If India & Pakistan Went to War: 5 Weapons Pakistan Should Fear

[GURU DUTT]

Idiot the dawarka base destruction in 1965 war.

but who ran to tashkent and signed tashkent accord and why ?
Tashkent Declaration - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Juggernautjatt]

Ummmmmmmmmm

Okay if your men were so intelligent then I must tell you how they were fooled by Indian naval officers in '71.
The Indian navy crew on-board the missile destroyer INS Nirghat, INS Nipat and INS Veer carried out communications with the HQ at Mumbai and the IAF in Russian. Not English or Hindi!
This was done to fool the Pakistani naval intelligence before the commencement, and during Operation Trident, as they could not trace the relations to any offensive sea movements by the Indian Navy. Operation Trident was followed by Operation Python which destroyed the Karachi port in the 1971 Indo-Pak war.
The Pakistan intelligence mistook this radio chatter as that of the Russian Navy far off in the Arabian Sea (far from Karachi) thinking that it may be related to counter the U.S. Navy movements in the region during the war. Poor Pakistanis, they had no clue what hit them.
@Abingdonboy @OrionHunter @thesolar65 @gslv
Did you know about it?
I nearly fell off the chair when I came to know about it. Lol

There were some other similar incidents when super intelligent Pakistani military was fooled by Indian military.
In 71 war Pakistanis thought Russian AWACS was controlling the TACDE squadron aircrafts to facilitate night attacks because strange call signs of airfields, Dada, Popo or TO, were mistaken for Russian code words. Although those airfields call signs were based on of three pilots; Dada Deshmukh, Popo Sahay and TO (Trevor) Osman.
But the fact was night raids in Pakistan were carried out by skilled pilots of TACDE without any AWACS help.

Secondly, during pre-emptive air strikes carried out in 71 war PAF did not strike Adampur air base because in October that year, a Pakistani spy, equipped with a radio transmitter, had been apprehended near Adampur base The Intelligence Bureau and Air Force top brass decided to play a double game. The spy was made to transmit false information about the impregnable air defence weapons network in and around the Adampur base to his contacts back in Pakistan. As a result PAF decided to leave out Adampur AFB from its strike plans.

 

[anant_s]

Ummmmmmmmmm

Okay if your men were so intelligent then I must tell you how they were fooled by Indian naval officers in '71.
The Indian navy crew on-board the missile destroyer INS Nirghat, INS Nipat and INS Veer carried out communications with the HQ at Mumbai and the IAF in Russian. Not English or Hindi!
This was done to fool the Pakistani naval intelligence before the commencement, and during Operation Trident, as they could not trace the relations to any offensive sea movements by the Indian Navy. Operation Trident was followed by Operation Python which destroyed the Karachi port in the 1971 Indo-Pak war.
The Pakistan intelligence mistook this radio chatter as that of the Russian Navy far off in the Arabian Sea (far from Karachi) thinking that it may be related to counter the U.S. Navy movements in the region during the war. Poor Pakistanis, they had no clue what hit them.
@Abingdonboy @OrionHunter @thesolar65 @gslv
Did you know about it?
I nearly fell off the chair when I came to know about it. Lol

There is one more story (Some may be knowing) on sinking of PNS Ghazi.
While the circumstances under which the sub marine sank are still disputed by both sides, the fact that submarine was lulled neared Vizag is undeniable. False communications were sent by IN commanders, that leaked and made PN believe INS Vikrant (which PNS Ghazi was entrusted to sink) was ported at Vizag, when actually it was somewhere near Andaman and Nicobar islands.

Text last telegram raised on board the sunken submarine "Ghazi"

The sub met its fate in deep waters of Bay of Bengal near Vizag.

Leaders of the Indian Navy was aware from the outset that the Pakistanis will inevitably be forced to send in the Bay of Bengal submarine Ghazi as the sole of his ship, which could operate in these waters. Fearing possible attacks primarily against their carrier base in the Pakistani underwater sabotage forces and means, being able to arrive Ghazi, Indian commanders take early measures for transfer Vikrant aircraft carrier group in the period preceding the start of hostilities, a secret anchorage in the Andaman Islands, designated as "X-Ray". On 13 November Vikrant with escort ships came from Madras to this point. Simultaneously, targeted actions have been taken by the enemy disinformation designed to mislead him about the true location of an aircraft carrier, and instill confidence in the Pakistanis that it is located in Visakhapatnam. It simulates the intense radio in the area. In private contractors have been ordered for delivery in Visakhapatnam large quantities of food, particularly meat and fresh vegetables, allegedly intended for the ships of the Eastern Fleet - as "straight talking" in the local bazaar. Indian high-ranking officers were "reckless" official talks on the phone between Visakhapatnam and Chennai the security-based ships, including Vikrant, in these bases and aircraft carriers allegedly involves a move from Vishakhapatnam "back" in Madras. From Vishakhapatnam private telegram was sent as if from one of the sailors of an aircraft carrier, to inquire about the health of his sick mother. All these activities were crowned with complete success - as mentioned above, November 25 Pakistani command sent Ghazi to Visakhapatnam, saying that "intelligence indicates the presence of an aircraft carrier in the port" ("INTELLIGENCE INDICATES CARRIER IN PORT").

Full story
Google Translate

With only Submarine threat out of picture, INS Vikrant was free to execute the missions entrusted.

@thesolar65 @Rain Man @Abingdonboy @Capt.Popeye @GURU DUTT @SpArK @Koovie @Skull and Bones @Juggernautjatt

 

[WAR-rior]

haha i wish if @Muradk was here, he would have told some nice dhoti flying stories of his days....

And how wud that made a difference in present and future? As per topic of the thread, Pakistanis has lost it completely as they will be fighting future and present wars only with stories of the past. JAANE KAHA GAYE WO DIN.

 

[GURU DUTT]

There is one more story (Some may be knowing) on sinking of PNS Ghazi.
While the circumstances under which the sub marine sank are still disputed by both sides, the fact that submarine was lulled neared Vizag is undeniable. False communications were sent by IN commanders, that leaked and made PN believe INS Vikrant (which PNS Ghazi was entrusted to sink) was ported at Vizag, when actually it was somewhere near Andaman and Nicobar islands.
View attachment 222400
Text last telegram raised on board the sunken submarine "Ghazi"
View attachment 222401
The sub met its fate in deep waters of Bay of Bengal near Vizag.
View attachment 222403
Leaders of the Indian Navy was aware from the outset that the Pakistanis will inevitably be forced to send in the Bay of Bengal submarine Ghazi as the sole of his ship, which could operate in these waters. Fearing possible attacks primarily against their carrier base in the Pakistani underwater sabotage forces and means, being able to arrive Ghazi, Indian commanders take early measures for transfer Vikrant aircraft carrier group in the period preceding the start of hostilities, a secret anchorage in the Andaman Islands, designated as "X-Ray". On 13 November Vikrant with escort ships came from Madras to this point. Simultaneously, targeted actions have been taken by the enemy disinformation designed to mislead him about the true location of an aircraft carrier, and instill confidence in the Pakistanis that it is located in Visakhapatnam. It simulates the intense radio in the area. In private contractors have been ordered for delivery in Visakhapatnam large quantities of food, particularly meat and fresh vegetables, allegedly intended for the ships of the Eastern Fleet - as "straight talking" in the local bazaar. Indian high-ranking officers were "reckless" official talks on the phone between Visakhapatnam and Chennai the security-based ships, including Vikrant, in these bases and aircraft carriers allegedly involves a move from Vishakhapatnam "back" in Madras. From Vishakhapatnam private telegram was sent as if from one of the sailors of an aircraft carrier, to inquire about the health of his sick mother. All these activities were crowned with complete success - as mentioned above, November 25 Pakistani command sent Ghazi to Visakhapatnam, saying that "intelligence indicates the presence of an aircraft carrier in the port" ("INTELLIGENCE INDICATES CARRIER IN PORT").

Full story
Google Translate

With only Submarine threat out of picture, INS Vikrant was free to execute the missions entrusted.
View attachment 222404
@thesolar65 @Rain Man @Abingdonboy @Capt.Popeye @GURU DUTT @SpArK @Koovie @Skull and Bones @Juggernautjatt

there are many pakistanies on this forum have starange notions which are not based on logik or rationality rether on paranoia and false bravado and they will never aknowledge there faults in the past which made them loose the plot and are still beating the same dead horse in a way its good for us anant bhai

 

[Abingdonboy]

Ummmmmmmmmm

Okay if your men were so intelligent then I must tell you how they were fooled by Indian naval officers in '71.
The Indian navy crew on-board the missile destroyer INS Nirghat, INS Nipat and INS Veer carried out communications with the HQ at Mumbai and the IAF in Russian. Not English or Hindi!
This was done to fool the Pakistani naval intelligence before the commencement, and during Operation Trident, as they could not trace the relations to any offensive sea movements by the Indian Navy. Operation Trident was followed by Operation Python which destroyed the Karachi port in the 1971 Indo-Pak war.
The Pakistan intelligence mistook this radio chatter as that of the Russian Navy far off in the Arabian Sea (far from Karachi) thinking that it may be related to counter the U.S. Navy movements in the region during the war. Poor Pakistanis, they had no clue what hit them.
@Abingdonboy @OrionHunter @thesolar65 @gslv
Did you know about it?
I nearly fell off the chair when I came to know about it. Lol

Yes I have heard about that practice- some fine thinking by the officers, the Indian military always displays impressive out of the box thinking when they are faced with a challenge.

 

[Levina]

There is one more story (Some may be knowing) on sinking of PNS Ghazi.
While the circumstances under which the sub marine sank are still disputed by both sides, the fact that submarine was lulled neared Vizag is undeniable. False communications were sent by IN commanders, that leaked and made PN believe INS Vikrant (which PNS Ghazi was entrusted to sink) was ported at Vizag, when actually it was somewhere near Andaman and Nicobar islands.
View attachment 222400
Text last telegram raised on board the sunken submarine "Ghazi"
View attachment 222401
The sub met its fate in deep waters of Bay of Bengal near Vizag.
View attachment 222403
Leaders of the Indian Navy was aware from the outset that the Pakistanis will inevitably be forced to send in the Bay of Bengal submarine Ghazi as the sole of his ship, which could operate in these waters. Fearing possible attacks primarily against their carrier base in the Pakistani underwater sabotage forces and means, being able to arrive Ghazi, Indian commanders take early measures for transfer Vikrant aircraft carrier group in the period preceding the start of hostilities, a secret anchorage in the Andaman Islands, designated as "X-Ray". On 13 November Vikrant with escort ships came from Madras to this point. Simultaneously, targeted actions have been taken by the enemy disinformation designed to mislead him about the true location of an aircraft carrier, and instill confidence in the Pakistanis that it is located in Visakhapatnam. It simulates the intense radio in the area. In private contractors have been ordered for delivery in Visakhapatnam large quantities of food, particularly meat and fresh vegetables, allegedly intended for the ships of the Eastern Fleet - as "straight talking" in the local bazaar. Indian high-ranking officers were "reckless" official talks on the phone between Visakhapatnam and Chennai the security-based ships, including Vikrant, in these bases and aircraft carriers allegedly involves a move from Vishakhapatnam "back" in Madras. From Vishakhapatnam private telegram was sent as if from one of the sailors of an aircraft carrier, to inquire about the health of his sick mother. All these activities were crowned with complete success - as mentioned above, November 25 Pakistani command sent Ghazi to Visakhapatnam, saying that "intelligence indicates the presence of an aircraft carrier in the port" ("INTELLIGENCE INDICATES CARRIER IN PORT").

Full story
Google Translate

With only Submarine threat out of picture, INS Vikrant was free to execute the missions entrusted.
View attachment 222404
@thesolar65 @Rain Man @Abingdonboy @Capt.Popeye @GURU DUTT @SpArK @Koovie @Skull and Bones @Juggernautjatt

wow!
They were completely fooled by India's startegy.
Adding one more to the list....
Pakistanis were also fooled into a trap when they were made to step in a horse shoe formation by Indian army during the Battle of assal uttar. Now just FYI -Pervez Musharraf participated in this battle as a Lt. of artillery in the 16 (SP) Field Regiment, 1st Armoured Division Artillery.
@OrionHunter Mushyy is so damn unlucky for Pakistan. He participated in Kargil (twice!!), and they lost on both the occasions.

Didn't know of that!!

Next time we should talk in Chinese and they will mistook Chinese have come to save them!!

Superb idea!!!
I overheard that during '71 war, our army made sure that signalmen (soldiers of signal regiment) near the border, were south Indians and communicated in Dravidian languages. I'm not sure about its veracity but I've heard this repeatedly over the years from the Signal officers ( my dad was in signals).

 

[gslv]

Ummmmmmmmmm

Okay if your men were so intelligent then I must tell you how they were fooled by Indian naval officers in '71.
The Indian navy crew on-board the missile destroyer INS Nirghat, INS Nipat and INS Veer carried out communications with the HQ at Mumbai and the IAF in Russian. Not English or Hindi!
This was done to fool the Pakistani naval intelligence before the commencement, and during Operation Trident, as they could not trace the relations to any offensive sea movements by the Indian Navy. Operation Trident was followed by Operation Python which destroyed the Karachi port in the 1971 Indo-Pak war.
The Pakistan intelligence mistook this radio chatter as that of the Russian Navy far off in the Arabian Sea (far from Karachi) thinking that it may be related to counter the U.S. Navy movements in the region during the war. Poor Pakistanis, they had no clue what hit them.
@Abingdonboy @OrionHunter @thesolar65 @gslv
Did you know about it?
I nearly fell off the chair when I came to know about it. Lol

Owned.

 

[Hashshāshīn]

Childish article. Treating war like some kind of game.

 

[Indian Jatt]

Have you also forgotten the dawarka destruction.

those shells were made in Indian ordinance factory before 1947.......that ur ships used

 

[HariPrasad]

Vikadi: Yes the CBG led with Vikadi can be used for Naval blockade.. Vikadi can do it by standing 100s of Km away from Karachi.

1)You are wrong. Wiki can be more useful in high sea operation. Tell me why Wiki is needed and what we can not do by small ship or ground attack planes taking off from Jamanagar and what additional advantage Wiki offers. COnsider risk part also.

2. INS Chakra: Its not SSBN, rather it is SSN. U are confused.

2) So what is the advantage? Our Prithvi and shaurya is more than enough do play any role. Why do you want to fire missile from nuclear sub only? For any other naval operation our diesel subs should suffice.

3. Apache: May not be used in Himalyas, bnecause the (fully loaded) Service Ceiling is lower. It can be used as

3) Appache is a very good attack chopper but we have them very less in numbers. Once we have them in numbers, I can incorporate it.

 

[ZooZoo]

1)You are wrong. Wiki can be more useful in high sea operation. Tell me why Wiki is needed and what we can not do by small ship or ground attack planes taking off from Jamanagar and what additional advantage Wiki offers. COnsider risk part also.


2) So what is the advantage? Our Prithvi and shaurya is more than enough do play any role. Why do you want to fire missile from nuclear sub only? For any other naval operation our diesel subs should suffice.

3) Appache is a very good attack chopper but we have them very less in numbers. Once we have them in numbers, I can incorporate it.

U are still not getting my point...
1. Vikadi is not used to keep parked in Andaman sea incase of war.. I am enough intelligent to know that AC never go closer to ports. They stationed at high sea, the supportive ships "Destroyer, Frigate, Submarines, fighter planes etc" go and hit the target.. ACs are sailed unless area is cleared by Submarine and Submarine hunter ships...

2. U are again confused, Chakra is not SSBN, it is not submarine which can fire Ballistic Misslies. It is hunter killer, It hunts Frigate, destroyer and other ships. Its does the same role what Scorpion does. Its just nuclear fueled.. Its doen't do the work of Arihent.. So Akula Class INS Chakra will be stalking Enemy boats.. Again question comes, why we have bought/lease Akula? to park it at Andaman sea?

3. Yes it is less in number.. But my point was "will it be workhorse at high altitude?".. Remember the ideology behind LCA and LCH was "to make a bird which can work efficiently at high altitude.".. LCH can work more efficiently than Apache at high altitude..
But again less or more in numbers, it is bought for use.


Enemy must be afraid of these mean machines../

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I think u might be knowing we have airbase in Kazakstan which has MiG29 (Indian Air defense fighters). Do you know why have we kept it there?? Just to ensure that Pakistan must not put it resources on eastern front...

Similarly if one CBG is stationed near red sea or near Gawadar will scatter Pakistan resources.. Paksiatn can withstand the war on multiple front and Check-mate.. (they will run to USA for peace treaty)...

Risk are high, but gain are higher....

 

[HariPrasad]

1. Vikadi is not used to keep parked in Andaman sea incase of war.. I am enough intelligent to know that AC never go closer to ports. They stationed at high sea, the supportive ships "Destroyer, Frigate, Submarines, fighter planes etc" go and hit the target.. ACs are sailed unless area is cleared by Submarine and Submarine hunter ships...

So you agree with me.

2. U are again confused, Chakra is not SSBN, it is not submarine which can fire Ballistic Misslies. It is hunter killer, It hunts Frigate, destroyer and other ships. Its does the same role what Scorpion does. Its just nuclear fueled.. Its doen't do the work of Arihent.. So Akula Class INS Chakra will be stalking Enemy boats.. Again question comes, why we have bought/lease Akula? to park it at Andaman sea?

So far as taking on enemy boat is concern, MKI with Brahmos or Brahmos fired from land shall be sufficient to reach any pakistani ports or any part of sea where the naval power of both country lies. So inspite being very potent, CHakra shall have limited role. If i want to kill an enemy ship than why would I not fire missile from land or MKI instead of Subs when enemy lies next door.

3. Yes it is less in number.. But my point was "will it be workhorse at high altitude?".. Remember the ideology behind LCA and LCH was "to make a bird which can work efficiently at high altitude.".. LCH can work more efficiently than Apache at high altitude..
But again less or more in numbers, it is bought for use.

LCH can go few thousand feet above appache does not mean that it is more efficient. Appache can carry more load and carry more lethal weapons and missile. We just need to increase the number.

Our most potent missile in indo pak conflict shall be Brahmos and there is no doubt about it.

 

[ZooZoo]

So you agree with me.


So far as taking on enemy boat is concern, MKI with Brahmos or Brahmos fired from land shall be sufficient to reach any pakistani ports or any part of sea where the naval power of both country lies. So inspite being very potent, CHakra shall have limited role. If i want to kill an enemy ship than why would I not fire missile from land or MKI instead of Subs when enemy lies next door.


LCH can go few thousand feet above appache does not mean that it is more efficient. Appache can carry more load and carry more lethal weapons and missile. We just need to increase the number.

Our most potent missile in indo pak conflict shall be Brahmos and there is no doubt about it.

1 Offcourse I agree with you.. I assumed the member (whom u replied) had not knowledge how CBG worked..

2. Ok we can have disagreement over Chakra Role...

3. With loaded Apache can't operate at higher altitude... With increasing load the Service ceiling decrease. Any Helo expert can help on this issue.. I assume at that height LCH and Apache both can carry almost same payload.

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Whereas the Russian Navy's Akula-II could be equipped with 28 nuclear-capable cruise missiles with a striking range of 3,000 km (1,620 nmi; 1,864 mi), the Indian version is reportedly armed with the 300 km (162 nmi; 186 mi)-range 3M-54 Klub nuclear-capable missiles. Missiles with ranges greater than 300 km (162 nmi; 186 mi) cannot be exported due to arms control restrictions, since Russia is a signatory to the MTCR treaty.


Indian Akula is for training and Hunter killer role, rather that firing ballistic missiles...

 

[hunter_hunted]

How Come SUNNY PAAJI isn't there on top of such a list ?

View attachment 222052

And this time we will get our hand pump . Mark my word and dig that Pump in Kashmir .........