India will spend $187 mn to double production of the LCA Tejas

[SR-91]

God save mother India as airforce strength is at the lowest. It's a joke really 16 aircraft per year. Hope soon China attacks I. Did. So some reasonable seriousness in defence prevails. 16 *10 is just 160... Which means of 16 per years from 2016 we could ask 160 Tejas lol..its should be 36 per year so 360 Tejas replace 280 plus miss 21 27 's in 7 to 8 years. Modi socks???

When I saw double production, I thought they will take it from 16 to 32. I got really happy but this is pathetic. Atleast push for 24 aircrafts per year.

 

[knight11]

Irony for both PAF and IAF too many to retire and yet happy over 16 aircraft per year

Could you tell me the timeline of the old F-16 A of PAF retirement timeline which was inducted in 80's -- My guess 2018 onwards.

 

[Ind4Ever]

production rate of 16 per year if enough to fulfill order of 120 tejas on time , 2nd fighter jet will soon be chosen to be made in India either F16In or F18sh to produce 128 planes after 2020 existing su30 production lines will move to FGFA hopefully so picture is not so Grimm by 2025 IAF will have 40+ operational squad strength of 4+ gen planes for sure.

One wonder how to measure NOT SO GRIM SCALE !!!! 120 Tejas till when? 2024? How fighter will be retired ? India always looks defence facilities with economical aspects. But these are for our defence. Capabilities are important. Russians Americans are super power not because of economical aspects alone... But their willingness to mass produce weapon systems in large scale... Which was known as Cold War Era.... Today we have same situation with China coming into its fold. What India willing to do? Order 120 Tejas Time line 8 years from 2017

 

[knight11]

When I saw double production, I thought they will take it from 16 to 32. I got really happy but this is pathetic. Atleast push for 24 aircrafts per year.

Relax, the production at full rate takes around 2.5 years from the SOP handover, the time when MK-1 SOP 2018 would attain FOC. 8 Jigs means 8 in the production line and 8 in the finally assembly, with average of six month for 1 aircraft. If you check the timeline of the Hawk build by the HAL -- 1st year 2 aircraft, 2nd year 4 aircraft, then 12 aircraft and then 18 aircraft, and the rest in few months.

 

[Ind4Ever]

When I saw double production, I thought they will take it from 16 to 32. I got really happy but this is pathetic. Atleast push for 24 aircrafts per year.

True that... Really pathetic

 

[knight11]

Give the production line to private companies, and they'll make more than 30 a year.

Which Indian pvt company have the capability and experience to build the fighter plane and integrate all LRU's without the help of HAL.

 

[Water Car Engineer]

Which Indian pvt company have the capability and experience to build the fighter plane and integrate all LRU's without the help of HAL.

TATA will be building assembly line for C295 under the aegis of Airbus. I dont see it far off when they can work with ADA for a fighter, etc. program. Fact is, HAL has brought NOTHING this whole time. We're in the middle of March, and SP2 is no where to be found.

 

[knight11]

TATA will be building assembly line for C295 under the aegis of Airbus. I dont see it far off when they can work with ADA for a fighter, etc. program. Fact is, HAL has brought NOTHING this whole time. We're in the middle of March, and SP2 is no where to be found.

Dear sir,
Hopefully you know very well ADA is just a development agency and not the integrator and many parts and LRU;s are developed by HAL during the development of the LCA Tejas and holds many IPR's . HAL is the best Integrator in the country with the experience of more than 15 types of aircraft, production of 3500 aircraft, and overhaul of more than 10000 engines, and have 12 production Units in the country. TATA on the other hand have only experience of airframe and some structure building only. Infact Mahindra, Godrej have more experience as far as military and heavy machinery is concerned but question here is not the numbers, but the Quality which is very important at this stage, and HAL should be the one to startup to remove all the glitches, and teething problems related to the production first, and the pvt companies should be confined to the parts building at this stage with HAL as the lead prime integrator.

 

[Bheemsen]

One wonder how to measure NOT SO GRIM SCALE !!!! 120 Tejas till when? 2024? How fighter will be retired ? India always looks defence facilities with economical aspects. But these are for our defence. Capabilities are important. Russians Americans are super power not because of economical aspects alone... But their willingness to mass produce weapon systems in large scale... Which was known as Cold War Era.... Today we have same situation with China coming into its fold. What India willing to do? Order 120 Tejas Time line 8 years from 2017

yes 120 tejas full 6 squad by 2024 replacing 150 odd mig 21 , by 2024 IAF strength will be like this

6 squad Tejas
6 squad Mig 21 bison(all retired mig 21 mothballed to provide spares for most upgraded BVR capable mig 21 in IAF)
3 squad Upgraded Mig 29
3 squad Mirage 2k upgraded
13 squad Su30 Mki - 4 of them super sukhoi
5 squad Darin 3 jaguar strike aircraft.
6 squad of MMRCA (which will be clear by this year end)

Dose this look too grim as you are planting ?

 

[Water Car Engineer]

Dear sir,
Hopefully you know very well ADA is just a development agency and not the integrator and many parts and LRU;s are developed by HAL during the development of the LCA Tejas and holds many IPR's . HAL is the best Integrator in the country with the experience of more than 15 types of aircraft, production of 3500 aircraft, and overhaul of more than 10000 engines, and have 12 production Units in the country. TATA on the other hand have only experience of airframe and some structure building only. Infact Mahindra, Godrej have more experience as far as military and heavy machinery is concerned but question here is not the numbers, but the Quality which is very important at this stage, and HAL should be the one to startup to remove all the glitches, and teething problems related to the production first, and the pvt companies should be confined to the parts building at this stage with HAL as the lead prime integrator.

I dont think the private firms should be, "confined", to only making modules. And they dont want that for themselves either.

The fact TATA has been here in the scene for only 8 some years, and already graduated to a lead integrator of a whole transport plane(Airbus's C295s) should tell you their ambitions in the long run. This ambition is something India shouldnt hold at arms length, either. If you continue to keep saying HAL has more experience, simply because they're the only ones around since before independence, you're going to continue have sub par performance from them. As we are seeing them with their continuous delays with SP2, schedules they themselves keep making.

Mahindra, Godrej, L&T, etc. have experience with modules making, fabrication work for ISRO, etc. But TATA has now graduated from simply making modules to full on lead integration and testing work for the IAF and Airbus. This is easily something ADA can leverage in future programs, and should.

 

[volatile]

Could you tell me the timeline of the old F-16 A of PAF retirement timeline which was inducted in 80's -- My guess 2018 onwards.

F16 A were all MLU and have a good service life left over 15 years if it were to be retire it will be post 2025. But F16A are not that much exclusively used as per my understanding in WOT thats why Pak wants another 8 or 18 block 52+ as operationally it is making different for 18 Fighters to work .

This is a joint Indo-Pak conspiracy to deprive their Airforces the much needed fighters.

This conspiracy is good as the money will be spend on people development

 

[Ankit Kumar]

yes 120 tejas full 6 squad by 2024 replacing 150 odd mig 21 , by 2024 IAF strength will be like this

6 squad Tejas
6 squad Mig 21 bison(all retired mig 21 mothballed to provide spares for most upgraded BVR capable mig 21 in IAF)
3 squad Upgraded Mig 29
3 squad Mirage 2k upgraded
13 squad Su30 Mki - 4 of them super sukhoi
5 squad Darin 3 jaguar strike aircraft.
6 squad of MMRCA (which will be clear by this year end)

Dose this look too grim as you are planting ?

5 Darin3 jaguar squadrons?

I don't think 61 airframes mean 5 squadrons. Does it?

yes 120 tejas full 6 squad by 2024 replacing 150 odd mig 21 , by 2024 IAF strength will be like this

6 squad Tejas
6 squad Mig 21 bison(all retired mig 21 mothballed to provide spares for most upgraded BVR capable mig 21 in IAF)
3 squad Upgraded Mig 29
3 squad Mirage 2k upgraded
13 squad Su30 Mki - 4 of them super sukhoi
5 squad Darin 3 jaguar strike aircraft.
6 squad of MMRCA (which will be clear by this year end)

Dose this look too grim as you are planting ?

Now if we talk about ~2024, lets have a look at what our neighbours will have
~120 F16s ( If they don't go for 2nd hand airframes )
~200 JF17s
~60 F7s
Atleast ....
Total => ~400

China
~ 200 J20s
~800 Flankers
~600 J10s

Total , atleast 1500 aircrafts.
1/3rd of 1500=> 500 aircrafts.

So we will be up against near 900 full 4th and above Fighter jets.

Compared to ~ 300 flankers + ~100 mirage and fulcrum + ~100 Tejas + ~200 upgraded 3rd gen fighters

Now that's actually very very grim situation.

 

[aakash_2410]

could also buy about 16 F/18 E/Fs from Boeing a year and set up to build 16 of those a year in India in 2/3 years.

thinking buy 64 from Boeing and build 64 in India for 128 aircraft


double the aircraft both use the same engine as well.


while increasing purchase of Su-30MKI.

best way to get the amount of fighters needed soon.

Also best way to kill indigenous efforts.

 

[Bheemsen]

5 Darin3 jaguar squadrons?

I don't think 61 airframes mean 5 squadrons. Does it?



Now if we talk about ~2024, lets have a look at what our neighbours will have
~120 F16s ( If they don't go for 2nd hand airframes )
~200 JF17s
~60 F7s
Atleast ....
Total => ~400

China
~ 200 J20s
~800 Flankers
~600 J10s

Total , atleast 1500 aircrafts.
1/3rd of 1500=> 500 aircrafts.

So we will be up against near 900 full 4th and above Fighter jets.

Compared to ~ 300 flankers + ~100 mirage and fulcrum + ~100 Tejas + ~200 upgraded 3rd gen fighters

Now that's actually very very grim situation.

The IAF plans to modify 123 licence-built Jaguars by fitting them with more powerful Honeywell F-125IN turbofan engines and the locally designed Display Attack Ranging Intertial Navigation-III (DARIN-III) avionics suite.

hence it will be 5-6 Squad of Jaguar strike aircraft.
3 squad of highly upgraded Mirage2k
3 squad of mig 29 UPG,
13 squad of Su30 mki with 4 upgraded to super su30
6 squad of Tejas MK1A
6 squad of MiG 21 bison (highly upgraded and BVR capable)
6 squad of MMRCA ?? this is the key to attaining required parity needed.

In all minimum 800 -850 aircraft will be there by 2024 in IAF inventory.

Figures you have presented for PAF is highly unlikely 120 F16 also 200 JF17 , 200 J20 is a biggest joke so is 600 J10.
Please stop smoking weed and live in reality

Also best way to kill indigenous efforts.

Indigenous effort are not above national security

 

[knight11]

5 Darin3 jaguar squadrons?

I don't think 61 airframes mean 5 squadrons. Does it?



Now if we talk about ~2024, lets have a look at what our neighbours will have
~120 F16s ( If they don't go for 2nd hand airframes )
~200 JF17s
~60 F7s
Atleast ....
Total => ~400

China
~ 200 J20s
~800 Flankers
~600 J10s

Total , atleast 1500 aircrafts.
1/3rd of 1500=> 500 aircrafts.

So we will be up against near 900 full 4th and above Fighter jets.

Compared to ~ 300 flankers + ~100 mirage and fulcrum + ~100 Tejas + ~200 upgraded 3rd gen fighters

Now that's actually very very grim situation.

Ankit Bhai Seriously 200 J-20 ?