India inks deal with Russia to immediately procure 70,000 latest AK rifles off the shelf

[Black Tornado]

Not the replacement that is the debate here unless you missed it, the fact your armed forces have 4 different types of standard issue rifle in service is bizarre, more so that none are actually made in India.

You have around 1.5 million men under arms. Very very strange situation.

Only SiG-716 is not made in India, carbines and assault rifles would be made here. And standard issue rifle is AK-203 and SiG-716, Carbines are not rifles and what is 4th type?

 

[Yasser76]

Only SiG-716 is not made in India, carbines and assault rifles would be made here. And standard issue rifle is AK-203 and SiG-716, Carbines are not rifles and what is 4th type?

Call them what you want, main firearm rfile/carbine

1) Sig
2) INSAS
3) AK
4) Tavor


Tavor, SIG and AK-203 are not being made in India, these were purchased from abroad, let me know if you are still confused.

 

[Black Tornado]

Call them what you want, main firearm rfile/carbine

1) Sig
2) INSAS
3) AK
4) Tavor


Tavor, SIG and AK-203 are not being made in India, these were purchased from abroad, let me know if you are still confused.

AK-203 will be made in India over 7.5 lakh, INSAS has to be phased out, SiG-716 were imported. Carbines will be manufactured in India whoever wins the contract.

 

[Yasser76]

AK-203 will be made in India over 7.5 lakh, INSAS has to be phased out, SiG-716 were imported. Carbines will be manufactured in India whoever wins the contract.

I am not talking about "what will happen" in Indian defence, everyone here knows the yawning gap between what India says will happen and what happens, I am talking about facts on ground.

INSAS = Made in India, being replaced
Tavor = Imported
AK = Imported
SIG = Imported

Additioanlly BSF, Army, AF all using different types depending on unit. No standardisation, units having to swap rfile types, different ammo types, retraining. It's a mess I have never seen in any modern army

 

[Black Tornado]

Tavor = Imported

Tavors are for Special Forces and are manufactured in India

AK = Imported

Those were bought decades ago

Additioanlly BSF, Army, AF all using different types depending on unit. No standardisation, units having to swap rfile types, different ammo types, retraining. It's a mess I have never seen in any modern army

BSF is not Military, it uses standard Arsenal AK which is standard issue with all CAPFs, Armed Forces is INSAS (being replaced).

 

[Yasser76]

Tavors are for Special Forces and are manufactured in India

Those were bought decades ago

I was talking about the AK-203s that were on the original post, these are being made in Russia, did you bother to read the post?

Tavors are also used by BSF (Last time I checked these were not considered as SF, but I guess anything is possible in India), I have seen these myself at Wagha border.

Let me know if you need any further updates on Indian defence matters, as you seem unaware of much of it

 

[Black Tornado]

I was talking about the AK-203s that were on the original post, these are being made in Russia, did you bother to read the post?

Those are initial batch which was supposed to be imported and rest to be made in India, it’s not something which happened overnight, read any old article related to this deal, an initial batch was supposed to be imported with rest of 7.5 lac made in India.

Tavors are also used by BSF (Last time I checked these were not considered as SF, but I guess anything is possible in India), I have seen these myself at Wagha border.

Tavor X-95s are issued to CAPFs not military, Tavor TAR-21 is used by Special Forces of IA.

 

[Yasser76]

Those are initial batch which was supposed to be imported and rest to be made in India, it’s not something which happened overnight, read any old article related to this deal, an initial batch was supposed to be imported with rest of 7.5 lac made in India.

Tavor X-95s are issued to CAPFs not military, Tavor TAR-21 is used by Special Forces of IA.

Again, what was "supposed" to happen is not relevant here. You still are stuck with 4 types of main weapon for your armed forces, and yes, BSF is using Tavor.

 

[Black Tornado]

Again, what was "supposed" to happen is not relevant here. You still are stuck with 4 types of main weapon for your armed forces, and yes, BSF is using Tavor.


View attachment 771673

4 types?, BSF is CAPF as I mentioned above and someone was telling me that he can better tell me about my defence forces?

Supposed to be is irrelevant only for you, by the same your “supposed to be” rifle replacement is also irrelevant. This is not how you debate, “everyone knows, this will not happen, irrelevant” are not points to debate. The early tranche was supposed to be bought from Russia and rest made in India, first tranche ordered, now factory will start sometime later.

 

[Yasser76]

4 types?, BSF is CAPF as I mentioned above and someone was telling me that he can better tell me about my defence forces?

Supposed to be is irrelevant only for you, by the same your “supposed to be” rifle replacement is also irrelevant. This is not how you debate, “everyone knows, this will not happen, irrelevant” are not points to debate. The early tranche was supposed to be bought from Russia and rest made in India, first tranche ordered, now factory will start sometime later.

No, you debate by accepting reality, which you seem to consistantly fudge. Essentially all your major armed units (be it Army or CAPF) operate a biwildering array of weapons, there is no stantardisation in weapons, ammo, parts, training.

Compare it to say Pakistan. Rangers, Scouts, Army, AF, Navy even many commandos all standardise on the G3 or AKM. Both of which fire 7.62m. Can you understand the implications here for logistics, training, marksmanship levels, cross posting of troops etc

Please tell me you understand the implications?

No if you look at India

Within just the Army a unit could be equipped with either INSAS, SIG or AK. Indian, US, Russian weapons of different calibres, weights, parts etc.

Do you understand why this is very detrimental to an army?

 

[IblinI]

The debate should switch to the capability of india's small arms industry.

 

[Yasser76]

The debate should switch to the capability of india's small arms industry.

I think the INSAS saga told us all we need to know on that.

The fact they are importing rifles made in US and Russia also tell us a lot.

 

[Yasser76]

PAF better watch out....