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India should consider sub-conventional warfare against Pakistan

So when do you think next war is possible?


  • Total voters
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While the world’s strategic community remains engaged with Iran, North Korea and Palestine, an extremely volatile nuclear flash-point in South Asia – the India-Pakistan border – merits earnest attention. Since a ceasefire agreement in 2003, there have been numerous instances of ceasefire violations. In the first two months of 2018 alone, India reported 633 violations and Pakistan reported 400.

Unfortunately, there seems to be a lack of intelligence-based analysis of the recurring ceasefire violations. Even basic attempts at reasoned analysis show that violations are less likely to be random incidents of misadventure than calculated strategic moves under the bigger umbrella of Pakistan’s irregular warfare. The recent violations in Jammu, for example, could have been aimed at terrorizing the local population, providing momentum to disruptive activities in Kashmir valley or diverting attention from a large-scale infiltration attempt.

Understanding Pakistan’s irregular warfare is a study in itself. In contrast, India’s capabilities remain highly confined.

Pakistan has mastered the craft of proxy war over the past three decades in Afghanistan and Kashmir. It has assets in the form of radicalized groups in Kashmir and the other parts of India, but unfortunately, India does not have that advantage in Pakistan.

India also lacks an “aggressive strategic culture” needed to plan and implement systematic and sustained efforts in the field of psy-wars, cyber-wars, information warfare, sabotage, civil unrest and political disruptions. Unlike in Pakistan, with every election, policy, personnel and ideology change in India. Further, Indian agencies lack enough authority, are highly bureaucratized, and suffer from inter- and intra-agency rivalry.

Hence the range of options to counter Pakistan is very narrow. India’s edge over Pakistan has always been in conventional war, which possibly propelled Pakistan to make strategic and tactical nuclear weapons. There is a belief in parts of India’s strategic community that Pakistan would retaliate with a full-scale atomic attack in the case of a strong response by India to its terror tactics. Its body politic has sustained far more than the “thousand cuts” that the late Pakistani president Muhammad Zia-ul-Haq’s had dreamed of inflicting on India ultimately to weaken its hold on Kashmir.

India’s fears of a retaliation seem baseless and unfounded in light of Pakistan’s low-profile response to India’s surgical strikes. Pakistan does not seem to have a response mechanism for a scenario wherein India retaliates to its proxy wars with aggressive military action, short of full-scale war.

Resorting to nuclear options would actually be a greater disaster for Pakistan, something that the Pakistan Army – a highly rational actor – understands. It realizes that the nuclear option could be the last resort in the event of a serious threat to its very survival. However, that occasion may not arise in the case of sub-conventional, short-range and swift military action by India that is insufficient to justify retaliation with nuclear weapons. Herein lies the chink in Pakistan’s armor.

That said, the increasing radicalization of lower-level cadres in the Pakistan Army presents an alarming threat. If a radicalized field commander decided to use a tactical nuclear weapon in response to India, the confrontation would escalate into a nuclear catastrophe, which could prove to be the worst-case scenario for South Asia.

Still, India could consider a sub-conventional military response. It could attempt regular bouts of aggressive, high-intensity counter-offensive moves over an extended period, interspersed with perfunctory peace initiatives and diplomatic activity. The objectives of such actions should be to destroy the terror infrastructure near the Line of Control. A strike on Lashkar-e-Toiba’s headquarters at Muridke in Pakistan’s Punjab province could generate robust political capital for any political party in India.

With increasing levels of frustration in the Indian Army and the worsening situation in the Kashmir Valley, a sub-conventional response by India becomes a likely scenario. It could enhance India’s strategic footprint and trigger the diplomatic isolation of Pakistan. The upcoming national elections could also push the existing government to act in such a manner.

As long as centralized actors control the making and implementation of policy in Pakistan, a sub-conventional response would, in all likelihood, generate dividends for India.

http://www.atimes.com/india-should-consider-sub-conventional-warfare-against-pakistan/


Loool. This is a funny article.

If a radicalized field commander decides to use tactical nukes. It's like a lieutenant has nuclear handgranades in his back pocket.
Then they talk about religious groups in Kashmir and that India doesn't have such assets in pakistan....well you have to have some faith. Indian wouldn't lay their life for a cow or a statue would they?..

Fun read for kids.
 
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Deluded Hindutva bigots. Right now Pakistan is not doing much but giving Kashmiri mujahideen vocal support. Believe me if Pakistan was giving full support to Kashmiri mujahideen, Indian soldiers would be running back to India with their tails between their legs.

Pakistan is in no position to do any proxy war at this stage, neither in Afg or India. Pakistan is a victim of proxy terrorism from India and foreign forces in Afg.

Now that Kashmiris are being pushed to the wall and facing new levels of oppression, Pakistan may be forced to take a more active role mainly through the UN and OIC.
 
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Ok what after pakistan falls, do you think the emerging states out of them will be stable? It will simply lead to radical groups taking over and more blood shed happening. It will become just like iraq and that will spill over across to our border. Then we will have western agencies using those ppl to create trouble in India. It is not a wise long term strategy.

If Pakistan is taken out permanently, then we no longer have any serious security threat. The current condition is worse than the scenario you have chalked out.

The reason why there is so much insurgency is because neither Pakistan nor Afghanistan are stable. When the US invaded Afghanistan, they did not bother to consider Pakistan as part of the problem. Had they seen both countries as one, the insurgents would have nowhere to hide. They will be forced to be part of the peace process. Pakistan is facing the same problem with TTP. Their ability to operate against the group is severely curtailed because of the border.

The US Army had always wanted to cross the border, which the USG never allowed. There is no victory without crossing the border. You saw where OBL was hiding.

So, if tomorrow we take out Pakistan and an insurgency ensues, we will have to deal with it alongside Afghanistan (and Iran and Russia as well), and force the insurgents to come to the table at gunpoint since there is no real border to skip and hide behind. Don't forget that a large chunk of these insurgents will be the remnants of the Pak Army too and will be much more easier to negotiate with than local warlords.

Sindh and Balochistan will likely be free from insurgency anyway. We can let Pakjab burn for another 50 years.

And no, even if our gambit fails, it won't spill over. Our borders are not soft.

Loool. This is a funny article.

If a radicalized field commander decides to use tactical nukes. It's like a lieutenant has nuclear handgranades in his back pocket.
Then they talk about religious groups in Kashmir and that India doesn't have such assets in pakistan....well you have to have some faith. Indian wouldn't lay their life for a cow or a statue would they?..

Fun read for kids.

No field commander has tactical nukes. And if tactical nukes are used, India will use strategic nukes and take out Pakistan in a first strike.
 
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If Pakistan is taken out permanently, then we no longer have any serious security threat. The current condition is worse than the scenario you have chalked out.

The reason why there is so much insurgency is because neither Pakistan nor Afghanistan are stable. When the US invaded Afghanistan, they did not bother to consider Pakistan as part of the problem. Had they seen both countries as one, the insurgents would have nowhere to hide. They will be forced to be part of the peace process. Pakistan is facing the same problem with TTP. Their ability to operate against the group is severely curtailed because of the border.

The US Army had always wanted to cross the border, which the USG never allowed. There is no victory without crossing the border. You saw where OBL was hiding.

So, if tomorrow we take out Pakistan and an insurgency ensues, we will have to deal with it alongside Afghanistan (and Iran and Russia as well), and force the insurgents to come to the table at gunpoint since there is no real border to skip and hide behind. Don't forget that a large chunk of these insurgents will be the remnants of the Pak Army too and will be much more easier to negotiate with than local warlords.

Sindh and Balochistan will likely be free from insurgency anyway. We can let Pakjab burn for another 50 years.

And no, even if our gambit fails, it won't spill over. Our borders are not soft.



No field commander has tactical nukes. And if tactical nukes are used, India will use strategic nukes and take out Pakistan in a first strike.

Nice daydream.
 
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Deluded Hindutva bigots. Right now Pakistan is not doing much but giving Kashmiri mujahideen vocal support. Believe me if Pakistan was giving full support to Kashmiri mujahideen, Indian soldiers would be running back to India with their tails between their legs.

Pakistan is in no position to do any proxy war at this stage, neither in Afg or India. Pakistan is a victim of proxy terrorism from India and foreign forces in Afg.

Now that Kashmiris are being pushed to the wall and facing new levels of oppression, Pakistan may be forced to take a more active role mainly through the UN and OIC.

Oh suuure, India is going all the way to Afghanistan from Iran to spread terrorism in pakistan but pak isn't doing anything in Kashmir.
So believable.

You are fooling no one, ever since the inception of both our countries pak has been using non state actors, so let's not pretend like the leopard has suddenly changed its spots and that pakistan won't use any means necessary.

Pakistan tried its best back in the 80s & 90s and you failed.
mn.png
 
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LOL and you think you have better Layered ABM system than USA:help::suicide::suicide2::lol::rofl::enjoy:, Their own defense analyst stated that their layered ABM system capacity to intercept less than 50 ICBM, IRBM,MRBM etc etc fired from China and Russia @indianfighter1999 :crazy::crazy::crazy:

ICBMs from china Russia are sure too much to handle for any ABM, but all pakistan has is IRBMs
 
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More time I means more swift war from India and weaker Pakistan. Our capability had trumendously improved Its just a stupid move my Pakistan and just an phone call from Modi...

But I don't think India will restrict itself from retaliation but dividing Pakistan into 5 parts.And open up gateway from Afghanistan to India


LOL do u even know about each other capabilities ? Your hope is not Pakistan Army but Chinese Army . Just pray for their help
Says the guys who.only did rundi Rona after Mumbai and didn't dare to go to war
Even if another Mumbai happens u would again do your rundi Rona and your modi will give lollipop to stupid bhgats in form of fake strikes ;)

Oh suuure, India is going all the way to Afghanistan from Iran to spread terrorism in pakistan but pak isn't doing anything in Kashmir.
So believable.

You are fooling no one, ever since the inception of both our countries pak has been using non state actors, so let's not pretend like the leopard has suddenly changed its spots and that pakistan won't use any means necessary.

Pakistan tried its best back in the 80s & 90s and you failed.
View attachment 481847
After 911 pak attention diverted to afg and u got a lucky break but that break is over now and that graph is rising again :)
 
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Says the guys who.only did rundi Rona after Mumbai and didn't dare to go to war
Even if another Mumbai happens u would again do your rundi Rona and your modi will give lollipop to stupid bhgats in form of fake strikes ;)


After 911 pak attention diverted to afg and u got a lucky break but that break is over now and that graph is rising again :)

This is because Mumbai was a false flag operation. Everyone knows it. Pakistan is now under US pressure not because of Mumbai attacks, but failing Afghanistan war.
 
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India already tried that sub conventional war faire aka terrorism using ttp and bla which Pak army crushed now Indian ttp assets even being hit inside afg like fazlulah after USA approaching pak for dialogue mediation with Afghanistan Taliban which is inevitable conclusion of USA war of Afghanistan :)
 
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After 911 pak attention diverted to afg and u got a lucky break but that break is over now and that graph is rising again :)

Oh please, spare me your threats.

If you lot had any chance of actually having any success you would have gotten it back in the 90s.
It's too late now, we have reinforced our border, improved J&K police and the army has a better intelligence network, your honeymoon period is over.
The graph at best is fluctuating to a steady halt and will never hit 90s level but keep trying, you'll be failing anyhow.
 
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I always say a nice conventional war is required between the 2 neighbours.
India mostly has Russian weapons , while Pakistan has american weapons. This will be a classic conflict without one country having overwhelming advantage.
Su mki30 and mirage 2000 against f16 ,
T90 against t84, etc.
Of course Pakistan getting surreptitious support from China.
American and Russian support is a conundrum.
Go for it.
 
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Oh please, spare me your threats.

If you lot had any chance of actually having any success you would have gotten it back in the 90s.
It's too late now, we have reinforced our border, improved J&K police and the army has a better intelligence network, your honeymoon period is over.
The graph at best is fluctuating to a steady halt and will never hit 90s level but keep trying, you'll be failing anyhow.
Then why your people doing so.much rundi Rona :)
And also see the graph from 2016 to 18 and this graph will rise with inevitable USA withdrawal and as for 90s Kashmir became death sentence for Indian forces the soldiers posted there used to drink gutter water to be hospitalized instead of being sent to field if it wasn't for 911 u guys know it would have been for u what Vietnam and Afghanistan were for USA and Soviet
And now ur doing rundi Rona because it is becoming for u ;(
 
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Sub conventional warfare aka state sponsored terrorism , has been going on against Pakistan since 9/11, when Pakistani establishment foolishly gave away the strategic depth in Afghansitan on platter to America. Since then, the American establishment have brought in all its minions from the around the world, including India, to play their dirty games against Pakistan from Afghan soil.

OP is asking the wrong question. Sub conventional warfare (terrorism) against Pakistan has been going on for more then a decade.

What Pakistan needs to do to evict the American establishment from Afghanistan which in turn will make minions like India sitting ducks. Secure strategic depth and ensure no one will ever use Afghan soil against Pakistan, and in parallel active the insurgencies all across India. To achieve peace in Pakistan, all enemy nations must be kept in perpetual internal mess, so much so , that no one got time and energy to mess with Pakistan in future.
 
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Then why your people doing so.much rundi Rona :)
And also see the graph from 2016 to 18 and this graph will rise with inevitable USA withdrawal and as for 90s Kashmir became death sentence for Indian forces the soldiers posted there used to drink gutter water to be hospitalized instead of being sent to field if it wasn't for 911 u guys know it would have been for u what Vietnam and Afghanistan were for USA and Soviet
And now ur doing rundi Rona because it is becoming for u ;(

Really?
All I see is pakistanis doing their randi rona because of how the evil yindoos will unleash sub conventional warfare on them.

Why don't you see the graph from 2012-2018, the fatalities have been rising on the terrorists side disproportionately as compared to security forces.
So yeah, you are losing.
Only thing I remember about the 90s is pakistan losing a war which eventually led to your downward spiral and our rise.

Yawn, excuses and more excuses.
You couldn't do it in the 90s when we were far weaker forget about doing anything now, when we have increased the gap between us significantly and have become the fastest growing BRICS nation to boot.
 
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