In the end, India will still be trapped in debt

[SpArK]

The problem here on PDF being; When these right wingers see anything bad on India, they come running to defend it, by hook or crook. They must do that, whether they have to lie in the process. This is the psyche here.

Psyche here i guess is that fact that the majority think your participation is based on seeing "everything" bad on India.

And that "irritates' people because the whole motive of your threads, thoughts and post is a psychological issue.

 

[ashok321]

Well, I do not know about right winger but the facts are clearly not with author and those who follow that author.

Just think why is the same (author) being tolerated by none other than a Rajya Sabha BJP MP.

You have no case or its BJP MP who does not have one.
Somebody of the two is wrong.

The author still writes and is endorsed by BJP MP.

 

[EndangeredSpecies]

The founder of this weekly; Sunday Guardian, one who is a Rajya Sabha BJP MP, was the one under whose watch this article was released into mainstream.

Therefore the common sense says it that the author would not have been in any position to lie on figures or otherwise.

So people who question the motive of a writer, they should use little prudence before even speaking against the same.

If you examine the career of author on this publication / website, you can see they haven't written on that platform after 2014 (http://www.sunday-guardian.com/profile/jehangir-s-pocha). I do not know their motive and I do not question their motive but like you I also do not like to be taken for a ride and I smell bullshit strongly in what they have written. The entire alarmist narrative of 65% GDP as debt etc is simply fear mongering.

 

[ashok321]

If you examine the career of author on this publication / website, you can see they haven't written after 2014. I do not know their motive and I do not question their motive but like you I also do not like to be taken for a ride and I smell bullshit strongly in what they have written. The entire alarmist narrative of 65% GDP as debt etc is simply fear mongering.

Did not you agree with me that India's debt is at 68% earlier?
So why change the tracks now?

It is not good for any nation, whose quarter of the budget revenue gets eaten up by interests alone.
India is already low on its revenue:

This is a lot of burden for a third world, low income country as India, one who is already in precarious position as for its finance part:

https://twitter.com/x/status/852974748967587840

 

[EndangeredSpecies]

2014 is inconsequential and even dishonest to speak of or mention, because its the present situation thats being talked about. The peril is even bigger now. The per capita debt load/burden is growing.

2014 was when the author wrote this article hence it is of paramount importance to take this article IN that context. The numbers etc are from 2014 only. I fail to see how this is dishonest.

Did not you agree with me that India's debt is at 68% earlier?

I AGREE WITH YOU THAT INDIA'S TOTAL DEBT IS 68% OF INDIAN NOMINAL GDP.
What I do not agree is the argument that it is alarming. I believe it is normal for a developing economy like India.

 

[ashok321]

2014 was when the author wrote this article hence it is of paramount importance to take this article IN that context. The numbers etc are from 2014 only. I fail to see how this is dishonest.

That being the case, numbers are minor.
Now they have even swelled.
He could not have given 2017 numbers in 2014.

The magnitude of India's financial difficulty is bigger now.

 

[ParachinarTorkham]

2014 was when the author wrote this article hence it is of paramount importance to take this article IN that context. The numbers etc are from 2014 only. I fail to see how this is dishonest.


I AGREE WITH YOU THAT INDIA'S TOTAL DEBT IS 68% OF INDIAN NOMINAL GDP.
What I do not agree is the argument that it is alarming. I believe it is normal for a developing economy like India.

sir have you given upsc civils?

 

[ashok321]

What I do not agree is the argument that it is alarming. I believe it is normal for a developing economy like India.

How is it normal wherein 25% of the progress money is wasted on interests?

No wonder India spends .85 on R&D.
Education wise, the spending is poor too.
The way the things are growing, its going to be more & more by the day.
The loans are getting bigger if not better.

@EndangeredSpecies

 

[EndangeredSpecies]

https://twitter.com/x/status/852974748967587840

Duh! Samsung is a for-profit company. If Indian Government becomes for profit, you will be amazed how much revenue they can churn. Just imagine, a death tax! Or charging money for a suitable date for your case in the court of law, or reduction of penal sentences on a charge. Do you want such a government? I certainly do not.

sir have you given upsc civils?

I do not wish to become a bureaucrat. I think the most honorable folks are those who take risks with their own skin in the game -- like enterpenures. That is what I will be. Bureaucrat take risk on public money and assets, something I do not like in principle.

 

[ashok321]

Do you know each Indian owes more than each Pakistani?
@EndangeredSpecies

Now this is a shame for a fastest growing economy.

 

[ashok321]

Duh! Samsung is a for-profit company. If Indian Government becomes for profit, you will be amazed how much revenue they can churn. Just imagine, a death tax! Or charging money for a suitable date for your case in the court of law, or reduction of penal sentences on a charge. Do you want such a government? I certainly do not.

Even if you leave that comparison involving Samsung, what you got as India's revenue numbers?

Measly 300 billion.
Now defend these numbers.
Of course these were for 2015 though.

@EndangeredSpecies

 

[EndangeredSpecies]

Even if you leave that comparison involving Samsung, what you got as India's revenue numbers?

Measly 300 billion.
Now defend these numbers.
Of course these were for 2015 though.

One way to look at this situation is comparing Revenue to GDP.

IMF, recently published its data set on Revenue to GDP %. Please look at it

http://www.imf.org/external/datamapper/GGR_G01_GDP_PT@FM/ADVEC/WEOWORLD/AS5/CIS/DA/OEMDC

I will like to stress that we should not over analyse the above link and come to ridiculous conclusions like 'India same league as China' etc. But note worthy points are :-

1. Indian governments (State + Centre) collect about 20.87% of GDP as revenue in 2017 as seen in the IMF dataset. Advanced economies collect around 35% or so. We are by that measure, somewhat behind.

2. Countries behind India include Pakistan (15.2), B'desh (10.xx), Indonesia (14.XX), Iran (), Sri Lanka (14.XX%) etc. Countries ahead of us are China (27.XX), Europe (around 35% on avarage), Australia (34.XX%), US(31.XX%).

In all we are among developing nation when it comes to revenue vs economy. This includes likes of Mexico(21.XX), Malaysia(19.XX), Peru (19.XX), Philippines (19.XX) etc. Which is IMHO expected.

What this does not tell however is other underlying realities like corruption and inefficiency in government tax collection. I guess this government has made some progress on that front too. Its effects will show up in few years though.

 

[ashok321]

One way to look at this situation is comparing Revenue to GDP.

IMF, recently published its data set on Revenue to GDP %. Please look at it

http://www.imf.org/external/datamapper/GGR_G01_GDP_PT@FM/ADVEC/WEOWORLD/AS5/CIS/DA/OEMDC

I will like to stress that we should not over analyse the above link and come to ridiculous conclusions like 'India same league as China' etc. But note worthy points are :-

1. Indian governments (State + Centre) collect about 20.87% of GDP as revenue in 2017 as seen in the IMF dataset. Advanced economies collect around 35% or so. We are by that measure, somewhat behind.

2. Countries behind India include Pakistan (15.2), B'desh (10.xx), Indonesia (14.XX) etc. Countries ahead of us are China (27.XX), Europe (around 35% on avarage), Australia (34.XX%), US.

3. This data set does not capture why the revenue is low. My own guess is it is becuase of a ineffective tax collection and corrupting. I think digitization of records is helping to reduce this.

In all we are among developing nation when it comes to revenue vs economy. This includes likes of Mexico(21.XX), Malaysia(19.XX) etc. Which is IMHO expected.

What this does not tell however is other underlying realities like corruption and inefficiency in government tax collection. I guess this government has made some progress on that front too. Its effects will show up in few years though.

You forgot the key indicator, that is per capita.
Because India has billion plus people.
Malaysia & Mexico, both are richer than India.

Right now I am hammering my keyboard from Kuala Lumpur as I am connected with you.

Malaysia has better GNI, HDI and what not.
No comparison with India.
Malaysia beats India hands down.

Per capita wise, what has an Indian got if the wealth gets divided?

Peanuts.
And India is touted as the fastest growing economy or what not.

Hardly any meaning in it.

2 years ago Malaysia rolled out its GST with just 6%.
And look at India; average 14% because it goes to as high as 28%
Shame for low wage country.
Even the Singapore started with 10%

Modi wants to bleed his own Indians.
Not fair.

 

[EndangeredSpecies]

You forgot the key indicator, that is per capita.
Because India has billion plus people.
Malaysia & Mexico, both are richer than India.

Right now I am hammering my keyboard from Kuala Lumpur as I am connected with you.

Malaysia has better GNI, HDI and what not.
No comparison with India.
Malaysia beats India hands down.

Per capita wise, what has an Indian got if the wealth gets divided?

Peanuts.
And India is touted as the fastest growing economy or what not.

Hardly any meaning in it.

2 years ago Malaysia rolled out its GST with just 6%.
And look at India; average 14% because it goes to as high as 28%
Shame for low wage country.
Even the Singapore started with 10%

We were taking about Revenue so revenue it was. Now you are taking discussion on a totally different direction.

Obviously, India has a HUGE population. That means India has to tackle her problem differently and time scales will also be different. India is also friggin diverse, meaning policies will need more time to be hammered out. To top it all we are a democracy. However, I do not see what is the problem still. Different rules apply to different countries. Canada can support a universal health care because there are only 35 million canadian. US tried it and it added a yuuge number to her public debt. Scale changes every thing and every rules in macroscopic world.

 

[ashok321]

We were taking about Revenue so revenue it was. Now you are taking discussion on a totally different direction.

Obviously, India has a HUGE population. That means India has to tackle her problem differently and time scales will also be different. India is also friggin diverse, meaning policies will need more time to be hammered out. To top it all we are a democracy. However, I do not see what is the problem still. Different rules apply to different countries. Canada can support a universal health care because there are only 35 million canadian. US tried it and it added a yuuge number to her public debt. Scale changes every thing and every rules in macroscopic world.

BTW, I am hammering this on my TVS Gold Mechanical Keyboard with blue cherry keys and nice tactile feedback. All Made completely in India. Hell with Malaysia, this keyboard is cheaper and much much much much better. Using it since 2010, no complains till now.

The revenue that the GOI gets, it uses for its budget.
That in other words, for the uplift of all Indian.
Less revenue means all Indians suffer.
If you do not take per capita factor into consideration, how can you compare India with other economies?

A) I have a house and my income is 1000 Rs.
B) My friend has a house but lives with 3 more people (wife and 2 kids) and has 2000 as his income.

Who is better off?
A or B despite the variance in the income?

We were taking about Revenue so revenue it was. Now you are taking discussion on a totally different direction.

Obviously, India has a HUGE population.

So does China.
Who is richer?

Sometimes the excuses are not good enough.