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India Reinvents Obsolete F-16s

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February 17, 2012: India is buying 99 American F414 jet engines, for $8.1 million each. These will be used for the new LCA (Light Combat Aircraft, or "Tejas") jet fighter. Eventually, most of the LCAs built will be powered by the Indian Kaveri engine, which is still in development hell. The F414s will substitute only until the Kaveri is ready. But the Kaveri never seems to be ready. This is a big problem.

In one of many attempts to deal with the Kaveri problem, two years ago India made arrangements with French engine manufacturer Snecma, to provide technical assistance. Criticis in the Indian air force asserted that help from Snecma would not save the ill-fated Kaveri engine program. But the government apparently believes that it is necessary for India to acquire the ability to design and build world class jet engines, whatever the cost. Only a few nations can do this, and India wants to be one of them, soon, at whatever cost. Despite decades of effort, the Kaveri is still far from ready for production.

When work began on the Kaveri, in the mid-1980s, it was believed that the LCA would be ready for flight testing by 1990. A long list of technical delays put off that first flight until 2001. Corners had to be cut to make this happen, for the LCA was originally designed to use the Indian built Kaveri engine, and the engine was not ready.

For a jet fighter, the engine is the most complex part of the aircraft, and the Kaveri has had its share of setbacks. Fortunately, there was an American engine, the GE F404 that fit the LCA, and could be used as a stop-gap. The F414 is a more recent model of the F404, and has 15 percent more thrust. So as long as the Kaveri engine is not ready, the American engine fills in.

The LCA is only now preparing to enter mass production. Six prototypes and sixteen pre-production models exist. Mass production (at least 20 aircraft a year) was to begin, no matter what, this year. Or at least that's the plan. For over two decades, India has been trying to design, develop and manufacture its own "lightweight fighter," but the project has been a major disaster. It has, however been a valuable, and very expensive, learning experience.

Meanwhile, the 1970s era American F-16 is probably the premier "lightweight fighter" in service, and began joining squadrons about the time India came up with the LCA project. Both the F-16 (at least the earlier models) and the LCA weigh about 12-13 tons. But the F-16 is a high performance aircraft, with a proven combat record, while the LCA is sort of an improved Mirage/MiG-21 type design. Not too shabby, and cheap (about half the cost of an F-16). Also, for all this time, money and grief, India has made its aviation industry a bit more capable and mature.

For all this, India only plans to buy 200-300 LCAs, mainly to replace its aging MiG-21s, plus more if the navy finds the LCA works on carriers. Export prospects are dim, given all the competition out there (especially for cheap, second-hand F-16s). The delays have led the air force to look around for a hundred or so new aircraft (or even used F-16s) to fill the gap between elderly MiG-21s falling apart, and the arrival of the new LCAs. However, two decades down the road, the replacement for the LCA will probably be a more competitive, and timely, aircraft.

Three years ago, the Indian Navy announced it was buying six of the new LCA fighters to operate from the new carriers that are to enter service in the next five years. This is an experiment to see how the LCA will do as a carrier aircraft. The first LCA carrier trials are to take place next year. The navy has already bought navalized MiG-29s for these carriers. The navy LCAs will also be navalized (mainly stronger landing gear, a tail hook and different cockpit electronics.) The MiG-29K weighs 21 tons (16 percent weapons), while the navalized LCA weighs 13 tons (34 percent of that weapons). The MiG-29 is a better fighter, but the LCA carries a little more (4 versus 3.5 tons) armament, making it a cheaper way to attack ships or land targets with missiles and bombs.

Procurement: India Reinvents Obsolete F-16s
 
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FE -414 is still powering F-18 Super Hornet which is used extensively by USA. So, point 1. There is nothing wrong with the engine. Its still a great engine.

LCA Delays - Are we making any paper planes to create it in a day! It will take time. But surely India needs her own aircraft productivity. So any delay is worth waiting as long as we can develop indigenously!

Export maybe possible with the development of AMCA :smitten:
 
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JFT is a cropped delta..better do a research
JFT has Lerx for High AOA
DSI to decrease weight and decrease RCS..a advance tech
And JFT is damn agile on par with F-16 and you might have also checked the videos
JFT is closest in design to F-16..wing design with lerx.

on the othr hand LCa is a pure Compound Delta very less agile.
basd on mirages of 60's.

AND JFT inferior to LCA is all the indian drea

LCA having 45% of composite still weight more than JFT..both empty and loaded
give rise to two possibility
either the Composite is 3rd grade

or no composite are used
LCA is yet to fire a guided WVR.
20 Aircrafts for 2014 mid

On the other hand
JFT has anti ship and sead role achieved
50 almost inducted.
Block II within few months(lca mkII 2017-18 first squarden)
So Lets Check:

JF17 :Empty Weight : 6,586 kg
LCA : Empty Wight : 6,560 kg
LCA is lighter

JF-17 Max. takeoff weight: 12,383 kg
LCA: Max. takeoff weight: 13,200 kg
Carry more fuel and Weapons LCA

JF-17 : G-limit: +8 g / -3 g


LCA : g-limits: +9/−3.5 g[97
More Maneuverable : LCA

JG-17 Internal Fuel Capacity: 2,300 kg
LCA: Internal fuel capacity: 2,458 kg


J-17 : Maximum speed: Mach 1.6
LCA :Maximum speed: Mach 1.8


Now See Production :
JF-17 Block 1 – Production in China began in June 2006. The first eight Small Batch Production (SBP) aircraft, using the second prototype configuration, were produced in China and delivered to the PAF's JF-17 Test & Evaluation Flight from March 2007[to early 2008. A contract between the PAF and CATIC for 42 serial production aircraft was signed in March 2009. The first three Chinese weapons to be integrated are the PL-5E II AAM, SD-10 AAM and C-802K anti-shipping missile. PL-5E II integration was completed in mid 2010.

While Till now India has produced
2 Nos TD
5 Nos PV
6 Nos LSP + 2 Planned (For AirForce Use)
after that 1-40 Production Unit after that Block-11 will start (Engine / Radar is finalized/ Designed Freeze)


If you Know Rafael / Euro Fighter is also based on Delta Wing concept of 60's ..........
 
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Jf17 is reality we hav inducted these when u hav LCA inducted then come and compare.
 
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my question is,from when did f-16 became obsolete?

never, at least not yet!

It's still a fine fighter, with still what's considered a damn good airframe, and has been vastly upgraded to Block 60 standard.
It's battle proven and an awesome MR platform. I don't see it as obsolete, and I suspect there will be more orders for the F-16 and some more upgrades!

regards,
 
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Offtopic :What a whitewash on this thread by Mods ! Well This article is about LCA and F-16 not jf17 not rd-93.

Ontopic: F16's may be obsolete by western standards i.e they not procured by USA any more... but it's very capable platform for developing countries...This plane has created it's legacy... not only a hardware it is 'cult' like AK47.
But the government apparently believes that it is necessary for India to acquire the ability to design and build world class jet engines, whatever the cost
This is called determination!!
In democracy there is one big drawback "too many tongues"....but when all tongues speak with same voice, it's is hard to resist.
 
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importing F414 engine for our LCAs will kill the whole concept of indigenous production:disagree:...its better to be late than never!!
 
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importing F414 engine for our LCAs will kill the whole concept of indigenous production:disagree:...its better to be late than never!!

True .. but F414 is a very robust and capable engine it will give new heights to LCA project. USA is our 'strategic ally' .. our interest converges that's why i don't think USA will slap with sanctions.

Jet engine is very complex structure , Even Gripen also have this engine .... i think ,In this globalized world Indigenous has changed it's meaning... it's always how much % indigenous not absolute Indigenous :flirt:
 
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never, at least not yet!

It's still a fine fighter, with still what's considered a damn good airframe, and has been vastly upgraded to Block 60 standard.
It's battle proven and an awesome MR platform. I don't see it as obsolete, and I suspect there will be more orders for the F-16 and some more upgrades!

regards,
i also do not consider the viper as an obsolete platform.i was questioning the author of the article.
 
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