India-Pakistan talks possible only if MODI goes, Pakistani daily

[Spectre]

Man Mohan Singh of UPA 2 is a NIGHTMARE that India would like to forget for ever

He was the Rahu Ketu Shani all together for India

The true extent of the damage done to India by UPA will be evident in the next few years

@Bang Galore @Spectre

The difference between the Man Mohan SIngh of UPA 1 and UPA 2
was the attitude of the Gandhi Family

In a interview his former MOS in the PMO ; Prithvi Raj Chauhan said that
after the 2009 victory the Gandhis became all the more DISPARAGING toward him

And the Other Ministers took the cue from them ; the Gandhis

He was told in clear terms that he was just a Rubber stamp

As you have stated - The Man was the same, how ever his authority was limited by extra-constitutional means.

What happened in UPA-2 was a travesty and complete mockery of Indian constitution. However that does not make MMS a traitor.

He should have resigned to keep his legacy and dignity intact but I suspect he tried to mitigate the damage as much as he could. Out of seat he was useless within the set-up he atleast could exercise some restraint on the offenders.

Whether his silence, reluctance, appeasement etc was out of greed, compulsion or naivety either way none of this makes him a traitor.

I reapectfully disagree. We have extracted cost, damages, interest, punitive fine you name it.

That will not stop Pakistan from carrying out more terrorist attacks in future. To this I agree. They will continue to cut their nose to spite us. But that is the place we want them to be, if you understand long term objectives.

I disagree in totality to your post, again respectfully. Would help if you site the cost we have extracted not the ones which are self-inflicted.

India needs a stable Pakistan to deal with, keeping things in flux is a fallacious long term strategy - such a cornered adversary would hurt us and badly at that. Better Pakistan has a solid economy, peaceful society etc so that it would be fearful of loosing it.

 

[Killswitch]

Modi is an intelligent man. He knows Pakistan is a black hole. Better to work around it. That country doesnt want peace. It wants to destroy India, so we will build our defenses and let them die on them.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

India needs a stable Pakistan to deal with, keeping things in flux is a fallacious long term strategy - such a cornered adversary would hurt us and badly at that. Better Pakistan has a solid economy, peaceful society etc so that it would be fearful of loosing it.

India needs a stable Pakistan BUT one which is friendly towards India

The only thing that they are afraid of is massive retaliation

That fear had evaporated under MMS ; Modi has brought it BACK

That is why you see this obsession with Modi

The enemy Tries to TEST you in a number of ways

It looks for your responses and then calibrates its own further actions

Now the enemy is Under NO illusion as to what is faced with

 

[Stag112]

As you have stated - The Man was the same, how ever his authority was limited by extra-constitutional means.

What happened in UPA-2 was a travesty and complete mockery of Indian constitution. However that does not make MMS a traitor.

He should have resigned to keep his legacy and dignity intact but I suspect he tried to mitigate the damage as much as he could. Out of seat he was useless within the set-up he atleast could exercise some restraint on the offenders.

Whether his silence, reluctance, appeasement etc out of greed, compulsion or naivety either way none of this makes him a traitor.



I disagree in totality to your post, again respectfully. Would help if you site the cost we have extracted not the ones which are self-inflicted.

India needs a stable Pakistan to deal with, keeping things in flux is a fallacious long term strategy - such a cornered adversary would hurt us and badly at that. Better Pakistan has a solid economy, peaceful society etc so that it would be fearful of loosing it.

Pakistan is ruled by rich materialistic people, not by the common angry man who they rule by making them drink hyper nationalism. As long as there is no islamic revolution there, the ruling classes remain rich and have a lot to lose. Anyway they had thar coal and gwadar, they have CPEC to lose now

The self inflicted wounds are indeed self inflicted. But we have played a role too. The shytestorm in Pakistan after Mumbai attacks was no coincidence.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

@Spectre @Bang Galore

Coming to MMS ; so was his Pakistan policy really NECESSARY

The Gandhis did not ASK him to appease Pakistan

So why the hell was he doing it

AS it is now well known ; he had already abandoned governance and the economy

But why was it NECESSARY for MMS to appease Pakistan in the manner that he did

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@Spectre

Do you NEVER Wonder why MMS put up with ALL the indignities HEAPED upon HIM
by the Gandhis

It is said the MMS was very clean

But definitely his friends ; relatives and well wishers MUST have have BENEFITTED
from him being in the chair ; that is why he took all the crap thrown at him ; HAPPILY

 

[Bang Galore]

@Spectre @Bang Galore

Coming to MMS ; so was his Pakistan policy really NECESSARY

The Gandhis did not ASK him to appease Pakistan

So why the hell was he doing it

AS it is now well known ; he had already abandoned governance and the economy

But why was it NECESSARY for MMS to appease Pakistan in the manner that he did

From 2004 to 2007, he carried forward the Vajpayee legacy. Post Musharraf, things started to go downhill & ended with the dreadful events of 26/11/2008. He then had a different problem, one caused by former PM IK Gujral whose actions ensured that there were very few options on the table. MMS's own actions of doing very little on the military front while throwing money at the idiotically conceived social welfare schemes of Sonia Gandhi & Co. ensured that military options too were limited.

However post the elections of 2009, MMS simply could not get his Pakistan policy straight, largely because the Pakistani army under Kayani (who had been granted an extension) were unwilling to support his pet plan with Musharraf. The civilians were equally bad with Nawaz Sharif wanting to go back to 1999 while totally jettisoning the Musharraf plan. MMS's own internal situation with his government's credibility in tatters made things worse as did Antony's behaviour as the Prime Minister of Defence which hardly helped matters (that was both good & bad, Antony didn't play along with MMS's plans on Siachen but also allowed his "communist" dislike of America to virtually stop all major plans with the US). Manmohan Singh had by 2013 given up the ghost & allowed massive retaliation on the border after the beheadings.He never did accept Pakistani overtures to go to Pakistan, including coming down hard on Shehbaz Sharif when he attempted to invite him by seeking to appeal to his religious side. He also turned down the Siachen proposals towards the end saying that any solution to Siachen could only be a part of an overall settlement.

However as a person of a different generation, he looked at Pakistan in a manner that few of the younger politicians, including Modi look at. That is just the effect of the generation he was from.

 

[MilSpec]

what a bunch of jokers.

 

[Bornubus]

Modi or no modi only superior nations sets the term world over and in this case its already been set by india.

 

[ganesh623]

Its like pakistan is giving a ultimatum. Its either modi or talks with pakistan.
Pakistanis should understand indians will sacrifice talks with pakistan and pakistan itself 1000 times, for a single tenure of modi.
Modi is here to stay for long.

 

[wiseone2]

Bunch of jokers.
Its we who will decide who our pm will be, not you.
Modi will stay till at least 2030 and even further.

they are used to deciding who their prime ministers are

 

[dadeechi]

India elected BJP and Narendra Modi for the development and prosperity of this nation.Not for the dilly dally talks with a neighbour nation.
Narendra Modi and BJP will elected by us again if they deliver their promises.So far their rule is excellent .
We will give another five years if they complete these five year successfully.If that means a total non zero talks with Pakistan .We dont have any problem.
We need development in this nation.Not talks.

I won't bet on another term for Modi.

 

[homagnibhatt]

I won't bet on another term for Modi.

I'll make a counter bet. 280+ for BJP in 2019. Time will tell.

 

[dadeechi]

As you have stated - The Man was the same, how ever his authority was limited by extra-constitutional means.

What happened in UPA-2 was a travesty and complete mockery of Indian constitution. However that does not make MMS a traitor.

I understand what you are trying to say but look at the following text of the oath. The question is why did he compromise?


"I, A. B., do swear in the name of God that I will bear true faith
solemnly affirm
and allegiance to the Constitution of India as by law established, that I will uphold the sovereignty and integrity of India, that I will faithfully and conscientiously discharge my duties as a Minister for the Union and that I will do right to all manner of people in accordance with the Constitution and the law, without fear or favour, affection or ill-will."


http://lawmin.nic.in/olwing/coi/coi-english/Const.Pock 2Pg.Rom8Fsss(31).pdf


traitor

noun
1.
a person who betrays another, a cause, or any trust.
2.
a person who commits treason by betraying his or her country.

Traitor | Define Traitor at Dictionary.com

ISLAMABAD: India-Pakistan peace talks will be possible only when the BJP is voted out in India, a Pakistani newspaper said on Saturday.

The Nation said in an editorial that despite Islamabad's attempts, New Delhi was not ready for reconciliation.

"The BJP (Bharatiya Janata Party) might hopefully lose power soon, and maybe we can start (peace talks) again with a more level-headed government," it said.

READ ALSO: India raising 'terror bogey' to stall talks, says Pakistan

The editorial came after Pakistan's permanent representative to UN, Maliha Lodhi, handed over to the UN three dossiers allegedly containing "proof" of Indian involvement in terrorist activities in Pakistan.

Sartaz Aziz, adviser to Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif on national security and foreign affairs, also accused India of repeatedly violating the 2003 ceasefire pact with Pakistan on the LoC in Jammu & Kashmir.

"As far as the Indian government goes, Pakistan is the primary sponsor of terrorism, and they will stick by this claim no matter what those dossiers state," the daily said.

READ ALSO: Give up terror, Sushma tells Pak at UN

"Even if the audio and video evidence present in these files prove beyond doubt that India is indeed sponsoring state terrorism in Pakistan, nothing will change."

The Nation said: "For now, India is at an international high, and Prime Minister Narendra Modi is a superstar. This will fade."


India-Pakistan talks possible only if BJP goes, Pakistani daily says - The Times of India[/b][/b]

Actually If Pakistan is really interested in settling issues with India, Modi is the best bet.
No one is going question Modi even if he gives away the whole of Kashmir.