India puts on hold talks with Pak on Iran pipeline till polls

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Sign the Nuclear Deal already!

The stupid govt wont!

Communist will pull it down since it does not help China!

 

[Contrarian]

For now i'll have to take it with the pinch of salt. Reason being that as soon as india's new master tells it to stop, india will raise another issue or for that matter maybe fake an attack on the parliment who knows, but i dont see it happening.

So true!

Pakistan should go for the chinese option, sending a pipe line from iran through pakistan to china. India needs to be booted out as its just a waste of time, the project has already be delayed, it is not possible to delay it any further.

Again, Spot on! How DO you have such insighful ideas IceCold? Really i'd like to know and learn!

 

[Interceptor]

^

Its a huge project and simply cant be done in a few days it might take a few years in context of its scale.

I think this project will help greatly in strengthening both countries economy, at the moment we can see the glimpse of this fuel crisis so the future isn't pretty without energy.

I am sure the GoP is looking forward to completing the project with India and Iran.

 

[EagleEyes]

The stupid govt wont!

Communist will pull it down since it does not help China!

Didn't know India was a communist loving nation.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

The stupid govt wont!

Communist will pull it down since it does not help China!

In some ways the communists in India and the Mullah's in Pakistan are similar - they are both loyal to ideological masters/ideology beyond the nation.

 

[IceCold]

So true!


Again, Spot on! How DO you have such insighful ideas IceCold? Really i'd like to know and learn!

Is it not Malay? Even Iran has on number of occasions its concerns about the delaying tactics being used by India and they told it to resolve the issue of an already much delayed project. What makes you so sure that India wont come up with another excuse specially after the level of tilt that we are seeing these days in India's foreign policy towards the US.

 

[vish]

Is it not Malay? Even Iran has on number of occasions its concerns about the delaying tactics being used by India and they told it to resolve the issue of an already much delayed project. What makes you so sure that India wont come up with another excuse specially after the level of tilt that we are seeing these days in India's foreign policy towards the US.

Equalizing this "tilt" to a "master-slave scenario" goes beyond my logic.

The pipeline's been held up due to many factors.

The strongest factor driving the interest in this pipeline is the soaring price of crude oil.

 

[Contrarian]

Is it not Malay? Even Iran has on number of occasions its concerns about the delaying tactics being used by India and they told it to resolve the issue of an already much delayed project. What makes you so sure that India wont come up with another excuse specially after the level of tilt that we are seeing these days in India's foreign policy towards the US.

Had you posted such a reply with a reason to your logic, you would have gained and would gain much more respect on this forum, than by posting a tirade against India which would then make other members indifferent to your future posts.

Equating a foreign policy tilt to a master slave relationship is flaming and nothing else.

Now, to answer your logic, yes there is a very perceptible tilt and a deliberate attempt to HOLD or DELAY the final decision on the pipeline project bcause the govt wants to know which way the chips fall on the nuclear deal. At this point of time, holding off the pipeline would mean smoother passage for the nuke deal in the NSG and other fora, and signing it would give more ammo to the non proliferation hawks and many US senators.

Secondly, if the nuke deal does go through, the govt would most definitely sign the pipeline agreement to placate the left or as a consolation prize you can say, and even if the nuke deal doesnt go through then there is an alternate source of energy available through this pipeline and the govt can claim that they look for the best options for the country.

What im trying to say is that the pipeline project WILL commence sooner or later, there is only an attempt to delay it to get the best of both sides.

 

[Energon]

Is it not Malay? Even Iran has on number of occasions its concerns about the delaying tactics being used by India and they told it to resolve the issue of an already much delayed project. What makes you so sure that India wont come up with another excuse specially after the level of tilt that we are seeing these days in India's foreign policy towards the US.

Yes, we saw the level of this "tilt" when India quickly signed on to the US sponsored "nuclear deal" and started ordering large amounts of US arms immediately.

India wants the great offers US is putting on the table really badly; but they know that prompt acceptances of deals with the US come with great risks; mostly that of becoming a rental state.

The commies undoubtedly are idiots and they are supporting an ideology that has long proven to be a failure; the only peripheral advantage of their tantrums and subsequent impediments is that it shows that India can't be bought over rapidly via some backroom deal regardless of how "great" the offer is. The matter will be discussed openly and throughly where even input from the most ridiculous segments of the political machinery (and come on, the commies are about as ridiculous as anyone gets) is taken and factored into the decision making process; and this is what every pro democracy lobby group will applaud in the west regardless of how it frustrates their governments.

Now there are massive short-term drawbacks in these frustrating delays and protractions. The common argument of course is, "if we just took every deal that comes our way we'll catch up to China within the next decade or so." However, the long term advantages here cannot be ignored. Had India gotten itself into the USA's satchel right away after the economic liberalization (circa 1991) we would see them being pressured into things like supporting the Iraq war or cutting ties with Iran altogether. Also the economy would be hit a lot worse by the US specific sub-prime mortgage meltdown; but neither one of these things happened because India's economy and its political identity is still very independent (albeit very frustrating). And like I said, in the long run this may very well turn out to be a big boon; which is not to say that India shouldn't strongly favor western economic, military and political partnerships, it should just be done on the terms of the former.

Now there's always the risk of running out of enticing offers; but I don't think this will really happen is because like it or not, no developed economy will be ready to sacrifice a massive growing middle class of 350 million+ people.

 

[IceCold]

Had you posted such a reply with a reason to your logic, you would have gained and would gain much more respect on this forum, than by posting a tirade against India which would then make other members indifferent to your future posts.

Equating a foreign policy tilt to a master slave relationship is flaming and nothing else.

Now, to answer your logic, yes there is a very perceptible tilt and a deliberate attempt to HOLD or DELAY the final decision on the pipeline project bcause the govt wants to know which way the chips fall on the nuclear deal. At this point of time, holding off the pipeline would mean smoother passage for the nuke deal in the NSG and other fora, and signing it would give more ammo to the non proliferation hawks and many US senators.

Secondly, if the nuke deal does go through, the govt would most definitely sign the pipeline agreement to placate the left or as a consolation prize you can say, and even if the nuke deal doesnt go through then there is an alternate source of energy available through this pipeline and the govt can claim that they look for the best options for the country.

What im trying to say is that the pipeline project WILL commence sooner or later, there is only an attempt to delay it to get the best of both sides.

Reason was not meant to put a flame but anyways i agree i was writing it in a very bad mood. So apologies for that. Point is that if you see current US India relationship and the pace they are getting developed, its not hard to imagine that sooner or later US will be able to convince the Indians to get out of the deal. As for the nuclear deal, it will stay there maybe after the elections when those communist who the main hurdle gets booted out as suggested by one of the Indian members, the government will very likely prefer the 123 deal over the IPI gas pipe line one. From our point of view its a waste of time. Its now or never. The project has significantly been delayed and Pakistan these days is low on energy resources. That is why china was brought into the equation in the first place and Iran did not objected nor did china when Pakistan first propose this.

 

[Contrarian]

Reason was not meant to put a flame but anyways i agree i was writing it in a very bad mood. So apologies for that. Point is that if you see current US India relationship and the pace they are getting developed, its not hard to imagine that sooner or later US will be able to convince the Indians to get out of the deal. As for the nuclear deal, it will stay there maybe after the elections when those communist who the main hurdle gets booted out as suggested by one of the Indian members, the government will very likely prefer the 123 deal over the IPI gas pipe line one. From our point of view its a waste of time. Its now or never. The project has significantly been delayed and Pakistan these days is low on energy resources. That is why china was brought into the equation in the first place and Iran did not objected nor did china when Pakistan first propose this.

I have said in my last post, the IPI pipeline WILL go through, its just a matter of timing. As of now, the govt wants to delay it, whether the nuke deal gets signed or not, the IPI will go through. There is a deliberate attempt to delay the IPI to get the best of both the worlds. Whether it works or not remains to be seen, as things stand today, the Congress and Left are at their parting points, if this happens, a no confidence motion will be moved by the BJP in Parliament. If the Congress gets the support of the SP and scraps some independents with it, the nuke deal will pass, else the Government will fall and there will be elections.

In either case, the IPI would be delayed, but as per me, in either case, it will definitely go through.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I think if it goes through it will be a ground breaking moment in Indo-Pak relations.

Despite the hysteria around it from some quarters with regards to national security, I don't see much of an impact at all. The transit fees are not going to be high enough to hurt Pakistan were India to stop importing, and if Pakistan were to stop the supply, India would most likely go back to whatever means it is using currently to import gas.

There would be some financial loss, but nothing so devastating as "putting India's energy security in Pakistan's hands".

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

If India does not want to have the pipeline, why should Pakistan bother?

It should go ahead and organise its own energy security and have the pipeline as far as it desires.