Indian Air Force $19.5 Billion Fighter Program

[帅的一匹]

Perhaps with the J-10, but it won't make the cut.

As those flying coffin keep falling down, you need new F7 to fit in.

 

[randomradio]

If the current government wanted to get Rafales, then they would have continued with the MMRCA project, and ordered 100+ Rafales, all but the initial Made in India.
Dassault may have difficulty to accept non-French weapons on the Rafale.
If they wanted the F-16, then why wait with a decision until 2021?
The fan boys declaring the F-16 victory a year ago, maybe should keep a low profile right now.
The IAF/IN experience with Russian service levels makes the MiG-35 unlikely.
IAF might want the Rafale, given the choices in the tender, but it is the Indian Government that makes the decision, and the Indian Government might want a more cost effective solution.
Given the parameters, this opens up an opportunity for the Super Hornat Block III, which has the advantage that it will work on Indias new carrier (with difficulty) allowing IAF and IN to have the same airplane. Also tighter relations with the U.S. The U.S. requirement that India signs certain agreements might terminate that option. Refusal to provide source code, same effect.
Main competitor will be Gripen E, which seems to be what the IAF considers to be next best after Rafale. There are several things on the wishlist like fast take off, Wide Area Display etc., which can be used to show that others does not meet the requirements.
Whatever the Indian Government thinks today, may be irrelevant, if another party wins next elections.

The IAF writes the RFP. And the RFP will be structured in such a way that it's not possible for a single engine aircraft to win. For example, the IAF will ask for a payload of 8T to make the cut. Gripen will lose there. Similarly, there are many other qualities that single engine lack.

Similarly, SH also will lose since it won't meet performance requirements. Although it will be equipped with a more powerful engine, it will get heavier with avionics upgrades. And its airframe is not optimised as well as its main competitors when it comes to raw performance. Not to mention, it's really old and does not have a real future.

As those flying coffin keep falling down, you need new F7 to fit in.

The problem with the F-7 is it is worse than our flying coffins.

 

[Papa Dragon]

Not again, we are willing to ToT F7 to India. Can we join the bidding?


I love the pace of India, slow and elegant.

You could join the bidding but you'll end up giving kickbacks to some of our guys and once they receive em, the tender will be scraped. OTOH, your F7's are way more crappy than our mig-21s

If the current government wanted to get Rafales, then they would have continued with the MMRCA project, and ordered 100+ Rafales, all but the initial Made in India.
Dassault may have difficulty to accept non-French weapons on the Rafale.
If they wanted the F-16, then why wait with a decision until 2021?
The fan boys declaring the F-16 victory a year ago, maybe should keep a low profile right now.
The IAF/IN experience with Russian service levels makes the MiG-35 unlikely.
IAF might want the Rafale, given the choices in the tender, but it is the Indian Government that makes the decision, and the Indian Government might want a more cost effective solution.
Given the parameters, this opens up an opportunity for the Super Hornat Block III, which has the advantage that it will work on Indias new carrier (with difficulty) allowing IAF and IN to have the same airplane. Also tighter relations with the U.S. The U.S. requirement that India signs certain agreements might terminate that option. Refusal to provide source code, same effect.
Main competitor will be Gripen E, which seems to be what the IAF considers to be next best after Rafale. There are several things on the wishlist like fast take off, Wide Area Display etc., which can be used to show that others does not meet the requirements.
Whatever the Indian Government thinks today, may be irrelevant, if another party wins next elections.

Every tender is carefully designed to favor a specific country/company. If you look at the recent FRCV tender, it is clearly designed to favor the T-14 Armata. Even though that may not be procured directly, there is a high possibility that a private Indian defense firm along with a foreign partner would bag the contract and develop something on similar lines with Indian sub-systems.

MoD has scraped the SE tender, so I don't think F-16 or Gripen would make the cut and we clearly know dealing with the Americans comes with a lot of strings attached. I'm pretty sure the IAF is hellbent on procuring at least 2 more squadrons of Rafales. If IN also decides to go with the Rafale-M, there is a high possibility that the planes would be locally manufactured with significant ToT

 

[帅的一匹]

You could join the bidding but you'll end up giving kickbacks to some of our guys and once they receive em, the tender will be scraped. OTOH, your F7's are way more crappy than our mig-21s



Every tender is carefully designed to favor a specific country/company. If you look at the recent FRCV tender, it is clearly designed to favor the T-14 Armata. Even though that may not be procured directly, there is a high possibility that a private Indian defense firm along with a foreign partner would bag the contract and develop something on similar lines with Indian sub-systems.

MoD has scraped the SE tender, so I don't think F-16 or Gripen would make the cut and we clearly know dealing with the Americans comes with a lot of strings attached. I'm pretty sure the IAF is hellbent on procuring at least 2 more squadrons of Rafales. If IN also decides to go with the Rafale-M, there is a high possibility that the planes would be locally manufactured with significant ToT

I thought Indians are not stupid, why seperate the Rafale purchase into two different contracts? Due to the kickbacks? One to the Congress and the other one to the BJP?

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

You can't provide TOT, looks carefully at the terms. Many of Gripen E's parts are not produced by Sweden.

OLD NEWS:
Neither Boeing, nor LM makes aircraft engines, radars, EW etc.
LM has signed away rights of F-16 production to dozen countries etc.


Rafale does not fit the elevators on the next carrier.
The workaround will require refitting the wingtips, as soon as the Rafale has been brought
Up to the flight deck. A procedure which will take 15 minutes.
This will significantly limit flight operations, so the Super Hornet is likely to be ahead at IN.

India already has far stretched negotiations on producing F414.
India has a deal with Safran on the Kaveri.
No need for Gripen Engine TOT.

SAAB makes GaN radar, and EW.
SAAB also has state of the art competence on model based design.
India needs project management skills more than anything else,
and SAAB is doing ToT to Brazil at the moment.
The others do not have recent ToT experience.
There are plenty of stuff in the RFI that is met by Gripen, but not anyone else.

 

[Papa Dragon]

I thought Indians are not stupid, why seperate the Rafale purchase into two different contracts? Due to the kickbacks? One to the Congress and the other one to the BJP?

If BJP goes ahead with MMRCA which has been designed during the Congress regime, there is a high probability that Congress would claim it as their own achievement and BJP has only executed the final deal while the heavy work of evaluating and negotiations have been done by Congress. Even though both sides and IAF must've received quite a lot of kickbacks, every govt would like to claim it as their own achievement and Rafale hasn't been purchased in two different contracts as the first tender by congress has been scraped by BJP

 

[asiaticlion]

Not again, we are willing to ToT F7 to India. Can we join the bidding?


I love the pace of India, slow and elegant.

Sorry we do not buy stolen IP. Anyway you do not even have TOT of Russian engine. We will not even touch that with barge pole. Makes me vomit looking at that shit.