India protests over 'tribal' Virgin Mary and baby Jesus

[Biplab Bijay]

No the end story is that one way valve should not be used in two way water supply. Those people whose faith are weak they become terrorists, they kill apostates, they blow suicide vests and go for increase their number by marrying 4 wives, converting by force or deception(Taquiya), by invading other countries and doing mass murder. They claim themselves as thekedar of that faith too.

Peace.

the end of the story is that certain cast of Hindus do not want to do away with discrimination and social isolation of down trodden Hindus and at the same time you guys are against Christians and their social uplift projects which attract these Hindus to convert for better opportunities.


look within solve their porblems and they wont be lured by anyone.

For them the concept of Hinduism is weak enough to break for incentives and better living. Thats all. Give them sense of ownership of Hinduism and they wont go for other faiths not even for better living.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

I can see you are hiding behind facepalms ))

Lets suppose my faith is one way valve and we do stand by it BUT you Hindus are confused among your ownself. On the one hand you practice Hinduism as ONE WAY VALVE as well and on the other you are shying away from accepting the reality loudly.


Why dont you accept that You hindus are afriad of losing more people to Christianity hence the hue and cry and at the same time you are also NOT willing to abloish the discrimantion based on class/cast system so that Christian missionaries could not be able to lure your own people for incentives.

very good point but your rational responses are limited to threads related in Hindu's wrong doings only isn't it ? will you accept the fact that religious minorities are oppressed and opposed in Pakistan, perhaps even more than they do in India ? here you want Indians to accept our wrong doings candidly but on other threads your standard response will be to point out Hindu's wrong doings in response to arguments of oppression of religious minorities in Pakistan.so on Indian issues you will talk about India and on similar Pakistani issues you will again bring it as a counter point rather than admitting Pakistan's faults.

 

[Spring Onion]

very good point but your rational responses are limited to threads related in Hindu's wrong doings only isn't it ? will you accept the fact that religious minorities are oppressed and opposed in Pakistan, perhaps even more than they do in India ? here you want Indians to accept our wrong doings candidly but on other threads your standard response will be to point out Hindu's wrong doings in response to arguments of oppression of religious minorities in Pakistan.so on Indian issues you will talk about India and on similar Pakistani issues you will again bring it as a counter point rather than admitting Pakistan's faults.

They are oppressed everywhere indeed no denying neither me nor my media ever denies that. rather you will see majority of us here do post and discuss instead of shying away.


Infact its you who is bringing it as counter point instead of commenting on the topic

Your ID seems claiming to be an Agnostic yet you are pained at comments about facts viz a viz Hindu majority Vs Christians.

 

[surya kiran]

We are very clear we accept anyone irrespective of creed and color and if anyone wants to get out them he is NO more entitled to our faith's identity.


As far as your claim that Hinduism is NOT free for all then say it clear and state it loudly instead of coming up with many versions.

And indeed if you start worshiping Allah or Jesus then you are NO more a Hindu, thats for other religions as well.

@Spring Onion

Not sure, if this will make any sense to you but here goes anyways.

Technically, a Hindu believing in the supremacy of the Vedas is called Asthik. If he does not believe in the supremacy of the Vedas, he is a Nasthik. Now, Hinduism, unlike most misconceptions is based on a supreme being called the Brahman. Now, you can pray/believe in him in any form. Or you may choose to not believe and be completely rationale. This rationality was the Carvaka school of thought. So, from a pure technical perspective, I would place Jains and Buddhists also under the Hinduism fold under the Nasthik category. Most Hindus, today will fall under the nasthik category, because there has been a huge transformation on belief systems.

As a person you can worship God in whatever form you want. You can call him Allah (Muslims) Shiva (Saivites) or anything else. Anybody who turns around and says a Hindu is one who is worshipping a particular deity has either no knowledge of the subject mattter or has no idea what he is talking about.

Now, I go to a mosque and pray and call out to him and say "Allah help me overcome this problem". Or I go to a church and say "Mother Mary, look over me" does it make me less Hindu and more christian or muslim? I challenge, anybody on this forum to show me any instance in any of the scriptures which say I cannot do the above and make me a lesser Hindu?

At the end of the day, its all in the head.

 

[Spring Onion]

You are mistaken with the caste line you are taking with regard to Christian conversions. As a whole, more of our dalits have and are converting to Buddhism, as it is seen as a dharmic religion but without the caste bit. Precisely one of the things about Hinduism it strove to change when it was born - out of Hinduism.

)))))))))))))) and they still convert whether budhisim or christianity. and the REASON IS ???

 

[Mugwop]

What did i just read

 

[Sashan]

Christian India sounds better than Hindu India, but I am afraid, they might pervert the Christian religion to such an extent that it might become a hardcore pagan version of it.

Post reported.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

Please Enlighten us Mr. " I am an Expert on Christianity "

Please tell us about those Christians who consider MARY UNHOLY.

there are Christians who believe and pray to Jesus only, they don't don't recognise the holy statues of saints or mother Mary, they argue that she is just like a outer covering of an egg which Jesus needed only to take birth, once the Jesus is born the shell of egg has no significance.so don't be too quick to laugh at things you don't know.

 

[kena]

@Spring Onion

Not sure, if this will make any sense to you but here goes anyways.

Technically, a Hindu believing in the supremacy of the Vedas is called Asthik. If he does not believe in the supremacy of the Vedas, he is a Nasthik. Now, Hinduism, unlike most misconceptions is based on a supreme being called the Brahman. Now, you can pray/believe in him in any form. Or you may choose to not believe and be completely rationale. This rationality was the Carvaka school of thought. So, from a pure technical perspective, I would place Jains and Buddhists also under the Hinduism fold under the Nasthik category. Most Hindus, today will fall under the nasthik category, because there has been a huge transformation on belief systems.

As a person you can worship God in whatever form you want. You can call him Allah (Muslims) Shiva (Saivites) or anything else. Anybody who turns around and says a Hindu is one who is worshipping a particular deity has either no knowledge of the subject mattter or has no idea what he is talking about.

Now, I go to a mosque and pray and call out to him and say "Allah help me overcome this problem". Or I go to a church and say "Mother Mary, look over me" does it make me less Hindu and more christian or muslim? I challenge, anybody on this forum to show me any instance in any of the scriptures which say I cannot do the above and make me a lesser Hindu?

At the end of the day, its all in the head.

You are surely mistaken if you think that Allah/ Christian God = God in Hinduism. There is a world of difference. This is the kind of ignorance which allows others to claim that in Hinduism, everything goes.

 

[AnnoyingOrange]

10 July 2013 Last updated at 03:25 GMT




.India protests over 'tribal' Virgin Mary and baby Jesus


The 'tribal' statue of Virgin Mary and baby Jesus was installed on 26 May
A new statue which shows Virgin Mary and baby Jesus as tribals has been installed in a church in the eastern Indian state of Jharkhand, sparking off protests from non-Christian tribal groups. Amarnath Tewary reports on the controversy.


Wearing a red-bordered white sari, red blouse, necklace and bangles and holding baby Jesus in a cloth sling, the statue has invited both anger and astonishment.

Unveiled by Cardinal Telesphor P Toppo on 26 May, the statue stands tall in the local church in Singhpur village, 15km (nine miles) from the state capital, Ranchi.

“
Start Quote
It's an attempt to convert Sarna tribals to Christianity”
End Quote
Bandhan Tigga

Non-tribal leader


But ever since its installation, the statue has attracted the ire of some non-Christian tribal groups who are demanding its immediate removal.

Some of them even took out a protest march on 17 June in Ranchi in support of their demand.

"It is for the first time in the state that Mother Mary and baby Jesus have been portrayed as tribals. What was the need for it?" asks Bandhan Tigga, head priest of Sarna Society, which represents non-Christian tribal population of the state.

In Jharkhand, 27% of the population or 8.6 million people are tribals and only 3% of the tribal population is Christian.

"Showing Mother Mary as a tribal is a part of the larger design to make the tribal population believe that she was from their community and confuse them," says Mr Tigga.

"A 100 years from now, people here would start believing that Mother Mary was actually our tribal goddess. It's an attempt to convert Sarna tribals to Christianity."



'Nothing wrong'

Mr Tigga and his society leaders have asked the local Archbishop's House to remove the statue.

"If they do not remove it, a nationwide protest will be organised," he warns.

The Christian tribals, however, see nothing wrong with the statue - as residents of Jharkhand, they says they have "equal rights" over the red-bordered white sari and other tribal outfits.

"What's wrong in this? It's just like the Chinese, Japanese, Irish, German or even the African version of Mother Mary and baby Jesus," says Father Augustine Kerketta at the Archbishop House in Ranchi.


Some tribal groups have protested demanding the removal of the statue
"It happens everywhere as part of enculturation of the local tradition."

Cardinal Telesphor P Toppo is away in Rome and in his absence, Father Augustine has been nominated to negotiate with the non-Christian tribals over the controversial statue.

Father Augustine downplays the protests saying only a section of the non-Christian tribal population took part in them.

He says the charges levelled by the Sarna Society are "without any substance" and accuses some politicians of being behind the protests.

"General elections are due early next year and some people may wish to divide the Christian and non-Christian tribal populations for political gains," he says.

Nevertheless, he hopes to resolve the issue at their next meeting scheduled for 14 July.

But leaders of the Sarna Society say they do not expect much to come out of the meeting unless the statue is removed


BBC News - India protests over 'tribal' Virgin Mary and baby Jesus

First MacDonalds... then Pizza Hut... then KFC and how even a leading religion bows down the might of Indian consumerism...

 

[doppelganger]

)))))))))))))) and they still convert whether budhisim or christianity. and the REASON IS ???

Different things, different reasons. You can start another thread for Hindus converting to Buddhism. This one is about Hindus and Christianity. Please stay on topic and do not resort to strawman arguments baaji.

 

[Spring Onion]

@Spring Onion

Not sure, if this will make any sense to you but here goes anyways.

Technically, a Hindu believing in the supremacy of the Vedas is called Asthik. If he does not believe in the supremacy of the Vedas, he is a Nasthik. Now, Hinduism, unlike most misconceptions is based on a supreme being called the Brahman. Now, you can pray/believe in him in any form. Or you may choose to not believe and be completely rationale. This rationality was the Carvaka school of thought. So, from a pure technical perspective, I would place Jains and Buddhists also under the Hinduism fold under the Nasthik category. Most Hindus, today will fall under the nasthik category, because there has been a huge transformation on belief systems.

As a person you can worship God in whatever form you want. You can call him Allah (Muslims) Shiva (Saivites) or anything else. Anybody who turns around and says a Hindu is one who is worshipping a particular deity has either no knowledge of the subject mattter or has no idea what he is talking about.

Now, I go to a mosque and pray and call out to him and say "Allah help me overcome this problem". Or I go to a church and say "Mother Mary, look over me" does it make me less Hindu and more christian or muslim? I challenge, anybody on this forum to show me any instance in any of the scriptures which say I cannot do the above and make me a lesser Hindu?

At the end of the day, its all in the head.

i can debate with you on Budhism/Jainism and Hinduism however, this is a lengthy debate.

Your above post supposed to pacify all those who are against missonaries or conversions.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

They are oppressed everywhere indeed no denying neither me nor my media ever denies that. rather you will see majority of us here do post and discuss instead of shying away.


Infact its you who is bringing it as counter point instead of commenting on the topic

Your ID seems claiming to be an Agnostic yet you are pained at comments about facts viz a viz Hindu majority Vs Christians.

my memory says your style of debate is what I alleged , but since you denied it, I take it for now, let's see how you respond in future threads.
I didn't get your point about my comments in this threads or any other ? you mean agnostic can't comment or have an opinion about religious issues ?

 

[Spring Onion]

First MacDonalds... then Pizza Hut... then KFC and how even a leading religion bows down the might of Indian consumerism...

And the Indians aare still NOT Happy

 

[Dash]

Dash with having personality like chanakya and other traits and economy, i always failed to understand that your people or for that matter lets say Hindutvas failed to comeup with policies that are rational and NOT based on emotions.

Happens when you have your own god and your own faith to walk with. Precisely why you didnt have a patron.