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India Took a Shocking 33 Years to Develop a Jet Fighter (And It’s Still Not Ready for Combat)

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India Took a Shocking 33 Years to Develop a Jet Fighter (And It’s Still Not Ready for Combat)
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November 23, 2016

The Indian government is proposing to export its Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) Tejas light combat aircraft to other Asian nations. New Delhi hopes that the indigenously developed fighter’s relatively simple design and potentially low maintenance costs will be a selling point for the jet. But India’s prospects for selling the its “new” fighter are highly dubious.

“The government proposes to export the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas to other countries. In this connection preliminary discussions have been held with a few friendly countries,” reads a statement from Indian defense minister Shri Manohar Parrikar. “Presently, HAL has established facilities for manufacturing and delivery of 8 LCA per annum. There is a plan to ramp up the production rate from 8 to 16 Aircraft per annum progressively by 2019-20.”

It’s unclear which potential customers might be interested in the Tejas, though New Delhi has been trying to market the jet overseas with an appearance at theBahrain air show earlier this year. But given that India has been trying to develop the Tejas since the 1980s without delivering a viable combat aircraft, it is highly doubtful that any of New Delhi’s allies would be willing to purchase such a fighter. Moreover, even after more than 33 years of development, the Tejas continues to be plagued with problems—though developers believe that they can resolve outstanding issues with the aircraft within a year. “I told them that all shortcomings should be fulfilled and the plane should be ready in a year,” Parrikar told the Hindustan Times on Nov. 20.

Nonetheless, New Delhi continues to assert that the Tejas offers performance comparable to France’s Dassault Rafale. “This is a plane which is completely indigenously manufactured and can compete with any other fighter plane in the world. It is as capable as the Rafale. Only this is a light combat aircraft (LCA),” Parrikar told the Hindustan Times. “Only a 3.5 ton missile can be carried on it, Rafale on the other hand can carry a nine ton (payload). This plane can fly at the rate of 450Kms, Rafale can run 900Kms because it has twin engines.”

Despite, India’s bold claims, the generally unimpressive Tejas is not in the same league as other comparable aircraft in the export fighter market. The Swedish Saab JAS-39 Gripen and even upgraded older model F-16s and F/A-18s generally offer superior performance for comparable and sometimes even lower prices. Moreover, the Tejas—with a hodgepodge of technologies drawn from Israel, France, Russia and the United States, among others—would be a nightmare to clear for export.


Despite being billed as an indigenous aircraft, roughly 25 percent of the current Mk-1 version of the aircraft is built from imported components. While that might seem fairly low, those components are the core of what makes a fighter a fighter. Imported systems on the Tejas include the Israel Aerospace Industries/ELTA EL/M-2032 radar, an Elbit helmet-mounted cueing system, a British-made Martin Baker ejection seat and an American General Electric F404 afterburning turbofan. Additionally, many of the jet’s weapons—such as the GSh-23 23 mm cannon—are of Russian origin. Indeed, the very fact that the Tejas is equipped with a U.S. engine means that Washington has a veto on which nations New Delhi can offer the aircraft to for sale. Thus, a potential customer might be better served to simply purchase a used F-16 or F/A-18—which are far better jets with a far more attractive package of weapons (not to mention political clout).

Meanwhile, India recently ordered 83 more Tejas Mk-1A jets, a slightly refined version of the current Mk-1 aircraft, of which 20 are on order. The Tejas Mk-1A will replace the current mechanically-scanned radar with a new Israel Aerospace Industries/ELTA EL/M-2052 active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar, a new electronic warfare pod and a Cobham in-flight refueling probe. There are also a host of other improvements to correct the deficiencies found on the original Mk-1.

New Delhi is continuing to refine the aging Tejas design with the Mk-II version, which is set to make its debut in 2025. The new version of the jet will be equipped with the 22,000-pound thrust class General Electric F414 engine, which was originally developed for the Boeing F/A-18 Super Hornet. However, the Indians are attempting to revive the failed Kaveri indigenous engine that was originally slated to power the Tejas before it became glaringly apparent that it was not up to the task. The France’s Snecma is working with the Indians to certify the Kaveri engine for the flight of a Tejas light combat aircraft prototype in 2018.

“Once the engine houses make it a flightworthy engine, we have numerous programs coming up and there is more than one place for it to be fitted. The question is whether we will be able to fit it into only the LCA or will we be able to get it into the (GE) 414 with the higher power is a point that we are raising,” C.P. Ramanarayanan, DRDO’s Director General for Aeronautics told India’s Business Standard.

Given India’s abysmal track record in developing indigenous combat aircraft, there is little reason to be optimistic about New Delhi’s prospects for the Tejas. Frankly, the Indian Air Force would be better served by relegating the Tejas to being technology demonstrator and simply buying a genuine combat aircraft from one of its allies.

http://nationalinterest.org/blog/th...-33-years-develop-jet-fighter-its-still-18505
 
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EVEN AFTER THE SAME NUMBER OF YEARS IF WE START TODAY...TEJAS WILL NOT FLY...
 
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While there are various reasons for the Tejas program to have stalled (I wouldn't use the word 'failed') - one thing is clear, Western companies don't want to see either India, China or any other large Asian nation become self-sufficient in fighter design or manufacture, certainly not in indigenous design of modern jet engines.

The China situation is now acknowledged to be lost, however Western companies are trying their level best to see that India remains dependent on foreign technology for this. The billion dollar stakes are just too much and they will try to influence Indian politicians to the n'th degree.

Chinese aviation industry are acknowledged to be well-ahead of India, but there was a time when India was ahead of China. Why Indian aviation industry went into the doldrums is unexplained. Maybe one of the Indian posters here can explain.

India's first indigenous fighter, the HF-24 Marut, flew in 1961 and was fully inducted by 1968. These sturdy fighters served into the 1980's. This one example below is preserved in Germany.

marut-1.jpg


The Marut certainly did not take 32 years to design and develop (probably less than a decade), and this was in the 1960's when India was far less advanced in its aviation industry. The initial version had a pair of Rolls Royce Orpheus engines, pushing the plane to a top speed of Mach 1.02 at 40,000ft. The same Orpheus engines also powered the Folland Gnat (Ajeet)that was also made in India in that same period.

Maybe the existing Indian politicians' cut of graft from buying foreign fighters is just too much that the MiG-21 replacement is taking so long (finally Gripens)?
 
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While there are various reasons for the Tejas program to have stalled (I wouldn't use the word 'failed') - one thing is clear, Western companies don't want to see either India, China or any other large Asian nation become self-sufficient in fighter design or manufacture, certainly not in indigenous design of modern jet engines.

The China situation is now acknowledged to be lost, however Western companies are trying their level best to see that India remains dependent on foreign technology for this. The billion dollar stakes are just too much and they will try to influence Indian politicians to the n'th degree.

Chinese aviation industry are acknowledged to be well-ahead of India, but there was a time when India was ahead of China. Why Indian aviation industry went into the doldrums is unexplained. Maybe one of the Indian posters here can explain.

India's first indigenous fighter, the HF-24 Marut, flew in 1961 and was fully inducted by 1968. These sturdy fighters served into the 1980's. This one example below is preserved in Germany.

marut-1.jpg


The Marut certainly did not take 32 years to design and develop (probably less than a decade), and this was in the 1960's when India was far less advanced in its aviation industry. The initial version had a pair of Rolls Royce Orpheus engines, pushing the plane to a top speed of Mach 1.02 at 40,000ft. The same Orpheus engines also powered the Folland Gnat (Ajeet)that was also made in India in that same period.

Maybe the existing Indian politicians' cut of graft from buying foreign fighters is just too much that the MiG-21 replacement is taking so long (finally Gripens)?
I would like to have a very important reason. China by Western arms sanctions. China can not get military technology from US and Europe, only their own production. This led to the independence of China's military technology, and does not rely on Western technical support.

Q-5, J-6, J-7, J-8, J-10, J-10B, J-10C, J-11, J-11B, J-15, J-20, J-31, JH-7, Y-8, Y-20, H-6K, KJ-2000, KJ-500. These are the pursuit of China's military independence.

Now China has become the world's fourth largest arms exporter. Aircraft, tanks, artillery, warships, missiles all can be exported. Perhaps, this is the West's fault, or China's lucky?
 
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I would like to have a very important reason. China by Western arms sanctions. China can not get military technology from US and Europe, only their own production. This led to the independence of China's military technology, and does not rely on Western technical support.

Q-5, J-6, J-7, J-8, J-10, J-10B, J-10C, J-11, J-11B, J-15, J-20, J-31, JH-7, Y-8, Y-20, H-6K, KJ-2000, KJ-500. These are the pursuit of China's military independence.

Now China has become the world's fourth largest arms exporter. Aircraft, tanks, artillery, warships, missiles all can be exported. Perhaps, this is the West's fault, or China's lucky?

American 'China Hands' handled the relationship with China very badly and clumsily over the years. Which led to China not leaning to either Soviets or USA after 1960. The Americans had a chance with Nixon, Kissinger, Alexander Haig et al to improve relationship with then older Chinese revolutionaries (compatriots of Mao Tze Dong) but the lack of finesse on the American side gave rise to the term in the US, 'who lost China'.

"In the summer of 1960, the Soviet Union summarily pulled out of China its key technicians on whom China was critically dependent. They carried off even the blueprints for plants under construction -- as well as China's expectations for receiving a Soviet "sample" atomic bomb.

Henry Kissinger, despite his fascination with China and its rulers, cautioned in his memoirs":

"For all their charm and ideological fervor, the Chinese leaders were the most unsentimental practitioners of balance-of-power politics I have encountered. . . . [In 1971-72] Peking and Washington were entering a marriage of convenience transformed into an emotional tie primarily by Chinese psychological skill and American sentimental recollection of a China that no longer existed, if ever it had. Once China becomes strong enough to stand alone, it might discard us.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...04e-b1a3-72105eaad26e/?utm_term=.38c103ba92b4
 
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Once China becomes strong enough to stand alone, it might discard us.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...04e-b1a3-72105eaad26e/?utm_term=.38c103ba92b4

As a great american (cartoon) character once said...HAAAAA HAAAAA


While there are various reasons for the Tejas program to have stalled (I wouldn't use the word 'failed') - one thing is clear, Western companies don't want to see either India, China or any other large Asian nation become self-sufficient in fighter design or manufacture, certainly not in indigenous design of modern jet engines.

The China situation is now acknowledged to be lost, however Western companies are trying their level best to see that India remains dependent on foreign technology for this. The billion dollar stakes are just too much and they will try to influence Indian politicians to the n'th degree.

Chinese aviation industry are acknowledged to be well-ahead of India, but there was a time when India was ahead of China. Why Indian aviation industry went into the doldrums is unexplained. Maybe one of the Indian posters here can explain.

India's first indigenous fighter, the HF-24 Marut, flew in 1961 and was fully inducted by 1968. These sturdy fighters served into the 1980's. This one example below is preserved in Germany.

marut-1.jpg


The Marut certainly did not take 32 years to design and develop (probably less than a decade), and this was in the 1960's when India was far less advanced in its aviation industry. The initial version had a pair of Rolls Royce Orpheus engines, pushing the plane to a top speed of Mach 1.02 at 40,000ft. The same Orpheus engines also powered the Folland Gnat (Ajeet)that was also made in India in that same period.

Maybe the existing Indian politicians' cut of graft from buying foreign fighters is just too much that the MiG-21 replacement is taking so long (finally Gripens)?

Designed by Kurt Tank, of world war 2 fame. Hence this copy is in Germany.
 
.
While there are various reasons for the Tejas program to have stalled (I wouldn't use the word 'failed') - one thing is clear, Western companies don't want to see either India, China or any other large Asian nation become self-sufficient in fighter design or manufacture, certainly not in indigenous design of modern jet engines.

The China situation is now acknowledged to be lost, however Western companies are trying their level best to see that India remains dependent on foreign technology for this. The billion dollar stakes are just too much and they will try to influence Indian politicians to the n'th degree.

Chinese aviation industry are acknowledged to be well-ahead of India, but there was a time when India was ahead of China. Why Indian aviation industry went into the doldrums is unexplained. Maybe one of the Indian posters here can explain.

India's first indigenous fighter, the HF-24 Marut, flew in 1961 and was fully inducted by 1968. These sturdy fighters served into the 1980's. This one example below is preserved in Germany.

marut-1.jpg


The Marut certainly did not take 32 years to design and develop (probably less than a decade), and this was in the 1960's when India was far less advanced in its aviation industry. The initial version had a pair of Rolls Royce Orpheus engines, pushing the plane to a top speed of Mach 1.02 at 40,000ft. The same Orpheus engines also powered the Folland Gnat (Ajeet)that was also made in India in that same period.

Maybe the existing Indian politicians' cut of graft from buying foreign fighters is just too much that the MiG-21 replacement is taking so long (finally Gripens)?



The blind faith on ToT and the easy access to weaponry world market may have killed India's aviation industries, and military industries for that matter. Many Indian members here seem to believe the successful ToT with each military purchase is the indicator of the true technology advancement to India's own industry. That is simply wrong. You learnt algebra in the school, but it doesn't mean you are as good as your math teacher.

For India, obtaining ToT is the end of story. For Chinese, it is just the beginning. Take Mig-21 as example. Both China and India received Mig-21 ToT from USSR in the 60's, and Russian subsequently withdrew their technical support to China before the transfer complete. India sit on the fully served ToT and manufactured the SAME fighter jets for the next 30 some years. Chinese had to chew on the half cooked ToT, and figured out every possible how's and why's on their own. The rest is the history.

50 years have past, while Indian engineers at government organizations are enjoying all govt benefits, reading newspaper and taking their tea breaks without dirty their hands, million strong Chinese engineer army are working their ars-out on "7-11" schedule. The results are there for the world to see.
 
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Developing a technology is quite difficult thing than to assemble it..in course of developing one makes several mistakes and learn from it..sometime accidently it leads u to develop a new unknown thing too..
Well i work in it industry and i know what that developing from scratch is very vast and time taking aproach but once u have developed the libraries you can use it again and again or tweak it to ur demands..later it takes only 1/100th time than earlier.. :) ..and i hopes its true in every corner of world..so just keep making fun of the project bcz it shows how ignorant u are :) ...
 
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In fact, we are backward. India has a number of stealth fighter, since the emergence of J20
We are still a developing country, India is a super power. We are far behind India
177528.jpg

 
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Designed by Kurt Tank, of world war 2 fame. Hence this copy is in Germany.

It was a complete breakthrough for a country like India back in the day, too bad the follow-on momentum could not be kept up, maybe due to misplaced priorities. If things were kept ship-shape Indian aviation today would be in a different place today....
 
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I give India a further 10 years to make the Tejas combat ready.
 
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I give India a further 10 years to make the Tejas combat ready.
even without gun n bvr,its already combat ready n in squadron service.
well,,our dpsu's n govt r working day n night very hard,but,the "definitive" version ala tejas mk2 wont be operational in a decade,,thts almost 99% sure.
mk2 it will be bestest of best in world class
 
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even without gun n bvr,its already combat ready n in squadron service.
well,,our dpsu's n govt r working day n night very hard,but,the "definitive" version ala tejas mk2 wont be operational in a decade,,thts almost 99% sure.
mk2 it will be bestest of best in world class


Get FOC for your LCA MK1 to make them "combat worthy" first, then we can talk about MK1a. MK2 is in the distant future, let's not go overboard to claim 99% sure, given your abysmal track records.
 
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American 'China Hands' handled the relationship with China very badly and clumsily over the years. Which led to China not leaning to either Soviets or USA after 1960. The Americans had a chance with Nixon, Kissinger, Alexander Haig et al to improve relationship with then older Chinese revolutionaries (compatriots of Mao Tze Dong) but the lack of finesse on the American side gave rise to the term in the US, 'who lost China'.

"In the summer of 1960, the Soviet Union summarily pulled out of China its key technicians on whom China was critically dependent. They carried off even the blueprints for plants under construction -- as well as China's expectations for receiving a Soviet "sample" atomic bomb.

Henry Kissinger, despite his fascination with China and its rulers, cautioned in his memoirs":

"For all their charm and ideological fervor, the Chinese leaders were the most unsentimental practitioners of balance-of-power politics I have encountered. . . . [In 1971-72] Peking and Washington were entering a marriage of convenience transformed into an emotional tie primarily by Chinese psychological skill and American sentimental recollection of a China that no longer existed, if ever it had. Once China becomes strong enough to stand alone, it might discard us.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...04e-b1a3-72105eaad26e/?utm_term=.38c103ba92b4

http://www.npr.org/2014/11/08/362342377/answering-the-old-question-who-lost-china
 
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