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India faces threat from China, Pakistan: Jaswant

"Indian Muslims are Indian first and Muslims later; otherwise they are welcome to abandon ship.

Sensationalizing are we?

Did you bother reading my post?

I made it clear that if Indian Muslims' interests collide with India's due to their religious pseudo-obligations and if they complain that the GoI is looking after India's and not after them, regardless of how idiotic their stance is, then they are free to abandon ship.

I also said that I'll say the same thing for followers of any other religion. I wonder why didn't you highlight this.

Further, what wrong did I say? Do you expect Hindus in Pakistan to be hindus first and Pakistanis later?

One can understand why it is whenever one meets Indian Muslims they complain that Pakistan has closed immigration to them and they are compelled to suffer the discrimination of Hindus.

Gee... how many Indian Muslims did you meet? Please detail your encounters...

It's a most regrettable attitude, that in the long term works to pakistan's advantage

How? How has it (and again what?) has worked to Pakistan's advantage? The last time I checked the theory that religion holds everything together was bamboozled long back.
 
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USA AND OTHER NON-ISLAMIC COUNTRIES are making planning to crash muslims.WE need to take help from DR.ABDUL QADEER KHAN to power boost our defence power.we need to attack on ISRAEL[SHATAAN]
 
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M.KHURRAM.KHAN [747 ARMY];173019 said:
USA AND OTHER NON-ISLAMIC COUNTRIES are making planning to crash muslims.WE need to take help from DR.ABDUL QADEER KHAN to power boost our defence power.we need to attack on ISRAEL[SHATAAN]

Pearls of wisdom ?
 
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Muse,

Isn't it a worldwide phenomenon that the radical of Islam always find that they are discriminated and that their voice alone is the voice of reason?

Check this forum itself and you will observe that they all complain that the world is against them and they are never wrong!!

Only God is said to be perfect!

Check what M Khurram has written.

He is so archetypal!

Religion cannot be paramount when it comes to national interests.

Pakistan is reeling because religion is taken as paramount and the country immaterial. That is why the radicals are eating into the innards of the country and the people watch aghast and helpless.
 
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M.KHURRAM.KHAN [747 ARMY];173032 said:
YES you are right.India fears that pakistan and china on them.thank you.

You are a humorist, right?

Or merely a dreamer under heavy opiate sedation?
 
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M.KHURRAM.KHAN [747 ARMY];173037 said:
I am not a dreamer i ma a emotional pakistani.A man of 747 army.what s your email address i want to chat with you.

You are a aircraft bomber?

747 is an aircraft!

I am not an aircraft and so my e mail id will be of no use to you!
 
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"How? How has it (and again what?) has worked to Pakistan's advantage? The last time I checked the theory that religion holds everything together was bamboozled long back."

I notice you always seem to have straw man arguments - which is fine - but just as long as you know that this transparency, makes the argument ineffective.

As long as the message to Indian muslims is "you can leave if you don't like it", it can only mean trouble for India - indian Muslims have no where to go, it's make or break right there in india - and that's a double edged sword, it invites a activism that can have unwelcome effects on the polity as some hindus imagine it.

In fact this is already happening. And you can take it or leave it, but I honestly cannot recall meeting Indian muslim who did not voice concerns about what they feel as discrimination, from schools to credit card applications to loans -- caution, what goes up must come down.
 
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"How? How has it (and again what?) has worked to Pakistan's advantage? The last time I checked the theory that religion holds everything together was bamboozled long back."

I notice you always seem to have straw man arguments - which is fine - but just as long as you know that this transparency, makes the argument ineffective.

As long as the message to Indian muslims is "you can leave if you don't like it", it can only mean trouble for India - indian Muslims have no where to go, it's make or break right there in india - and that's a double edged sword, it invites a activism that can have unwelcome effects on the polity as some hindus imagine it.

In fact this is already happening. And you can take it or leave it, but I honestly cannot recall meeting Indian muslim who did not voice concerns about what they feel as discrimination, from schools to credit card applications to loans -- caution, what goes up must come down.

As far as Pakistan is concerned religion does not hold all, it is being used to disintegrate the nation by the very ardent tree hugging (metaphorical) Islamists and none can do a damn about it since Islam is supreme and none dare challenge its misuse.

There is no question of Indian Islamic followers leaving India. It is their country as it is of any other Indian. And none can give such a writ.

Religion cannot rule in India. That is what even Vajpayee understood and he distanced himself from the RSS and the idiotic VHP.

As I have said elsewhere, the Islamic people, more so the illiterates, always feel that world is discriminating against them unless the world gives into their demands. Why has Islam got a bad name? It is because of the radicals. Are there no Moderate amongst Islam? They speak, but the din of the radicals overpowers and fades the voice of the Moderates. Therefore, nothing unusual if people of the Islamic faith you have met, complain. The Hindus complain, the Christians complain and they all complain. And yet, none cares about the Nation or kicking their radicals in the teeth!

Look at Paksitan. Who is forcing its destiny? The radicals who congregate at the Red Mosque and bequeathed their children to Jihad and clown like Mehsud and Farkarullah!

They are holding the progress of Pakistan and its prosperity at ransom!

They are pulling Pakistan down into decadence!

Rise Pakistan and fight these anti national forces!

Don't be moribund and allow these Merchants of Powerlust misusing religion and giving it a bad name.

Be men!!
 
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"How? How has it (and again what?) has worked to Pakistan's advantage? The last time I checked the theory that religion holds everything together was bamboozled long back."

I notice you always seem to have straw man arguments - which is fine - but just as long as you know that this transparency, makes the argument ineffective.

I'll again ask you the same question: What is working to Pakistan's advantage and how?

As long as the message to Indian muslims is "you can leave if you don't like it", it can only mean trouble for India - indian Muslims have no where to go, it's make or break right there in india - and that's a double edged sword, it invites a activism that can have unwelcome effects on the polity as some hindus imagine it.

I'll give the same message to any Indian who thinks their religion/caste/tribe is more important than the writ of the Republic of India. If that invites activism, then be it.

I've noticed that you are trying to give an anti-Muslim tone to my argument; suggest you refrain from doing so.

In fact this is already happening. And you can take it or leave it, but I honestly cannot recall meeting Indian muslim who did not voice concerns about what they feel as discrimination, from schools to credit card applications to loans -- caution, what goes up must come down.

There is discrimination in India, but not to the extent that you are implying. There are plenty of Hindus who feel Muslims get the better deal in India. Everybody thinks they face discrimination and that they do not discriminate.

Further, tell me where exactly did you encounter these Indian Muslims?
 
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Muse,

I am not a Hindu.

I feel that the Mos.lems have a damn good deal while others don't!

They get what they want (Shah Bano case) while the others languish. Not that it matters since we do well on our own merits. We don't require alms!! We are not beggars. We are as good as anyone else in India!!

Look at Tata. He has not only taken on India, but he is taking on the world.Who has helped him? He does not require help from India, India requires help from him!

And what is the % of Parsis?

Stand up and be recognised as Premji Azmi is doing!! He is a Mo...slem!!and India is proud and indebted to him. He is a great Indian as our erstwhile President Kalam. They are gems and they required no one's alms or compassion!

Our govt's survival is on the opinion of Kalam! So!

That is the power of being beyond using religion as a crutch.

Be recognised for what you are worth
 
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I find it painful when someone whines over religion and how everyone discriminates!

If the Jews are doing well, how are they doing so when they were hated in Europe?

Let us not blame Hitler alone. Anti Jew feeling was historically universal in Europe.

Yet, the Jews made themselves indispensable in all walks of life and they could not be ignored!

What stops people of the Islamic faith to do the same, instead of cringing and whining and blaming everyone?

Be bold and face the world on its terms and conquer it like the Jews!!

Can you or you are not of the same mettle?
 
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