you down. HE is same for all, you get what you deserve based on your deeds.

Some of the Indian Muslims may be good muslims and good humans too (and they will be rewarded for their deeds on individual level) but in the broader picture they are nothing more than a cannon fodder like all other indians. As a nation only Pakistan is destined to rise, rest all nations will eat the dust. Indian Muslims have zero achievement in last 70 years unfortunately whereas on this side of the border Pakistan has come up as the most powerful military Muslim Ummah ever had, so lot many good things to come for Pakistan.

 

[The Deterrent]

Ministry of Defence
01-April, 2019 14:21 IST
Visit of Chief of the Army Staff to USA

General Bipin Rawat, Chief of the Army Staff is scheduled to visit United States of America from 02 April to 05 April 2019 on an official visit. During the visit, General Bipin Rawat led delegation will interact with senior military hierarchy of the US Armed Forces with an aim to take forward the military to military cooperation. The Army Chief will also visit the US Military Academy at West Point and the Command and General Staff College at Fort Leavenworth, Kansas.

General Bipin Rawat shall interact with General Joseph F Dunford, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and General Mark A Milley, Chief of Staff of the US Army to discuss military cooperation issues of mutual interest. General Bipin Rawat is also an alumnus of Command and Staff College, Fort Leavenworth. The visit to US aims to give impetus to the military ties and enhance strategic engagements. The functional experience gained during the visit shall further enhance Indo-US relationship.

http://pib.nic.in/newsite/pmreleases.aspx?mincode=33

 

[Viny]

Some of the Indian Muslims may be good muslims and good humans too (and they will be rewarded for their deeds on individual level) but in the broader picture they are nothing more than a cannon fodder like all other indians.

Last we knew was that some drones cannons were having some fodders in a very pious land.

As a nation only Pakistan is destined to rise, rest all nations will eat the dust.

No Americans, no Germans, no whites, no blacks...damm not even Arab Muslims
Ok in which parallel universe and in which era?
Dont worry if you dont have the answer at this point of time, feel free to consult the moulvi at your madrasa.

Indian Muslims have zero achievement in last 70 years

Can you find a single person who can match the following at global level

1. APJ Abdul Kalam
2. Azimji Premji
3. Yusuf Ahmed
4. A R Rehman
5. Sharukh Khan

unfortunately whereas on this side of the border Pakistan has come up as the most powerful military Muslim Ummah ever had, so lot many good things to come for Pakistan.

I hope this helps
https://www.globalfirepower.com/countries-listing.asp

 

[Reichsmarschall]

3. Yusuf Ahmed
4. A R Rehman
5. Sharukh Khan

they are traitors and are told to relocate to Pakistan on daily basis

 

[Aasimkhan]

IF Shimla is dead, that does not restore any earlier conditions that were neutralised by Shimla; those remain neutralised.

In effect, we have now a very fluid situation that is not in the interest of anybody. And it is one directly sought for by one state by mounting a series of provocations over a cumulative period of 48 years.

Anybody's patience may be strained; it was unwise of successive generations of provocateurs to lose track of what the effect of their predecessors was, and not to factor that into their own calculations.

The present situation is clear: thanks to offering these latest provocations at a time when an insecure megalomaniac's entire political situation was under threat, the Pakistani establishment has made a spectacular miscalculation that its fanboi squads' yelping cannot cover. It has created a new, higher threshold of non-nuclear response; no longer is the Indian state inclined to that degree of strategic restraint that its wiser, more mature earlier leadership had exercised, it is today finding to its surprise that crossing the LOC is an option, as it wasn't during Kargil; that locking on to PAF units is an option, as it was earlier, but that now, releasing a lethal missile in air-to-air combat is an option, as it wasn't during Kargil; that bombing locations within 'legitimised' Pakistan is an option, that was ruled out after 26/11 at Mumbai; that mobilising the Air Force does not lead to anything further than a counter by the opposed Air Force, a possibility that was never completely accepted to the political leadership that wished to skirt a nuclear confrontation by far more than the margins allowed by the current leadership.

The loser is Pakistan. As @sheena 1980 has pointed out in a very emotional post, a series of encounters cannot work in favour of Pakistan, the PAF, the PA or the PN, for reasons that need no elaboration.

@Cobra Arbok made a good point about the pollution of the Indian defence procurement process, a point buttressed by the thoughtful observations of @The Deterrent somewhere else; it is worth remembering by those Pakistanis who retain their sanity and balance that these defects can be cured in a democracy, where nothing, finally, is hidden. The curing may be painful and humiliating, and expensive, and may cost a million lives lost to slow starvation and the ravages of hunger, but what will confront Pakistan is not the starved women and children, but the strengthened and reinforced machinery to grind down the opposition.



As Akbar pointed out once, Allah seems to have sided India on each and every occasion.

The restraint hasn't been removed on indian side only. It has been removed for Pakistan as well. Pakistan was always within range of indian air craft but now with longer range missiles bulk of indian air space will be target, it's a sword which cuts both ways

Last we knew was that some drones cannons were having some fodders in a very pious land.


No Americans, no Germans, no whites, no blacks...damm not even Arab Muslims
Ok in which parallel universe and in which era?
Dont worry if you dont have the answer at this point of time, feel free to consult the moulvi at your madrasa.



Can you find a single person who can match the following at global level

1. APJ Abdul Kalam
2. Azimji Premji
3. Yusuf Ahmed
4. A R Rehman
5. Sharukh Khan



View attachment 550713

I hope this helps
https://www.globalfirepower.com/countries-listing.asp

U keep looking at this table to make a fool of yourself, I will look at the results of 27 feb 2019. PAF just proved this chart wrong

Last we knew was that some drones cannons were having some fodders in a very pious land.


No Americans, no Germans, no whites, no blacks...damm not even Arab Muslims
Ok in which parallel universe and in which era?
Dont worry if you dont have the answer at this point of time, feel free to consult the moulvi at your madrasa.



Can you find a single person who can match the following at global level

1. APJ Abdul Kalam
2. Azimji Premji
3. Yusuf Ahmed
4. A R Rehman
5. Sharukh Khan



View attachment 550713

I hope this helps
https://www.globalfirepower.com/countries-listing.asp

Don't run to your dad USA about drones. Talk about your flying coffins, as for USA we r gonna sort them out and Israel also your other father

I don't prefer confrontations, but this is the most delusional post i have seen in 2019.

Pakistan has not really been going "Gaga", not the Government or the Military at least. The Government is handling its affairs where as the Military has geared up already for a possible Indian strike or retaliation, probably a sucker punch. Do you know why its just a confrontation and not a war ? Because Pakistan kept it that way responsibly. had Pakistan wanted, it would have been an all out war. The irresponsible behavior of India was an all intent to not just escalate but push Pakistan into a trap of an all out war and then decimate it conventionally since Pakistan is getting stronger with every passing day. If India claims of a kill on Pakistani soldier, Pakistan also retaliates and makes a kill. Its a tit for tat but even after igniting the LOC and killing civilians, India is not succeeding in weakening Pakistan. I can sense the stench of a burn in your words, in your sentences, the way you portrayed your thoughts. Its alright Mate, Pakistan is not Palestine and India is no Israel. You are under no capacity to point out whether there is a victory or not, whether its a moral victory or not. Let me assure you that scared, panicked and frightened nations behave in a very different way than how Pakistan reacted. Its your own blindness that you see a gesture of good will of returning a POW as an act of fright. Maybe that's your take of fear, in Pakistan we call it kindness and act of friendship.


Its ironic that India's tough stand, threatening and dictating Pakistan only bore fruit in securing an immediate release of pilot who Pakistan treated as a guest and respectfully from Day One; not the release of spy Yadav, not the shut down of so called alleged launching pads, not the closure of river and seas shared by both countries etc. So according to you Pakistan became intimidated and then obliged on releasing the pilot. Maybe you should step down from cloud number nine and wake up. The pilot was handed back as Pakistan didn't want to escalate the conflict but end it, however, delusional as Indian war mongering is, a good gesture was taken by India as a slap on the face by Pakistan. Sorry to disappoint you, but yes Pakistan behaved smartly and showed that it has a bigger heart than India could ever have. India wanted war and got a kind gesture in return, the world acknowledged it, i won't bother to copy paste links, do go through neutral media and news channels.

If you visit Pakistan and introduce yourself as an Indian, you will experience it too. Not just a cup of tea and free passage home, but also free stay and free food, not by the Military but a common Pakistani, we as a nation are that hospitable. Why don't you come and find out before you allege us of cowardice.

India lost a helicopter, an economic loss ? Pity, you calculate the lost lives of your soldiers as an economic loss. For me, its a tragic loss of life, getting shot down by your forces is also showing incompetence of the highest level. May i remind you that the words you used for Pakistan wrongly before, like scared, fright etc can be fitted correctly here, Panic is the correct one. Shooting down own plane in Panic, its a loss after all.

As for the Mig-21, I can imagine why its easy for you say its not a big deal. Flying coffins fall everyday in India right ? No big deal, truly ! This one fell inside Pakistan, why bother. Indian Mig-21's are allowed to fall here and there, that's why IAF flies them. A jet in the process of being phased out, armed with best missile and electronics, once touted to be be better than PAF F-16's... is sent to take on adversary aircraft and the loss is accepted as phasing out strategy, truly amazing, anyways moving ahead.

The poor guy Abhinandan had no idea what he was doing or what was going to happen to him on that fateful day, but it did change the course of the situation and made IAF a laughing stock in front of the whole world. It forced Indian Navy into action which was humiliated just like IAF and its sub was sent back scurrying back to India. So its a series of humiliating events, the Indian Army was getting thrashed on LOC all year long, IAF released payload on trees and backed off avoiding actual combat, when the actual combat was enforced on them by PAF, then the IAF pilot got shot down,in panic IA/IAF shot down own helicopter, then the IN sub was detected and told to go back. If indeed there was a military tri-services mocku-mentary to be made, the premise has been written by IA/IAF/IN together.

Are you really trying that hard to define victory again ? if this happened, If that happened. Get real Mate, what has happened as happened. IA/IAF/IN got humiliated and the India Tri Services Command knows it. IAF Pilot error was forced by PAF, but what about the command and control error? Why didn't you IAF send a squadron across? Remember the words you wrote above, fright, panic etc, yes that seems to be the atmosphere in IAF command center.

Its just you coming online to pacify yourself by giving different definitions of victor after every couple of sentences. Good that you acknowledged that crossing LOC is suicide, IAF proved you correct by crossing LOC. PAF showed you otherwise.

Yes there was a confrontation, the outcome was Pakistan losing a few trees where as india losing plane, losing helicopter, losing troops, submarine getting detected. India Government has been violent in statements trying to hide the shame of losses, but its not working out that well. Indian media has been instrumental in igniting own people, but whats the use of that. As for invading Pakistan again, the submarine did show reckless action, poor thing got detected. Now being brave and being reckless/irresponsible are two very different things. IAF recklessly killed a few trees and then stupidly crossed LOC, Pakistan reacted responsibly without initiating war, took down Abhinandan and handed him back. Pakistan might not initiate the war, but it can defend itself. PAF has the guts to cross LOC, and it did.

Im surprised to know that you acknowledge that India has been bullied by Pakistan thoroughly many times in the past. Its amazing to know that such a small country has the capacity to strike fear in the heart of its rival. To think that Pakistan has gone on the defensive means that you have fallen into the trap of delusion. Had Pakistan been on the defensive, Pakistan would never have crossed LOC into Indian air space and flew towards Indian Bde HQ, dropped bombs at a safe location without creating collateral loss and exited safely. Its further delusional on your part to think that Pakistan will approach super powers for a ceasefire, i suggest you wake up and look at the inventories of nuclear weapons of both countries which will make a difference always in a war.

Pakistan made the announcement of an incident of intrusion and bombing because it actually happened this time, unlike last time, where a Bollywood stunt of SF Ops took place in dreams of Indian GHQ and was presented as a reality show infront of the world while no way near to the reality. While Indians succumbs to Indian media's rhetoric, Pakistan doesn't mislead and this a prime example of that. Abhinandan made the mistake of his life by crossing LOC and has now paid the price dearly, bringing shame to IAF and India. If getting hit by enemy earns medals, then IAF certainly outshines all air forces.

Since you mentioned that this time Indians actually crossed the LOC, means you also know that the last venture by IA SF was a lie - glad you agreed. PAF showed that intrusion into LOC will create trouble for IAF, so crossing LOC only brought losses for IAF. If Indian military intents to intrude again, it will meet with the same fate: Losses-Prisoners- Deaths. It now seems that Indian Military is willing to sacrifice its personnel and increase losses to gain absolutely nothing except than inflated ego of politicians. The worth of a soldiers life is so measly in Indian Military that Politicians aim to gain from it, then by all means, keep losing the war of attrition through failure in operational planning.

Pakistan is never scared of a full fledged war; if such was a premise then PAF jets wouldn't have crossed into India and Pakistan would have laid low and ignored or covered the incident, infact never accepted that IAF bombed trees inside Pakistan. See, now this is where your delusional thinking has taken you and proved that you are completely illogical. Pakistan knew that by sending Pakistan was taking a risk of a fledged war but the Bully India needed to be taught that you cannot mess with Pakistan. So PAF jets intruded into Indian air space and the rest is history. India and IAF were shocked to the core, they were not anticipating a strike in broad daylight (check out the confidence and courage of PAF aviators) and make it back safely. India could have started a full fledged war on this premise, but wait, India couldn't, guilty as charged. Shocked to the bone, stunned and speechless, Indian Military just watched as its own aircraft and helicopter were shot down. With a 1.1 million standing army, an Airforce and a Navy bigger than its arch rival, India couldn't do anything but stand and watch in awe and disbelief. Slapped on the face by an Air Force much smaller in strength with light and medium aircrafts, all IAF could do was to show wreckage of a missile while claiming to have downed an F-16, which can never be proved.

This is what India media does to minds of Indian military - The military forgets that it has trained personnel and weapons to fight a war. IAF couldnt win a war in the skies so IAF top brass started a war on media hoping to win it, but failing miserably to prove anything, infact becoming a laughing stock of the world by holding the tail of AMRAAM infront of international audience. Somebody needs to tell them that let the Media fight its own war. Commandeering the cameras is not going to win wars for IAF. The pilots have to actually sit in planes and fly them to win war against PAF. The prowess of PAF forced Indian Military to stand infront of Cameras to fight a war with Pakistan and you are shouting "victory" all over your post, really? Victory by standing infront of the cameras, yeah buddy, sure thats the Bollywood style of victory, always infront of Camera, following a script.

Its a dream of India and enemies of Pakistan that the economy of Pakistan drains and it becomes pennyless. How many years has it been since independence ? 72 ? The Pakistan nation has survived its worst. The past 15 years have been the worst, billions and billions of damage, loans, corruption and what not. But Pakistan is still standing strong and it will keep standing strong. The damages have surely taken place but timely investment through Chinese and other nations has not only come but is also coming, its on the way. There are many countries which are willingly showing interest in CPEC and other avenues of investment into Pakistan are opening up. Chinese have been allocated certain zones and they have been allowed businesses in those zones, similarly KSA has been allocated areas of interest for investment. Its an Indian dream that somehow Chinese come and ruin Pakistan completely, unfortunately, that dream of India will never materialize. Indians have hoped on every step that Pakistan dis-integrates into tiny pieces and collapses. Its not just your desire in 2019, many before you have desired the same for Pakistan, but with every passing day Pakistan stands strong, its military flourishes, its revenue grow, its population increases, its production increases, Pakistan brings more countries closer to it and makes new partnerships and builds new relationships. Russia, Turkey, China are few solid examples. Most importantly, two of these countries are super powers.

Its not just today that LOC is witnessing constant firings and use of ammunition. If firing and expending ammunition was becoming so expensive for Pakistan then why doesn't the firing stop, no one waits for the last bullet. India knows that Pakistan's COD's (Central Ordnance Depots) are scattered all over Pakistan; in major cities, in suburban areas, in military cantonment's, inside bomb proof mountains. If 1000 bullets are expended everyday, the next day 10,000 arrive while POF keeps churning them out. Pakistan has devised sniper tactics and GPS guided mortars for accurate use of ammunition, not just to expend it but also to make kills. causalities are occurring on both sides of LOC, Pakistan has increased intake of officers/soldiers and raised new formations to balance the strategic shift. Pakistan has actually defined the warfare policy on LOC by shifting ts strategy to cover ots weak points impeccably and forced Indian Military to dictate to its terms.

The most beautiful and admirable methodology of Pakistan is that whatever India throws at it, Pakistan adapts and not only survives but also progresses.

Your post will only give you temporary relief, a false sense of victory, fallacious excitement, temporary relief from burns and spurious sense of satisfaction, nothing more. Stay delusional and keep yourself in a happy state of mind by watching Indian media and Bollywood - On Ground Reality is something you cannot face !

Moody came to power thumping a 56 inch chest and is now running around with a 56 inch hole in his rear made by God knows sd10 or amraam

 

[ProudPak]

I don't prefer confrontations, but this is the most delusional post i have seen in 2019.

Pakistan has not really been going "Gaga", not the Government or the Military at least. The Government is handling its affairs where as the Military has geared up already for a possible Indian strike or retaliation, probably a sucker punch. Do you know why its just a confrontation and not a war ? Because Pakistan kept it that way responsibly. had Pakistan wanted, it would have been an all out war. The irresponsible behavior of India was an all intent to not just escalate but push Pakistan into a trap of an all out war and then decimate it conventionally since Pakistan is getting stronger with every passing day. If India claims of a kill on Pakistani soldier, Pakistan also retaliates and makes a kill. Its a tit for tat but even after igniting the LOC and killing civilians, India is not succeeding in weakening Pakistan. I can sense the stench of a burn in your words, in your sentences, the way you portrayed your thoughts. Its alright Mate, Pakistan is not Palestine and India is no Israel. You are under no capacity to point out whether there is a victory or not, whether its a moral victory or not. Let me assure you that scared, panicked and frightened nations behave in a very different way than how Pakistan reacted. Its your own blindness that you see a gesture of good will of returning a POW as an act of fright. Maybe that's your take of fear, in Pakistan we call it kindness and act of friendship.


Its ironic that India's tough stand, threatening and dictating Pakistan only bore fruit in securing an immediate release of pilot who Pakistan treated as a guest and respectfully from Day One; not the release of spy Yadav, not the shut down of so called alleged launching pads, not the closure of river and seas shared by both countries etc. So according to you Pakistan became intimidated and then obliged on releasing the pilot. Maybe you should step down from cloud number nine and wake up. The pilot was handed back as Pakistan didn't want to escalate the conflict but end it, however, delusional as Indian war mongering is, a good gesture was taken by India as a slap on the face by Pakistan. Sorry to disappoint you, but yes Pakistan behaved smartly and showed that it has a bigger heart than India could ever have. India wanted war and got a kind gesture in return, the world acknowledged it, i won't bother to copy paste links, do go through neutral media and news channels.

If you visit Pakistan and introduce yourself as an Indian, you will experience it too. Not just a cup of tea and free passage home, but also free stay and free food, not by the Military but a common Pakistani, we as a nation are that hospitable. Why don't you come and find out before you allege us of cowardice.

India lost a helicopter, an economic loss ? Pity, you calculate the lost lives of your soldiers as an economic loss. For me, its a tragic loss of life, getting shot down by your forces is also showing incompetence of the highest level. May i remind you that the words you used for Pakistan wrongly before, like scared, fright etc can be fitted correctly here, Panic is the correct one. Shooting down own plane in Panic, its a loss after all.

As for the Mig-21, I can imagine why its easy for you say its not a big deal. Flying coffins fall everyday in India right ? No big deal, truly ! This one fell inside Pakistan, why bother. Indian Mig-21's are allowed to fall here and there, that's why IAF flies them. A jet in the process of being phased out, armed with best missile and electronics, once touted to be be better than PAF F-16's... is sent to take on adversary aircraft and the loss is accepted as phasing out strategy, truly amazing, anyways moving ahead.

The poor guy Abhinandan had no idea what he was doing or what was going to happen to him on that fateful day, but it did change the course of the situation and made IAF a laughing stock in front of the whole world. It forced Indian Navy into action which was humiliated just like IAF and its sub was sent back scurrying back to India. So its a series of humiliating events, the Indian Army was getting thrashed on LOC all year long, IAF released payload on trees and backed off avoiding actual combat, when the actual combat was enforced on them by PAF, then the IAF pilot got shot down,in panic IA/IAF shot down own helicopter, then the IN sub was detected and told to go back. If indeed there was a military tri-services mocku-mentary to be made, the premise has been written by IA/IAF/IN together.

Are you really trying that hard to define victory again ? if this happened, If that happened. Get real Mate, what has happened as happened. IA/IAF/IN got humiliated and the India Tri Services Command knows it. IAF Pilot error was forced by PAF, but what about the command and control error? Why didn't you IAF send a squadron across? Remember the words you wrote above, fright, panic etc, yes that seems to be the atmosphere in IAF command center.

Its just you coming online to pacify yourself by giving different definitions of victor after every couple of sentences. Good that you acknowledged that crossing LOC is suicide, IAF proved you correct by crossing LOC. PAF showed you otherwise.

Yes there was a confrontation, the outcome was Pakistan losing a few trees where as india losing plane, losing helicopter, losing troops, submarine getting detected. India Government has been violent in statements trying to hide the shame of losses, but its not working out that well. Indian media has been instrumental in igniting own people, but whats the use of that. As for invading Pakistan again, the submarine did show reckless action, poor thing got detected. Now being brave and being reckless/irresponsible are two very different things. IAF recklessly killed a few trees and then stupidly crossed LOC, Pakistan reacted responsibly without initiating war, took down Abhinandan and handed him back. Pakistan might not initiate the war, but it can defend itself. PAF has the guts to cross LOC, and it did.

Im surprised to know that you acknowledge that India has been bullied by Pakistan thoroughly many times in the past. Its amazing to know that such a small country has the capacity to strike fear in the heart of its rival. To think that Pakistan has gone on the defensive means that you have fallen into the trap of delusion. Had Pakistan been on the defensive, Pakistan would never have crossed LOC into Indian air space and flew towards Indian Bde HQ, dropped bombs at a safe location without creating collateral loss and exited safely. Its further delusional on your part to think that Pakistan will approach super powers for a ceasefire, i suggest you wake up and look at the inventories of nuclear weapons of both countries which will make a difference always in a war.

Pakistan made the announcement of an incident of intrusion and bombing because it actually happened this time, unlike last time, where a Bollywood stunt of SF Ops took place in dreams of Indian GHQ and was presented as a reality show infront of the world while no way near to the reality. While Indians succumbs to Indian media's rhetoric, Pakistan doesn't mislead and this a prime example of that. Abhinandan made the mistake of his life by crossing LOC and has now paid the price dearly, bringing shame to IAF and India. If getting hit by enemy earns medals, then IAF certainly outshines all air forces.

Since you mentioned that this time Indians actually crossed the LOC, means you also know that the last venture by IA SF was a lie - glad you agreed. PAF showed that intrusion into LOC will create trouble for IAF, so crossing LOC only brought losses for IAF. If Indian military intents to intrude again, it will meet with the same fate: Losses-Prisoners- Deaths. It now seems that Indian Military is willing to sacrifice its personnel and increase losses to gain absolutely nothing except than inflated ego of politicians. The worth of a soldiers life is so measly in Indian Military that Politicians aim to gain from it, then by all means, keep losing the war of attrition through failure in operational planning.

Pakistan is never scared of a full fledged war; if such was a premise then PAF jets wouldn't have crossed into India and Pakistan would have laid low and ignored or covered the incident, infact never accepted that IAF bombed trees inside Pakistan. See, now this is where your delusional thinking has taken you and proved that you are completely illogical. Pakistan knew that by sending Pakistan was taking a risk of a fledged war but the Bully India needed to be taught that you cannot mess with Pakistan. So PAF jets intruded into Indian air space and the rest is history. India and IAF were shocked to the core, they were not anticipating a strike in broad daylight (check out the confidence and courage of PAF aviators) and make it back safely. India could have started a full fledged war on this premise, but wait, India couldn't, guilty as charged. Shocked to the bone, stunned and speechless, Indian Military just watched as its own aircraft and helicopter were shot down. With a 1.1 million standing army, an Airforce and a Navy bigger than its arch rival, India couldn't do anything but stand and watch in awe and disbelief. Slapped on the face by an Air Force much smaller in strength with light and medium aircrafts, all IAF could do was to show wreckage of a missile while claiming to have downed an F-16, which can never be proved.

This is what India media does to minds of Indian military - The military forgets that it has trained personnel and weapons to fight a war. IAF couldnt win a war in the skies so IAF top brass started a war on media hoping to win it, but failing miserably to prove anything, infact becoming a laughing stock of the world by holding the tail of AMRAAM infront of international audience. Somebody needs to tell them that let the Media fight its own war. Commandeering the cameras is not going to win wars for IAF. The pilots have to actually sit in planes and fly them to win war against PAF. The prowess of PAF forced Indian Military to stand infront of Cameras to fight a war with Pakistan and you are shouting "victory" all over your post, really? Victory by standing infront of the cameras, yeah buddy, sure thats the Bollywood style of victory, always infront of Camera, following a script.

Its a dream of India and enemies of Pakistan that the economy of Pakistan drains and it becomes pennyless. How many years has it been since independence ? 72 ? The Pakistan nation has survived its worst. The past 15 years have been the worst, billions and billions of damage, loans, corruption and what not. But Pakistan is still standing strong and it will keep standing strong. The damages have surely taken place but timely investment through Chinese and other nations has not only come but is also coming, its on the way. There are many countries which are willingly showing interest in CPEC and other avenues of investment into Pakistan are opening up. Chinese have been allocated certain zones and they have been allowed businesses in those zones, similarly KSA has been allocated areas of interest for investment. Its an Indian dream that somehow Chinese come and ruin Pakistan completely, unfortunately, that dream of India will never materialize. Indians have hoped on every step that Pakistan dis-integrates into tiny pieces and collapses. Its not just your desire in 2019, many before you have desired the same for Pakistan, but with every passing day Pakistan stands strong, its military flourishes, its revenue grow, its population increases, its production increases, Pakistan brings more countries closer to it and makes new partnerships and builds new relationships. Russia, Turkey, China are few solid examples. Most importantly, two of these countries are super powers.

Its not just today that LOC is witnessing constant firings and use of ammunition. If firing and expending ammunition was becoming so expensive for Pakistan then why doesn't the firing stop, no one waits for the last bullet. India knows that Pakistan's COD's (Central Ordnance Depots) are scattered all over Pakistan; in major cities, in suburban areas, in military cantonment's, inside bomb proof mountains. If 1000 bullets are expended everyday, the next day 10,000 arrive while POF keeps churning them out. Pakistan has devised sniper tactics and GPS guided mortars for accurate use of ammunition, not just to expend it but also to make kills. causalities are occurring on both sides of LOC, Pakistan has increased intake of officers/soldiers and raised new formations to balance the strategic shift. Pakistan has actually defined the warfare policy on LOC by shifting ts strategy to cover ots weak points impeccably and forced Indian Military to dictate to its terms.

The most beautiful and admirable methodology of Pakistan is that whatever India throws at it, Pakistan adapts and not only survives but also progresses.

Your post will only give you temporary relief, a false sense of victory, fallacious excitement, temporary relief from burns and spurious sense of satisfaction, nothing more. Stay delusional and keep yourself in a happy state of mind by watching Indian media and Bollywood - On Ground Reality is something you cannot face !

Welldone. There are some who think all out war is good but sit at home just talking. And some are in foreign lands telling us what to do when they dont even have the guts to live in their land of origin.
Proud of you

 

[notorious_eagle]

The present situation is clear: thanks to offering these latest provocations at a time when an insecure megalomaniac's entire political situation was under threat, the Pakistani establishment has made a spectacular miscalculation that its fanboi squads' yelping cannot cover. It has created a new, higher threshold of non-nuclear response; no longer is the Indian state inclined to that degree of strategic restraint that its wiser, more mature earlier leadership had exercised, it is today finding to its surprise that crossing the LOC is an option, as it wasn't during Kargil; that locking on to PAF units is an option, as it was earlier, but that now, releasing a lethal missile in air-to-air combat is an option, as it wasn't during Kargil; that bombing locations within 'legitimised' Pakistan is an option, that was ruled out after 26/11 at Mumbai; that mobilising the Air Force does not lead to anything further than a counter by the opposed Air Force, a possibility that was never completely accepted to the political leadership that wished to skirt a nuclear confrontation by far more than the margins allowed by the current leadership.

Hon Sir

Can you please expand on the following point.

I am a bit at a loss here. Did you expect Pakistani State not to respond after IAF crossed the border and made a bombing run inside Pakistan? From what i see, Pakistan had no choice but to respond. I think our PM made it clear that Pakistan would have no choice but to respond if India exercises the surgical strike option. But i will wait for your feedback.

The loser is Pakistan. As @sheena 1980 has pointed out in a very emotional post, a series of encounters cannot work in favour of Pakistan, the PAF, the PA or the PN, for reasons that need no elaboration

Sir, with all due respect, that has to be the most delusional post i have ever read. It has been perfectly rebutted by @Signalian and @IceCold

 

[Viny]

Don't run to your dad USA about drones. Talk about your flying coffins, as for USA we r gonna sort them out and Israel also your other father

Now that you are trying to make an personal attack.
Let me ask you where were you when USA drones for screwing you up...

I am a bit at a loss here. Did you expect Pakistani State not to respond after IAF crossed the border and made a bombing run inside Pakistan? From what i see, Pakistan had no choice but to respond. I think our PM made it clear that Pakistan would have no choice but to respond if India exercises the surgical strike option. But i will wait for your feedback.

If there was nothing on those locations, then the right approach would have been making a detailed report of India's action and bringing it to world table by taking all the global media to location and doing live reporting, releasing the satellite images of pre and post action and accusing India of wrong doing and demanding sanctions and actions by global powers. Followed by a threat that if no constructive action is taken by global powers then pakistan will take its own action. More power should have been put behind diplomacy bring countries like Turkey, China and muslim ummah to support the claims.

This would have gained much traction and would have moved Pakistan in much better position in regards to exposing Indian lies as well as proving that Pakistan in accused of false terrorism charges. More ever this would have helped a lot in getting out of FATF, as well as would have made a considerable gain in form of support from Muslim Ummah at OIC.

Airstrike was more for domestic consumption. No real gain made on global level or at regional level.
Instead a risky endeavor that could have blown out of proportion in slightest mistake.

 

[MastanKhan]

I agree it is a losing preposition.

I have stated twice how to counter the enemy, One was when chandu was captured and the other was when abhinandan was captured but not alot of people here agreed with my strategy.

Hi,

Please direct me to those posts---I somehow missed them. Thank you.

 

[CrazyZ]

I guess you forgot same team told you about winning 1971 war, when 90,000 armed forces where surrendering.

90k figure is vastly exaggerated. It includes non combatant government employees. Even PIA baggage handlers were claimed as soldiers. True figure is like 30k. But like much around 71, the figures are exaggerated.

Pakistan's conventional offensive capability is greater then it has ever been. Should India chose to push things further, Pakistan can defend its territory and strike back at India's much lauded economy. Jamnagar oil refinery is within rocket artillery range of Pakistan. How can you maintain 7% growth and fight a war with knocked out oil refineries? You can't.

 

[El Sidd]

Hi,

Please direct me to those posts---I somehow missed them. Thank you.

Dear Mastan Uncle,

So now you know that the enemy is amassing on your border with stated doctrine of cold start and 2.5 front whilst building up pressure internally through businessmen who have shared investments.

What or how much mass would you allow for the sake of war posturing/gaming before going Nasr?

just a curious question from a Troll

 

[MastanKhan]

I asked this to you to know how much you know about psychology of our enemies. I know them since more than 30 years. I don’t pretend to know them 100%, but I spent lot of time observing them, I have learnt many things about them. That’s why I agree with what said MastanKhan. And that’s the main point of the discussion.

I pray Allah that we are wrong in the same time.

Nothing personal bro

Hi,

Most pakistanis are clueless to who they are dealing with when it comes to the indians---. You and I are not wrong about our assessments---.

 

[Viny]

90k figure is vastly exaggerated. It includes non combatant government employees. Even PIA baggage handlers were claimed as soldiers. True figure is like 30k. But like much around 71, the figures are exaggerated.

Pakistan's conventional offensive capability is greater then it has ever been. Should India chose to push things further, Pakistan can defend its territory and strike back at India's much lauded economy. Jamnagar oil refinery is within rocket artillery range of Pakistan. How can you maintain 7% growth and fight a war with knocked out oil refineries? You can't.

And as if indian conventional power is still that of 1947...
Oil refinery in Jamnagar is a private company and there are many companies which are much bigger than oil refinery, so even if we suffer damage to it we will be down by few percent in growth, but what will happen to you...give a thought...