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In rare move, Indonesia raises Hague ruling vs China

striver44

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The move provides an 'important building block' for Manila, which won the historic award against Beijing, says Asia maritime expert Greg Poling

https://www.rappler.com/authorprofile/sofia.tomacruz
Sofia Tomacruz


000_1NJ4QQ_383AFB428B3C4D71A4EFE14ADC44DD52.jpg


LAW OF THE SEA. This handout picture shows Indonesian President Joko Widodo during his visit to a military base in the Natuna islands, which border the South China Sea. Photo by Handout/Presidential Palace/AFP



MANILA, Philippines – The Indonesian government submitted a rare communication to the United Nations, raising the 2016 Hague ruling that rejects China’s 9-dash line seeking to claim ownership over virtually the entire South China Sea.

Indonesia stated its position on the matter in a note verbale addressed to UN Secretary General António Guterres on May 26, where it opposed a series of circular notes filed by Being in relation to Malaysia’s application to define the limits of its extended continent shelf.

In particular, Indonesia cited China’s notes protesting Malaysia’s application itself, and later on, rejecting the Philippines’ and Vietnam’s positions on the matter.

Indonesia explicitly stated the 2016 Hague ruling the Philippine won against China confirmed the country’s position on maritime features and its entitlements – that "no maritime feature in the Spratly islands is entitled to an exclusive economic zone or a continental shelf of its own."

It also cited as illegal China’s sweeping 9-dash line that encroached on several Southeast Asian states' 200-nautical mile exclusive economic zones, including the Philippines.

"Indonesia reiterates that the 9-dash line map implying historic rights claim clearly lacks international legal basis and is tantamount to upset UNCLOS 1982," Indonesia said, referring to the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS).

It added: "This view has also been affirmed by the Award of 12 July 2016 by the Tribunal that any historic rights that the People’s Republic of China may have had to the living and non-living resources were superseded by the limits of the maritime zones provided for by UNCLOS 1982."

The two points are among the main issues of the 2016 arbitral award striking down as illegal China's claim to historic rights in the South China Sea.

Why this matters. Asia maritime expert Greg Poling said Indonesia’s raising of the 2016 Hague ruling is a "important move" as "no other country except Philippines has been so explicit in its support" for the ruling.

While other Southeast Asian states like Vietnam have only implied its support for the ruling, Poling told Rappler "this is the first time any Southeast Asian state has explicitly backed the Philippines."

Prior to this, Indonesia had cited the Hague’s 2016 decision which said there were no disputed waters between China and Indonesia when protesting the presence of Chinese fishing and coast guard vessels in the Natuna islands. Indonesia does not consider itself a party to territorial disputes in the highly volatile South China Sea.

Poling told Rappler Indonesia had also worked the ruling into the country’s new map of its waters in 2017, using the tribunal's precedent on what is and isn't considered an island.

"This could be an important building block if Manila ever wanted to take up the ruling again," Poling said. Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte – under whose term the victory came after the Philippines’ filed its case in 2012 – has downplayed the victory in exchange for economic benefits from China.

Ways forward. Experts have urged Southeast Asian states to rally behind the 2016 Hague ruling as a way to unite and push back against China aggression in the strategic waterway.

After the ruling was handed down in 2016, Paul Reichler – who was the Philippines’ lead counsel against China in its case – had said although the award is legally binding only on China and the Philippines, “it has very strong implications for other coastal states in the South China Sea." – Rappler.com

https://www.rappler.com/world/regio...e-move-indonesia-raises-hague-ruling-vs-china
 
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Not rare if the writer see the recent development in ASEAN.

It is very clear after ASEAN country accept the adoption of Indo Pacific concept from Indonesia in June last year in which one point of the concept said clearly that any dispute in Indo Pacific region (including SCS) should be discussed and solved based on international law (UNCLOS).

ASEAN reaffirms international law as basis for sovereignty in South China Sea
  • Dian Septiari
    The Jakarta Post
    Jakarta / Sat, January 18, 2020 / 03:56 pm
2020_01_17_84847_1579271972._large.jpg

Foreign ministers of ASEAN: Malaysia's Saifuddin Abdullah (left to right), Myanmar's Union Minister for International Cooperation Kyaw Tin, the Philippines' Teodoro Locsin, Singapore's Vivian Balakrishnan, Thailand's Don Pramudwinai, Vietnam's Pham Binh Minh, Brunei's Minister of Foreign Affairs Erywan bin Mohd Yusof, Cambodia's Prak Sokhonn, Indonesia's Retno LP Marsudi, Laos' Saleumxay Kommasith and ASEAN Secretary-General Lim Jock Hoi pose for a group photo during the ASEAN Foreign Ministers' Retreat in Nha Trang on Friday, Jan. 17. (AFP/Nhac Nguyen)

ASEAN’s top diplomats have reaffirmed the need to respect international law amid concerns over tensions in the South China Sea, where Chinese vessels have repeatedly violated other countries’ sovereign rights.

The regional bloc’s foreign ministers were in the coastal city of Nha Trang in southern Vietnam on Thursday and Friday for a closed-door retreat session, where they candidly discussed national and regional concerns, including the situation in the highly disputed South China Sea.

The meeting marks the first ASEAN meeting under the chairmanship of Vietnam.

Vietnamese Foreign Minister Pham Binh Minh said all ASEAN countries voiced their concerns on land reclamations and serious incidents in the South China Sea.

He called for countries to enhance mutual trust, "exercise self-restraint in the conduct of activities and avoid actions that may further complicate the situation", as well as pursue peaceful resolutions of disputes in accordance with international laws, including the 1982 United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS).

“We reaffirmed that international law, including the 1982 UNCLOS, is the basis for determining sovereignty, sovereign rights and legitimate interests over maritime areas. We further reaffirmed that the 1982 UNCLOS is the overarching framework of legal order for the seas that must be respected by all countries,” he said in a statement after the meeting.

https://www.thejakartapost.com/seas...-appointed-as-pgn-president-commissioner.html
 
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The move provides an 'important building block' for Manila, which won the historic award against Beijing, says Asia maritime expert Greg Poling

Sofia Tomacruz


000_1NJ4QQ_383AFB428B3C4D71A4EFE14ADC44DD52.jpg


LAW OF THE SEA. This handout picture shows Indonesian President Joko Widodo during his visit to a military base in the Natuna islands, which border the South China Sea. Photo by Handout/Presidential Palace/AFP



MANILA, Philippines – The Indonesian government submitted a rare communication to the United Nations, raising the 2016 Hague ruling that rejects China’s 9-dash line seeking to claim ownership over virtually the entire South China Sea.

Indonesia stated its position on the matter in a note verbale addressed to UN Secretary General António Guterres on May 26, where it opposed a series of circular notes filed by Being in relation to Malaysia’s application to define the limits of its extended continent shelf.

In particular, Indonesia cited China’s notes protesting Malaysia’s application itself, and later on, rejecting the Philippines’ and Vietnam’s positions on the matter.

Indonesia explicitly stated the 2016 Hague ruling the Philippine won against China confirmed the country’s position on maritime features and its entitlements – that "no maritime feature in the Spratly islands is entitled to an exclusive economic zone or a continental shelf of its own."

It also cited as illegal China’s sweeping 9-dash line that encroached on several Southeast Asian states' 200-nautical mile exclusive economic zones, including the Philippines.

"Indonesia reiterates that the 9-dash line map implying historic rights claim clearly lacks international legal basis and is tantamount to upset UNCLOS 1982," Indonesia said, referring to the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS).

It added: "This view has also been affirmed by the Award of 12 July 2016 by the Tribunal that any historic rights that the People’s Republic of China may have had to the living and non-living resources were superseded by the limits of the maritime zones provided for by UNCLOS 1982."

The two points are among the main issues of the 2016 arbitral award striking down as illegal China's claim to historic rights in the South China Sea.

Why this matters. Asia maritime expert Greg Poling said Indonesia’s raising of the 2016 Hague ruling is a "important move" as "no other country except Philippines has been so explicit in its support" for the ruling.

While other Southeast Asian states like Vietnam have only implied its support for the ruling, Poling told Rappler "this is the first time any Southeast Asian state has explicitly backed the Philippines."

Prior to this, Indonesia had cited the Hague’s 2016 decision which said there were no disputed waters between China and Indonesia when protesting the presence of Chinese fishing and coast guard vessels in the Natuna islands. Indonesia does not consider itself a party to territorial disputes in the highly volatile South China Sea.

Poling told Rappler Indonesia had also worked the ruling into the country’s new map of its waters in 2017, using the tribunal's precedent on what is and isn't considered an island.

"This could be an important building block if Manila ever wanted to take up the ruling again," Poling said. Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte – under whose term the victory came after the Philippines’ filed its case in 2012 – has downplayed the victory in exchange for economic benefits from China.

Ways forward. Experts have urged Southeast Asian states to rally behind the 2016 Hague ruling as a way to unite and push back against China aggression in the strategic waterway.

After the ruling was handed down in 2016, Paul Reichler – who was the Philippines’ lead counsel against China in its case – had said although the award is legally binding only on China and the Philippines, “it has very strong implications for other coastal states in the South China Sea." – Rappler.com

https://www.rappler.com/world/regio...e-move-indonesia-raises-hague-ruling-vs-china
Very good move!

the more the protest the better

but don’t forget to buy more warships
 
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V

but don’t forget to buy more warships
we did.
our 2 new Iver Huidtfeldt will be in service before 2024. in addition to another 2 additional Sigma 10514 (total of 4) , 4 OPV's ,3 additional changbogo Submarines (total of 8)
 
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Thailand buy CN warships,tanks---> Panasonic quit Thai and move to VN.

Apple, Nintendo chose VN instead of other ASEAN nations. JP wanna help VN become stronger against CN in SCS ( east VN sea) even CN only control abt 12% ( PLA actually cant fight in real war without daddy US support ) while VN control abt 65 % :laugh:

If other ASEAN nations dont show their protest against CN expansion in SCS ( east VN sea) then they should forget hoping more JP-US factories will come and boost their export :cool:
 
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we did.
our 2 new Iver Huidtfeldt will be in service before 2024. in addition to another 2 additional Sigma 10514 (total of 4) , 4 OPV's ,3 additional changbogo Submarines (total of 8)
my estimate before 2026 (if everything goes smoothly) the Indonesian Fleet strike force will be comprised of

-2xIver Huidtfeldt
-4xSigma 10514 frigate
-4xSigma 9013 corvette
-3x F2000 corvette
-3x Fatahillah corvette
-14x Parchim corvette
-4x OPV (FFBNW with missile)
-6x FAC60 missile craft
-12X FPB-57 (4 are missile armed)
-8 Submarines (type 209 and Changbogo)
 
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my estimate before 2026 (if everything goes smoothly) the Indonesian Fleet strike force will be comprised of

-2xIver Huidtfeldt
-4xSigma 10514 frigate
-4xSigma 9013 corvette
-3x F2000 corvette
-3x Fatahillah corvette
-14x Parchim corvette
-4x OPV (FFBNW with missile)
-6x FAC60 missile craft
-12X FPB-57 (4 are missile armed)
-8 Submarines (type 209 and Changbogo)

I rather believe it happen just before 2030, and dont forget 5 Ahmad Yani class frigates are not going to be retired soon as SCS situation demands it, those frigates also have undergone some modernization.
 
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I rather believe it happen just before 2030, and dont forget 5 Ahmad Yani class frigates are not going to be retired soon as SCS situation demands it, those frigates also have undergone some modernization.
the Ahmad yani's need to be mothballed, and their 76mm guns and sensors should be installed in other assets that currently lacked weaponry (LPD's fro example)
 
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my estimate before 2026 (if everything goes smoothly) the Indonesian Fleet strike force will be comprised of

-2xIver Huidtfeldt
-4xSigma 10514 frigate
-4xSigma 9013 corvette
-3x F2000 corvette
-3x Fatahillah corvette
-14x Parchim corvette
-4x OPV (FFBNW with missile)
-6x FAC60 missile craft
-12X FPB-57 (4 are missile armed)
-8 Submarines (type 209 and Changbogo)

Are those two Iver really coming in 2024? Then it's great.
 
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Are those two Iver really coming? Then it's great.
according to alma helvas, yes. also pt.pal confirm it in their IG

*edit:pt.pal doesn't spesifically mention the 2024 timeline,but confirm that the ships are currently under construction.
 
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the Ahmad yani's need to be mothballed, and their 76mm guns and sensors should be installed in other assets that currently lacked weaponry (LPD's fro example)

I expect we will keep operating them until 2035 considering SCS situation.


Start watching in 3.10

 
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I expect we will keep operating them until 2035 considering SCS situation.


Start watching in 3.10

I'm ok with that we need all available resource to defend sea lanes in case SCS goes hot

in 2027 Australia will start replacing their anzacs, we need to get our hands on one
1280px-HMAS_Ballarat_during_RIMPAC_2016.jpg
 
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according to alma helvas, yes. also pt.pal confirm it in their IG

*edit:pt.pal doesn't spesifically mention the 2024 timeline,but confirm that the ships are currently under construction.

Today at prefab workshop of PT PAL

101060245_3303611222992949_6630502359023747072_o.jpg


As far as i know, the KCR 60 is already on assembly level, LPD is at dry dock so which components it is part of?
 
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