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India erodes US expectations

Not really I expect a two faced policy for as long as possible but when push comes to shove India has and will choose America.
It is one faced policy, for GoI, India comes first and foremost, we are not going to choose one or the other based on somebody else's convenience.
That is for small countries to do.
 
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By now US would have understood that they cannot treat India like other countries in South Asia...

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Oh yes special relationship lol

it clearly states that author wants india to be a stooge of U.S and also talk about US ignorance of pakistan for india;).
this is we called as jealousy

You call the truth jealousy??.

India is a stooge to the white man and US has proved beyond any doubt with the failure of their plans for the neighbourhood which no country was interested in except India lol

it clearly states that author wants india to be a stooge of U.S and also talk about US ignorance of pakistan for india;).
this is we called as jealousy

You call the truth jealousy??.

India is a stooge to the white man and US has proved beyond any doubt with the failure of their plans for the neighbourhood which no country was interested in except India lol

There is no unwinding of the Indo-US strategic relationship. As long as China remains hostile to India and the US, this relationship will remain in place. Despite all the F-18s we don't buy from them and all the non UNSC sanctions we don't abide by. America does not expect us to do what is not in our national interest. If they really do so, then they do not really want India as a strategic partner and if that be the case, then we do not owe anything to the US, and they should not really expect anything from us, no? Both ways, India's national interest comes first always and every time.

Excellent mate you hit it on the head. India is scared of China etc and feels it needs a white daddy to assist it. That security concern will trump the desire for oil which can be imported from elsewhere away from Iran especially with American assistance.
 
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Pakistan acted like US lapdogs after 9/11 and took the bait ( U are either with US or against it ) and they think that these are the only two options available in this world. Musharraf clearly failed to extract the kind of leverage which could have been extracted out of US by leasing them bases.

Why are you using the emotive word lapdog. Do you want me to remind you of what you are??

Pakistan may have done that as a face saving exercise. If you look at the facts from 2007 onwards America realised that Pakistan was never on it's side and at best was playing both sides. A bit like India is trying not so successfully with Iran-America.

That's why America have come to India. Pakistan will never help America to contain China etc lol.

Now they expect India to act fools like them which is clearly not the case. When the IRAN oil issue came up, pakistani members were falling over one another congratulating to find India is a spot (similar to the one they were in after 9/11). Obviously, South Block have dealt the situation with much more ease and that is the source of all these frustrated articles.

Every other day some pk/BD member will post such BS articles in some form or other. We can simply ignore them or redirect them to the above post.

@pmukherjee : Nicely put up. :)

You said pmukherjee put it nicely but what you stated was very different from the head shot he took which I explained earlier which was India needs a big white daddy to protect it so it will choose America over Iran lol
 
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Excellent mate you hit it on the head. India is scared of China etc and feels it needs a white daddy to assist it. That security concern will trump the desire for oil which can be imported from elsewhere away from Iran especially with American assistance.

There is no scare, it is always a law of nature that every body keep their security as utmost priority. And they are not our white dady but Pakistan's only...

India depends upon Russia than America in security matters.
 
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Pak leaders are short sighted, they hardly have for a long term vision. Foreign policy should not based on emotions but self interests and benefits.

Oh like your lot did when they dumped Russia because they thought that it was going to be a unipolar world lol. Do you even understand what policies your government follows. Sometimes I think I am talking to kidergarten
 
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Oh like your lot did when they dumped Russia because they thought that it was going to be a unipolar world lol. Do you even understand what policies your government follows. Sometimes I think I am talking to kidergarten

No.

Like the Pakistani lady of the evening who first went to the US. When Uncle Sam got bored,

She went to China.

...and is now approaching Russia.

Man!

White ddady and yellow daddy both!:laugh:

...and boy she got paid handsomely, didn't she? :lol:
 
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:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Oh yes special relationship lol



You call the truth jealousy??.

India is a stooge to the white man and US has proved beyond any doubt with the failure of their plans for the neighbourhood which no country was interested in except India lol



You call the truth jealousy??.

India is a stooge to the white man and US has proved beyond any doubt with the failure of their plans for the neighbourhood which no country was interested in except India lol



Excellent mate you hit it on the head. India is scared of China etc and feels it needs a white daddy to assist it. That security concern will trump the desire for oil which can be imported from elsewhere away from Iran especially with American assistance.

I can see you talk from 60 years of experience..
 
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Oh like your lot did when they dumped Russia because they thought that it was going to be a unipolar world lol. Do you even understand what policies your government follows. Sometimes I think I am talking to kidergarten

Dumped Russia? what are you speaking? just widen your perspective. Some Diplomacy you do not understand at all.
 
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Dumped Russia? what are you speaking? just widen your perspective. Some Diplomacy you do not understand at all.

An article by a former ambassador of India to Russia M K Bhadrakumar – December 23, 2011
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Dai Bingguo heading for Islamabad


Francis Fukuyama wrote a sequel to his celebrated book The End of History and the Last Man (1992) no sooner than he realised that he was hopelessly wrong in his prediction that the global triumph of political and economic liberalism was at hand. He wrote: “What we may be witnessing is not just the end of the Cold War, or the crossing of a particular period of postwar history, but the end of history as such… That is, the end point of mankind’s ideological evolution and the universalization of Western democracy as the final form of human government.” But in no time he realised his rush to judgment and he retracted with another book.

However, unlike the celebrated American neocon thinker, Indian foreign policy thinkers who were heavily influenced by his 1992 thesis are yet to retract. The Indian discourses through the 1990s drew heavily from Fukuyama to throw overboard the scope for reinventing or reinterpreting ‘non-alignment’ in the post-Cold War setting and came to a rapid judgment that Russia belonged to the dustbin of history. Our discourses never really got updated despite Fukumaya’s own retraction.

Indeed, western commentators also fuelled the consequent sense of insecurity in Delhi through the 1990s by endorsing that India would never have a ‘Russia option’ again and Boris Yeltsin’s Russia itself was inexorably becoming an ‘ally’ of the west — and, therefore, what alternative is there for India but to take to the New American Century project? Remember the drama of the Bill Clinton administration arm-twisting Yeltsin not to give to India the cryogentic engines?

In sum, India got entrapped in a ‘unipolar predicament’. The best elucidation of this self-invited predicament has been the masterly work titled Crossing the Rubicon by Raja Mohan, which was of course widely acclaimed in the US. While releasing the book at a function in Delhi, the then National Security Advisor Brajesh Mishra even admitted that India’s main foreign policy challenge was somehow to engage the US’s “attention”.


Russia, of course, went on to prove our pundits completely wrong. Russia remerged as a global player and the evidence of it is today spread (and is poised to expand) all across global theatres — Libya, Syria, Iran, Central Asia, Afghanistan, etc.
Why I am underscoring all this is that I am strongly reminded of that sad chapter in the recent history of India’s foreign policy when I see the huge ‘psywar’ being let loose on Pakistan currently when that country too is at a crossroads with regard to its future policy directions in a highly volatile external enviornment.

In Pakistan’s case, the ‘psywar’ substitutes Russia with China. The US’s ‘Track II’ thesis is that China is hopelessly marooned in its own malaise so much so that it has no time, interest or resources to come to Pakistan’s aid, the two countries’ ‘all-weather friendship’ notwithstanding. Let me cull out two fine pieces of this ongoing ‘psywar’.

One is the lengthy article featured by America’s prestigious flag-carrier Foreign Affairs magazine in early December titled “China’s Pakistan conundrum”. Its argument is: ‘China will not simply bail out Pakistan with loans, investment, and aid, as those watching the deterioration of US-Pakistani relations seem to expect. China will pursue politics, security, and geopolitical advantage regardless of Islamabad’s preferences’. It puts forth the invidious argument that China’s real use for Pakistan is only to “box out New Delhi in Afghanistan and the broader region.”

Alongside the argument is the highly-tendentious vector that is beyond easy verification, namely, that US and China are increasingly ‘coordinating’ their policies toward Pakistan. Diplomacy is part dissimulation and we simply don’t know whether the US and China are even anywhere near beginning to ‘coordinate’ about ‘coordinating’ their regional policies in South Asia, especially with regard to Pakistan (and Afghanistan). The odds are that while the US and China may have some limited convergent interests, conceivably, their strategic interests are most certainly in sharp conflict.

A milder version of this frontal attack by US pundits on Pakistan’s existential dilemma appears in Michael Krepon’s article last week titled ‘Pakistan’s Patrons’, which, curiously, counsels Islamabad to follow India’s foreign-policy footsteps and make up with the US. Krepon literally suggests that the Pakistanis are living in a fool’s paradise.

The obvious thrust of this ‘psywar’ — strikingly similar to what India was subjected to in the 1990s — is that Pakistan has no option but to fall in line with the US regional strategies, as it has no real ‘China option’. The main difference between India and Pakistan is that the foreign policy elites in Islamabad — unlike their Indian counterparts — are not inclined to buy into the US argument with a willing suspension of disbelief. In a way, the Sino-Pakistan relationship is proving once again to be resilient. Pakistan is in no mood to get into a ‘unipolar predicament’, as the Indian elites willingly did in the 1990s.


Thus, the visit by the Chinese delegation led by State Councilor, Dai Bingguo to Islamabad at this point in time assumes much significance. Dai is one of the highest-ranking figures in the Chinese foreign-policy establishment and the fact he is leading a delegation that includes of senior Chinese military officials is very significant. Dai is scheduled to meet not only Pakistan’s political leadership at the highest level but also army chief Ashfaq Kayani and ISI head Ahmed Shuja Pasha.

Obviously, Beijing is making a big point through the timing of this visit as well, which, incidentally, is taking place at a time of great uncertainties in Pakistan’s internal affairs. When it comes to relations with China, it must be assumed that Pakistan’s civil and military leaderships are together.

Dai doesn’t really have a US counterpart as he is ranked above the FM. Arguably, it would be secretary of state Hillary Clinton. If so, to what extent Dai ‘coordinated’ his proposed visit with Clinton will be of particular interest. The future of the US’s ‘psywar’ on Pakistan is at stake.

The big question is whether this would be Dai’s last major trip to South Asia, as he is a key member of President Hu Jintao’s team and China is moving into a period of transition at the leadership level. Dai’s visit to Delhi for the Special Representatives meet was called off at the last minute.
Posted in Diplomacy, Politics.

By M K Bhadrakumar – December 23, 2011
 
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Maybe US shall tie LCA engine with Iran issue. India no support of US sanction on Iran stance. F404 engines will be ban from export to India.

That will effective killed off LCA. Anyway, LCA is almost dead with MCA deal sign of rafale.
 
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IMHO, India has done what any sovereign state would do and that is decide in favour of its own national interests, and by the way i'd never digest the question why the west always interfere in the personal matters of the countries so far away from their countries? did we asians ever did that? they are so prejudiced that they would not tolerate USSR relations with latin american and eastern european countries but on the contrary they think this globe belongs to them and they sort of own it.

The 'West' has progressed because of centuries of hard work, rationality, and brutal internal wars to emerge as a great unified group of countries. The West is on top because they explore and take chances. And some of that is obvious imperialism, currently couched as 'Freedom' and 'democracy' while really it is the commercial interests which are at work. There are immense goods for the entire humanity because of the Western 'drive' and then there are immense bad.

Coming back to the topic, of course India is going to defy America. What choice do the Americans have but to tolerate Indian defiance?

BTW, Indians here only fool themselves if they think Pakistan has sold itself cheap to the Americans. I know Pakistanis here can be ungrateful but I really think American contribution to Pakistan's defense and civilian infrastructure over the decades has been immense. I know Musharraf could have extracted a bit more after 9/11 but then the Americans were like a raging bull and the Pakistanis knew that the support for the Talibans till 9/11 was a huge, huge problem for Pakistan....
 
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