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India ignored as Pak. takes charge of Afghan-Taliban talks

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SOURCE: THE HINDU

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As representatives of the Afghanistan government prepare for another round of talks in Pakistan with Taliban representatives on Friday, India is being frozen out of the talks. The official stand of the government is that it is “supportive of the peace process” provided “it brings genuine peace and internationally accepted red lines.” However, officials in Delhi and Kabul have toldThe Hinduthat India is far from comfortable with the “direction the talks are taking,” saying that “all red lines have been violated so far.”

In 2010, former President Hamid Karzai had listed these ‘red lines’ as an acceptance of the Afghan constitution; peace or a ceasefire as a pre-condition for talks; and following an ‘Afghan-owned, Afghan-led’ process, which had been endorsed by the UPA government.

ISI presence

In contrast, the current round of talks initiated by President Ashraf Ghani is happening without a ceasefire in place, where Taliban representatives are pushing for the re-establishment of an Islamic Emirate, rather than the constitution. In addition, the talks are being hosted by the Pakistan government, with senior ISI intelligence officials sitting in on all the discussions that were held on July 7 in the Pakistani hill station of Murree between Afghan officials and Taliban leaders produced by Pakistan.

Pakistan Army Chief Raheel Sharif has also been credited by both US Generals as well as the Afghan President Ghani’s government for “facilitating” the talks.

“Far from Afghan-owned, these talks seem to be ISI-controlled and ISI-led,” one official toldThe Hindu.

The next round of talks are expected to be held Pakistan on July 31, according to a representative of the Afghanistan Peace council.

Initial negotiations between Afghanistan Peace envoys and various Taliban leaders in this round began in May this year, with representatives of the UN, US and China attending as observers at a meeting in Doha in early May. This was followed by a second round of talks in Urumqi, in China’s Xinjiang province in the third week of May. However, the “Murree peace talks” of July 7-8, as they are referred to by the Pakistan government, were the first officially acknowledged round of talks from all sides.

Unlike other abortive attempts for talks, officials in the US and China characterised the Murree talks as a success. On July 8, White House spokesman Josh Earnest said the United States welcomed the talks, calling them “an important step toward advancing prospects for a credible peace”, adding that the US “acknowledged and appreciated Pakistan’s important efforts to host these conversations,” while Chinese Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying saying China viewed the talks “positively”.

“A second face-to-face meeting in less than a month clearly suggests a forward movement,” a senior Pakistani official told Pakistani newspaperThe Express Tribuneon Monday. “A truce and other CBMs will top the agenda when both sides meet on July 31,” he added. The Taliban has also brought up other demands, including the release of Taliban leaders from US custody in Guantanamo Bay, and of removing other leaders from the UN sanctions list under Resolution 1267.

India has made no official statement about the current round of talks, which have blind-sided the government with their speed and progress. Officials remain sceptical about whether the talks will resolve the violence in Afghanistan, as the Taliban continues to carry out attacks in the country.

“With each round of talks, both Afghanistan and the international community are accepting that the Taliban is a legitimate representative of Afghans, when in fact they are a terror group under Pakistani control,” said a senior diplomat.”

However officials in New Delhi and Kabul concede that given that India has little say in the outcome, the government will take a more “realistic” position. “We will convey our unease and concerns,” one official toldThe Hindu, “but quietly, and only to those willing to listen.”
 
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SOURCE: THE HINDU

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As representatives of the Afghanistan government prepare for another round of talks in Pakistan with Taliban representatives on Friday, India is being frozen out of the talks. The official stand of the government is that it is “supportive of the peace process” provided “it brings genuine peace and internationally accepted red lines.” However, officials in Delhi and Kabul have toldThe Hinduthat India is far from comfortable with the “direction the talks are taking,” saying that “all red lines have been violated so far.”

In 2010, former President Hamid Karzai had listed these ‘red lines’ as an acceptance of the Afghan constitution; peace or a ceasefire as a pre-condition for talks; and following an ‘Afghan-owned, Afghan-led’ process, which had been endorsed by the UPA government.

ISI presence

In contrast, the current round of talks initiated by President Ashraf Ghani is happening without a ceasefire in place, where Taliban representatives are pushing for the re-establishment of an Islamic Emirate, rather than the constitution. In addition, the talks are being hosted by the Pakistan government, with senior ISI intelligence officials sitting in on all the discussions that were held on July 7 in the Pakistani hill station of Murree between Afghan officials and Taliban leaders produced by Pakistan.

Pakistan Army Chief Raheel Sharif has also been credited by both US Generals as well as the Afghan President Ghani’s government for “facilitating” the talks.

“Far from Afghan-owned, these talks seem to be ISI-controlled and ISI-led,” one official toldThe Hindu.

The next round of talks are expected to be held Pakistan on July 31, according to a representative of the Afghanistan Peace council.

Initial negotiations between Afghanistan Peace envoys and various Taliban leaders in this round began in May this year, with representatives of the UN, US and China attending as observers at a meeting in Doha in early May. This was followed by a second round of talks in Urumqi, in China’s Xinjiang province in the third week of May. However, the “Murree peace talks” of July 7-8, as they are referred to by the Pakistan government, were the first officially acknowledged round of talks from all sides.

Unlike other abortive attempts for talks, officials in the US and China characterised the Murree talks as a success. On July 8, White House spokesman Josh Earnest said the United States welcomed the talks, calling them “an important step toward advancing prospects for a credible peace”, adding that the US “acknowledged and appreciated Pakistan’s important efforts to host these conversations,” while Chinese Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying saying China viewed the talks “positively”.

“A second face-to-face meeting in less than a month clearly suggests a forward movement,” a senior Pakistani official told Pakistani newspaperThe Express Tribuneon Monday. “A truce and other CBMs will top the agenda when both sides meet on July 31,” he added. The Taliban has also brought up other demands, including the release of Taliban leaders from US custody in Guantanamo Bay, and of removing other leaders from the UN sanctions list under Resolution 1267.

India has made no official statement about the current round of talks, which have blind-sided the government with their speed and progress. Officials remain sceptical about whether the talks will resolve the violence in Afghanistan, as the Taliban continues to carry out attacks in the country.

“With each round of talks, both Afghanistan and the international community are accepting that the Taliban is a legitimate representative of Afghans, when in fact they are a terror group under Pakistani control,” said a senior diplomat.”

However officials in New Delhi and Kabul concede that given that India has little say in the outcome, the government will take a more “realistic” position. “We will convey our unease and concerns,” one official toldThe Hindu, “but quietly, and only to those willing to listen.”

Again Indian media crying about ignoring India ?? I hope same is the case with Indian govt !
• solving afghan issue is more important than ignoring a crying baby & it's a good sign if we remove Indian elements from Afghanistan by collaborating with Afghanistan govt & the big break through will be if Taliban & Afghanistan govt reach to some sort of settlement/understanding... Good luck for the next round of talks...
 
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SOURCE: THE HINDU

However officials in New Delhi and Kabul concede that given that India has little say in the outcome, the government will take a more “realistic” position. “We will convey our unease and concerns,” one official toldThe Hindu, “but quietly, and only to those willing to listen.”



This is precisely what I have been saying all along and Indian members have jumped all over me. This show is not India Controlled and India can only be a spectator from the sidelines. The talks are actually held between the Taliban and Government of Afghanistan. Pakistan is merely performing the duty of moderator or facilitator in hosting these talks.

Besides, Pakistan is given more credit than we actually deserve. Pakistan has no control over the Afghan Taliban leadership. If we did, we would have asked them to hunt down the TTP ( aka Pakistani Taliban ) in Afghanistan for us. If Afghan Taliban were under our control, they would have delivered " Mulla Fazlulla " to our troops. The fact that they have not obliged us with that favour speaks volumes regarding this charge.

@Irfan Baloch , kindly merge the two threads. Thanks...
 
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Again Indian media crying about ignoring India ?? I hope same is the case with Indian govt !
• solving afghan issue is more important than ignoring a crying baby & it's a good sign if we remove Indian elements from Afghanistan by collaborating with Afghanistan govt & the big break through will be if Taliban & Afghanistan govt reach to some sort of settlement/understanding... Good luck for the next round of talks...

The Hindu is a commie newspaper and anti democratic govt..such issues raised by it aren't taken seriously in India.

Afghanistan govt is a responsible govt and their talks with a terrorist group is not India's concern whatever be the consequence. It's not going to go anywhere. ..unless the afghan govt decides to disband and handover afghanistan or taliban controlled to the taliban.

Even then their killings aren't going to stop because that's what they do.

The only concern for India here is that pakistan will start sending taliban fighters into India for terror ops..like they did post 1989.


In a wide-ranging interview with Al Jazeera, conducted in Muzaffarabad, the capital of Pakistan-administered Kashmir, he also said that anti-US and anti-state fighters in Afghanistan owe Kashmiris "a debt", and that he expects that it will be paid "on [Kashmiris'] terms" after the planned US military withdrawal from Afghanistan in 2014.

Afghan mujahideen 'owe Kashmir a debt' - Al Jazeera English

Pakistanis mujjis anticipating afghan mujjis to aid them in terror ops in India.
 
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Indian Assets in Afghanistan are already on Plan B.

Not much worries of India, other than 1-2 consulates limiting its activities.
 
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Lets not get carried away with some Cake cutting and Meeting seetings.

We prepared our self much before this started.
 
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we always get back stabbed, we spent billions on Afghanistan, we helped them get back on their feet.....now that they are standing on their own......they have thrown India like a toy..........and Pakistan which wants to nuke Afghanistan....has suddenly become their best friends and allies......but do not forget Indians never forget such back stabbings....
 
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This is precisely what I have been saying all along and Indian members have jumped all over me. This show is not India Controlled and India can only be a spectator from the sidelines. The talks are actually held between the Taliban and Government of Afghanistan. Pakistan is merely performing the duty of moderator or facilitator in hosting these talks.

Besides, Pakistan is given more credit than we actually deserve. Pakistan has no control over the Afghan Taliban leadership. If we did, we would have asked them to hunt down the TTP ( aka Pakistani Taliban ) in Afghanistan for us. If Afghan Taliban were under our control, they would have delivered " Mulla Fazlulla " to our troops. The fact that they have not obliged us with that favour speaks volumes regarding this charge.

@Irfan Baloch , kindly merge the two threads. Thanks...

don't worry they have a habit of jumping around when they miserably fail,since afg invasion congress govt and later Hamid karzai tried hard to play a victimisation card by depicting Pakistan as an terrorism sponsoring country and for karzai it was easy to blame Pakistan for every problem to hide his govt failures by pointing figures at us and to make his daddy happy and poor afghan govt was not alone in pointing finger at us the same thing Indians did on many occasions when Afghan Taliban attacked their consulate, at the same time the Indian govt used proxies against Pakistan..

• From last 13 years U.S & NATO never succeeded to take over control of 50% land from Afghan Taliban and yet all of them were blaming Pakistan..for them Pak was a scapegoat..
• Indians had a dream to encircle Pakistan from both side of the border and they thought that we have found an all weather alley on Pakistan western border..In Afghanistan they tried to present themselves as an friends of Afghani people,even these Afghanis will trust Jews if they start talking against Pakistan in Afghanistan land..Indians invested billions but that doesn't mean Pakistan never invested in Afghanistan but they don't know that u can't sit there for a long time and now as U.S troops will start withdrawing next year from Afg & with that indian influence will start vanishing in thin air, it was evident that Afghanistan leadership will look toward Pakistan that doesn't matter how much they hate us and yes it's a fact that we remained neutral on afghantan issues i.e afg Taliban/peace talks and other core issues and that give us advatange...
• I hope in few days or weeks indian govt will show its concerns but the fact is that Indian cannot do anything bcz afghan Taliban's hates them nor India can play her role in this process..

• Indian presence in Afghanistan is a destabilizing factor and with the passage of time their presence will reduce but they will keep feeding anti Pakistan elements & i.e the main area where we should work with afghan govt..
 
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This is precisely what I have been saying all along and Indian members have jumped all over me. This show is not India Controlled and India can only be a spectator from the sidelines. The talks are actually held between the Taliban and Government of Afghanistan. Pakistan is merely performing the duty of moderator or facilitator in hosting these talks.

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Talks are actually between Afghanistan and Pakistan... rest is optics. India has no place in it.
 
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Talks are actually between Afghanistan and Pakistan... rest is optics. India has no place in it.

Pakistan is a facilitator & China is a guarantor & U.S + other countries are observers in these talks..why do u think that the talks are BTW Pakistan and Afghanistan ?? For what purpose Afghan Taliban representatives are present there??
 
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Pakistan is a facilitator & China is a guarantor & U.S + other countries are observers in these talks..why do u think that the talks are BTW Pakistan and Afghanistan ?? For what purpose Afghan Taliban representatives are present there??
Pretty Self explanatory:
Talks are actually between Afghanistan and Pakistan... rest (as you mentioned) are optics
 
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This is precisely what I have been saying all along and Indian members have jumped all over me. This show is not India Controlled and India can only be a spectator from the sidelines. The talks are actually held between the Taliban and Government of Afghanistan. Pakistan is merely performing the duty of moderator or facilitator in hosting these talks.

Besides, Pakistan is given more credit than we actually deserve. Pakistan has no control over the Afghan Taliban leadership. If we did, we would have asked them to hunt down the TTP ( aka Pakistani Taliban ) in Afghanistan for us. If Afghan Taliban were under our control, they would have delivered " Mulla Fazlulla " to our troops. The fact that they have not obliged us with that favour speaks volumes regarding this charge.

@Irfan Baloch , kindly merge the two threads. Thanks...
yr not understanding the point. 8it is understood by everyone deep down that these kablis dont listen to anyone and r dheet race.

The reason why they were on top of Pakistan was that Pakistan was the only country they trust!, and Pakistan has always been a 'western slave', hence realistically only Pakistan could do what they cant for them.
 
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