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India should accept defeat before Kashmiris’ struggle, says Nawaz

I am not talking about Pakistan, It is about Kashmiris themselves.. Why Pakistan should be involved at all in this?
If you hold a referendum on Kashmir, and the people decide to separate, then they can call their nation anything they want or join Pakistan if they want, and I am putting the emphasis on they_The Kashmiris_


Kashmir by itself is no entity, it forms one region of a State that acceded to India.

Among all the states that merged into India / Pak no state merged in parts - it was all or nothing.

Pakistan & Pakistanis cherry pick one region of a state from where all their water flows through into Pakistan and make a noise about it.

No happening
 
Wow....Time to distribute the sweets ..Our dumb Prime minister has finally broken the ice.
 
Kashmir by itself is no entity, it forms one region of a State that acceded to India.

Among all the states that merged into India / Pak no state merged in parts - it was all or nothing.

Pakistan & Pakistanis cherry pick one region of a state from where all their water flows through into Pakistan and make a noise about it.

No happening

Junagarh and Manavadar both acceded to Pakistan....we all know what happened to them...
 
With regards to the number of Troops in Kashmir, the actual figure is classified.
Based on reliable estimates the number ranges from 300,000 to 600,000.
There have been cases of an increase in police and paramilitary forces.
There are even reports of a decrease in Indian Troops in Kashmir.

Sources:-
http://www.cotf.edu/earthinfo/sasia/kashmir/KAtopic5.html
http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/lead/kashmir-fewer-troops-more-peace/article559791
6.ece

http://www.voanews.com/content/indi...in-kashmir-by-a-quarter-113602524/166895.html

I don't want you, of all people, to fall into this trap. I have very high expectations of you.

Let me explain.

Until recently, there were two Army Corps in the general vicinity of Kashmir; now there are three. Please follow the rest of VERY carefully.

There is XIV Corps in the far north, consisting of two divisions (locations, numbers already given earlier, and I am getting bored of this), one facing the LOC at Dras (that's where the Kargil thing happened, so you can guess why) and one facing the PLA.

There is XV Corps in the Valley, more or less, two divisions again, one at Gurez, one at Baramula.

There is the XVI Corps down outside the Valley, south of the Banihal Pass, watching to see that there are no Akhtar Maliks or Eftekhars; this time, of three divisions, one at Rajauri, one at Jammu, and one at Yol (don't sweat it, it's near Dharamshala, in the hills behind, in deep echelon).

So there we have it, two divisions in the Valley, more or less. A division is 15,000 troops and perhaps another 8,000 support staff for a three division Corps; even though XV Corps is two division, let us go on the generous side. That gives us (15,000 + 8,000 =) 23,000 x 2 = 46,000 max.

Let's go for gold; let's assume three divisions per Corps and all three shoehorned into the valley, treading on each other's toes. That's 23,000 x 3 x 3 = 207,000 max.

You can add another 100,000 RR and armed police; nothing goes beyond 300,000. And the actual figure is closer to 60 or 70,000 policemen.

So the realistic figure is 93,000 soldiers and 70,000 police. Do the math.

As I say this, there is a very slow build up on the XIV Corps front, one armoured division being built in stages, now at the moment, two or maybe three armoured regiments strong. This is speculative, as my own guess is that it will finally look like a mechanised division with an integral armoured brigade. Even that taken into account lowers the figure, as armoured formations typically have fewer soldiers on the complement than infantry.

There you are, then.

Junagarh and Manavadar both acceded to Pakistan....we all know what happened to them...


No,no, long story, and I'm not in the mood. One of my colleagues has already warned me in personal mail that I am getting testy and crotchety, so perhaps we will leave this for some other date.
 
All off topic troll/rants reported and rated.

You may disagree with what he said but do so in a civilized manner. Similes and one liners do not make your argument look any stronger rather it makes you look stupid. Refrain from trolling and flaming!
 
Gen Raheel Showing his abilities and Power
India should be scared now it is time to free Kashmir on wishes of Kashmiris
How long you will press this matter, one day it has to be separate from India so being a good student of global class room they should free them, Bitter Truth
 
I don't want you, of all people, to fall into this trap. I have very high expectations of you.

Let me explain.

Until recently, there were two Army Corps in the general vicinity of Kashmir; now there are three. Please follow the rest of VERY carefully.

There is XIV Corps in the far north, consisting of two divisions (locations, numbers already given earlier, and I am getting bored of this), one facing the LOC at Dras (that's where the Kargil thing happened, so you can guess why) and one facing the PLA.

There is XV Corps in the Valley, more or less, two divisions again, one at Gurez, one at Baramula.

There is the XVI Corps down outside the Valley, south of the Banihal Pass, watching to see that there are no Akhtar Maliks or Eftekhars; this time, of three divisions, one at Rajauri, one at Jammu, and one at Yol (don't sweat it, it's near Dharamshala, in the hills behind, in deep echelon).

So there we have it, two divisions in the Valley, more or less. A division is 15,000 troops and perhaps another 8,000 support staff for a three division Corps; even though XV Corps is two division, let us go on the generous side. That gives us (15,000 + 8,000 =) 23,000 x 2 = 46,000 max.

Let's go for gold; let's assume three divisions per Corps and all three shoehorned into the valley, treading on each other's toes. That's 23,000 x 3 x 3 = 207,000 max.

You can add another 100,000 RR and armed police; nothing goes beyond 300,000. And the actual figure is closer to 60 or 70,000 policemen.

So the realistic figure is 93,000 soldiers and 70,000 police. Do the math.

As I say this, there is a very slow build up on the XIV Corps front, one armoured division being built in stages, now at the moment, two or maybe three armoured regiments strong. This is speculative, as my own guess is that it will finally look like a mechanised division with an integral armoured brigade. Even that taken into account lowers the figure, as armoured formations typically have fewer soldiers on the complement than infantry.

There you are, then.

No,no, long story, and I'm not in the mood. One of my colleagues has already warned me in personal mail that I am getting testy and crotchety, so perhaps we will leave this for some other date.

Thank you for the detailed explanation. I research first and then fall into traps... ;)
The figures I came up with are from International and Indian Sources...Which I placed in my response...

Junagarh and Manavadar were mentioned to corner third eye...I want to see his response...
 
Thank you for the detailed explanation. I research first and then fall into traps... ;)
The figures I came up with are from International and Indian Sources...Which I placed in my response...

Junagarh and Manavadar were mentioned to corner third eye...I want to see his response...

You research very well. Haven't seen you falling into major traps yet. If I do, you may be sure I will point out the data points well in time. No worries. I'll shut up about the rest.
 
Junagarh and Manavadar both acceded to Pakistan....we all know what happened to them...

I am glad that you are knowledgeable but whats your point here ?

FYI Manavadar was a vassal to Junagadh which in turn was a vassal to Baroda State

Have I been cornered ?
 
Vegies cant keep a lid on this anylonger the kashmiris hate them, get over it and listen to the will of the people, apply the UN resolutions.
 
Gen Raheel Showing his abilities and Power
India should be scared now it is time to free Kashmir on wishes of Kashmiris
How long you will press this matter, one day it has to be separate from India so being a good student of global class room they should free them, Bitter Truth

Just wait till the INDIAN ARMY STRIKE CORPS gets deployed on the Border

Then We will see who says what

With regards to the number of Troops in Kashmir, the actual figure is classified.
Based on reliable estimates the number ranges from 300,000 to 600,000.
There have been cases of an increase in police and paramilitary forces.
There are even reports of a decrease in Indian Troops in Kashmir.

Are you aware of the Actual and Real SIZE of the Indian Army

If you knew ; you would not guess or speculate on how many troops are in Kashmir
 
Gen Raheel Showing his abilities and Power
India should be scared now it is time to free Kashmir on wishes of Kashmiris
How long you will press this matter, one day it has to be separate from India so being a good student of global class room they should free them, Bitter Truth
Well.. then he better hurry up... he has less than 100 days before he retires.. and from what I have heard he is not planing an extension...
 
Gen Raheel Showing his abilities and Power
India should be scared now it is time to free Kashmir on wishes of Kashmiris

Of course India is scared .. its scared stiff , why..its immobilized with fright.

I suspect its the scared stiff part which is the reason why India has not moved an inch in J&K nor ever will.
 

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