India is the revisionist power

[Perceptron]

Totally different context of the IMF chief ; The IMF chief was not discussing economics with the hotel maid, he allegedly raped her. Shashi Tharoor is a UN diplomat who has been doing the jaw-jaw work for quite some time now. He is an accomplished diplomat, and has had his fair share of controversies, vilified inside Indian politics as well as by the media. But the guy has not spoken without facts in this context. I already posted the link wherein he brushed all liberals with a single brush which was a mistake ; However i do appreciate the way he dealt the simpleton-like narrative of Haider with the treatment it deserved. And Shashi Tharoor for all his shortcomings, makes a far better jury of his article, than a Haider would do of his own.

 

[53fd]

This whole article was nothing but Mr. Haider tryiing to justify Pakistan's attacks on India.

According to Mr. haider-

1948 war: It was not the Pakistan army , but Indigenous uprising against the occupation of Kashmir by Indian Army

1965: We did not attack India. we just crossed the CFL(LOC) and attacked and killed Indian Soldiers.

1971: It was not Our fault that 10 million Bangladeshis entered India to escape from genocide even though India had repeatedly asked West Pakistanis to honour the election results of 1970.it is India's fault that they did not have a strong economy to take in those 10 million refugees and had to resort to war.

1999: India did Siachen so it is not fault we had to try Kargil(and failed badly)

1971 was initiated by India when they trained the Mukti Bahini (both inside India & Bangladesh), & interfered by sending troops into Pakistani territory when the Pakistan Army started the operation against the Mukti Bahini. 1965 was initiated by Pakistan. 1999 cannot even be categorized as a war, more of a 'skirmish'. 1948 Kashmir was pretty much 'up for grabs', hence not really initiated by Pakistan.

The 1971 war started when India armed & trained Mukti Bahini insurgents (both inside India & East Pakistan) against the Pakistani Establishment [which is why Pakistan attacked India]; just like the 1999 'war' was initiated by Pakistan when they infiltrated proxies over the LOC. Apply the same standards in both situations.

 

[53fd]

This whole article was nothing but Mr. Haider tryiing to justify Pakistan's attacks on India.

According to Mr. haider-

1948 war: It was not the Pakistan army , but Indigenous uprising against the occupation of Kashmir by Indian Army

1965: We did not attack India. we just crossed the CFL(LOC) and attacked and killed Indian Soldiers.

1971: It was not Our fault that 10 million Bangladeshis entered India to escape from genocide even though India had repeatedly asked West Pakistanis to honour the election results of 1970.it is India's fault that they did not have a strong economy to take in those 10 million refugees and had to resort to war.

1999: India did Siachen so it is not fault we had to try Kargil(and failed badly)

I suggest you read the answer to your question written by Agnostic Muslim (post # 12) on this thread:

http://www.defence.pk/forums/current-events-social-issues/120856-refuting-aatish-taseer.html

 

[Pride]

Crux of the article : 48,65,71, 99 everything was OK. Mukti Bahini was Ok, LTTE was OK. But these Indians are still bad having Khap Panchayats, Maoists and Ahh favorite Occupied Kashmoir.. See I told you, Indians are bad and Piling more Armed stuff..

Leave Bashing, do an introspection. That will quite help Mr Author.

 

[Pride]

1971 was initiated by India when they trained the Mukti Bahini (both inside India & Bangladesh), & interfered by sending troops into Pakistani territory when the Pakistan Army started the operation against the Mukti Bahini.

You are missing point here. We did not force people to win Sheikh Mujibur Rahman. We did not ask Mr Bhutto or Yahya Khan to kill uprising. We did not invite milions of refugees. We did not ask you to kill Milions of people next to us.

1965 was initiated by Pakistan. 1999 cannot even be categorized as a war, more of a 'skirmish'.

This was also a "Skirmish" by your definition but we thought of making it war, our choice.

1948 Kashmir was pretty much 'up for grabs', hence not really initiated by Pakistan.

Again by Your defintion, If it was 'up for grab' then be happy what you got and let us be happy what we got. Why then sending so called "Freedom Fighters" or doing 65 or 99??

The 1971 war started when India armed & trained Mukti Bahini insurgents (both inside India & East Pakistan) against the Pakistani Establishment [which is why Pakistan attacked India]; just like the 1999 'war' was initiated by Pakistan when they infiltrated proxies over the LOC. Apply the same standards in both situations.

Ok We trained some armies and you attacked us. Now you train Freedom fighters are we allowed to do same for you?

 

[notsuperstitious]

1948 Kashmir was pretty much 'up for grabs', hence not really initiated by Pakistan.

Why do some Pakistanis have to resort to dishonesty at the drop of a hat? This makes debating with them very difficult as they are just not trained to introspect and be honest when it comes to 'beliefs' - kashmir being one of them.

Funny isn't it when one calls Kashmir up for grabs when convenient, but then cry a river trying to moralise about Kashmir!!! Revise that!

 

[newdelhinsa]

Revisionist...huuummm

Same Musharraf came for peace talks after killing ~500 Indian soldiers in Kargil.

Same Pakistanis kept right of self determination out from the agenda since 2004- till yesterday's bilateral talks. But are lying to their own public and to bunch of Kashmiri separatists.

Same Pakistanis are now ready to go along with CBM which they were not even ready to listen.

Same Pakistanis accepted Zia ul Haq's Ideology and now are cursing him openly.

Same Pakistanis were ranting in UN that J&K is Pakistan's now no one knows know what exactly they want, everyone is blowing his own flute on J&K.

Same Pakistanis surrendered land to China which was J&K in the first Place.

Same Pakistanis assimilated districts of J&K into Pakistan by doing constitutional amendments few years back.

Same Pakistanis encouraged Jihad and then stopped Jihadis infiltrating into India on and off at at whim.

Same Pakistanis recognized Taliban and then supported USA on WOT against them. or vise a verse.

It is well known to everyone, heck, a typical Pakistani accusation against India that there is status co in India's foreign policy vis a vis Pakistan and resolving J&K issue. Now since Pakistanis are finding Indian approach on this particular issue more appropriate and good for deteriorating Pakistan's image after being exposed as complicit regime on global issue of terrorism, they are trying to save their face in front of their own people by accusing India doing flip flops, the one they have been doing since 1947.

Quite a good cunning reverse psyop by this Pakistan army stooge.

 

[Respect4Respect01]

Nice article, and its true.

 

[IND151]

^^ a well written article to justify 1965 war started by Pakistan.

he ( the author ) has short memory. he says;

And Pakistan attacked India in 1971!? This actually takes the cake. Ignore India’s full-fledged assault on then East Pakistan and trot out Pakistan’s attack in the west, an attack that came too late. That episode also opens the chapter in this region of covert war. Yes, it was introduced by India when it trained the Mukti Bahini; India repeated this exercise with Sri Lanka when it trained the LTTE. I don’t grudge India any of its actions. States do these things in their interests, perceived or real. But to present India as the babe in the wood? Nah; not happening.

however he forgets to add that it was policies about east Pakistan designed and planned by Pakistani overlords which created nasty mess in east Pakistan and ended up into fleeing of 10 million east Pakistanis in India.

it proved burden for Indian economy. no world power responded to appeals of Indira gandhi of taking action against genocide in east Pakistan.

this forced India to form mukti bahini which led to war.

i know Pakistan has its own policies. but to pretend that Pakistan is always at receiving end and innocent

 

[SQ8]

Totally different context of the IMF chief ; The IMF chief was not discussing economics with the hotel maid, he allegedly raped her. Shashi Tharoor is a UN diplomat who has been doing the jaw-jaw work for quite some time now. He is an accomplished diplomat, and has had his fair share of controversies, vilified inside Indian politics as well as by the media. But the guy has not spoken without facts in this context. I already posted the link wherein he brushed all liberals with a single brush which was a mistake ; However i do appreciate the way he dealt the simpleton-like narrative of Haider with the treatment it deserved. And Shashi Tharoor for all his shortcomings, makes a far better jury of his article, than a Haider would do of his own.

Doesnt matter what he did, he was considered infallible.. what makes Shashi Taroor any different..
What if Mr Taroor never got caught in any act..?

 

[EjazR]

I don't understand why the history of Kashmir is twisted again and again. Collective amnesia is rightly the problem here. Except its Ejaz Haider's amnesia.

There is overwhelming proof of tribal invasion of J&K in 1948. The raping and pillaging and killing of local Kashmiris mostly muslims led to a resistance movement from the locals under the leadership of Sheikh Abdullah. It was only much later that the Sikh regiment flew into Sri Nagar.

The early core of the national conference workers that defended Kashmir valley from the tribal onslaught ended up becoming the JK Light Infantry regiment which even today is a Muslim majority
Official Website of Indian Army

Do read
Did Jinnah know about the Kashmir War? ? by Ishtiaq Ahmed | LUBP
The 1947-48 Kashmir War


The status quo and revisionist is about boundaries in general IR discussion.

India is status quo because it is not demanding a change in boundaries even though a lot of Indian territory is being occupied by China and Pakistan.
However, Pakistan is revisionist because it does want a change in borders.

There is no good or bad in this, the state that wants a change in the borders is the revisionist state.

 

[Bond]

The World doesn’t focus on India’s problems because unlike Pakistan India isn’t exporting their problems to the rest of the World.

 

[WHF]

He's spot on! I am glad that we have at least someone who writes real things on ET, majority of the contributors are Apologist type of part-time writers.

wow what a logic...kashmir is a disputed teritory hence we will cross over and the war must be confined to kasmir and not on the international borders with pakistan, but if india crosses the LOC then we pakistanis will nuke each and every city of india, then we will not considers borders..GR8..go and sell ur logic to the sand dwellers perhaps they will raise it in IOC and issue fatwas, but frankly saying yes we will not budge down from status quo, if u want it try and take it..

 

[WHF]

Nice article, and its true.

same here dude,,wat ever keeps u happy ...but the truth is as soon as ur truth crosses the border it becomes the greatest false and yeah the same happens to my truth on ur side..

 

[Subramanian]

1971 was initiated by India when they trained the Mukti Bahini (both inside India & Bangladesh), & interfered by sending troops into Pakistani territory when the Pakistan Army started the operation against the Mukti Bahini. 1965 was initiated by Pakistan. 1999 cannot even be categorized as a war, more of a 'skirmish'. 1948 Kashmir was pretty much 'up for grabs', hence not really initiated by Pakistan.

The 1971 war started when India armed & trained Mukti Bahini insurgents (both inside India & East Pakistan) against the Pakistani Establishment [which is why Pakistan attacked India]; just like the 1999 'war' was initiated by Pakistan when they infiltrated proxies over the LOC. Apply the same standards in both situations.

Kashmir was not up for grabs or anything.When things were happening smoothly and peceafully and people of both countries had similar national conciousness and culture,Pakistan tried to act cool and aggressive.To be honest this is the trigger for India's attitude towards pakistan and this is how it will be forever.

Once u start competing in a one-up manship,the bigger man is always going to win it.Thats the whole message.