Indian Army has eyes on Chinook too , Round 2 with IAF soon

[hkdas]

Indian Army has eyes on Chinook too , Round 2 with IAF soon ?? | idrw.org

 

[Capt.Popeye]

Indian Army has eyes on Chinook too , Round 2 with IAF soon ?? | idrw.org

Not surprising to hear of this development. This demand will also certainly come later from the IA.

And the arguments on their side will be: IA is paying for them, they will be operated solely to meet IA's OP reqmts, the IA already has an AAC and has Helo pilots, operational doctrines of use of Helos are now organic to Armies around the world hence the operational control of Helos in other countries are being vested with the Armies concerned.

The IAF's arguments will be: the IA has less experience of operating Helos, IA has less equipped maint. facilities for Helos, IAF has much more operational experience of flying Helos in the North and NE (where these Helos will be primarily used), if anything flies then it must belong to the IAF.

MoD will have act as a referee. While it will have to consider all the arguments, including those above; it will need to examine a very basic and important question: are the use of these Helos a Strategic or Tactical Op. Reqmt?
The answer to that will help to form the verdict.

 

[Sergi]

Not surprising to hear of this development. This demand will also certainly come later from the IA.

And the arguments on their side will be: IA is paying for them, they will be operated solely to meet IA's OP reqmts, the IA already has an AAC and has Helo pilots, operational doctrines of use of Helos are now organic to Armies around the world hence the operational control of Helos in other countries are being vested with the Armies concerned.

The IAF's arguments will be: the IA has less experience of operating Helos, IA has less equipped maint. facilities for Helos, IAF has much more operational experience of flying Helos in the North and NE (where these Helos will be primarily used), if anything flies then it must belong to the IAF.

MoD will have act as a referee. While it will have to consider all the arguments, including those above; it will need to examine a very basic and important question: are the use of these Helos a Strategic or Tactical Op. Reqmt?
The answer to that will help to form the verdict.

Simple and better choice for MOD is to transfer all IAF Helo pilots and helos to IA ACC and tell IAF to recruit and train new pilots for jet operations
Ist it simple

Whatever happen IAF's wish to own anything that fly wont be fulfilled in long run. Sooner or later they have to accept IA's mini airforce.

 

[SQ8]

Not surprising to hear of this development. This demand will also certainly come later from the IA.

And the arguments on their side will be: IA is paying for them, they will be operated solely to meet IA's OP reqmts, the IA already has an AAC and has Helo pilots, operational doctrines of use of Helos are now organic to Armies around the world hence the operational control of Helos in other countries are being vested with the Armies concerned.

The IAF's arguments will be: the IA has less experience of operating Helos, IA has less equipped maint. facilities for Helos, IAF has much more operational experience of flying Helos in the North and NE (where these Helos will be primarily used), if anything flies then it must belong to the IAF.

MoD will have act as a referee. While it will have to consider all the arguments, including those above; it will need to examine a very basic and important question: are the use of these Helos a Strategic or Tactical Op. Reqmt?
The answer to that will help to form the verdict.

Due to their battlefield centric nature, Helo's have generally been the better left to the Army to decide their usage and purpose. The airforce should generally stick to specialized helos for CSAR and SoF.

 

[Brickwall]

Infact IAF should give up the heli operations and focus on jets and space assets .... In the long run I hope it will be more beneficial

 

[Capt.Popeye]

Due to their battlefield centric nature, Helo's have generally been the better left to the Army to decide their usage and purpose. The airforce should generally stick to specialized helos for CSAR and SoF.

That is the correct and rational PoV that must be held wrt this issue.
But the IAF has been quite consistent.........and pig-headed when asked to cede control of their air-assets. They have long held the credo: if it flies, then it must be ours.

Current War-Fighting concepts and doctrines require that air-assets must operate seamlessly with ground assets. This need is even more pronounced at the Tactical level where the Battlefield Commander must be able to use/shift his resources at will in order to manage a dynamic battlefield.
There is a reason why Tactical reconnaissance via drones is now in the control of local Battle Formations.

 

[SQ8]

That is the correct and rational PoV that must be held wrt this issue.
But the IAF has been quite consistent.........and pig-headed when asked to cede control of their air-assets. They have long held the credo: if it flies, then it must be ours.

Or perhaps... If there is a budget for all that flies, it must be ours.

 

[Capt.Popeye]

Simple and better choice for MOD is to transfer all IAF Helo pilots and helos to IA ACC and tell IAF to recruit and train new pilots for jet operations
Ist it simple

Whatever happen IAF's wish to own anything that fly wont be fulfilled in long run. Sooner or later they have to accept IA's mini airforce.

All that apart; that shift will be in fact forced onto the IAF; when further 'rationalisation' of Defence Spending is carried out.

Or perhaps... If there is a budget for all that flies, it must be ours.

Pls refer to my post# 8 above.
Fait accompli is round the corner.

 

[sancho]

Due to their battlefield centric nature, Helo's have generally been the better left to the Army to decide their usage and purpose. The airforce should generally stick to specialized helos for CSAR and SoF.

True, but that is the case only for helicopters that actually are used in operations with the army, like combat or medium class helicopters. This is about heavy lift helicopters, which are mainly used to transport heavy cargo and less for normal utility or troop transport. IAF in fact used the Mi 26 widely in operations with civillian use or ISRO too and not only to support army operations, sadly one of the prime missions was even lifting crashed aircrafts. People tend to confuse the Chinook operations in US army, with what it would be used in IAF, but both will be very different. German army diverts it's CH 53s to the Luftwaffe too, because the heavy lift role is basically a vertical extention of their cargo transport roles with fixed winged aircrafts, while the direct support of the army in carrying troops or lifting howitzers will be done by NH90s of the army. So whenever the support of the troops are the prime factor, the helicopters (mainly the light and medium class fleets) are better used in the army, while it's better to keep them in the air force, if actural cargo transport is the prime factor.

If CSAR and SoF would had been the aim, IAF never had evaluated the Mi 26, but V22s, Black Hawks or EC 725 that are modified for these roles.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Wow, I didn't think the IA would make a push for the heavy lift helos for at least another 7 years!

Today the AAC is relatively modest in size and remit -no heavy lifters, no dedicated attack helos only light and medium class helos. In the next few years they are going to start packing a serious punch with the ALH in ever greater numbers, the Rudra and LCH (in vast numbers), now they want the Apaches and now the Chinooks? They really are thinking big...

 

[Kloitra]

Is it not possible to create a common command for air/ground assets which are to be used by multiple forces? Let there be a command consisting of related IAF and IA personals with control over the helis.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Is it not possible to create a common command for air/ground assets which are to be used by multiple forces? Let there be a command consisting of related IAF and IA personals with control over the helis.

Sounds like a mess in the making- it won't happen.

 

[Sam Manekshaw]

What is the use of Chinook to IAF?????
@Abingdonboy

 

[IndoUS]

What is the use of Chinook to IAF?????
@Abingdonboy

Logistical transport, ferrying cargo to bases. While the army would mostly use them for troop transport even that usually for SF and ferrying their howitzer.

 

[Abingdonboy]

What is the use of Chinook to IAF?????
@Abingdonboy

What anyone would use the Chinook for! Logistics, troop transport, relief work etc. From the IA's perspective they have a point that much of the Chinook's missions (if it was in IAF hands) would be supporting the IA.