( II ) Refreshing Memories; Genocide of Circassians by Russian Empire ( 21st May of 1844 )

[Deliorman]

Do some research as to who ruled the Soviet Union during all those killings and deportations. They were not "Russians", the Soviet premier and head of the NKVD were both Georgians. It's shocking how ignorant people are.

Mr. Smart guy... maybe this is why I mentioned them as "Russians" not as Russians as they were the people who ruled over this country, who promoted Russian language, Russian culture, Cyrillic alphabet and they are the people you are proud of. I know which leaders of the Soviet Union were Georgian, Jewish etc., I know that your Tsars didn't even have Russian blood in their veins (like most other aristocratic families in Europe at that time).

Okay, I as a Turk admit the bad stuff we did in the past, but the same has been done to us yet we don't cry like small girls about stuff that happened so many decades ago. We killed and we were killed, you kill or you are being killed- that's how history and life works. I'm telling you that as a Turks who lives in a country that used to be part of the Ottoman empire and had a huge (35-40%) Turkish- Muslim population which is now between 10-15%. So don't tell me what bad stuff we did but rather look at worse things you did to the World- things that you are more than proud of. I can admit our bad deeds, but can you admit yours?

 

[ptldM3]

Mr. Smart guy... maybe this is why I mentioned them as "Russians" not as Russians as they were the people who ruled over this country, who promoted Russian language, Russian culture, Cyrillic alphabet and they are the people you are proud of. I know which leaders of the Soviet Union were Georgian, Jewish etc., I know that your Tsars didn't even have Russian blood in their veins (like most other aristocratic families in Europe at that time).

Placing quotations around a word does not excuse you from forming a detailed rebuttal. That is not even what quotations are used for. If you wanted to get your point across you could have simply stated that none Russian ruled over the Soviet Union and emperial Russia.

Okay, I as a Turk admit the bad stuff we did in the past, but the same has been done to us yet we don't cry like small girls about stuff that happened so many decades ago. We killed and we were killed, you kill or you are being killed- that's how history and life works. I'm telling you that as a Turks who lives in a country that used to be part of the Ottoman empire and had a huge (35-40%) Turkish- Muslim population which is now between 10-15%. So don't tell me what bad stuff we did but rather look at worse things you did to the World- things that you are more than proud of. I can admit our bad deeds, but can you admit yours?

It's nice that you admit that But many Turks are in denial about the Armenian genocide, while at the same time accuse Russians of genocide, do you see the irony? And who is "crying"? Many countries and historians from around the world acknowledge the Armenian Genocide. It would probably be less talked about if Turkey actually fessed up.

In my closing statement, look at all the threads about "Russian Genocide" most of the time it's tarted by Turks and then you wounder why people bring up the Armenian Genocide?

 

[Deliorman]

Placing quotations around a word does not excuse you from forming a detailed rebuttal. That is not even what quotations are used for. If you wanted to get your point across you could have simply stated that none Russian ruled over the Soviet Union and emperial Russia.







It's nice that you admit that But many Turks are in denial about the Armenian genocide, while at the same time accuse Russians of genocide, do you see the irony? And who is "crying"? Many countries and historians from around the world acknowledge the Armenian Genocide. It would probably be less talked about if Turkey actually fessed up.

In my closing statement, look at all the threads about "Russian Genocide" most of the time it's tarted by Turks and then you wounder why people bring up the Armenian Genocide?

Let's not argue when one should use quotations or not... The things I wanted to say is that even when those leaders were not real Russians by blood they ruled over the Soviet/Russian empire and made political moves for it. Even when regular hardworking Russian people were basically their feudal slaves for centuries at the end of the day everybody says THEY did bad things, Russians themselves, not their leaders who forced them to do it. The thing is that you guys don't want to admit bad stuff you did in the past but rather feel proud about them. At the same time your whole propaganda machine is forced against us around whole Europe so talking to me about Turks starting Anti- Russian threads is more than funny. Anyway the thread is about the Genocide on Circassians not the one on Armenians.

I asked you one think, can you admit your bad deeds from the past as I as an individual did? The Holodomor, the Gulags, the Deportations and killing on millions of people around the whole territory of the Russian/Soviet Empire- all that during times of peace. That resulted in tens of millions of people dying- in that category We look like Angels compared to you.

ps Unfortunately every nation did bad stuff in their history but no one admits the mistakes of his people. I believe that once and for all every nation, every human should admit his mistakes and try to forgive to his "enemies". Believe me or not but I know a lot of Russian people and I don't think you are bad people at all... I even believe we have a lot in common as nations but we have the luck to be ruled by warmongers throughout most of our history.

 

[Deliorman]

Forget Jimmy Carter !

Let historians decide. Ronald Suny Michigan Edu. :

The argument of those who deny that the Ottoman Turkish government carried out a genocidal deportation and mass killing of its Armenian subjects in 1915 might be summarised as:

"There was no genocide, and the Armenians are to blame for it! Armenians, after all, were rebellious, seditious subjects who presented a danger to the empire and got what they deserved."

Why don't historians from both countries try to open all archives and find out what really happened? Why are Armenians against that, and why they somehow forget what they did to the Muslim population living around them in WWI? Why do they forget that massacres did on them were not even carried out by ethnic Turks? Tell me what other empires did to people who rebelled against them especially in time of a war, not even mentioning it was the greatest war the world has ever seen?

Now let's stop talking about Armenians but rather concentrate on Circassians. Don't use the tactic to derail the thread and change the topic... If you have nothing else to say just don't and leave other people have a discussion here. Thank you.

 

[damm1t]

Man, I can't resist reply since you make really good assits and I love to score

First thing about you I have seen that you are a fake-accounter google worm and no clue about facts. You pick up things from search pages as you want to see.

Damned. What a pity.
1.557 Turkish security forces were killed in 2015 during the clashes with PKK, while it lost 220 fighters.

I will quote myself from another thread, it fits to your argument with an official statement.

Since the operations has started last year in July,

4571 terrorists have been killed, 1441 captured, 641 surrendered. Total 6623 terrorists have been neutralized. Operations are going on. We will finish this shit.

On the other hand if you wanna talk about historians...

Forget Jimmy Carter !

Let historians decide. Ronald Suny Michigan Edu. :

The argument of those who deny that the Ottoman Turkish government carried out a genocidal deportation and mass killing of its Armenian subjects in 1915 might be summarised as:

"There was no genocide, and the Armenians are to blame for it! Armenians, after all, were rebellious, seditious subjects who presented a danger to the empire and got what they deserved."

Let's leave it to the historians then;

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_McCarthy_(American_historian)

Prof Justin McCarthy said: “There is no Armenian Genocide, but Turkish Genocide”



History Professor Justin McCarthy, from the History Department of Louisville University, the USA, said in a conference in Toronto that they have so many historical documents and archives about 1915 events, and those evidences show that Turks did not carry out any genocide, but Armenians carried out a genocide on Turkish people. He also stated that during 1915 events, people might have killed each other mutually, but it does not mean genocide, but history calls it just a war. Prof McCarthy also explained that in 1914 and 1915, Armenians revolted, and Turkish state carried them to another place to ensure the life of Turkish citizens.Even it is known that Ottoman Empire protected Armenians against Armenian rebels he said.



Now open a new tab from your browser, go to google.com and begin searching for more assists for me

 

[damm1t]

@waz mate, this dude posts some disturbing images, above post in the quoted part ..

 

[bsruzm]

A Turk talking about genocide you guy committed one of the biggest and most gruesome genocides in history. I can find countless pictures of sawed off Armenian heads on spikes.

Besides the Armenian genocides the Turks rapped and murdered their way through Europe, Middle East and Africa with Isis style killing of sawing off heads, drowning people, etc.

Heads or tales?

"Do we all recognize this one? The "heads" are often presented either as genocide victims or as Armenian notables. Steve Keohane of Bibleprobe provided the following caption: "Heads of Christians, traditionally treated like trophies by the Turks."

The AGA site gets to the bottom of the story behind this photo; we are given the names of these heads as well as the source. They are the members of Dashnaktsutiun and resided in a village in Iran. From its own page:

"... If such partisans fell into the hands of the Ottoman authorities, they had to count on execution. The photo shows the heads of eight of nine Armenians from the village Mahlam in Salmast (Iran), who were executed on 26 October 1898 on instruction of the Ottoman government and to which the Dashnaktsutiun had belonged to a social-revolutionary Armenian party. It concerned Chatschatur Harutjunjan out of Moks (left above), Harutjun out of Ulnia (Sejtun), Stepan of Chisan, Harik of Schatach, Gabriel Muradjan, Nahapet Jeriasarjan ("Nacho" from Wosm), Harutjun Chatschatrjan out of Moks as well as Galust Galojan. Awetis Ohanjan, the ninth victim, is not to be seen in the picture."

The source is none other than the official news organ of the Dashnaktsutiun, "The Droshak," Jan. 31, 1899, S. 5."

From The Liverpool Courier, August 10,1897:

From The Bristol Times And Mirror,September 9, 1897:

What heads are you talking about? This isn't about Russian backed Armenian terrorism in WWI but Russia's barbarism against free people, which can be observed in Syria today. Stop spreading bullsh*t to prove your point or to cover the truth.

 

[ptldM3]

Heads or tales?

"Do we all recognize this one? The "heads" are often presented either as genocide victims or as Armenian notables. Steve Keohane of Bibleprobe provided the following caption: "Heads of Christians, traditionally treated like trophies by the Turks."

The AGA site gets to the bottom of the story behind this photo; we are given the names of these heads as well as the source. They are the members of Dashnaktsutiun and resided in a village in Iran. From its own page:

"... If such partisans fell into the hands of the Ottoman authorities, they had to count on execution. The photo shows the heads of eight of nine Armenians from the village Mahlam in Salmast (Iran), who were executed on 26 October 1898 on instruction of the Ottoman government and to which the Dashnaktsutiun had belonged to a social-revolutionary Armenian party. It concerned Chatschatur Harutjunjan out of Moks (left above), Harutjun out of Ulnia (Sejtun), Stepan of Chisan, Harik of Schatach, Gabriel Muradjan, Nahapet Jeriasarjan ("Nacho" from Wosm), Harutjun Chatschatrjan out of Moks as well as Galust Galojan. Awetis Ohanjan, the ninth victim, is not to be seen in the picture."

The source is none other than the official news organ of the Dashnaktsutiun, "The Droshak," Jan. 31, 1899, S. 5."

From The Liverpool Courier, August 10,1897:

From The Bristol Times And Mirror,September 9, 1897:

What heads are you talking about? This isn't about Russian backed Armenian terrorism in WWI but Russia's barbarism against free people, which can be observed in Syria today. Stop spreading bullsh*t instead history.

Stop with the BS, the Ottoman atrocities against the Armanians were documented by the British, French and Russians, the evidence is overwhelming, everything from first hand reports from Europeans and Russians to photographic evidence, mass graves and Turkish accounts.


There are also idiots that deny the the Holocaust even though it's one of the most documented events in history as is the Armenian Genocide. I had family in Auschwitz and people were telling me that the Holocost is fake. Point is, you will always find that one idiot that will write some article that 99.9% of experts will dismiss while there are plenty of other gullible idiots that take it for face value.


And what are you talking about with regards to Syria? Most Syrians support the government. What good has Turkey done in Syria? If Turkey would close its borders instead of violating Syrian sovereignty, then terrorists would not besiege towns in Syria thus much of the fighting would seize. Ironic how every captured Isis terrorist as well as other terrorist group all say they crossed from Turkey. Even funnier is that a number of captured Isis fighters have admitted Isis has had contact with Turkish authorities. Turkey is soooo innocent by allowing terrorists to flow into Syria while bombing Kurds that fight Isis, while Russia is so bad for bombing all terrorists.

 

[bsruzm]

Stop with the BS

History isn't BS.

There are also idiots that deny the the Holocaust even though it's one of the most documented events in history as is the Armenian Genocide. I had family in Auschwitz and people were telling me that the Holocost is fake.

"We reject attempts to create a similarity between the Holocaust and the Armenian allegations. Nothing similar to the Holocaust occurred. It is a tragedy what the Armenians went through but not a genocide."

Shimon Peres, (then) Nobel prize-winning Israeli Foreign Minister, (later) President as quoted in the April 10 2001

Calling people, who are speaking with proof, idiot won't get you anything but prove how ignorant you are. Indeed, you are or worse.

Here's another record of Russian backed Armenian terrorism:

"We have first hand information and evidence of Armenian
atrocities against our people (Jews). Members of our family
witnessed the murder of 148 members of our family near Erzurum, Turkey, by Armenian neighbors, bent on destroying anything and anybody remotely Jewish and/or Muslim... Armenians were in league with Hitler in the last war, on his promise to grant themselves government if, in return, the Armenians would help exterminate Jews. Armenians were also hearty proponents of the anti-Semitic acts in league with the Russian Communists."


Elihu Ben Levi, Vacaville, California, letter, San Francisco Chronicle (December 11, 1983). [Armenian guerillas rounded up and massacred Jews in the area of Hakkari; in Trabzon and vicinity they massacred thousands of Greeks. The idea behind these atrocities was to secure an Armenian majority. (Kara Schemsi, Tures et Arméniens devant l'Histoire, Gèneve, Imprimerie Nationale, 1919, p. 49, 41). Jews were attacked everywhere; the Commander of Gendarmerie Regiment at Van recorded: "Some three hundred Jews trying to escape from Akaridan were captured at the village of Sil and cut into pieces. Then (the Armenians) stacked the corpses." (Aspirations and revolutionary movements of the Armenian parties,. pp. 298-309) ]

 

[ptldM3]

History isn't BS.


"We reject attempts to create a similarity between the Holocaust and the Armenian allegations. Nothing similar to the Holocaust occurred. It is a tragedy what the Armenians went through but not a genocide."

Shimon Peres, (then) Nobel prize-winning Israeli Foreign Minister, (later) President as quoted in the April 10 2001

Calling people, who are speaking with proof, idiot won't get you anything but prove how ignorant you are. Indeed, you are or worse.

Here's another record of Russian backed Armenian terrorism in WWI:

"We have first hand information and evidence of Armenian
atrocities against our people (Jews). Members of our family
witnessed the murder of 148 members of our family near Erzurum, Turkey, by Armenian neighbors, bent on destroying anything and anybody remotely Jewish and/or Muslim... Armenians were in league with Hitler in the last war, on his promise to grant themselves government if, in return, the Armenians would help exterminate Jews. Armenians were also hearty proponents of the anti-Semitic acts in league with the Russian Communists."


Elihu Ben Levi, Vacaville, California, letter, San Francisco Chronicle (December 11, 1983). [Armenian guerillas rounded up and massacred Jews in the area of Hakkari; in Trabzon and vicinity they massacred thousands of Greeks. The idea behind these atrocities was to secure an Armenian majority. (Kara Schemsi, Tures et Arméniens devant l'Histoire, Gèneve, Imprimerie Nationale, 1919, p. 49, 41). Jews were attacked everywhere; the Commander of Gendarmerie Regiment at Van recorded: "Some three hundred Jews trying to escape from Akaridan were captured at the village of Sil and cut into pieces. Then (the Armenians) stacked the corpses." (Aspirations and revolutionary movements of the Armenian parties,. pp. 298-309) ]

An Israeli foreign minister is not an expert in the Armenian Genocide, he is a politician

Real experts, do not agree with his Claims.

Like I said there is alway that one idiot that denies the Armanian Genocide or tried to down play it as not a real genocide and then there is always that one idiot that falls for this crap. You might as well post articles about 911 being an "inside job", the Holacaust being fake, and Big foot being real and Al-Bagdadi being a Jew agent



I can post a thousand sources that support the fact that the Armenian Genocide happened. So you prove nothing other then the fact the you are gullible.

 

[bsruzm]

Like I said there is alway that one idiot that denies the Armanian Genocide and always that one idiot that falls for this crap. You might as well post articles about 911 being an "inside job", the Holacaust being fake, and Big foot being real and Al-Bagdadi being a Jew agent

You are worse lol

I can post a thousand sources that support the fact that the Armenian Genocide happened. So you prove nothing other then the fact the you are gullible.

Post a thread about it then, this one isn't about Russian backed Armenian terrorism.

 

[ptldM3]

You are worse lol

If only that made any sense. Please continue posting opinions of Israel politicians about the Armanian Genocide

Post a thread about it then, this one isn't about Russian backed Armenian terrorism in WWI.

Why would I need to make such a worthless thread? There has been plenty of threads already and 90% of the Turks on this forum deny the Armanian Genocide and plenty of none Turks on this forum, mainly Muslims, defend the Turks. It's like arguing with a door knob.

If I'm going to open a thread about the Armenian Genocide I might as well open a thread about water being wet and the sky being blue.

 

[bsruzm]

Why would I need to make such a worthless thread?

Because, this thread isn't about it and you are the one ignorantly off-topic.