India-Pakistan Standoff September 2016 - Member opinions

[T-AhA]

not yours, not mine, this fire is started by someone else...

 

[R Wing]

This is naive way of thinking...India showed utmost restraint during Pathankot investigation...even allowed your investigation team to our base(something unheard of in our relations since eternity) and yet what was the output...Nada as even that incident has been touted as fake by you guys...so how on this earth you expect any restraint when relations are sour to the level where we are??

Just because we blamed Pakistan(a practice both neighbours follow earnestly) is equivalent of it being a fake operation??


Nah....not true....International community is not in agreement to this...if you have tangible proofs then you should have managed to garner some support from international community on this front...no??

International community support is not based on who actually supports terrorists and who doesn't --- we have seen the US deal with many questionable governments, sell arms to the Saudis (perhaps the largest supporters of violent extremism), etc. These days, it's about geopolitical and monetary interests.

I love how you casually said "nah... not true" as if you know everything the ISI and RAW have in their hands against each other. Let's be adults, please --- the Indian state, like all States in the region and most States out of it has sponsored terrorist movements, whether from its own soil or from somebody else's. If you can't stomach this, you have bought into your manufactured illusion a bit too much.

 

[deckingraj]

International community support is not based on who actually supports terrorists and who doesn't --- we have seen the US deal with many questionable governments, sell arms to the Saudis (perhaps the largest supporters of violent extremism), etc. These days, it's about geopolitical and monetary interests.

I love how you casually said "nah... not true" as if you know everything the ISI and RAW have in their hands against each other. Let's be adults, please --- the Indian state, like all States in the region and most States out of it has sponsored terrorist movements, whether from its own soil or from somebody else's. If you can't stomach this, you have bought into your manufactured illusion a bit too much.

Its not casual....you need to understand Nations are not like me and you...Nations deal with one thing which is National Interests...moralities and other stuff is for mortals like me and you...When i say nah..not true...then it is simple...International community is not with you since you have failed to provide any tangible proof...there have been enough moments when US needed Pakistan like anything...they even sided with you in 71 war and yet they have never supported your claims on Balochistan viz-a-viz India..no??...the question is why??

There is no manufactured illusion here...world agrees that Pakistan is a breeding ground of terrorists and India is not...is that not a fact?? please share your thoughts....

 

[R Wing]

Its not casual....you need to understand Nations are not like me and you...Nations deal with one thing which is National Interests...moralities and other stuff is for mortals like me and you...When i say nah..not true...then it is simple...International community is not with you since you have failed to provide any tangible proof...there have been enough moments when US needed Pakistan like anything...they even sided with you in 71 war and yet they have never supported your claims on Balochistan viz-a-viz India..no??...the question is why??

There is no manufactured illusion here...world agrees that Pakistan is a breeding ground of terrorists and India is not...is that not a fact?? please share your thoughts....

The answer is very simple: the US desperately needs to prop up India against China, so India's state sponsorship of terrorism doesn't get the same spotlight that Pakistan's does. Just like you said --- national interests. Right now, it is in the US national interest to try and contain China in the region by propping up a rival.

Do you really think your country doesn't support terrorist movements in the region? You sound like a very reasonable person, so I'm surprised that you aren't able to acknowledge this reality.

The "world" does not think Pakistan harbors terrorists --- it's mostly NATO, which sees China as a major emerging threat to its dominance in the region. And since most publications we read are controlled by NATO countries, who miserably failed in Afghanistan, the blame game is an easy way out.

I am not saying Pakistani intel agencies haven't used militant proxies --- I am saying everyone in the region (and most countries out of it) use them. I think we can agree on that?

 

[litman]

both modi and nawaz are cashing kashmir situation for their own politics.

 

[Indo-Pak]

When Pakistani says and believe "there was no strike by Indian forces"

Then why Pakistani ppl/media/army are giving justification???

Keep cool and enjoy life...

PM Nawaz should clearly mention In UN speech Uri Attack was False Flag Operation carried out by Indian Agency to deflect attention of the world form Indian atrocities in IOK. As we know Pakistan will be first on the speech, so before Indian say any thing about Uri Attack, our PM should brush aside these allegations and warn the world of Indian foul play. If PM mention it first then no one will pay any attention to Indian side and also they will question them instead of us. We need to be on offensive mode in diplomatic channels instead of Defensive. And this is the only way forward.

Like USA did 9/11 and brits did 7/7....
Bad country killing there own soldiers..

Nawaz sir, what you ate/drink before going to UN?? Lassi?

 

[deckingraj]

Got a tad busy so could not reply earlier. Hope that you still want to continue the discussion...

The answer is very simple: the US desperately needs to prop up India against China, so India's state sponsorship of terrorism doesn't get the same spotlight that Pakistan's does. Just like you said --- national interests. Right now, it is in the US national interest to try and contain China in the region by propping up a rival.

The bold part has the key...however as said earlier Pakistan accusation of India's involvement in Balochistan is decades old...no?? At that time US was a firm supported of Pakistan...why do you think they didn't support your case then??

Do you really think your country doesn't support terrorist movements in the region? You sound like a very reasonable person, so I'm surprised that you aren't able to acknowledge this reality.

India has supported Mukti Bahini...there was enough support for LTTE however that is another point that we got bitten by them, realized how big a frankestein we have created and course corrected...As far as support of terrorists in Balochistan is concerned then i have my doubts...Both geography wise, capabilities wise and geo-politically it is a loosing game for India...Not only we will end up making friends like Iran uncomfortable, we will also loose our high moral ground viz-a-viz Kashmir...The fact of the matter that Modi is the only PM to openly raise human rights violations in Balochistan and that too on our Independence day is testamount to what i just said above..

So its not about morals...its about logic...Secondly forget rest of the world...even your best friend China has not backed your claims on India's hands in Balochistan...does that say anything?? Look dear we all need to be reasonable however every thing that our respective country say/claim is not necessarily gospel truth...

The "world" does not think Pakistan harbors terrorists --- it's mostly NATO, which sees China as a major emerging threat to its dominance in the region. And since most publications we read are controlled by NATO countries, who miserably failed in Afghanistan, the blame game is an easy way out.

Are you sure about it?? Please explain what do you mean by world?? The only thing that world openly don't admit is that your govt. is in cohoots with Terror groups...

I am not saying Pakistani intel agencies haven't used militant proxies --- I am saying everyone in the region (and most countries out of it) use them. I think we can agree on that?

Of-course...the only issue is that right now you are on the wrong side of the world...

 

[R Wing]

Got a tad busy so could not reply earlier. Hope that you still want to continue the discussion...


The bold part has the key...however as said earlier Pakistan accusation of India's involvement in Balochistan is decades old...no?? At that time US was a firm supported of Pakistan...why do you think they didn't support your case then??


India has supported Mukti Bahini...there was enough support for LTTE however that is another point that we got bitten by them, realized how big a frankestein we have created and course corrected...As far as support of terrorists in Balochistan is concerned then i have my doubts...Both geography wise, capabilities wise and geo-politically it is a loosing game for India...Not only we will end up making friends like Iran uncomfortable, we will also loose our high moral ground viz-a-viz Kashmir...The fact of the matter that Modi is the only PM to openly raise human rights violations in Balochistan and that too on our Independence day is testamount to what i just said above..

So its not about morals...its about logic...Secondly forget rest of the world...even your best friend China has not backed your claims on India's hands in Balochistan...does that say anything?? Look dear we all need to be reasonable however every thing that our respective country say/claim is not necessarily gospel truth...


Are you sure about it?? Please explain what do you mean by world?? The only thing that world openly don't admit is that your govt. is in cohoots with Terror groups...


Of-course...the only issue is that right now you are on the wrong side of the world...

I think you have pinpointed the issue --- current global level strategic politics want a denuclearized Pakistan and a contained China. This means that we are on the wrong side of media reporting and support/statements from the Western world. China has a strong policy of not making controversial accusations on any side. I still believe, after having talked to people in the know, that there is strong support of Baloch militancy by the Indian state. We can start a separate thread about that --- but since neither of us has any concrete proof of either allegation (just like the US has never made "proof" of our support to the Afghan Taliban public despite claiming it has "a lot" of it), let's rest the issue for now.