India’s vanishing Parsis

[INDIC]

Sad. I blame the Arabs... Did they invade India too?

They conquered Sindh and South Punjab(present Pakistan) but could not move further Eastward after the Battle of Rajasthan in 8th century.

 

[vsdoc]

Page badlo post .... now with Chrome

hello is there anybody out there

 

[PlanetWarrior]

That is already possible for Parsi kids of Parsi father - Non-Parsi mother unions.

Not vice versa.

For a progressive community, we are pretty conservative and chauvinistic.



You have to be born a Parsi.

But you actually formally enter the faith only with your religious investiture / thread ceremony (Navjote).

And Navjote is not allowed for non-Parsi fathered kids. Even if and when both husband and wife are willing.

The flip side is that in those cases where Parsi fathered (non-Parsi mother) kids are concerned, thanks to our fundamentally tolerant and equal/fair/democratic/whatever you call it nature and religious ethos, the Parsi fathers do not insist on their kids having their Navjotes - citing informed choice of the kids as a reason, to be allowed by the parents to their kids when they grow up - in terms of which faith they would like to follow.

Conveniently forgetting that a Navjote can only be performed before Puberty sets in (I think its 12 for guys though most have it by 9, and 9 for girls though most nowadays have it by 7).

Massive **** up man .... we are basically too clever or too stubborn for our own good.

That sacred thread ceremony for boys sounds like the jeno sanskar for Brahmins in Hinduism

 

[Black Widow]

2000 years ago, religion believed in purity, pure blood. Thats why conversion was not considered a tool to increase head count. The older religions don't believe in conversion.

Then come Christianism, when it was founded (some 2000 years ago) conversion was made tool . Then Islam was founded some 1300 years ago, Same tool used by Islam. Chirtianism and Islam were founded on same concept, Conversion. Both copied existing methodology of worship and living (there is nothing in Xians and Islam which was not performed earlier), all activities in both religions are borrowed from local/alien cultures.


If Parsis are really concerned, they should follow Islam path (Not violence but conversion) Parsis should allow Persian to revert to There original religion. Parsis are rich, so they can spend some money to revert Irani persians.

 

[vsdoc]

That sacred thread ceremony for boys sounds like the jeno sanskar for Brahmins in Hinduism

Its very similar.

If Parsis are really concerned, they should follow Islam path (Not violence but conversion) Parsis should allow Persian to revert to There original religion. Parsis are rich, so they can spend some money to revert Irani persians. [/COLOR]

Iranian Zoroastrians also do not inter-marry with the local Muslim populace as far as I know.

But the conversion taboo is only Indian (Parsi). I don't think there is any law against it (reversion in the case of Iranian Muslims) in Iran as far as the faith is concerned.

However there is the little matter of death for apostasy to take care of first.

 

[Black Widow]

What I mean by Irani persian is Converted Muslims (Those Parsi who converted to Islam due to various reasons.)

Converted Muslims must revert to there real faith.

 

[vsdoc]

What I mean by Irani persian is Converted Muslims (Those Parsi who converted to Islam due to various reasons.)

Converted Muslims must revert to there real faith.

I know what you meant.

I have had this discussion with some Iranians like Abii here.

Iranians have been Muslim for a long long time now.

Islam and the Arab influence of a millenium cannot be reversed in a few generations.

Yes, many of the current generations given the chance and opportunity free from persecution and a violent death would probably wholeheartedly revert to their ancestral Zoroastrian faith.

And this would snowball in the generations to come. Iran is like that. Iranians are like that. And truth be told, secretly, though they would never admit it, the rest of the Sunni Muslim majority would heave a massive sigh of relief. That's the huge pain the presence of Iran poses to the rest of the Arab ideology dominated Islamic world.

Yes many of them (official Muslim Iranians) even today quietly and secretly do worship as per their ancient faith within their homes.

But they cannot go openly to fire temples. Doing so would invite death (apostasy - leaving Islam) at the hands of their hardcore Shia clerics.

But the movement is gathering steam.

Sometime back the clerics tried to test the waters and ban Navroze.

Then there was talk of building a big dam that would have inundated many of the holiest ancient Zoroastrian sites.

I believe both Zoroastrian and Muslim Iranians rose as one and quickly disabused the clerics of any such notions.

So I believe. As does every Parsi alive today. Wherever in the world he or she may be.

And we have faith and pray to Ahura Mazda, who knows all, sees all, and controls all.

And we live life per His simple commandments - Good Thoughts, Good Words, Good Deeds.

Humata Hukta Hvarshta

 

[russellpeters]

iranians and parsis are our civilizational cousins.

i am happy to see that Iran, though officially Islamic, has not denounced its ancient culture, and symbols of its Zoroastrian past have not been purged.

So much so, that the name for Salat (the Muslim Prayer ritual) is also given as Namaz. Now Namaz is an ancient avestan word for 'to prostrate' , cognate with the sanskrit 'namah'.

We must extend all support and fraternity to them. As they promised, Parsis have been akin to sugar in milk.

 

[vsdoc]

As they promised, Parsis have been akin to sugar in milk.

Thanks bro. It would truly not have been possible without the rest of you.

Left at the wrong temperature or the introduction of pesky yeasts, milk tends to curdle quickly.

Only in India can you melt like sugar yet remain proudly crystalline.

And for that Zoroastrianism owes a debt of gratitude to India.

All of India, and not just the Hindus.

 

[somebozo]

Every minority will soon become vanished in rising shining democratic india!

 

[vsdoc]

Every minority will soon become vanished in rising shining democratic india!

 

[INDIC]

Thanks bro. It would truly not have been possible without the rest of you..

What was the name of the community leader who sent back milk mixed with Sugar.

 

[russellpeters]

Every minority will soon become vanished in rising shining democratic india!

this, gentlemen, is a fine example of the difference between literacy and education.

 

[vsdoc]

What was the name of the community leader who sent back milk mixed with Sugar.

I know the name of the Hindu Rajput king - Jadi Rana. He is a part of our religious folklore now (Qissa-e-Sanjan).

Qissa-i Sanjan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


The Story of Sanjan (also Qissa-i Sanjan or Kisse-i Sanjan) (Persian: قصه سنجان‎, Gujarati: કિસે સનજા&#2728 is an account of the early years of Zoroastrian settlers on the Indian subcontinent. In the absence of alternatives, the text is generally accepted to be the only narrative of the events described therein, and many members of the Parsi community perceive the epic poem to be an accurate account of their ancestors.

The account begins in Greater Khorasan, and narrates the travel of the emigrants to Gujarat, on the west coast of present-day India. The first chapter, which is the longest, ends with the establishment of a Fire Temple at Sanjan (Gujarat), and the later dispersion of their descendants. In later chapters, the Qissa narrates the success in repelling Islamic invaders, then the failure in the same, and the subsequent flight of the Zoroastrians. The account closes with a chapter on the conveyance of the "Fire of the Warharan" to Navsari.

In its conclusion, the story is signed by a Parsi priest named Bahman Kaikobad (or 'Bahman Kaikobad Hamjiar Sanjana'[1]). The date of authorship is recorded as 969 YZ (1599 CE, see Zoroastrian calendar) - several centuries after the described events are thought to have occurred. The account is in verse, in the highly verbose style common to Persian poetry.

 

[Contrarian]

Parsis in analogy can truly be referred to as the Jews of India.

Vsdoc, would you elaborate, in an academic manner, why you feel that there is a possibility of having many Iranians revert back to Zoroastrianism. Whether that number of re-converts reaches a critical point to have a snowballing effect is something separate thing. Are there re-conversions in Iran from Islam to Zoroastrianism?