India raises concern over Russian attack copter sale to Pakistan

[holysaturn]

Not happy with this ... Our Military think tanks are big failure in weapons purchase policy making from past 30 years

just 50+ F16s in which half are old
30 years old Gunships xcept few
No Super Cobra nor Apache etc

Its not about the money but about the policy making and lobby... IMO this is bulky helicopter and easy to down through any anti weapon....

Russians weapons are shit... either Su30 or stealth aircraft or helicopter.. all are bulky....

Very true mi-35s(helicopter in general) dont have a very good history against light AAA and MANPADS .After vietnam, afganistan ,now again in iraq. Why dont the generals dont understand the vulnerability of attack helicopters even against light air defences ,instead they criticize A-10s as not being survivable against modern air defences. A-10 and super tucano type counter insurgency aircraft will be ideal for PAF or any airforce instead of mi-35,apache.

 

[KingMamba]

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@Irfan Baloch @Icarus

Lmaooo so true.

 

[Indischer]

From the days when we fielded Soviet gunships(still do) and Pakistan fielded American gunships to us getting Apaches and Pakistanis getting MI 35s....foreign policy has come a full circle.

 

[Bratva]

These Helies are perfect for what we need right now , no other Heli can fill that role , we need a fast mode of transportation to drop a team of 6-8 men provide them cover during the time they complete their task & then extract them .

Now since you are such and excellent Weapons Procurement expect , please tell me which Heli should we buy ?

Fox Saheb, Two of these Helis were brought down in Iraq by AA Gun and it's armor is not as thick as we think it is

 

[Rahil khan]

From the days when we fielded Soviet gunships(still do) and Pakistan fielded American gunships to us getting Apaches and Pakistanis getting MI 35s....foreign policy has come a full circle.

I was thinking the same..!

 

[Indischer]

I was thinking the same..!

Further proof that Churchill knew what he was talking about. Nations just have permanent interests, not friends.

The ease with which we see the powers-that-be arm the 'adversaries' of their 'trusted allies' makes me wonder if Nations were to be personified, they'd have to be shown as pre-pubescant school kids.

 

[F.O.X]

Fox Saheb, Two of these Helis were brought down in Iraq by AA Gun and it's armor is not as thick as we think it is

Our Cobra was also taken down by AA fire from militants , so does that mean they are not effective, or that we should not use them against terrorists ?

 

[Alfa-Fighter]

Russia also announced to replace its Mi-24/35 with MI-28N aka "havoc" and Ka-52 . ......and IAF also decided to replace its Mi-35

i don't know why india would feel insecure by decade old n replaced technology copters. and don't know why PAK poster beating their chest with proud with rejected n obsolete technology and claiming it a coup.

 

[FNFAL]

@Bratva @F.O.X
Where it was hit is of paramount importance
The weakest section of the Hind is her tail boom section..rather for any helicopter apart from the contra rotating ones.The soviets hind loses in afg could be attributed to two primary reasons:
1. Stingers: The exhausts were near rotor hubs.
2. 50 cal file severing tail rotor shaft.
I am certain in case of iraq, the hit was on the tail section My 2 cents

 

[Pandora]

Why would we offer any incentive?

Obviously if india is asking for no deal to pakistan then they would obviously have to offer some deal in return to russians.

 

[HAIDER]

I am not thrilled of Russia selling to Pakistan, it should offer better than just Mi-35s.

Recently Ukraine, Syria and Iraq via ISIS - Mi24/Mi35 were shot down by anti-aircraft rockets.

Non Russian Mi24/35 shotdown in above three conflicts yet......Not in my knowledge.

 

[Bratva]

Our Cobra was also taken down by AA fire from militants , so does that mean they are not effective, or that we should not use them against terrorists ?

Two Mi-24/35 brought down in Iraq when they were doing low level missile strafing by AA. The scenario of dropping 6-8 soldiers sticking out for a while and picking them up isn't perfect and it increases collateral damage where only two pilots would have died, now 6-8 SF soldiers lives are at stack which could be brought down in 3 stage process by AA.

By spending money on Mi-35, why not spend on a better platform which carry more armament (8-16 ATGM missiles Vs 4 ATGM on cobras) or carry guided 2.75" missiles jn large amount. Have better avionics and can secure LZ or carryout precision strikes from an appropriate distance or height where AA can't reach it.

Cobra are effective for close range attacks. We need platforms which do stand off range attacks. from a height of 4000-5000 Meters or at a distance of 4-5 KM.

 

[HRK]

My condolences to taliban NOT... and obviously for our indian pals... specially the indian govt.. and Ms Sushma Swaraj .



Don't sell helicopters to Pakistan, India tells Russia

I read somewhere Pakistan is buying these hellies for Anti Narcotics Force and will be used for 'anti narcotics operations' ......

 

[ptldM3]

Its not about the money but about the policy making and lobby... IMO this is bulky helicopter and easy to down through any anti weapon....

Two points that you can not grasp. The MI-24/35 is the most heavily armored helicopter in the word, it can, for instance, withstand 12.7mm rounds to its rotor bladed. In fact, the entire helicopter is protected to withstand 12.7mm rounds. Even with direst hits by stinger type rounds to surface missiles, MI-24's were able to land, most other attack helicopters can not even take hits from 7.62.

So your logic that it is easy to down is simply based on ignorance. Also elaborate on what you mean by "bulky" if you think that a helicopter like a cobra is less vulnerable to surface to air missiles then you are very mistaken, the Cobra's smaller profile will not protect it, once a missile is locked it's locked. And contrary to popular myth helicopters can not outturn a missile, so a smaller helicopter has no advantages here.

Russians weapons are shit... either Su30 or stealth aircraft or helicopter.. all are bulky....

Yet Russians have been innovative in weapons design so much so that many of the designs/concepts that have come from the Soviet Union/Russia have been copied.

 

[Shahmir]

Poor indians must be weaping after hearing this news