India Developing, but still a long way to go

[gslv mk3]

 

[IndoCarib]

Delhi T3

 

[IndoCarib]

Gurgaon's Rapid Metro: Intra-city metro service's trial run flagged off

 

[Maritimer]

Question to all.

Ok, Delhi Metro = $ 25 Billion.

• In PPP terms wise to say $ 1 = $ 10-20 re: infra. projects of saria, cement, labour & rodi.

Therefore, the real expenditure in PPP real terms:

- Average for above $ 10 - $ 20/2 = $ 15;

• so it is $ 15 * $ 25 Billion = $ 375 Billion in PPP terms!

Baap-re, maybe world's most expensive metro system.

Wot?

If the $25 billion figure is correct, then PPP would be approx $70 billion.
Taking market exchange rate at ₹53 per $ and PPP rate as ₹ 19 per $, we get 25 x 53 / 19 = 70

On topic, all these metro projects are great. India is catching up late with urban development, but better late than never.

 

[patentneer]

If the $25 billion figure is correct, then PPP would be approx $70 billion.
Taking market exchange rate at ₹53 per $ and PPP rate as ₹ 19 per $, we get 25 x 53 / 19 = 70

On topic, all these metro projects are great. India is catching up late with urban development, but better late than never.

^^^

Again, thanks for your response.

Pls. explain how you came up with the '₹ 19' figure, whatever '₹' means.
Interestingly, there is something called relative purchasing parity Vs. absolute purchasing parity.
Re: relative purchasing parity, note how I tried to explain how labour, cement, reta, saria is cheaper by far in India. The idea is to figure out how much is this infra. stuff really worth, and not debate needlessly and endlessly, r8 ?

• The joy is that said infra. projects are a much awaited boon to the public. The costs and normal logic reflect that they are top-of-the-line, next gen. type projects which is a normal thing in the evolutionary phase of developing countries. So Inida's infra. may end up top of the class. The fear is that said infra. projects are 'padded' re: corruption. Maybe a given, so how much padding.

I'm genuinely interested to know.

Meanwhile, Supertech's 50 Acre Project

- booking open

 

[r1MM0n]

If the $25 billion figure is correct, then PPP would be approx $70 billion.
Taking market exchange rate at ₹53 per $ and PPP rate as ₹ 19 per $, we get 25 x 53 / 19 = 70

On topic, all these metro projects are great. India is catching up late with urban development, but better late than never.

These things are not that simple.
For patentneer,Let me first explain :
India's gdp in PPP terms for 2011-12 financial year=4.5 Trillion dollars
India's gdp in exchange rate terms terms for 2011-12 financial year=1.85 Trillion dolars
So in purchasing power terms every dollar india spends is equivalent to (4.5/1.85)= 2.4
So for $25 b expenditure the actual figure in PPP comes out to be $60 b.

Now let me explain why this should not be calculated this way::
GDP is made up of Agriculture, industry and services. GDP is the sum total of the value of all the goods and services produced in the country.In developing economies the value of services is a fraction of what is in developed world. Major commodities are traded across the globe so their price is almost equal in every places. But the commodities whose export/import is restricted/pertly allowed by GOI their prices vary with the global prices.
For example, India restricts exports of many agricultural items, so their prices are depressed artificially. But items whose trade is not restricted have equal prices all over the world.
For metro construction, the raw materials are steel, concrete, coaches and manual labor.Since steel is almost equal in price everywhere, major difference is the cost of labor, consultancy, coaches and desi cements.This is having low price in india.If coaches are imported they have the same global prices. So, you cannot convert the price tag of metro in terms of PPP since this doesn't have the same compostion of GDP.

In GDP, services are mostly expensive in developed countries.Like labor cost.You must have seen the difference in prices of
Taking a taxi,trains
visiting a doctor
buying medicines
buying fast foods
renting a place
paying electrical bills
buying clothes
enrolling in schools etc
for developed and developing markets. In India(developing) they are dirt cheap as compared to say UK(developed).These items are mostly services sector of the economy.Services account for 60% of our economy, so,for paying for the same services, you have to shell out more money in developed countries and hence difference in two values of gdp.
This is also done by MAC index. For eg you can see the difference in price of chicken burger in all the countries having same ingredient. The price difference will give u an idea of purchasing power of their currencies.In Switzerland u have to pay $5.5 for the same Mc chicken that u pay $1.4 here in India. This difference is due to difference in purchasing power of currencies in different countries.
Hope i have cleared your doubt. So price tag of $20 b of metro cannot be taken as $60 b on simple conversion by PPP terms.

 

[Maritimer]

^^^

Again, thanks for your response.

Pls. explain how you came up with the '₹ 19' figure, whatever '₹' means.
Interestingly, there is something called relative purchasing parity Vs. absolute purchasing parity.
Re: relative purchasing parity, note how I tried to explain how labour, cement, reta, saria is cheaper by far in India. The idea is to figure out how much is this infra. stuff really worth, and not debate needlessly and endlessly, r8 ?

The ₹ is the symbol for Rupee. The PPP implied rates for 2011 are from IMF database.

 

[luckych]

lanco hills ,hyderabad

 

[patentneer]

These things are not that simple.
For patentneer,Let me first explain :

India's gdp in PPP terms for 2011-12 financial year=4.5 Trillion dollars
India's gdp in exchange rate terms terms for 2011-12 financial year=1.85 Trillion dolars
So in purchasing power terms every dollar india spends is equivalent to (4.5/1.85)= 2.4
So for $25 b expenditure the actual figure in PPP comes out to be $60 b. (cont'd.)

^^^

Thanks for your detailed response r1MM0n.

In dis-agreeing with you, I say steel, cement, consulting, technology and specially labour, though a small part, is multiple times cheaper. Coaches, specially the drive motors, may be imported fully loaded or in parts and sure there are now locals making the stuff, however; it’s nowhere near the 3-5 multiple re: $ value in PPP with a near $ 60 Billion final tag. It’s got to be more. I still say it’s closer to $ 250 Billion as I concluded a rough heuristic of 1 to 10 re: civil engg. type Metro project in PPP terms.! That’s some metro . Not even gold-plated.

"A shortage of bricklayers, rod benders, welders and other skilled laborers could slow India's economic growth. But for the workers, the shortage is making a difference not just to their wages but to their standards of living."- The Wall St. Journal

(c) Shortage of Laborers Plagues India - WSJ.com

A Recent Bombay Shot
----------------------
- Mumbai Shanghaing

Even in areas like Boeing or Airbus passenger jets where its $ 1 on $ 1 OECD govt.’s cross subsidise the exports by underwriting risk on long term, easy financing. Same easy, long term financing goes for above coaches, motors, consultancy etc.

I hope my post is factual, logical and self-explanatory. Feedback welcome.

---xxx---


PPP This - India to invest $147bn in railways by 2017 !

Indian Railways is planning to invest $147bn during the next five-year plan period that runs from 2012 to 2017. Indian Railway Minister Dinesh Trivedi said the Railway Ministry intends to borrow Rs500bn ($10bn) from the market through the Indian Railway Finance Corporation (IRFC) during the 2012-13 fiscal year.

• "There has been considerable criticism of Indian railways in regards to only partial implementation or sometimes no implementation of the recommendation of several committees set up in the past," Trivedi said. The Indian Government has sanctioned about ten new electrification projects in the Railway Budget 2012-13, 17 gauge conversion projects to be completed in 2012-13, and the upgrade of 84 stations as model stations during the fiscal year.

An additional 700km of new rail lines are to be added to the network in the fiscal year starting in April.
India is also planning to introduce 75 new express trains, 21 passenger trains, eight new mainline electrical multiple unit (MEMU) and nine diesel-electric multiple unit (DEMU) services, which will also include extending the run of 39 trains and increasing the frequency of 23 trains.

The new express trains would include nine AC express trains comprising double-decker express trains between Chennai-Bangalore and Habibganj-Indore. During 2012-13, the Indian Railways is aiming to carry 1,025 million tonnes of revenue earning traffic, while the freight earnings target has been kept at Rs89.3bn ($17.9bn), indicating a growth of 30.2% over the current year's revised targets. Trivedi said with the increase in the number of trains and higher occupancy, the number of passengers is expected to increase by 5.4%, and the passenger earnings are estimated at Rs36,073 crore ($722.7m). According to a proposal by the minister, Indian Railways will achieve 6,500km electrification of routes for the Udhampura, Srinagar and Baramullah line in the northern part of the country. The Railway Ministry is planning to set up a new line from Agartala in India to Akura in Bangladesh in a bid to connect neighbouring countries through the rail network.

- 15 March 2012

(c) India to invest $147bn in railways by 2017 - Railway Technology

 

[IndoCarib]

Delhi

 

[patentneer]

we do make our own rolling stock at bombardier facility in Gujrat..But we can not supply to all these metros being built.

Also BEML manufactures metro coaches. BEML sas so itslef and reading between the lines, thy never day we make electric motors for said rakes. So, they must not make what is really the heart of the rake, the DC motor; :nuts: nutty logic but regression analysis has merit .

BEML delivers India's 1st standard gauge metro car

^^

In our Global world, your uber DYI nationalism, is kinda jaded.

By the way, you think Global metro manufacturers are silly, simple and stupid who don't already factor in your type of ppl. Therefore, manufacturing bases in client countries.

Tata Marcopolo
----------------
- on duty as a Delhi municipal bus, orange non-AC type Vs. CNG green AC types below:

Vs.

 

[luckych]

new stadium in rajkot

 

[Lenin]

Aamby valley city near mumbai...

 

[Lenin]

Buddh international circuit...

 

[djsjs]

woowooowoooow.morden city,beautiful buildings.great skyline ,i thought it was new york.